WTF to do against walkers as Tyranids

[Buguba]

I have no idea how to counter walkers with Tyranids now. It used to be that a well-microed VC Brood could do the job well, but now they deal such pitiful damage that walkers make me cry. I primarily play the LA as nids, and I can't ever find much to do against these beasts of burden.

The worst part is that Tyranids don't have any T2 walker of their own to counter enemy walkers (no, the TG doesn't count as a real walker). The only thing I can ever thing of doing is getting a Zoanthrope + VC brood combo to slow/destroy the enemy walker, but that's a pretty dang expensive requisition price I'm paying. That's especially considering that Tyranid requisition is always steadily taxed by gaunt reinforcement. In some ways, it takes me longer to accumulate the requisition I need for the VC + Zoan combo than the enemy player needs in power for the walker unit.

So do any of ye other Tyranid players have ideas against enemy walkers like Dreadnoughts, Deff Dreds, and WLs? I'm starting to think that playing the HT with crushing claws is the only way to go now, but I think my LA is much prettier.

[Shinova]

I dunno, I always just tried pitting TG and adrenal warriors against one. If you've got zoan, focused blast is nice at the start.

[Sabulum]

You're talking 1v1 right? I haven't played nids yet 1v1 in the new patch, but AG warriors + upgraded hormogaunts and a VC warrior should hold a dread off long enough so that you can sacrifice a few minutes and get a fex out. The point is to keep it off your gen farm.

If you're pushing for a stronger T2 and delaying fex, use a zoey and just ignore the dread until you can get 2x VC up or to get the dread alone and stealer/AG warrior rape it.

I imagine its tougher now that nids are less efficient, but I can't see how the strategy would change all that much from the last patch. At least with the SM dread, it means that the SM player is delaying his termies by a bunch, and the WL is easier to deal with than a falcon early on.

[Aquila]

Tyrant Guard + Venom Warriors + Zoanthrope

Any combination of the above should work.

[SOLID MATTIC]

Well I'm not an expert on nids but I always thought they were pretty good in the av department. Are you sure that a combination of Adrenal Gland and Venom Brood Warriors wont get the job done? AG gaunts do some dmg too or can be used to try to tie up the rest of their army while your taking the dred down.

Zoanthrope stun and the TG as a meatshield for the Warriors could work to.

Once again I hear ppl complaining about Venom Brood Warriors. I don't understand it. Whenever I play against or as nids I've seen Venom Warriors do pretty decent damage imo, is there something I'm missing?

[Dux]

Since you're using the LA, why not try Corrosive Claws? If you can just a single cloaked hit on the walker, you will double the damage output of your Venom Broods. Alternatively, you could use AG Warriors in melee, which would do quite well with the damage multiplier afforded by Corrosive Claws.

[OVFellblade]

I use the VB + WBAG combo as others have mentioned, with varying degrees of success. For awesome tank-killing power later on in the game, get yourself a couple of Genestealer broods with the upgraded claws...

[Katastrophikus]

I normally don't have too much trouble with walkers. I find that a squad of Adrenal Gland warriors to ties it up nicely and long enough for the Venom Brood to finish it off.

[Buguba]

You're talking 1v1 right? I haven't played nids yet 1v1 in the new patch, but AG warriors + upgraded hormogaunts and a VC warrior should hold a dread off long enough so that you can sacrifice a few minutes and get a fex out. The point is to keep it off your gen farm.

Yup, this is all 1v1 stuff.

The problem with using AG Warriors to tie up walkers is that AG warriors deal very little damage by themselves, and once an AG Warror pops the rest of your army goes with it. The entire point of walkers is that they hardcounter melee armies (when used properly), so the melee splash damage and high frontload damage means that your Warriors are only going to tie up the walker for several seconds. Moreover, Warriors aren't exactly cheap to replace.

Also, like I mentioned in the OP, the resource total of a Zoanthrope + VC Brood combo is pretty hefty considering that it all needs to be purchased at once. Eldar, for example, will usually already have a Banshee squad lying around for the Banshee + WS AV combo.

I do realize that a part of it is being wise about requisition expenditure in t1 and making sure that you have enough for the combo, but I just find in general that it's very difficult to counter properly used walkers in 1v1.

