Hmm so far... On primarch

[CommissarRezail]

Well my setup on most missions now seem to be.

My hero : with melee weapons

Tac sqaud, with plasma or flamer

scouts/ always with shot gun

hwt/ missle launcher

last assualt sqauds with melee weapons as well.

Some of these mission on primarch is hardd as frack and the one with the waith walker

Its waaay to hard to get around those platforms. I tried using assualt sqauds to jump to them but they will get eaten up by hordes of fire. Then i tried the scouts and their shot guns along with hwt and missle launcher but their range doesn't exent as far with plats.

So only way i get to the plats in the mission >.< is to put a sheild around the hero and send him in hoping to kill the plat.

Once i finaly made it to the darn waith walker, he uses a ability that wiped out all my men except the hero. The hero was taken down by the warlocs around the waith walker...

anyone know a better way of killing plats warlocs and that damn waith walker hero?

[Ap0k]

Gonna move this one to general strategy since it's not really dealing with multiplayer stuff (my bad, since I forgot to specifiy that part when I was setting up the sections).

[Hirmetrium]

I think that on Primarch, you need scouts. They get an instant revive skill and permenant cloaking, and revive while cloaked - later on that means safe revives, and your ALWAYS covered. Considering that the problem with scouts is that their fragile, this definately covers that issue.

I found that emperor shrines to improve troop toughness and the invinciblity skill are pretty much requirements.

[Brenil]

Yeah, something I've noted on the difficulty below Primarch (damned if I can remember it, captain, commander... something) is that Assault Marines are very, very, very squishy and are only useful for the initial shock and fighting other troops so long as there is nothing behind them (which rarely happens if you jump them in first). Therefore, the best thing I've found a use for are indeed scouts.

Scouts specced into the energy tree can:

- Rez commanders while stealthed.
- Stealth near enemy positions and sit there allowing you valuable intel on how best to assault a position.
- Use a myriad of abilities like flash bangs, frag grenades, demo charges, and even drop turrets.
- Sniper rifle. Sniper rifle. SNIPER RIFLE. Forget the Shotgun from multiplayer, the sniper rifle is where it is at with scouts. The mark target is an instant kill for most enemies and really helps when you assassinate a key target (like Tyranid synapse creatures).

A good way to take out entrenched Eldar platforms (such as on that mission you mentioned) is to sneak your scout squads near cover right next to the position and either use a demo charge, a frag grenade, or flashbang to begin the assault. Then jump your troops in behind the target and move your other two squads up (Devs or tacs with your commander).

This seems to work more often than not, but it takes care because if you overlook any intelligence you'll take heavy losses. So while it may be boring, plan every assault ahead of time, don't just rush in and expect to win, because as I've found out... you won't.

[konfeta]

I concur. Thaddeus is worthless beyond having a jump on Primarch, at least until you get him abilities that increase his survivability long enough for your other troops to suppress/disrupt the bad guys.

So far, for me, the most useful assets are heavy weapons and nades. The commander's melee and Cyrus's sniper rifle special ability is a close second (it one shots platforms, warp spiders, and synapse creatures, but it's not that hot against Orks. Use shotguns against Orks IMO).


I really wonder, though, how would make your team entirely ranged work out? Two heavy weapon users, two equivalent to ranged Tacs, and Cyrus for replacing one for support when needed.

[Brenil]

On Primarch difficulty I imagine having a ranged specced Assault Marines would work out very well, jump into them for shock value, melee platforms, then take cover and lay down covering fire while the other units move into position.

According to the equipment and abilities for the commander, ranged appears to be extremely viable. Not to mention the terminator armor upgrade for Avitus which turns his entire squad into terminators wielding assault cannons.

I think my next play through I'll go with unorthodox specced units.

[brn4meplz]

I got no problem on Primarch, I take some losses but it's expected. The wraith lord wasn't that bad my FC solo'd it to 1/4 life and the missile launcher did the rest. It's the Lictor's that are hard to fight, they will flesh hook your leaders and kill the entire squad.

When i used Thaddeus i gave him Flash bangs. Jump in throw flashbang at feet clean up the mess. Of course my FC also had a Jump pack then and could jump on anyone else i saw behind what Thaddeus was hitting.

