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View Full Version : Variable weather conditions and LoS/FoW



jon_the_d
23rd May 08, 4:55 AM
kind of following on from the discussion about how far units should be able to see and shoot, I realised how much I would love for them to implement variable weather (choosable in multiplayer, or set to random).

The different weather conditions would not only affect the look and feel of the whole battle, but could also be used to drastically change the strategies players will adapt.

For example:
Clear - The sun(s) are out and it's a beautiful day, units can see much further than usual.
Cloudy - There's a slight haze and dimness, units can't see quite as far as on a clear day.
Rain - The rain makes it hard to see very far, and accuracy and movement speed could have slight penalties all round (for troops at least).
Snow - even worse visibility than rain, and a greater penalty to movement.
Fog - Thick fog makes it hard to see further than your pistol will shoot. severe penalties to visibility (Fog of War very close to the units)
Storm! - The skies are blackened and the heavens have opened. The map is dark and the rain hinders visibility and movement to a greater extent than just "rain". Lightning flashes intermittently, briefly illuminating the map and giving the units a split second of increased visibility, before the darkness returns to envelope them.
Night! - Darkness, severe penalties to visibility, and a very ominous feel to the map, with the small glowing lights of weapons and armour dancing through the blackness. explosions would briefly illuminate areas, and weapons fire will trace through the dark.

-Or...
Time of day could be implemented separately (chosen for MP, or randomly selected for campaign missions, unless you launched the attack in which case you can choose), and then players would set time of day and weather condition for each battle. eg:
Day - daylight
Twilight - slightly dimmer with a slight penalty to visibility, and with a nice sunset flare to all the buildings and units, long shadows etc.
Night - night (as earlier)

The time of day needn't be a separate setting, perhaps just the settings listed at the top of the page would be enough.

Anyway, If visibility was implemented so that units can see a lot further than what they can currently in DOW(ie, Fog of War is much further back), but that weather conditions will dramatically reduce this visibility range (effectively of course, fog of war being closer to the units), it will mean that certain maps will have to be approached in vastly different ways, with long range snipers and heavy support weapons not being much use in the Fog or dark for example, and CC troops being much more sensible. but on a clear day, they can stan da top of hill and rain hell down on the enemy, and the enemy will have to be prepared to take them out asap, or make use of the terrain and buildings to avoid their fire.

overall, this would breathe so much life into just a few maps, would add so much atmosphere to the game, and add so many extra levels to tactics and strategy.

I think it would Rock.

what do you guys think?

Mind Strike
23rd May 08, 5:53 AM
Rain or Snow

It would be good to have rain/snow hindering invisibility by sticking to armour thus creating an accuracy advantage to the enemy.

An opposite argument to this would be the accuarcy disadvantage to the enemy because they are trying to shoot through a blizzard or deluge.

The limiting factor would therefore be range

Warp Holder
23rd May 08, 9:36 AM
How many weather variations were there in CoH: OF? Perhaps weather work will be like that.

Versian
23rd May 08, 10:16 AM
It would make the game more realistic, but the visual effects should be optimized. Snow was hated in empire earth 2 because everytime a blizzard showed up, computers would lag big time.

Otherwise, I'm all for it.

Thuraash
23rd May 08, 10:41 PM
Jon, have you played CoH? They've implemented just about all the effects you're talking about, including lightning. (People, PLEASE don't start talking about how units should be randomly struck by lightning... C&C Tiberian Sun did it right, by making Ion Storms a massive, game-altering hazard for all players, but really, those were crazy storms and it was STILL ridiculously aggravating to lose units to lightning!) The effect was strictly visual, but I wish it had some limited strategic consequences, like wheeled vehicles being a bit slower, infantry being a bit slower, shooting slightly less accurately, and with slightly less visual range in the rain or storms. They also implemented Dawn/Day/Dusk/Night, which was locked with given weather conditions.

Warp Holder, they have a pretty nice variety, but no map has more than two time/weather options. They've got clear, rain, storms and Dawn/Day/Dusk/Night. Maybe cloudy too... don't remember. It's a cool little feature, and really spices up the visuals.

Norsehound
23rd May 08, 10:50 PM
I'd be all for setting weather variables before an SP match.

Thuraash
23rd May 08, 10:52 PM
I would go for it in MP as well! Just another part of the map.

jon_the_d
24th May 08, 1:20 AM
I haven't played CoH much, my computer couldn't run it very well when I bought it on release, and I got into other games.

But yeah, my main addition is to make it NOT just purely visual. What I'm suggesting here, apart from the varied visuals, is to make it dramatically affect units visibility, forcing whole new tactics and strategies on what is essentially the same map.

Compare a map played in "clear" to the same map played in "Fog". If "fog" reduced units visibility (how far they can see; ie: how far away from them the fog of war is) to pistol range, and "clear" was equivalent to roughly double what we're used to in DOW, The way you'd approach a map would be completely different, and the units you'd decide were best for the job would be completely different too.

Then add in movement penalties and accuracy penalties, and you've essentiallt turned one map into about 7. In terms of multiplayer, if people don't like the more extreme settings (very far sight, very close sight) then they can just set their games to the setting they prefer.

Imagine walking through the fog, barely able to see 5 metres in front of you, and all of a sudden you get attacked from both sides by banshees!!! or better yet: genestealers!!

how much would you jump! awesome!

LowlyGrunt
24th May 08, 6:15 AM
Since this all takes place on other planets, what about dangerous weather effects, like the ion storms in C&C2? Acid rain for instance? It could add a new dimension if certain areas became impassable to certain units for a while. Or it could just be annoying, I'm not sure.

Weather in CoH:OF was origanally intended to alter the gameplay - tanks stuck in mud etc - but they decided against it in the end.

jon_the_d
24th May 08, 7:12 AM
dangerous weather gets a great big NO!!!! from me. as does any kind of localised weather (it's raining in the bottom left corner of the map...-_-)

Tanks randomly getting stuck in mud sounds really lame too.

Any weather affect should affect the battle field on a global scale, and not throw up anything unexpected.

eg: It's foggy, I better plan my strategy around the fact that me and my opponent will not be able to see very far. end of.

NOT: It's raining....omg my tanks have all got stuck, omg god my comander has fallen in a puddle and can't get up. omg the mud has splashed on my troops eyes and they're running around blind. omg my half my troops guns have jammed....etc.

no surprises, just strategy altering affects.