Bolter weapons in the campaign.

[Steel*Faith]

Bolters in the campaign are really ineffective in comparison to all other weapons. Especially with the Force Commander & Thaddeus, but bolters become pretty useless even to Tarkus as you level up.

Bolters are the backbone of the SM army, and are probably the most important weapon in their arsenal. Something about them, as the campaign progresses, just seems lacking. Whether it be damage, or lack of special abilities associated with the bolter.

It be nice if Relic could buff bolters in the campaign. Also for future campaigns, they should make it so every weapon choice is useful throughout the campaign, not just early on.

I think the main problem seems to be the animations, and how unresponsive mobile ranged weapons can be, especially when using them ona single unit like the FC. He misses with a lot of shots, then he has to reload, he stops firing, he tries to find his own cover when I need him to attack a target ect. It just makes the bolter, and plasma guns ect annoying.

Anyone know what i'm talking about?

[Gorb]

Bolters are the backbone of the SM army, and are probably the most important weapon in their arsenal. Something about them, as the campaign progresses, just seems lacking. Whether it be damage, or lack of special abilities associated with the bolter.Boltguns are the standard firearm for an Astartes, and are the most basic weapon in their arsenal. They are by no means the most important; to a Space Marine every weapon is important in a certain situation. They are the bog-standard infantry weapon and lack any mystical or awe-inspiring properties. They are relatively easy to manufacture and maintain. They are, for want of a better word, normal.

They're basic anti-infantry weapons; they don't need buffing. They kill Sluggas/Shootas/Guardians/Gaunts pretty quickly, especially on the realistic game settings (Captain and Primarch aren't really that realistic in terms of damage ratios). I would agree that units in general can be unresponsive and/or not do the things you want them to - the problem is not limited to the ranged firing animations, it is prevalent across a range of weapon types.

[Steel*Faith]

Well Bolters are the "Back Bone" of the SM arsenal. Yes they're the "standard" weaponry of a SM chapter, but they're incredibly important to their success, and one of their most trusted, deadly, and reliable pieces of weaponry. What would SM be without the Bolter? There would be a noticeable difference in their success rate I think.

I think the biggest thing hurting the game overall is the auto-cover. It really puts ranged units, especially SM's at a disadvantage.

[Aliblabla]

You want to make them realistic? Fine, Relic's going to have them popping up explosions five metres tall and annihilating entire squads of enemies in single shots, causing notable damage to light vehicles and buildings and on top of that, being fully automatic.

[Ciaphas Cain]

Well I definitely agree that the bolters should be a bit more powerful (and speaking of more powerful, why did the beta turn my armor from ceramic titanium reinforced plating into tin foil?).

For fighting vehicles, they seem to be about accurate, as far as you can make them. They're essentially mini tank rounds, and as you may or may not know, it takes several large tank shots to take down one in the modern era, due to the combination of thick plating and outside explosives to deflect the blasts. I suppose it does make sense that Warhammer 40,000 would have not only better plating, but also something better in the way of deflecting blasts.

As for against things like people.. They should be more effective, definitely. I don't know if anyone's ever seen what happens to a bunker when a tank round gets in, or has played something like Battlefield where you get to drive a tank, and shoot people.. They turn into cat chow.

I think the biggest things hurting DoW right now, is the buggy campaign AI, and the lack of unit variety. Does anyone else think that the SM and the Orks got screwed at Tier 3? The Predator and Looted Tank do not match up to a Carnifex or the Avatar.

[Aliblabla]

The problem is that it's imbalanced. You want bolters that can kill light vehicles, you're going to want nuke-grade Plasma Cannons and tank-scrapping Plasma Guns, flamers that can melt buildings and Missile Launchers that can lock on from 500 miles away or something.

With the kind of map sizes in this game and its engine mechanics, it's not possible to represent SM weaponry in such a realistic fashion, because the maps do not have sufficient space to store the kind of armies that you'd need to kill a team of ten fluffy SMs.

[TheDeadlyShoe]

You can get some pretty good bolters in the mid and late game; some of them have absurd DPS, or knockback, which is beneficial for reasons that are apparent.

In my last game I used an uber-bolter with no reload on my FC after I got the instant kill chance ability. Even ignoring the regular damage, he fires very quickly with this bolter. This maximizes the chance he has of instant killing things, so he rips through tough troops. This was very useful fighting the Warboss with his Super Slugga spawns.

And midgame sometime I picked up a +60 health good DPS bolter which I tossed on Tarkus (along with the Armor of Terra) to make him unbelievable tough.

It's just that you only have so many squads and often you need that additional plasma damage against tougher targets.

[ThirdDanScoota]

Aliblabla, I'd really like to know where he asked for "realistic" bolter damage pwning everything in sight.

To be honest the Bolters I've picked up have been pretty subpar. A good example was a level 20 blue that had 44 DPS and a chance to cause a bit more damage per hit. Fairly unimpressive in the grand scheme of things, when you've got level 16+ green Storm Bolters sitting at over 70 DPS and better additional effects.
Could just be my luck, though.

[TheDeadlyShoe]

That's because terminator weapons stomp all over non-terminator weapons xD

Here's that bolter I was talking about

http://www.deadlyshoe.com/images/bolter.jpg

Huge rate of fire (good) plus instant kill chance per-shot (amazing) and suppression (OMG)

It's too bad you lose any and all melee special attacks when you give the FC a bolter.

[ThirdDanScoota]

Ah yes, I recall that one. I haven't made a ranged FC yet (Thunderhammers are just so damn sexy), so I've not experienced that combination. Maybe I'll give it a shot (no pun intended), though I rarely get the good drops.

Funny how that 13 green destroys a 20 blue, though. ;)

[Pocktio]

Anyone got the bolter with Deathwatch-special acid rounds? That thing cuts infantry to pieces.

[DeafMute]

Best bolter ive got is the bog standard blue which has insane melee dps.
Doesnt seem to cut it anymore on primarch against mobs sadly.
(just killed the eldar farseer)

[Steel*Faith]

Yea, i went back in tested. Bolters on Sergeant difficulty are quite effective, problem is I played on hard difficulty. Doesn't make the campaign feel as fluffy, so I went back to normal.

[enfant]

guys, i have a question, when bolters are equipped, how is the ranged damage reflected?

eg. i habe a bolter with 32dmg but a chance to inflict 20 dmg upon hitting the enemy and some other random shit

compared to a bolter with 50dmg with melee perks, lesser range and no ranged buffs

which one is better? the ranged dmg for the former bolter appears higher on my squad's profile but is it better than a bolter that deals consistent 50dmg with no ranged perks?

@ pocktio, i habe it, it is called "Brother's Keeper". will post screenies soon :spin:

[Exo]

Problem with the very high damage bolter is that it is -seriously- short on range, not just a little bit. Fine if you're planning on getting personal, but otherwise irritating.