[Akranadas]

I like Thaddeus, I'm specing him to power weapons and health, he suppresses when he jumps on troops, as well as killing them.

For my Tacs, I'm going to spec them toward melee weapons; so I can triple up on the melee power to add with the extra suppression. Plus, Nades and charge in works well :D

I tend only to bring the scouts when I for the sniper rifle and satchel charges; not much else as I find them die rather easy.

Devastators, specing him to be my support platform. So he's got extra equipment slot; and putting more points into the melee tree.

FC at the moment has Power fist and Iron halo; trying to get the regen of his energy up more so he can be unstoppable.

[Brenil]

I tend only to bring the scouts when I for the sniper rifle and satchel charges; not much else as I find them die rather easy.

Oddly enough, I've found scouts to be one of the best units to field for almost every situation. Their mark target with a sniper rifle (especially a good one) one-shots most synapse creatures, causing them to fight amongst themselves (I love that) and if you have the Forge World sniper rifle, you can actually take out vehicles with it. Then there's the shotgun mark target which is actually good against vehicles as well and has the usual disperison knockback expected from a shotgun.

Yet, the best value scouts have is their ability to gain intelligence and to properly start off an assault with flashbangs, frags, or demo charges. The ability to almost always sneak up close, see what you're facing, and then incapacitate your enemies moments before your assault makes them invaluable.

The only time I've found scouts lacking are in missions where you require alot of firepower, but even then they still can hold their weight if they're kitted properly.

I find it rather strange I'm advocating scouts, seeing as I've never been a fan of them in the past game, or in fluff; but they're damn neat in Dawn of War II.

[Hirmetrium]

If your sternguard, swap to mastercrafted frags and give Cyrus your frags. You get truely amazing results with 2x the normal amount of frags. Also, you can infiltration > frag targets.

I can't reiterate how AWESOME Cyrus is with sniper rifle, like Brenil. He's slowed an entire side of one map with his skills on a lower difficulty, while the other 3 struggle and get constantly supressed/mauled. Snipe > frag > High powered shot > finish off.

[konfeta]

Can you get a second set of frag nades without Sternguard?

Like, the more I look at it, the more I realize how absurdly easier the game becomes if one has access to pre-order unlocks.

Guaranteed equipment on one hand, a metric ton of extra XP on another hand, and that healing banner thing + nades...

[CommissarRezail]

So far with 3 termi suits things gotten more steady not easier but steady enough i can use tactics to live for more then 3 seconds.

The dread dies alot, i found it hard to use :(

[Xiemos]

Yeah the dread seems to fall over dead from full hp to none for no apparent reason. Had that happen when he was attacking a lone group of shoota boyz..I was like eh? Also noticed that on the eldar defense missions, even with terminators, the warlock squad leaders lightning attack 1 shots anything :|
group of guardians kill dread/commander/couple terms in like 3 seconds, lol

[Grov]

Got toally anialted on the wraith lord mission. Got to it ok, but it wasn't even close, how are you supposed to defeat it? Not very impressed so far, im gettin bored ive had the same units for ages now, where the fuck are my dreads?

[Matmoz]

Got toally anialted on the wraith lord mission. Got to it ok, but it wasn't even close, how are you supposed to defeat it? Not very impressed so far, im gettin bored ive had the same units for ages now, where the fuck are my dreads?

I did it by hanging my commander in the back, with the healing stone thingy for AOE ressing just in case, and advancing my dev squad to take pot shots at the wraithlord then retreating. I attacked from the north side. The assault squad is useless in this fight.

It's a stupid boss and it's not the last one. There are no tactics involved, just hit-and-run. Piss boring. But just wait til you have to start defending against tyranid swarms.... it's a stupid heal fest. Your squads go down extremely fast, even when standing right next to the reinforcement point.

That's what grinds my gears the most with this campaign, there are no tactics other than squad preservation.

EDIT: Played co-op after I wrote this. Good times were had by all. The campaign suddenly became excellent. Great stuff!

