DC 1.2 Sorc's Corruption

[DirtyCajun]

Issue: The corruption spell is too weak to see use.

The Example: Have you ever seen it use in Automatch?

The Fix: Buff the damage



Personally it's one of those upgrades you can't afford to buy because you won't get your money's worth. I so seldom see it used and never use it myself. It's T3 ability that can be run from if you cared. I think it should be brought in line to around the damage of Psychic Inquisition. Why is T2 ability> T3 ability? if they buffed the damage this thread would go away and it might actually find a use.

[Vipus]

fix = don't have it hurt friendly units (who thought of that crazy idea)

[DirtyCajun]

@psychodil: If by buff you mean make a useless upgrade useful then yes. I can not imagine they designed the ability and it's working to their vision. Besides a good SM T2 > early CSM T3.

I'm sure there are numerous other upgrades out there nobody uses but lets focus on this one. Yeah why do chaos spells cause FF when nobody else do (expect burna bomb). So let's drop the FF of corruption and increase damage.

[Blakey85]

Nah...i rather it just heals on a low rate for some time. I mean something like a +2 to healing rates over 30 seconds.
It wont be combat useful alot,but still useful.

Otherwise a damge buff is ok yeah.The FF has gotta go.

[GRIM Ripper]

already too much damaging abilities. how about a pretty significant morale drain for anyone who walks through it, and a slight slow of movement (-20%), plus the negligable damage that is already present.

yeah you need to make it worth something, but thats assuming chaos T3 gets nerfed in other areas bc right now its probably one of the best (if not THE best) T3's...

[Blakey85]

"
yeah you need to make it worth something, but thats assuming chaos T3 gets nerfed in other areas bc right now its probably one of the best (if not THE best) T3's.."

Screw that. It's strong...not imba. Fix the other guy's stuff,don't complain about chaos tier 3.

I'm on you that there are too many damge abilitys though. I rather it does something else beside damge.

[blackpaladin05]

Alright, a non-damage effect. How about it heals Chaos infantry within AoE?

[Blakey85]

I guess..chaos has not healing beside the building HP regen bonus.

[Ferryman]

I never use it, agree it's useless. It needs a change more than a buff. Maybe affects only buildings? I dont know, but chaos has many offensive spells/abilities, they should make it be different. Do something else.

[Zallis]

Hmmmm... maybe make it like a huge AoE marker light. It of course, would have to be toned down a bit though. Maybe something like negative cover to any units standing in it? Or just units standing in it take 25% more damage.

The only problem I see with this is that chaos already has a lot of damage buffing abilities, like berserk fury. Would probably be overkill....

Unless we make it morale damage? Any unit standing inside the little area takes 25% more morale damage? Again.... I see the potential for having a single PSM squad break a whole army.

My only other idea is to either slow down units in the thing AoE, or make it slow down production on the buildings you caught in its area of effect? IE, buildings that rain troops produce 10% slower.

[Fail_Kun]

How about, the sorc gains a percent of the damage dealt as health regen. So he can be kinda tanky. But then the spell would have to stick to units..

[DirtyCajun]

Anything to make it usefull would be nice. I don't like the moral damage as T3 armies tend to get around that easily with sargents in every squad revitalizing moral. I would like it to give maybe a little patch of land chaos can get a regen benefit from or make it like Eldar Eldritch storm where it hurts buildungs majorly. I like making it neg cove too or something to that effect. Just a use any use something more than right now :(

[Pure-instinct]

just give it like a 15% damage increase a 10% slowdown and a slight regen increase on the choas health that would be really good to cast in cc to slow down health regen and damage

[Vipus]

either buff it or take it out of the game, as it is now it's useless. Seriously

[SubakuGaara]

yeah you need to make it worth something, but thats assuming chaos T3 gets nerfed in other areas bc right now its probably one of the best (if not THE best) T3's...

