What is life?

[SajuukCor]

Here is my once-in-a-lifetime spark of devine knowledge:

What is life? Is it what we touch, see and feel or just merely electronic impulses stimulating cells? Is the person the brain or is the brain the person? Do we live only knowing that one day our final line of programming, the same programming laid down when we became a multi-celled organism in the womb, will be carried out?

Let's break it down. When you touch something nerves in your finger send signals to the brain telling if it's hot or cold, what the texture is or maybe even how dense the object is. When you see it your optic nerves sends a vertically invert picture to the brain which then translates it correctly. Maybe the object reminds you of something of another object or possibly a whole different experience. It could have a smell. Your smell receptors send their info directly to the part of the brain for memory, and you could instantly remember something at a very young age without thinking about it. All this has taken place in no less than a single second. Are all those experiences that occurred in a second's time life? Think about this: if we stimulate those same exact nerves to recreate the same experience will it be the same? You feel it but not touch, see it but its not there, and smell it with no fragrance. Is that life? Are we governed by what is there or what we think?

And what about our final chapter in existence? It almost feels as if it's all wasted. All the experiences and memories that we carried around for years will become nothing more that a few pounds of inert organic matter. Once we die, we are gone forever. It is, quite literally, Armageddon, the end of all things. Everyone we know, everything we learned, all the things we made are gone without us knowing. What about people who die but then are revived by an outside force? Are they the same people? When the person dies he is gone; the electrical impulses cease and he is no more. Moments later the reaction between cells start again and regains consciences. Is he the same or just a person with used memories? Sure he might look and sound the same, but those things were already there. Is he a brand new person that came to life after the death only to be confined by memories of the former? People do say that they are a changed person, even a different person, after a near death experience.

What it all comes down to though is that we are all here by chance. There's a one-in-a-thousand chance that your specific Y chromosome was chosen, and the same odds are applied to the other X or Y chromosome. Your existence was plucked from about a million others that could have been but never will be. What if another chromosome was chosen? Where would you be? Would you be complete and udder nothingness or perhaps one of the lucky few who came into being a second time around? Don't forget about the odds your parents had, and their parents and so on. In speaking that they were chosen from a specific Y and X/Y chromosome, the odds of you being reaches a number so high it is unimaginable to the human mind.

So what is life? Is it what we can see or we think we can see? It is the thought that death is programmed and could run its course at any time? Or maybe it's being here against the sheer odds that were against you?

[Vaarok]

Life is a joke.

Think of it. A self perpetuating chemical proces. Originally some simple chemical pattern that perpetuated itself, and only those that continued to perpetuate perpetuated, growing in complexity to survive, until it crapped out us.

Divine creation and purpose my ass. We're an accident that keeps on happening.

Disappointing, isn't it?

[Necromancer]

In order to answer the question is to ask this question... "Why is there life?"

Everything happends for a reason and I strongly believe that an entity created the entire universe...
If you look at the logic of nature then u see that almost every lifeform breeds. For example humans...
Humans intentional breed, because humans want a child... A child to love and see grow up later and be proud of.

An entity could do that as well...

[Æs Sídhe]

Who, or what, created the entity?

All I know is that life is precious. It is ongoing victory over chaos that not even death can diminish. Life is the light that reveals relevance to that which would otherwise be nothingness.

[x-crispy]

We're pretty insignificant. Personally, I think we humans think too highly of ourselves. Although it doesn't really matter.

I really can't imagine what immortaility would be like. I have a short attention span. I could absorb the knowledge of the Earth, but even that has an end. I would simply get bored. I just get tired of consciousness. Ever just want to go to sleep? Even if you are not tired? Take a break? I'll take what life has to offer, and when that is done, the living part of me will end. I don't expect to be disappointed. My remains will continue on, changing forms, states, locations. If I had lived a crappy life? Well, thank you closure. It's over. I had a good life? Congradulations Colin, you fufilled everything you wanted to. Good game.

I can't even comprehend the odds of my existence. Given one universe, one Earth, a heap of organic matter, what are the chances that I'd exist? Unimaginable. There's luck. Heh.

