my thoughts on dawn of war

[Teatherman]

the poll for which armies you would like to see in dawn of war was getting pretty long, so i decided to start a new thread and kick it off with my personal thoughts on the subject.

i would really like to see EVERY army games workshop currently produces in the game. now before someone gets off on a tangent, that doesnt mean i plan on being able to play all of them, just give each race a battle or cameo in the grand scheme of the game.

i really dont ecpect to fight any tyranids, but a mention of a hive fleet approaching in a cut scene would be cool. Tau being so young, and unable of warp travel, maybe the marines could intercept a transmission from a lost Tau ship. perhaps even a "small" battle with some necron tomb spyders on mars protecting the void dragons sleep even? in a battle against orks, maybe you could run into a dark eldar assasian?

now when it comes to playable races i really think an old school shout out to the originaters of 40k should be recognized...

space marines
orks
eldar
chaos

just my ideas

[Maximus Decimus]

alright sounds REASONABLE unlike ppl who want the damn game to feature all 10 unique races in their unique ways which is impossible in the time span of this game and the game will be great without em. they will probebly have add on packages or patches for diff races later on. ur way is pretty reasonable and can be done. if they did try to feature every army as playables then we would get a command and conquer game where a marine shoots and fights like a eldar, a terminator shoots and fights like a wraith guard etc.

[z-beam]

as chaos is so similar to normal space marines (with demons)
it would be good to see some tyradids. and also i reckon eldar would play far to much like fast space marines and not add enough diversity to the overall game as the tyranid race would.

i am not knocking eldar at all, in fact i actually would like chaos to be left out untill later on in favor of the fair race. this would be something to really look forward to.

all i can ask for is that there are more than three races.

[Anthonace]

it really doesnt bother me wich races are included so long as they're balanced and have different styles of playing

chaos marines seem to have no access to razorbacs and land speeders this is probably to make up for their ability to use daemons

[Propbuddha]

I'd rather see a good representation of a few armies, rather than too many factions.

It is very difficult to produce quality 3D models for a game. Making every faction would be impossible. And even if there were alot (lets say 5) don't expect a good variety of troops.

I would be very surprised (and impressed) if there were more than 3 factions (2 of which will be Space Marines and Chaos) in the game...

[DarthFelth]

i really think we will see chaos, marines and orks

[Maximus Decimus]

Propbuddha

i must commend u on that, something iv tried to get the ppl at the what armies should be in 40k thread to see but they insist on all 10 races or so. yeah i think there will be 3 or 4 races but there is a very good chance there will be 3 due to the 2 yr developement schedule.

[No Surrender]

Bah, if one of the races has to be dumped, dump the SM. They have been in every single 40k game ever made. I am so sick and tired of them and their "O, we're humanity's best warriors so we're the most important even though the Imperial Guard does 80-90% of the fighting and dying"

[DarthFelth]

more 90% of the dying ;)

[Maximus Decimus]

lol, well their not gonna dump em bud cause theyr GW gold mine. im glad their in the game and if u got a objection then i believe u can go to h*ll lol jk. i think its great and theyv only been in chaos gate, final liberation, space hulk, that is it.

heretic!
heresy begets retribution

[Tribunal]

I'm hoping that the game is GREAT, and that the sales reflect the quality of the game. Then, providing that there is sufficient demand, several expansion packs could be released each with 1-3 new armies, multi-player and single player skirmish maps, and a nice continuation of the storyline. If this happened, maybe the folks at Relic would be able to do most of the major races/factions, and maybe make new fans of some of the lesser played factions (come on now, I'm sure we have some squat fans in denial here :D )

[Numenor]

If there is both Chaos space marines and normal Space marines i think i will scream! No real variety there whatsoever compared to normal.

I think if chaos are included then Eldar should deffinetly be also, and any 40k players who know their fluff will agree, and for man kind, i would suggest Imperial Guard. I think they have the best range of vehicles and when you have people from different planets, they look different, dress different even have different units. Not like Space Marines where all they do is change colour.