[Ixal]

I got no problem on Primarch, I take some losses but it's expected. The wraith lord wasn't that bad my FC solo'd it to 1/4 life and the missile launcher did the rest. It's the Lictor's that are hard to fight, they will flesh hook your leaders and kill the entire squad.


I have a hard time imagining that a FC alone can do several ten thousand points of damage to that walker and stay alive during the whole time, especially when the other eldar units also join the battle.

[Midgetus]

I imagine if he's got high toughness and is using stimulants and rally as soon as the cooldown ends (and has lots of stimulants) it should at least be possible, provided the other troops are keeping the seer council away from the FC.

[Private]

Day 21. Can someone tell me how no earth can I defend against looted tank boss charging at defended shrine, two-shoot killing everyone, including Force Commander with 680 HP and 50 armor, having no other AV possibilities other than demolition packs and melta bombs that literally scratches a paintjob? Of course I could swap heavy bolter to a rocket launcher to have a bit more AV firepower but then I would be squished by a mob of elite ork infantry. Don’t get wrong I know it is the highest difficulty setting, but I would like to have at least chance to succeed, especially that one day earlier I had close encounter with killa can boss that required only one melta bomb to be send to orky heaven.

[CommissarRezail]

Melta bombs are your friend if you find melta bombs, it will help alot. ALso the dread is meh, until you can get it fully kitted out. Then it can handle several crowds of enemies pretty well.

For the singing spears i use my scouts to snipe them, with special skill. Since they one shot you sooo easy.

For the dread it helps to find more wargear for it. since there alot of it.

I love when i equiped this assualt cannon and he was actualy ripping through crowds.

The only problem is the dread and termies have a hard time staying still to shoot anything.

[Warskull]

Playing on primarch here is what I've found.

Scouts are amazing, get Cyrus a sniper rifle and he solves so many of your problems. On primarch high powered shot one-shots platforms, enemies in buildings, tyranid warriors, and the Tyranid spore turrets. With a sniper rifle and a set of frags he will be able to take pretty much anything.

Blind grenades are your best friend, they work very well on ASM also. Blind grenades can be thrown with impunity as they do not stun your own troops. This is huge as they disable many bosses and can make enemy infantry (even banshees and sluggas) easy fodder for your melee.

The shrines are your most important item. Each one gets you one use of invincibility. It will save your ass many times over.

You can only have 9 of each limited use item stocked up, don't be afraid to use them. Using more than 3-4 in a boss fight is rare.

Look into a ranged commander, I know it sounds crazy. However, you have to take your commander into every fight with you. Having him highly flexible (some melee and some ranged) is useful. If he can't take heavy weapons the only way to get missile launchers is via Avitus. Avitus's heavy bolter is one of the deadliest weapons you have access too.

Be highly flexible in what squads/units you take.

[konfeta]

Ranged Commander is a mixed bag. You will really miss having him rip things up that try to melee your guys, but his damage output at range is fairly respectable. He loses his monstrous melee damage output, but he can now contribute to every fight from the very beggining, which evens it out.

The biggest problem with him is, that using a Heavy Weapon (HB, ML, or PC) removes your ability to use his Commander gear slot... Which is painful enough for me to pinch him into using a normal Plasmagun. The banner is just too good - instant suppression break and a free full HP heal for 50 energy. Alternatively, the Iron Halo makes him an uber tank, especially if you get one that adds +mad amounts of armor. Even teleport or jump packs are more useful than a heavy weapon on him. That's fairly dissapointing, I was really looking forward to having two heavy weapons teams.

That said, I don't regret try out a ranged commander. He can still cover your guys in melee with his charge ability, and his close proximity to your Avitus/Tarkus squad ensures that your Battlecry/Focus Fire combo is an emergency "kill everything in front of you" ability. Plus, having an all ranged team makes boss fights a breeze as you don't have to worry about some moron charging into melee to get 1-2 shotted while you micro squads away from grenades/etc.


Overall, now that I played around with Thadius a little using Arkandas advice, I believe that none of the squads are useless. All you really need is to give everyone an extra accessory slot (or at the very least, Tarkus, Commander, and Cyrus) - the key to making any squad composition work is intelligent use of grenades, turrets, artillery, rosarius.