Someone has to have the best t3. Last patch it was SM. Now its either chaos or eldar. Those plats are brutal and warpspiders are still deadly. SM t3 isn't bad either with 6000 HP predator tanks. But yeah, someone has to have the best.

IMO corruption sucks so much its ridiculous. But chaos t3 is pretty offensive. I will say that I've found that chaos t3 lacks building attacking power. When orks fight under their waagh banners, chaos can only win by retreating, massing as much as possible, then returning. On my SM account, ork's have no defense cause missiles are ridiculously good at base trash and there is the ultimate anti-turret farm weapon called the orbital bombard+ds dreads. I'd like to see chaos get an Anti building spell, but I fear it would be over powered. Maybe a spell that turns an asp champ into a possessed marine (LOL) or something or a summon of some temporary demon creature. Dunno.

[DirtyCajun]

I think it would be best to ether buff the crap outta it's building damage or give a regen bonuse to chaos units over it to support Zerks and PSM in CC.

[optimal_prism]

You can make corruption somewhat like soolar pulse, esxcept it gives you -20% movement reduction (as said earlier), and units in the area either cant shoot or get 75% more damage. And morale regeneration is lowered .

Make it like a NON-DAMAGING spell, but a spell that cripples enemy squads.

[Blakey85]

You already get chains. That's just a very buffed chains. Chaos has great melle units,that plus some mass 'not move' ability is going to make it imba.

[Zallis]

Hmmmmm, you do bring up a point about the majority of the chaos army lacking useful AB.

Maybe make it like a slightly buffed, mass version of the vespid thingy that took the place of shred with this patch? Forgot what its called.

[Blakey85]

Or maybe make it weaken building armor penetration for a couple of secs. I mean corrupting the inside so the building becomes weak >_<.

But since i'm heavy on defilers buildings don't pose too much of a challange to me.

[Gostface14]

i think it should heal as well, SM have apothacaries and chaplin, eldar have webway, and orks have mad dok. chaos have healing at there base but noone is gonna send there army back to there base to heal.

[Blakey85]

Eldar webways is the same thing. Common we're chaos! To zorg with healing just walk it off. Into the breach!!!

[fuggles]

Borrow the pariah max damage dynamic, give it to this spell as a temporary effect over a small AOE.

[Energizer Bunny]

Strong as Chaos are, this does need fixing

Personally I would prefer they completely changed the use of the spell, rather than buffing the existing one. They could change this for any number of uses - what about say, if the spell created an area in which Chaos units could not take damage for a small window of time (a sort of Chaos WOTE if you will - more powerful in that units would not get damage but less versatile in that the area would not move with the units).

[Azmodael]

Why not add a solar pulse then?

Seriously, the Chaos Sorcerer is already an extremely potent spellcaster. Curruption is crap, yes, but the hero doesn't need another extremely potent spell. this issue is best resolved with a buff on curuption, not with adding more extremely strong spells...

[Blakey85]

"Seriously, the Chaos Sorcerer is already an extremely potent spellcaster. Curruption is crap, yes, but the hero doesn't need another extremely potent spell. this issue is best resolved with a buff on curuption, not with adding more extremely strong spells..."

That's why the solar pulse ability add on has been ignored -_-'.
He's not that strong really.He's real good at being a chainer for zerks at tier 2,yeah...but other then that doombolt ain't really much and corruption is nothing.
It's been aching for a change for ages. The ideas here have been intersting,although farther discussing is needed. So why wont you just FoF your way out of here to your "BUFF EVERY UNIT ELDAR HAS PL0X" Threads every post in your entire time here has followed... .

[DoomBringer]

All we wont is a usful spell not obital bombardment or anything imba.

[Question]

I remember it being nerfed to its current level in WA because people kept complaining that chaining one squad and using corruption wiped out entire armies(i never understood this logic.).

The damage and cost needs to be buffed. As a T3 ability, its a joke. It has the power of a T1 army. Its really not THAT much better than psychic storm, and thats the worst damage spell in the game.