Although space marines will probably used, almost definitely, i would be a lot happier without them.

Numenor

[Jet Thrust]

Originally posted by Tribunal
I'm hoping that the game is GREAT, and that the sales reflect the quality of the game. Then, providing that there is sufficient demand, several expansion packs could be released each with 1-3 new armies, multi-player and single player skirmish maps, and a nice continuation of the storyline. :D )

I think the most important issue is that they get D O W right from the start, it needs to appeal to those people who have an "interest" in W40K, or just maybe like the look of it but have never really got involved in it. Hopefully there will be expansion packs and additional releases to complement the original game, though having said, nobody will buy expansion packs if the original is shite. Its basically all or nothing, they have all the ingredients for something spectacular, and the history and sheer numbers to create a long running series of games ( i.e big bucks!), i hope it isnt all rushed and formulaic like so many have been before. If the original is good enough then it will sell itself (and any released expansion packs in the future also).

Fingers crossed.

[Fable]

I think it would be cruel if it were just SM CSM and Orks. SM and CSM are just too similar. I think SM Eldar CSM and Orks are a good place to start and later expansion packs can add IG/Tyranids/Tau and after that DE/Necron.

[Maximus Decimus]

Not like Space Marines where all they do is change colour

looks like somebody doesnt know their fluff. anyway someone said that it has to appeal to the 40k fans first? no. we are in the minority and this game is FIRST going to be made to appeal to the general audience before our wants are put in there. ur asking to crash and burn if u want to make a top seller game thats rlly geared towards GW fans and ignores the general public. we GW fans are 2nd to the public here, first they make a game what they think the general public will want and like then 2nd they try and accomidate us.

[Fable]

Originally posted by Maximus Decimus
i think its great and theyv only been in chaos gate, final liberation, space hulk, that is it.

heretic!
heresy begets retribution [/B]

They're also major players in Firewarrior, and if you play Rites of War then you also get them (in fact you start collecting SMurfs before you finish collecting eldar units). The fact is spacemarines are (and will be) in every 40k based video game.

[Tribunal]

It just makes too much sense to include CSMs if you have SMs in the game, if only as antagonists to go up against in the campaign. I can't wait for E3, because I'm sure there will be quite a bit of info to read up on about DOW.

As far as target audiences etc, the 40k fanbase is an automatic, known group that will more likely than not buy enough copies of the game to make a profit, if even only a small one. Now you have the Relic fanbase, which is growing with every quality title published. You have a good title, an established and growing fanbase, and a company that is known for its quality products (who also happen to be great fans of the game itself) already there's a lot going for it.

Now all we need to know is what type of RTS it is going to be. Is it going to be something along the X-Com series, where you have your one squad and equip each one, keep track of him/her, or maybe something along the traditional 'Craft series of games, or something along the Ground Control vein? Each sub-genre of the RTS category has its own established fanbase, so I am really interested in what direction Relic is going, and also if it was their desire to go in that direction or GW/THQ's decision to go in the direction that they are going in.

[Maximus Decimus]

i hope it has the realism that ground control 2 is promising and the a ability to call down rienforcements. each player controls a set of objective that give u more rienforcements and supplies etc. u can fortify these and conquer the enemies. they can range from important bases to starports etc. cant wait till some new info too. just a little note i have to say Rites of War was the worst game GW ever made and the worst iv ever played.

[Teatherman]

well if look to the past you might find an answer.

chaos gate was originally going to allow you to play imperial or chaos marines, but due to running out of time was made to simply be a single player strategy game. if DOW followed suit and only made regular marines and chaos marines playable i wouldnt be upset. since orks are in the screens it would only make since in a follow-up to go ahead and make them playable.

so before people jump to conclusions about who is in and who isnt, just remember the past. the only armies i would think to be a shoe in ias playable are space marines and chaos(since the models and playstyle are so similar).

