Mass Appeal?

[flipper]

Hey guys.

I wanted to ask if this game is going to have mass appeal, as in, will appeal to those outside of the W40K target group. I have to say the game in concept sounds very appealing to me, but I have never played W40K, nor do I know about the factions or the rules of the game.

I guess what I am trying to get at is does this game require someone familiar with and a fan of the W40K universe in order to enjoy? Will it have tutorials to explain the factions and their differences? Will getting into this game be a painless experience for those without W40K know-how?

Thanks in advance for any and all responces.

[Dyntheos]

All I can say is HELL YES.

What's not to like about it? Sure the 40k license makes it's appeal greater but from what we've seen it looks fanatstic.

[No Surrender]

The basic concept of 40K is pretty easy to understand, it's a basically a galactic free for all.

[Wolfma[N]]

I think it is the aim of Relic to have this game satisfy both the hardcore 40k players and the new comers to this universe. You should have nothing to worry about. :buddies:

[WarpGhost]

With all the excited coverage from the Gaming world, I think it will be utterly hilarious and ironic if people turn there noses up at this game. After all, theyre just as much a bunch of geeks (in fact some you could easily go as far as to call nerds :argh: !) as the people who play GW games are :buddies: (hi everyone! :) ).
We may convert them yet... :claw:

[Dimension]

i guess the only people this doesn't appeal to in theory are WH40K hardcore fans that won't play anything that differs from the tabletop too much (Uh want muh dice!) ;)

[mentally_dumb]

Out of my friends, I am the only one who likes the look of this game with no real background in Warhammer 40K (or any of their products for that matter). I've watched friends play and what not when they tried to get me involved, read a few of the game books and so on.. But otherwise..

So certainly at the moment it has its appeal to me as a strategy game or whatever, I just hope it lives up to expectations :)

And from what people at Relic have said, a huge knowledge shouldnt be a must cause the story will be told as you go along.. But if so, just focus on the pwetty graphics :)

[DevlshOne]

On a backwards note, it seems that all the visitors to WH40K:DoWP have been talking about the tabletop version and very little about the game. This may be due to the lack of info out there on Dawn of War, but I seem to be noticing more hype about the WH40K Universe hitting the PC than the game itself.

WH40K looks easy enough to grasp, I would think that even PC gamers not familiar with it should enjoy and comprehend the game.

[BirdyNumNum]

based on what i've seen and read so far, this game wont just be a great addition to the warhammer 40k game roster, but it will next to unparralled in the strategy genre. i'm a strategy gamer myself and there realy isnt too much that is schedueld to come out to rival DoW upon its release. they're coming to the field with a lot of new and great sounding ideas that i think will pay off in the end.

[Rikesgard]

based on what i've seen and read so far, this game wont just be a great addition to the warhammer 40k game roster, but it will next to unparralled in the strategy genre. i'm a strategy gamer myself and there realy isnt too much that is schedueld to come out to rival DoW upon its release. they're coming to the field with a lot of new and great sounding ideas that i think will pay off in the end.

Balance is the key to it being something of an unparalleled strategy game. While it certainly looks good on paper and has some pretty graphics, it's premature to fawn over its quality before we see how well they do in the most important facet of all.

[Beelzebuddy]

Indeed - I would highly suggest having a large beta test, to make sure that the game is balanced the way that nothing but 10,000 fanboys can.

[BirdyNumNum]

Originally posted by Rikesgard


Balance is the key to it being something of an unparalleled strategy game. While it certainly looks good on paper and has some pretty graphics, it's premature to fawn over its quality before we see how well they do in the most important facet of all.

Originally posted by BirdyNumNum


based on what i've seen and read so far...

when i said "based on what i have seen", i was implying that DoW is the nicest looking strategy game (graphically) to my knowledge, which includes a vast section for strategy games, and when i said "based on what i've read," i was refering to articles i have read that explain what the game is going to be like (strategically). my intentions weren't to claim that DoW will be an unrivaled title, i was simply trying to say that there really isnt much competition in the strategy genre in the future.

[Soulblighter]

typically i am all for a large public beta test but i would have too say in this case it would be an awful idea. fanboys on the whole make terrible testers... because they are so into the pretty graphics and enchanted by the developer that they rarely want to put any work in. secondly getting table top gamers to beta test the game is another bad idea. the game is not going to work like the table top. so what relic and thq dont need is a hundred emails saying 'this is not how this works, and this is not how that works'. i think the best bet for relic is too have a private beta with about 500 - 1000 people headed by thq q/a.

but hey what do i know:\.

[Rikesgard]

when i said "based on what i have seen", i was implying that DoW is the nicest looking strategy game (graphically) to my knowledge, which includes a vast section for strategy games, and when i said "based on what i've read," i was refering to articles i have read that explain what the game is going to be like (strategically). my intentions weren't to claim that DoW will be an unrivaled title, i was simply trying to say that there really isnt much competition in the strategy genre in the future.

I realize that. What I was saying is that things written in articles are, unfortunately, all too often not what the game is like at all. I want DoW to kick ass as much as anyone else here, but I've been excited for a game and then let down far too many times to put faith in anything but hands-on experience, or the trusted opinion of a friend whose tastes I'm familiar with. All I'm getting at is that there are so many ways for stuff written about the game to be changed, broken, unbalanced, or axed entirely between now and when the game is released to really have anything but, no offense, irrational faith. It's a sad trend these days that developers simply don't or can't spend the necessary time on their games to get things right, and while I wish Relic the very best and hope DoW tops their previous titles, I will also not be surprised if yet another game that looked stellar on paper flopped in practice.

[mr_mich]

Getting people here to beta test is a bad idea, I agree. I mean, instead of getting people that will help you find bugs and fix actual problems, you'll get people saying "The bolter should be so much stronger than the Ork Shoota" or people that are just interested in playing the game.

