D'Viere
22nd Dec 05, 4:49 AM
Having ideas is like yawning, infectuous. After reading that post with suggestions by Ghaawak , I’ve had an inspiration of sorts…. :banana:
To make Chaos even more interesting and Fluffy Fluffy, how ‘bout removing Zerks and Possessed separate production facilities and instead having CSMs become them, by “casting” those “upgrades” on CSM tacs, a-la Bloodthirster summoning ( after reaching necessary tier and having necessary buildings ).
Apart from even more fantastic FXs, it would occasionally shake up todays placid factory assembly line-like spamming, and also finally own up to the fact that Chaos army core ARE CSMs, and that they are the most important and widely used.
So it could be something like this, in the relevant building, (zerks/sacrificial pit , possessed/daemon pit) you build at a certain cost those “transformations”, they also can be allowed to pile up to a certain amount before being cast ,like the horrors, then select one icon and right click on a tac squad that has minimum 5 members for ‘zerking’ and 3 members for ‘possessing’ .
If there’s more than minimum in a squad ; E. g. it has an Aspiring Champ. and heavy weapons , say , 4 HBs and there are 9 members, it’d be separated into the new unit of 5 zerks and a unit of 3 CSMs retaining 3 HBs and Aspiring Champion.
This separation shouldn’t be difficult to create, I think, as we already have Aspiring Champs separate from their parent squad into Bloodthirsters.
There are several interesting variations of this transformation.
1. Zerks could be reinforceable (of course, for a higher cost than originating CSMs), but possessed would not. Or both could be not reinforceable. In both cases the minimum number of their start up squad would be increased
2. Have Asp. Champ., if there’s one with tac squad, transform into Zerk Champ, if he is not there then Zerks could get their own. No such thing for possessed , of course , they’d be powerful enough as it is.
3. For frugally minded, even the loss of heavy weapons can be reimbursed in this way: “build” those upgrades free of cost, only on casting it on a CSM squad would the resources be subtracted ,less of them (full or half price of heavy weapons) if the squad loses any heavy weaponry.'
4. CSMs have their Champs, Zerks have their Champs, for something really nasty , have BloodThirster be attachable to possessed as their Leader! :muffy:
As a Greater Daemon , he is, technically and theoretically.
5. And finally, although it seems “game = true to fluff” is a dreamland combination, this method of creating new units out of CSMs could allow to have Chaos Mark based units. That is, instead of berzerkers allround, only a World Eater player would get Zerkers from his CSMs, a Death Guard player would get Plague Marines, Emperor’s Children – Sonic Weaponry Marines, Thousand Sons - Upgraded marines with some Psyker powers, all of the above with different stats and capabilities, of course.
For the sake of simplification and conformity Chaos Undivided armies (Night Lords, Black Legion, Word Bearers etc) could apply any Mark of Chaos to their CSMs, but once one is applied they’d be able to build only that Mark’s upgrades for their CSMs.Possessed would remain Possessed for all.
:angel: Aaahh, dreaming on, what a variety and tactical choices would that bring to team games.
I am in trance now – Khornate armies should have a team of BloodLetters instead of Chaos Sorcerors, while Thousand Sons should get a second, more powerful Sorceror instead of Chaos Lord. Nurgle and Slaanesh followers would get the usual CL and CS, as would Chaos Undivided armies who choose their Marks. (It would be necessary to chose one of the four marks for Undivided on hitting Tier 2.) If Undivided chooses Khorne, then at Sac. Pit CS icon is greyed out and BloodLetters appear.If it is Tzeentch they choose , their Chaos Lord ( if active at the time) would be irreplaceable, but they would get the ability to build that second, more powerful Sorceror, once Chaos Lord dies.
All four Marks of Chaos should get their own Greater Daemons.
After all that’s the thing about Chaos, fundamental variety.
Eldar have their various aspects.
Orks are a pan-galactic variety show as it is.
Imperium of Man thrives on conformity. A Land Raider of Dark Angels is the same as Space Wolves’. A Leman Russ or Baneblade tanks are the same in Catachans or Valhallans divisions with only minor variations. Not to speak of lasguns.
***** ‘Crash!!!’ Ouch ^%$&^ ***** Ok, I’m back on earth.
:gnight:
* just can’t stop the flow, for the next patch, (if any), Zerkers should get morale , only on hitting zero , they won’t break but enter Frenzy , where they will move much faster, but take double damage from everything, except melee attacks.
So what do Citizens of 40,000, think of the above?
Edit: Whoops , sorry,posted in the wrong place. :gonemad:
Edit: Forgot to mention, for those two upgradations, of course you'd need free pop cap. Those new units would definetly take extra pop.