[Demonic Spoon]

Use your commander abilities.

For HT, that's crushing claws.

For RA, that's corrosive devourer.

For LA, that's corrosive claws + <AV weapon of your choice>

[Sabulum]

Deff dreads can be taken out with soft AV, but with the other walkers, thats 120+ power right there. There's no way that you can be "surprised" by a walker anymore. If you're having trouble getting the counters out in time, there's a problem with your T1 power expenditure, not your anti-walker. Besides which, you should be building yourself enough of a lead T1-early T2 against someone saving up for a walker that you can sacrifice some map control for time.

[Buguba]

Deff dreads can be taken out with soft AV, but with the other walkers, thats 120+ power right there. There's no way that you can be "surprised" by a walker anymore. If you're having trouble getting the counters out in time, there's a problem with your T1 power expenditure, not your anti-walker. Besides which, you should be building yourself enough of a lead T1-early T2 against someone saving up for a walker that you can sacrifice some map control for time.
Walkers are never a surprise, but the honest truth becomes that they're still exremely difficult to deal with (for me, at least). My problem is that the combination of upkeep and steady gaunt reinforcement prevents me from getting the requisition I need quickly enough to pump out a combo that's good enough to actually deal with a walker. Even with a Zoanthrope + VC brood combo though, it's barely enough to endanger an enemy walker. VC Brood squads deal an absolutely pitiful 36 DPS to oncoming walkers, and getting a Zoanthrope to slow it down barely helps. Warp Shot does 100 damage to a vehicle and slows the walker for 10 seconds to 25% speed. At most, you're going to deal 360 damage to a walker with a VC brood when you've stunned it with Warp Shot. Considering that something like a Dreadnought or WL has 1200 HP, knocking off 460 damage is helpful but not exactly sufficient. You'll be doing more damage even before and after the Warp Shot, but a Walker is just as dangerous at 1/3rd health as he is at 3/4s health.

I'm not trying to say it's impossible for Tyranids to face walkers. Obviously it's being done somehow, but I'm just not getting it. Does anyone have a replay of a 1v1 or even a 2v2 where a Tyranid players successfully manages an enemy walker? I'd like to see what other people do, because I think I'm a little too stuck on how Tyranids used to operate.

[Arbit]

Not a 1v1 guy, but Genestealers do OK even prior to the melee_heavy upgrade. 4.5 AV dps x 6 members x 1.4 adrenal rush is 37.8 dps. I hate using VBs now that they lost their leap attack, so I try to combine genestealers plus zoans/commander wargear/prayers. Or, do get a VB and sic the speedy genestealers on their support - the walker will have to choose between attacking the genestealers while getting shot by the VBs, or chasing the VBs while the stealers eat their support.

Just throwin out ideas here. I'm pretty rusty. : (

[mlai]

You have problem with Walkers? Even with VC Warriors? I don't get it.

Nobody likes to leave their walker to be shot continuously by VCs. The walker, or a significant part of their supporting army, will try to neutralize the VCs. Then you just kite a little with the VCs, while your melee Nids nomnomnom the fleshy parts of his army. I actually don't like vehicles more than I don't like walkers, because VCs can't run fast enough or deal enough front-load damage to finish off escaping vehicles. And you can't kite vehicles.

When I reach T2 first thing I get is usually TGuard. He can tank any walker long enough for you to (1)keep the walker occupied while the rest of your army routs the rest of his army, (2)keep the walker busy while VCs shoot the walker.

If the walker tries to deal with things other than the TG, then I just leave the TG to continuously bash on its rear. Yeah, walkers... the one thing that can't kite TGs, lol. Nobody likes to see their walker continuously bashed on by TGs without fighting back.

I usually use my Hormas to deal with the fleshy parts of his army, not his walker. You bleed req when you go Hormas vs walker. I don't feel rich enough anymore for that, as a Nid. :down:

Zoans I don't buy. I go tier 3 first, for BS Fex. Thank you Relic for ignoring the BS Fex and its free spore mines! Then I want a Zoan to hide behind the Fex and heal it. :wave: Or I buy Stealers first.