As for all those quirky aspects of our minds... Our thoughts/memories are not influenced by consciousness alone. So much more goes on under the surface. Things we don't even know we are thinking. One third of our lives is spent sleeping. A lot goes on. Considering that, we are still increadibly weird. That makes us interesting. I love to think about what makes us tick.

In the grand GRAND scheme of things, I'm about as important as that stone I just kicked along the ground. What's so interesting about a stupid stone anyway? Study mineralology. Chemisty. Physics. There's a lot going on in that stone. Good game, stone.

[sajuukar]

Mm, nothing like theory...

I believe life to be a mission to become all-knowing...

Of course, since the span of our lives is not enough to acomplish this, one must know as much as possible, for the more one knows, the more one is capable of cotrolling his surroudings...

Which is why I always seek to understand :angel:

[ÜberJumper]

It's all about reproduction folks.

[oneredpanther]

wtf.
yeah, but it doesn't matter.
There's no point reading anything into life other than the fact that you're alive at all. It's all one big accident anyway.

There's no specific reason we're here and in the form we are. we just....uh...are. It's all one big coincidence. Someone said so. And I believe them.

Many people argue that life are too comlex and seemingly highly-engineered to be accidental. To them I say "pffft".

Anthropic principal tells us that if things were any different, then we wouldn't be here to comment on our complexity in the first place, this voiding any commentary on the subject in the first place.

If this all still makes good sense when I'm not as stoned as I am now, then things are definately looking up.

[skywalker]

Panth, are you ALWAYS on drugs? :)

Hmm, sounds like creationism vs evolution with a different mask, and sajuuk's first paragraph sounds a bit like the matrix...

I think the definition of truly being "alive" (Not scientific definition of life) is being aware of it. I think. Therefore I am.

[Alpha_Monkey]

"Life is a bad teacher. I gives the test 1st, and the lesson after"
-some guy

[Walker]

I know the Answer.

I figured it out one time. Felt good for a while, then I forgot the Question.

That sort of thing is always happening to me.

[Demon-X]

life is too complicated for me, im just trying to remember to breathe.

Id rather know about whats after death, i dont want to waste my life doing pointless things just to find out ive been screwed over by death and i aint coming back.
:angel:

[Tygre]

life and death are like positive and negative...if ya have one ya have another. It all eventually equals out to zero in the end. Do your part! Restore the balance of absolutely nothing to the universe! Die today!!!

[IgnusDei]

the meaning of life is to have a life of meaning.

[Walker]

And who decides what that is? (at least it's tidily soundbitish)


Besides, this isn't what the dude asked. He wants to know what life is, not what it means.

I had a minor skirmish when I first came here over this. The opinion of every single person on this board, deduced from the fact that not a soul aided me in refuting it, is that "life" the thing, the whizz-bang that makes us more than rocks, is nothing at all but certain chemicals reacting in a responsive organ.
I assure you, everyone was most adamant on this point - there was no scope for misunderstanding there. Life is, by the Relicboard doctrine, a chemical process.

I hope you feel comforted by that.

[Sans_Shadow]

"Reality is merely an illusion, albeit a very persistent one. "
- Albert Einstein (1879-1955)

Whether that refers to life, I don't know.

"I think therefore I am" - I don't think being aware of being alive is life.

I do think "life" is just a chemical process. But do you mean consciousness?

[SquidDNA]

Scanning, scanning, no biology here, move along.

[Vaarok]

Life's perpetual battle and victory over Chaos?

Are you insane?!!!

Chaos is blessed. Without change there is only entropy. Without strife there is no challenge. Without challenge there is no purpose. Without purpose there is no reason to exist!

I say bring forth the chaos that I may prove myself!

[sajuukar]

Life is our perception. If we had no perception, we wouldn't even know that we are alive, and therefore proly not be.

Then again maybe it is simply a physical manifestation of love... if you know what I mean... :D

The point is that no one really knows...

:angel:

[deadguy]

Life is a fatal and incurable sexually transmitted disease.