If the entire CSM squad is transformed ,5 Tacs were "zerked" into 5 Berzerkers, then the original pop cap of the Tac squad is gone and freed up.
To make Chaos even more interesting and Fluffy Fluffy, how ‘bout removing Zerks and Possessed separate production facilities and instead having CSMs become them, by “casting” those “upgrades” on CSM tacs, a-la Bloodthirster summoning ( after reaching necessary tier and having necessary buildings ).
Apart from even more fantastic FXs, it would occasionally shake up todays placid factory assembly line-like spamming, and also finally own up to the fact that Chaos army core ARE CSMs, and that they are the most important and widely used.
So it could be something like this, in the relevant building, (zerks/sacrificial pit , possessed/daemon pit) you build at a certain cost those “transformations”, they also can be allowed to pile up to a certain amount before being cast ,like the horrors, then select one icon and right click on a tac squad that has minimum 5 members for ‘zerking’ and 3 members for ‘possessing’ .
If there’s more than minimum in a squad ; E. g. it has an Aspiring Champ. and heavy weapons , say , 4 HBs and there are 9 members, it’d be separated into the new unit of 5 zerks and a unit of 3 CSMs retaining 3 HBs and Aspiring Champion.
This separation shouldn’t be difficult to create, I think, as we already have Aspiring Champs separate from their parent squad into Bloodthirsters.
There are several interesting variations of this transformation.
1. Zerks could be reinforceable (of course, for a higher cost than originating CSMs), but possessed would not. Or both could be not reinforceable. In both cases the minimum number of their start up squad would be increased
2. Have Asp. Champ., if there’s one with tac squad, transform into Zerk Champ, if he is not there then Zerks could get their own. No such thing for possessed , of course , they’d be powerful enough as it is.
3. For frugally minded, even the loss of heavy weapons can be reimbursed in this way: “build” those upgrades free of cost, only on casting it on a CSM squad would the resources be subtracted ,less of them (full or half price of heavy weapons) if the squad loses any heavy weaponry.'
4. CSMs have their Champs, Zerks have their Champs, for something really nasty , have BloodThirster be attachable to possessed as their Leader! :muffy:
As a Greater Daemon , he is, technically and theoretically.
5. And finally, although it seems “game = true to fluff” is a dreamland combination, this method of creating new units out of CSMs could allow to have Chaos Mark based units. That is, instead of berzerkers allround, only a World Eater player would get Zerkers from his CSMs, a Death Guard player would get Plague Marines, Emperor’s Children – Sonic Weaponry Marines, Thousand Sons - Upgraded marines with some Psyker powers, all of the above with different stats and capabilities, of course.
For the sake of simplification and conformity Chaos Undivided armies (Night Lords, Black Legion, Word Bearers etc) could apply any Mark of Chaos to their CSMs, but once one is applied they’d be able to build only that Mark’s upgrades for their CSMs.Possessed would remain Possessed for all.
:angel: Aaahh, dreaming on, what a variety and tactical choices would that bring to team games.
I am in trance now – Khornate armies should have a team of BloodLetters instead of Chaos Sorcerors, while Thousand Sons should get a second, more powerful Sorceror instead of Chaos Lord. Nurgle and Slaanesh followers would get the usual CL and CS, as would Chaos Undivided armies who choose their Marks. (It would be necessary to chose one of the four marks for Undivided on hitting Tier 2.) If Undivided chooses Khorne, then at Sac. Pit CS icon is greyed out and BloodLetters appear.If it is Tzeentch they choose , their Chaos Lord ( if active at the time) would be irreplaceable, but they would get the ability to build that second, more powerful Sorceror, once Chaos Lord dies.
All four Marks of Chaos should get their own Greater Daemons.
After all that’s the thing about Chaos, fundamental variety.
Eldar have their various aspects.
Orks are a pan-galactic variety show as it is.
Imperium of Man thrives on conformity. A Land Raider of Dark Angels is the same as Space Wolves’. A Leman Russ or Baneblade tanks are the same in Catachans or Valhallans divisions with only minor variations. Not to speak of lasguns.
***** ‘Crash!!!’ Ouch ^%$&^ ***** Ok, I’m back on earth.
:gnight:
* just can’t stop the flow, for the next patch, (if any), Zerkers should get morale , only on hitting zero , they won’t break but enter Frenzy , where they will move much faster, but take double damage from everything, except melee attacks.
So what do Citizens of 40,000, think of the above?
Edit: Whoops , sorry,posted in the wrong place. :gonemad:
Edit: Forgot to mention, for those two upgradations, of course you'd need free pop cap. Those new units would definetly take extra pop.
If the entire CSM squad is transformed ,5 Tacs were "zerked" into 5 Berzerkers, then the original pop cap of the Tac squad is gone and freed up.