Every single one of accessory slot babies are godly.

1. Frag grenades are universal - wipe out crowds, cover, heavy weapons, garrisons, melee charges, carve out a chunk from vehicles and bosses. Your best friends, and if you have Stenguard Wargear, they are doubly your best friends.

2. Blind Grenades are excellent - they completely shut down infantry, leaving them open for a follow up frag, an Avitus set up in front of them, hell, even a det pack.

3. Detpacks are fairly difficult to use, but they work out great. Main use is to conserve Frags while emptying buildings, trashing large amounts of cover, forcing heavy weapon platforms to move, conjunction with Blind Nades to wipe out armies. These are also excellent against bosses when they charge up an attack and do a number on vehicles if they hit - 1 shotting Carnifexes NP. Lastly, they are your best bet for bringing down buildings/turrets.

4. Melta bombs 1 shot Falcons, and bring Wraithlords to 10% HP, where a few normal Plasmagun shots can wipe them out. Nothing else to say about them, AV grenades are AV grenades.

5. Proximity mines - at first I thought they were useless. Then, I realized that you could simply have Cyrus walk up to, well, anything and plant them right at their feat. Cyrus stopped being support and became a Death Machine. It's a little tricky to use at first because he becomes detected for a few seconds, but once you have "Place stuff without becoming detected", well, Jesus Christ, Cyrus is a one man army. With Sniper/Shotty (specialist ammunition), Proximity Mines, Det Packs, and Grenades he can pretty much solo any mission outside of bosses.

6. Turrets are mostly for defense missions, covering your flank in missions where enemy respawns, and boss fights. In boss fights, they add a decent amount of damage or distract them, acting as meat shields.

7. Artillery - well, not much to say about it. Softens and disrupts things up at range. I mostly use this as an emergency explosive - if I see a pair of platforms pulling up and setting up, they eat it ASAP.

8. Rosarius - the main use for this is to keep your Resilience score up. You shouldn't have much difficulty recovering your troops at boos fights if they get downed, nor escaping massive enemy forces thanks to the handy retreat button, so mostly use this if you see your a squad about to go down and feel that you can prevent such slip ups in the future.

I haven't yet tried out the Drop Pod, Orbital Bombardment, or Remote Det Pack; but if all the previous items are of any indication, these will be tremendously useful.

[Warskull]

I find artillery quite nice, I think of it as a long range frag. If you have Cyrus scout out a target you can usually blast a large cluster of enemy units. You see a few really good artillery points per area.

I find using detpacks to blow up cover works wonders. This is especially true in defensive missions. If the enemy is taking cover in a specific area, just blow up the green cover. This is less effective on offense, but you can still use it to save frags on buildings.

[Herro]

Orbital Bombard is insanely good. You can get up to two uses per mission I believe, and lately I have been using it to soften up bosses. An Avitar with almost 300k HP seemed nigh impossible, but after two Orbital Bombards he was actually somewhat managable. Playing on Primarch makes me wish I had gone ranged spec on the FC because now he pretty much dies instantly the second he gets into a scrap with anything.

Also, I wonder if anybody else has realized how insanely awesome the special shot you get with the shotgun is. I thought it was bugged at first, but if you shoot at a target that's behind a lot of stuff, pretty much everything inbetween gets gibkilled. Nids, nobs, lootax, the hated seer council, everything. The shotgun damage on the shotgun I have is pretty low other than that for the stage in the game I'm at, but except for a few missions I always use the shotgun simply because that shot is so amazingly powerful.

[konfeta]

All three Scout weapons are very good when you have their special abilities unlocked.

1. Sniper Shot just murders Platforms/Synapse Creatures/Warlocks/etc.
2. Explosive is excellent at softening up, finishing off, and ruining the day of multiple targets.
3. Immolate, well, let's just say that Immolate + Use Abilities while Infiltrated means Cyrus is an Angel of Death.

[Asiriya]

Am I just crap, or does everyone find their troops go down in no time on Primarch? I'm wondering if the constant retreating is why I'm not enjoying the game. I wouldn't say it's hard, just boring.