If i use it on an army that army should be forced to go "OH SHI-" and start running...just as if one had used psychic inquistion. Not go "Excuse me, wtf are you doing?" and shoot the sorc to pieces.

[Blakey85]

So what? Make another psychic inqusition? Lets just play on the safe side and don't make it another vannila damge ability.

[DoomBringer]

Each patch relic makes they have slowly made usless units or abilitys worth getting, is it to much to ask to make corruption usful, and while they are at it weaken resovle could do with a tweak.

[hermanJnr.]

To be honest, I long ago gave up hope on this being fixed...so please Relic, prove me wrong :awesome:

What it needs, in my opinion, is to heal Chaos units. Chaos has no other real healing, so this would actually make the ability useful. Or perhaps up morale...or drain enemy morale.
Or do damage.

Really, anything that makes it better than a pretty decal on the floor would be greatly appreciated.

There's something a little underwhelming when FC casts OB or Farseer casts ES, and I sit there watching my units die horribly, or at least getting lobbed about a lot.
Then, out comes Sorc with his Corruption, and the battle stops for a minute to unleash an embarassed silence. Then a snigger. :rolleyes:

Honestly though, it just needs a useful purpose. Right now I don't even bother researching it 90% of the time, Chains of Torment does a far better (useful) job anyway, and Doombolt is actually more useful too imo.

[Blakey85]

I want a building armor reducer ;(

[Zallis]

Someone once told me that chains and corruption deal roughly the same damage. Can anyone verify that?

[SirNick]

Yes, yes it does, at least over the same time span.

Checking numbers and stats is fun.

http://wiki.reliccommunity.com/Chaos_Sorcerer

Corruption does 12-15 DPS for 15 seconds in its AoE. Chains does 80-100 damage and it lasts 10 seconds.

So for that first 10 seconds of Corruption that's another 120-150 damage.

So, if you use Chains on a unit, then Corruption, that's guaranteed extra damage for a total of 200-250 damage.

Then Doom Bolt does 125-150 damage if all 5 bolts hit, in a nice radius.

Use Doom Bolt on top of all that and that's 325-400 damage to a single squad, all said and done. Plus a little change left over from the last couple of seconds of Corruption.

That's a pretty huge chunk of life out of most squads.

So, I think Corruption's really intended more to supplement Chains of Torment than it is to actually be used independently.

[Zallis]

Yeah. Given the time difference. It seems that you should place corruption on an area first, then chain a unit down. Right now though, I'd rather chain something down and just rip it to shreds with zerkers of the sorc.

[Pellucid]

Wait, how about a WAY more simple solution here instead of buffing it and possibly creating an imba situation?

Just give it to him out of the box or as part of the basic hero upgrades. Voila. Now it's free damage.

[DirtyCajun]

I'd go for that Pellucid. Anything to make my upgrades funtional even if in mean making them innate. Personally I like the healing idea the best as Chaos does come out on the lacking end in that area. To get any kinda decent healing you have to go back to base right now with is just asking to be mowed down by range or some other nasty trick while you try to get the injured fighting ready again. Even Eldar can cloak a webway with healing aura near the frontlines. IG well don't commies give them a nice little regen? Anywho there are several good ideas in this thread I hope somebody "qausi-official" sees it and implements something (though I doubt this thread will get any credit for it :P)

[SubakuGaara]

Nah. That'd be imba.

It has to be something strategic. My best suggestion is a teleport spell that sends a single enemy unit/squad to any visible location on the map that the sorcerer desires. Not too great but possibly useful enough. And that spell doesn't even kill anything.

[DirtyCajun]

DUDE! Subaku! I'd abuse that! I'd teleport your zerks ontop of the buildings in Fallen CITY. Or teleport 1 squad into neg cover surroundered by HB's :p

[Zallis]

That would be a nice spell, but then it really doesn't have anything to do with corruption, does it? Still, they could just change the name into something else.