If your parents never had it, chances are, you won't either.

[SajuukCor]

:argh: Now that the boards are working for me, I can finally check up on this. So many people!

Let me explain my post. I want to figure out who we are in life. I say "we" because it feels that people are a collective consciousness, that we do something based on the thoughts of other people. We are people, yet we are not; we're nothing but a huge peice of matter that reacts to electrical impulses inside it. With these impulse we form a "mind."

With the mind is the experiences over the years which then forms the person, and the person then forms the collective consciousness. If you didn't meet someone at a earlier time, would you be here? That person impacted you mind to the point were you are a different, albeit slightly, person. Factor in the odds of THAT person being chosen from the Y and X/Y chromosomes and you get and even higher number we can't think of.

:err: I could go on and on and on and on and on... but I'll save them for now :D

[Æs Sídhe]

Originally posted by Vaarok


Are you insane?!!!

Chaos is blessed. Without change there is only entropy. Without strife there is no challenge. Without challenge there is no purpose. Without purpose there is no reason to exist!

I say bring forth the chaos that I may prove myself!

Your second point is a good point. I think my statement would have been better served by saying that life brings order to chaos and hence understanding while transcending entropy/death if for no other reason that its very existance and persistence.

As to your question... I don't know. Ask Dyn as he seems to be qualified to make those judgements;)

My question to you is what is that purpose which gives "life" reason to exist?

[sajuukar]

Maybe life exists because it can...

There is supposudly an infinite distace in space, and so although the probability is low, there is a probability none the less of anything happening, and since there is a probability that some molocules just happen to fall into the right configuration to start life, some proly will!!

So there is a possibility that life would have never happened, but the thing is, that it did.

:angel:

[Vaarok]

And so the Chaos is blessed, for through it all things have potential.

No matter how improbable, it is possible. There is always a chance that a speck can change the universe. Empowering, no?

Better than theologies that say you must petition for a change of the rules to get anything done, and then that your result is only due to the higher power bending the rules for you.

I like being niezchiean.

[sajuukar]

What is a niezchiean?

According to the context I would think it is some sort of trancend, or philosipher, or something like that... but I don't really know.

I seek to understand...

[Æs Sídhe]

Friedrich Nietzsche was a German philosopher of the late 19th century who challenged the foundations of traditional morality and Christianity. He believed in life, creativity, health, and the realities of the world we live in, rather than those situated in a world beyond. Central to Nietzsche's philosophy is the idea of "life-affirmation," which involves an honest questioning of all doctrines which drain life's energies, however socially prevalent those views might be. Nietzsche believed that the instincts should not be repressed but given full vent, for they are life-giving. Guilt, a symptom of illness, should be repudiated. Instincts should be expressed, never repressed. A healthful joy is experienced in the feeling and venting of the will to power. Nietzsche had stated, "Life itself appears to me, as – an instinct for growth , for survival, for the accumulation of forces, for power : whenever the will to power fails, there is disaster.

Some say these views are what led to Naziism.
Others say he just hated Christianity and belived in life for life's sake.

If you believe what he believed you are a Nietzschean.

[Walker]

This is interesting, Sidhe. I did not know what Nietsche did, only that he was some philosopher.

Yet, the Answer I talked about earlier, the one that I came to? Is much the same as this. Through my own efforts and intelligence I came to the same conclusion as a famous philosopher, independently. Thass ver' good, I think.

My Answer didn't have the whole religion-is-spiritually-sapping thing though; but having read it, it concurs very much with the rest of the Answer, and clearly Nietsche understood so.

Someone tell me the Question again? I feel like the mice in Hitchhikers Guide.

[Alpha_Monkey]

I think Nietzsche got a raw deal. That made sense to me, and I don't feel like a nazi...I think he deserves cred for even trying to answer this.

PS: Deadguy...did u think of that? I'll have to write that down somewhere...:up:

[SquidDNA]

A little knowledge can be a dangerous thing. It's irresponsbile to say that Neitzsche was responsible for the NSDAP and its horror. At the same time, taking on the role of a historian for a moment, you have to realize that ideas change over time and spawn new ideas.