[hellic]

Orbital Bombard is insanely good. You can get up to two uses per mission I believe, and lately I have been using it to soften up bosses. An Avitar with almost 300k HP seemed nigh impossible, but after two Orbital Bombards he was actually somewhat managable. Playing on Primarch makes me wish I had gone ranged spec on the FC because now he pretty much dies instantly the second he gets into a scrap with anything.
Hm, I thought OB was limited to 1 per game. My FC is an absolute tank on Primarch. I went with a pure health and melee set-up, with only enough will to get his extra accessory slot. By around level 15, he had more than 800 effective health and an over 100 armor rating with the Iron Halo, good armor, and some purification seals.

Now he's level 20 with 1300 effective health and more armor (~150) than my Termies.


Am I just crap, or does everyone find their troops go down in no time on Primarch? I'm wondering if the constant retreating is why I'm not enjoying the game. I wouldn't say it's hard, just boring.Use your scouts to scout and/or soften the enemy up with explosives. If you plan your attack accordingly, you shouldn't be mobbed. Also, spam your stimpacks if you're dying. You can always get more.

[Old Painless]

For plats i use frags, its a one shot deal, i use the FC because he has an ability that means he cant be surpressed by the plats, you have to make use of heavy cover in every possible situation and advance in small steps.

Primarch is very hard. Which is good. I find the ASM die too easily in most situations without using an insane amount of accessories.

Flamers have an irritatingly low range.

[konfeta]

Flamers + Scouts = GG mobile.

My absolutely favorite Scout set up now is Flamer + Remote Det Packs + Melta Bombs. Cyrus literally dismantles armies by his lonesome, the only thing that seems to even compare to his destructive potential is the Assault Cannon's special ability on a Dred (Which 1 shots Carnifixes... Holy shit...)

Remote Det Packs are HILARIOUSLY overpowered. Walk up to an entire encampent, set one down, walk away, watch everything get turned into tiny meat chunks.

Reminds me of Silent Storm demolitions, actually.

The weirdest part about this, though, is that Remote Det Packs do higher damage against everything than the normal kind... except it barely tickles Carnifexes unlike the normal ones that one shot them.

The hell?

[KotCR]

Hm, I thought OB was limited to 1 per game
His final mind trait gives him an extra OB usage.

[Old Painless]

I dun remember sayin dat ? :D

[hellic]

Haha...quoting fail. =P

[KotCR]

Look at the time of the post; Gone midnight, was probably tired :p.
'tis fixed now anywayz.

[Energizer Bunny]

The avatar mission is idiotically hard. Like twice as hard as any other mission I've encountered thus far. He has an ability that one shots pretty much any troops within a large radius and his health regen is obscene.

[KotCR]

I tried the all-in approach against him and got almost totally wiped (by his minions more than him).

I only had two squads left in a safe rez-zone (actually it was one and I had to use Invulnerability to get the other guy out), but ended up soloing the Avatar (or rather tag-teaming) him with Tarkus and Avitus, both with Storm Bolters, with swapping the teams out for the other when one took loses.

It wasn't hard, but as you can imagine, chipping away at the Avatar's HP with Storm Bolters from the steps took a while.

[terlanis]

For the wraithlord mission i went fc, scouts, devs and asm. Worked extremally well, baiting units into my devs and asm and stealthing behind platforms. When in position i jumped in on the squads near the weapons platform and had the scouts mop up the heavy weapon. Worked extremally well and didnt get anyone knocked out. Yes this is on primarch. Now on the wraithlord melta bombs, and the missle launcher is crucial. When the warlocks come in back off and lure them in to get jumped/squashed by fc asm and devs. If the wraithlord is always chasing you just keep falling back until u reach a reinforce point. Also blind nades are extremally potent against the warlocks at the end. Those saved me alot.

[Alegis]

Cyrus is god tier on Primarch difficulty. I took down a few bosses using only cyrus (and remote detonation, sniper shot and grenades while infiltrated).

Cyrus takes care of the warlocks with sniper shot, takes down wraith lord with multimeltas while avitus launched his missiles and invulnerability bubble now and then.