Personally, I don't think healing is that much needed. It'd be nice, yes, but I don't seem to find that Chaos is in dire need of healing stuff. Besides, I still don't think the cost would be worth it if it's only going to heal your troops, unless it also damaged enemy troops as well. Then I might be tempted to buy it.

I wouldn't mind if the spell caused your units to gain the damage they deal back in health. That would be very interesting, but most likely imba. Could you imagine PSM running in and gaining back the damage they deal in HP? But if it caused just a set healing effect, then the PSM would still be really damn durable and hard to kill within that thing.

[ImmortalChaos]

I think he ment teleporting your own units, not your enemies. That would be impossible to balance for every map. Teleporing an enemy unit on top of a building(especailly when that unit has no means of getting off said building) would be game breaking.

[SubakuGaara]

actually I don't care which (either enemy or foe but not ubers), just teleport it to some spot on the map; and again, that spot has to be immediately visible with no fog of war present.

BTW, I'm quite sure that there are no spots on any map to which you can teleport yet not walk around. I am nearly 100 percent sure so I really don't see any issues with this alleged spell. You see, if there were spots to which you could teleport yet could not reach by walking, people would abuse them; you'd see oblits doing it and warp spiders and so on. Yet I've never seen it. Worst I've seen is a glitch with a nec lord where he warped off the map. The building on fallen city that you're talking about has a long path and you can walk up there with any unit you want. However on titan's fall, the buildings aren't actually part of the map and so you can't teleport up there. Ihope it helps.

At best this spell would be annoying to have your commander ported away from his army and have to walk back, or teleporting a unit into where its surrounded by enemy units. Thats about the worst you'll get from this spell and keep in mind its t3.

[ImmortalChaos]

Fallen city has a rooftop where you must teleport/jump off of. As do a bunch of team game maps and some non auto 1v1 maps. FC is the only auto once I can recal with it, but it would still be nasty- Over time youd have their entire army up there. They would have to delete it.

[Gostface14]

yeh there are still maps you can jump around onto buildings and such.

[SubakuGaara]

OH... I DID NOT KNOW. THEN I SUPPOSE IT HAS TO BE A TEAM ONLY SPELL. FORGIVE THE CAPS LOCKS.

[FriedChicken]

Would be nice if they upped the damage on it drastically and removed the friendly fire aspect of it. At least that way we could get a chance to try and use it as its intended, because right now its utterly useless.

The friendly fire aspect of it is rediculous for Chaos with the amount of melee focused units they have.

[Blakey85]

It's not weird..just aim way from your melle troops,It's not that hard.

Also damge upped "drastically" sounds rather harsh. It does around the 200 range if you sit it out.

[FriedChicken]

I really don't think that the 200dmg really cuts it for a T3 ability though, don't you think?

Thats also 200 damage, on the high end. If you can manage to get the full effect in, I just think it should have much more of an impact than 200 damage.

[Pellucid]

So what you're proposing is that we give the Sorc the old "Let it Burn." Yeah, that sounds fair. :rolleyes:

Look, we need to get all of these uberabilities OUT of the game, not put more in.

[Blakey85]

Err...IG opinions don't really fit with other races logic. If it was a SM player posting here he'd be saying "Sure,i'll just walk it off".

Like i said,i rather it does something other then damge. We're freaking chaos and we ain't got enough cool dark powers.Make it do something cool.

Ideas i liked and have been posted so far - Make it summon some deamons or something & lower penetration values of buildings for a while.

[Zallis]

Here's another interesting idea. Make a targetted enemy squad go psycho, giving them a massive attack boost but attacking anything they damn well please, perhaps putting closer squads as a higher priority?

Another idea along the lines of making a targetted squad go nuts is to make any targetted squad switch to CC for a time, while giving them a CC attack boost. The idea is to force a player to arbitrarily use his normally shooty troops in CC, but still let them do damage. Since shooty units tend to be less durable than melee units (TEND, not always the case... with termies and WS and Oblits and so forth...... my god) it still presents the chaos player an advantage to engage that thing with his own melee units.