So "Neitzsche's ideas influenced the ideology of the Nazi party" is different than "Neitzsche's ideas led to the development of the ideology of the Nazi party" is different than "Neitzsche's ideas are the ideology of the Nazi party."

[El Russo]

"i think therefore i am" is a self serving thing. u can't have one without the other. u can't think without existing and life (as in conscious life) can't exist without thinking.

[sajuukar]

Hmm, I didn't want to start a new thread, so this is the most closley related...

Did you hear about the study that states that those who get about 6 hrs of sleep tend to live longer than those who sleep 8 hrs?

Maybe life is not supposed to be in that idle state of sleep, and so is less healthy in those circumstances...???

[Tronno]

Idle less, decay slower.

Bah, life. You're all just a bunch of atoms orbiting each other in increasingly chaotic patterns and reacting to outside forces. Or you could be a divine being - God's masterplan. It all depends.

How do you define life? How do you know that your "life" isn't a mere illusion? Thought doesn't necessarily mean existence - as far as anyone can tell, the very laws of logic may not even be there.

It's all about perception. Do you trust your senses? Are you really a straitjacketed madman who perceives everything as normal, or a helpless vegetable who made up his own universe to replace one that he'd never seen? Think about it. Nothing is true. All is not as it seems.

There is no spoon.

[Harmanoff]

You know, it's funny. If i could choose between knowing the meaning of (my)life and getting the ability to engage in loose conversation with people i don't know.. i'd choose the latter.

[RBA-Wintrow]

God is dead. - Nietsche

Nietsche is dead. - God


Got that of off a T-shirt :-)

[El Russo]

Thought doesn't necessarily mean existence

i don't think there are any grey areas on this particular point. i'll have to completely and utterly disagree with u on that one - nothing personal.

how can u think but not exist? just because something is an illusion does not mean that it is not real. for example, presuming the movie the matrix is not fictitious the actual matrix itself does exist even though it is a computer made fake. it exists even if it is not what it claims to be.

surely a prerequisite of thought is substance? if u do not exist but can think, what can u think about? - u would not b able to interact with or analyse things that do exist because to acknowledge them would b impossible without any of the five senses (perception can only belong to beings that exist). for example, nasa can only see what happens in distant galaxies because it has the hubble telescope - the eye to nasa's body. how would we know what was there if we did not have that? how could that work if it did not exist? therefore u would have to have senses of some kind and u can only have those if u exist in some form.

am i making sense? is there a compentent argument for tronno's point? - i would certainly like to hear it.

[Tronno]

[edit] Hmm, I forgot to reread my post there.

It's probably not my place to question the laws of logic, but here I go. Logically, one cannot think without existing first. But what is logic? A concept, no more. Things generally occur in a logical order. Cause and effect. But what if what you perceive to be logical is completely insane from another point of view?

We know very little of the universe. We see inferior being as locked away from higher knowledge, but there's always a higher step up the ladder. A being more advanced than ourselves can just drop in from the sky and prove everything we hold true as wrong as drive us all insane in the process.

So, in other words, I might not exist, you might not exist, everything around you might not exist, and the idea of this universe's existence might just be a figment of someone's imagination.

But then, I'm probably opening myself to way too many possibilities. My bad.

[Tygre]

Life is a trip and you're along for the ride...it's gonna end eventually. Just have "fun" while you're on it.

[oneredpanther]

thank you for your kind advice, sir.
I shall endeavour to have more fun whilst tripping in the future.

peace out.

[Walker]

I don't reckon something that doesn't exist can think...


As I was coming down the stair, I met a man who wasn't there.
He wasn't there again, today...oh how I wish he'd go away...

[SWPIGWANG]

Life is singing "tobe Gundam" (Gundam 0079 Japanese Op)

or not......................

life is defined as a state that is not death.

[frstkor13]

alive is what this thread will be no more.

thx for bumping a thread that was over a month old swpigwang.