[Jet Thrust]

Hi Maximus, sorry, crossed wires here, i meant that it would help to appeal to those people who have always liked the look of W40K but were somewhat hesitant to get involved due to the complexities involved in playing table top W40K (there are so many out there!). I agree totally with your point, and i think it's a precarious balance of staying loyal to the W40K universe and satiating their needs whilst being accessible and appealing enough to allow the uninitiated (as above) to get involved. I think the ppl who buy pc strategy games/rts games are always looking for their next hit (so to speak...) and if the game is good enough then it will undoubtedly sell itself, via press publication or simply by word of mouth, elitist titles aren't known for selling by the bucket load unless they are fairly outstanding!

The pc game will naturally have a greater appeal by default, and i think a revised format and some changes to the way in which the game is played would allow ppl to get into the W40K universe more easily, though as i stated earlier, its crucial that the essence and feel of W40K is maintained otherwise whats the point!!. People are gonna buy the game regardless, i know i will and i'm sure many of the posters on here will too, though should the game do really well with those who are new to W40K then all parties concerned will know they're on to a good thing and the series(????) will hopefully grow and grow. expansion packs, sequels, prequels etc etc

I posted the other day about how i thought the commandos 2&3 platforms would be an ideal base from which to work, merging strategy and action perfectly and still maintaining a mass appeal. It over on the DOW Gameplay style thread should anyone want to read it, i still think it would be the best way to go about it, though as above its just my opinion.

[ObsceneName]

I wouldnt mind seeing ground control 2 style
but i want like space marines and imperial guard to be able to foritfy areas with liek engineers and stuff like look theres a hill lets fortify it while tyranids can kill things(for biomass) and call down more reinforcements

EDIT: i know im jumping ahead on the races but its jsuta example ya know

[Maximus Decimus]

well this is the thread for ur thoughts on dawn of war and i guess u can express what u mean by fortifying with enginseers? what i was thinking would be cool is if u control those objectives/supply locations that can be conquered etc, it would be cool to be able and build trenches and stuff against incoming assaults so its harder for the enemy to seize those objectives/supply locations eg starports, bases, etc. i think if dawn of war features this kind of play that it would be a great game but i doubt they thought of including something like that.

[Tribunal]

Being able to change the terrain on the fly like that can be a bit tricky, but that would be neat. Most likely it will be using the terrain you have been alotted, and finding the best place to put the stationary devastator squads (lascannons and heavy bolters a pleanty), and then using the remaining forces to make sure your heavy hitters don't get taken out before the dreddies arrive on the scene.

I'm not sure if there will be speeders, tanks or dreddies -- maybe one dreddie later on in the campaign for each race, and who knows about multiplayer (shrugs). Right now I really am not rooting for tanks or speeders, but an occasional dreadnaught would be nice for later on in the campaigns, but then again, the opposition could always be increased in anticipation of your increased strength/number of your troops.

[Maximus Decimus]

well in the PCGAMER shots u can see in the background that there is a huge host of marines, some devastators, dreadnoughts, preditors, landraiders. i believe this game will be geared to have huge battles like in the fluff cause thats what it appears to look like at the moment. no titans though which is GREAT(the scale provided cannot harbour them).

[Jet Thrust]

Was wondering just how far on the game is at present, how long before we start seeing in game shots etc etc or hearing any kind of confirmation about the gameplay?

[Tribunal]

Wow, I wasn't expecting that at all! From what I had read, it sounded like it would be squad based, and that there might be vehicles in the background etc.... If you're right about being able to use various vehicles, dreddies and scads of troops.... Then you've just made my day :D

[Maximus Decimus]

well yeah thats what the game looks and sounds like, in the screens u see this explosions going on from missle fire and alot of marines it looks like its really extreme warfare like. if u look carefully u can also see a ork dreadnought behind the marine dreadnought. yep u can see a preditor, landradier, a whole crap load of guys unloading their ammo in the far left an tons of ppl on the screen. the screens are all in game and nothing is scripted. the devs have said that those screens are dated compared to its current build and that the graphics look better then ground control 2. we probebly wont see too much before E3.