[Pellucid]

Err...IG opinions don't really fit with other races logic. If it was a SM player posting here he'd be saying "Sure,i'll just walk it off".IG are a part of this game and need to be balanced around just as much as any other race does.

[DirtyCajun]

Guys I'd like to keep things realistic. Something Relic could potentially fix in a small patch. Though game changing abilities COULD be cool they are a bit out of the question. Relic could however play around with the damage values pretty easily.

[Zallis]

Another idea is a changing corruption to a mobile heavy cover for chaos troops, or maybe a version of WotE that requires units to stay in it.

Personally, I'd rather see a spell change rather than just a damage buff. Chaos already seems to have tons of damage-heavy things.

[Pellucid]

Relic could however play around with the damage values pretty easily.Or remove the need to research it.

[Zallis]

Oh yes, changing spells entirely. Look at shred please. Changed entirely within a patch.

[Compeador]

Chaos has plenty of damage options. Ever tried chains, corruption and doombolt all on one fully reinforced tac/reaper/GM/FW squad? Talk about getting your money's worth....

[Blakey85]

Ahh..if we're talking about tier 3..the only ones that would be dead from that would be the GM. Others on critical,but still kicking.

[fs_xyz]

Just remove the friendly fire part.

[Zallis]

^ Not really going to make it worth a damn still.

Corruption couldn't kil cultists when I tried it back in WA, and I don't think it's been buffed at all since then (maybe it has. Dunno).

Removing FF would be nice, but it's not exactly a buff. Given that a WW is the god of artillery, yet they don't do FF, (neither does PI now for that matter) I think it should be a given that it shouldn't do FF. But that isn't a buff, nor is it going to make it any useful. When the hell are you gonna send your shit through it and care? Never. As for CC troops, last time I checked, Chaos CC troops are amongst, if not THE best, and corruption wouldn't make a damn difference to them, whether it did FF or not.

[Apogee]

I think it would work well as a massive area-effect spell that did minor damage to all enemy units (vehicles too) and caused a minor healing effect to all Chaos units (vehicles too!). Would make it different, useful, and not game breaking.

[Walter o' dim]

to basically say what i said in the 'chaos horrors' thread, i think corruption should be changed into a one-shot temporary really high regen rate on one unit or squad, have it heal like 100 or 150 (those numbers are just examples i hve no idea if they are relavant so pls dont get angry : D) hp over something like 10 seconds, something along those lines

[SubakuGaara]

Would prefer to have a spell thats a bit more useful. Maybe a spell that targets one of your squads and causes all damage absorbed by that squad to be reflected back to the attackers for 15 seconds. Not to oped, but relatively useful.

Or a doppelganger spell that makes a fighting copy or clone of any enemy unit/squad (even uber) that lasts for 15 seconds. You can even call that spell "bunshin no jutsu"... (some people will die laughing). Would really like to have that spell though.

[Pellucid]

Would prefer to have a spell thats a bit more useful. Maybe a spell that targets one of your squads and causes all damage absorbed by that squad to be reflected back to the attackers for 15 seconds. Not to oped, but relatively useful.Errr, that's not too OP'd? Basically you get a free unit for 15 seconds, probably something like a Kasrkin squad or a Terminator squad. It would be downright broken against IG, who could devastate their own formations in seconds. Cultists with 'nades would instantly gib themselves, too.

[Blakey85]

I'd use the lightning field logic for this one " Just don't attck him. Leave him alone. It can't be that bad "

[Hiroshi_Tea]

ah yeah
and what is LF?
Opedness

[dreddnott]

I'd like to see Corruption as more of a strategic and less of a tactical ability - to this end, I would keep the damage rate per second the same but increase the affected area by 50% and double or treble the duration of the spell.