I've helped develop a few mods and done some beta tests, and there's nothing more frustrating than people that think beta testing should be as fun as playing the fully-released game. They don't realize that the game isn't finished, and want to play some kind of role in its development, when in reality they just whine and ask for tech support before the game is actually even done.

Can you tell I have some deep-rooted sentiments on this idea yet? :P

On a more subtle note, just because someone likes the idea of the game coming out or the graphics or just wants to play doesn't mean they should be a tester. Testers need to be drawn from a base of experienced gamers (not tabletop ones :P) with a variety of systems and a variety of knowledge about what makes programs work (or more often times, not work).

Relic could just make people apply and give a certain number of tester positions to people from the public, but that would require them to sort through applications.

Nobody said making a game was easy. :P

[Gorechild]

I just think ist about time that 40K universe has been brought to life thsi way..
Before thsi there was rites of war.. which to be hoenst sucked dick..
And the old skool shadow of horned rat (which at time where ok)
Firewarrior.. Overhyped although a good game.. Multiplayer could ahev been better..
No this.. fro mwaht i have seen/read thsi is gona nblwo all otehrs away lets hope its as good as they say and looks..

PS - the 40K tabletop game is easy to grasp in a sense yes.. but to collect an army and be dedicated a vast knowledge of rules would be preffered as you dont always have to carry ruleboo karoudn and waste time sorting out shit.. and can just get on with game..

[Mephiston]

I agree with Soulblighter. Much as I would love to test this game, I don't believe relic did a public (closed) test for any of their other games, although I could be wrong. After seeing everything that Shadi has posted, they definitely don't need fanboys telling them what it says in the rules or fluff, seeing as how the team as a whole and shadi especially seem to possess a very potent knowledge of the rules and lore of 40k. I would much rather this be tested by a small, professional, dedicated team who are simply looking for errors. I can wait for a good game! (ex: Half-Life 2 :^P) The overall fun of the game I trust to Relic, as none of their previous titles have disappointed me yet.

Even people who push or promote the tabletop game wouldn't necessarily be a wise choice for beta. I was in an Alpha for an online card game where I was only one of two or three people who weren't product champions, and yet they struggled with some of the champions, as they were just as bad about just playing instead of actual testing.

As to mass appeal, there are always going to be purists who will not like a game "based on" another game, especially if it's another format. These players are likely a small percentage. However, there should be a huge cross market between

a) Old 40kers who loved the fluff and setting but quit for some reason (like myself)
b) people who follow relic religiously (also like me)
c) people who follow GW religiously
d) general pc strat gamers
e) people who will try a game if the ideas are innovative enough, have been applied well, and the game is just plain fun.

Gore: you did not list the good GW computer game representation, mainly chaos gate and the 40K epic title. Even if I didn't love the 40K game, it was cool just for the box art with the awesome imperial titan that was pushed up (for lack of a better way to describe it). Even if these games had their flaws, they were very good games that did some justice to 40K.

Firewarrior wasn't overhyped, it had no hype at all. All it had was a normal advertising campaign with some money behind it. Every single person I ever talked to about it had major trepidations about it, and every preview/review I read pretty much slammed it (except PSM, which still confuses me). I personally thought it was a very bland, mediocre game just taking advantage of a license. In a way, that makes me angrier than a just plain bad title; if you're going to fail, fail because you tried to be a little too innovative or just had bad coding.

Oh, and please watch your spelling/typing and cursing. I'm not a board mod or anything, but bad spelling, grammar and jumbled words makes things that much harder to read and cursing is just inconsiderate on a board; as much as I enjoy doing it in real life, I try to restrain when posting. I'm just asking this one poster to another, please help to make my board experience better, and I'll do whatever I can to make yours better. Thanks.

Cheers!

[Shadione]

Hey guys.

I wanted to ask if this game is going to have mass appeal, as in, will appeal to those outside of the W40K target group. I have to say the game in concept sounds very appealing to me, but I have never played W40K, nor do I know about the factions or the rules of the game.

I guess what I am trying to get at is does this game require someone familiar with and a fan of the W40K universe in order to enjoy? Will it have tutorials to explain the factions and their differences? Will getting into this game be a painless experience for those without W40K know-how?

Thanks in advance for any and all responces.

Our focus throughout the project has been to create a game that has mass appeal. We have a lot of 40k nuts on the project, so we figured between them and GW we'd get Warhammer 40,000 right, so we've put a lot of focus on making sure players new to the universe can jump right in.

For example, our focus on massive frontline combat with the shooting, the giant dreadnoughts crushing guys in their fists, the artillery hurling everyone around, etc. All this stuff is entertaining to anyone, regardless of what they know of the universe.

We think we've been very successful, as we have people on the team and at THQ who don't know the universe at all and find the game to be great fun, and easy to get into.

[Teatherman]

worried about mass appeal? one word...

Starcraft!

since Starcraft was basically a rip off of the 40k universe, i dont see where they can go wrong in this category. not to mention that there is no word of Starcraft II coming out anytime soon to provide competition.

a matter of fact it might be wise to leak some info on this game into the Starcraft forums, or Starcraft fan sites.

[Triceron]

hah! I'm one step ahead, I'm preachin this to the Warcraft 3 community already!

[No Surrender]

Alot of people play those games because they see the Blizzard logo.

[Rikesgard]

worried about mass appeal? one word...

Starcraft!

since Starcraft was basically a rip off of the 40k universe, i dont see where they can go wrong in this category. not to mention that there is no word of Starcraft II coming out anytime soon to provide competition.

a matter of fact it might be wise to leak some info on this game into the Starcraft forums, or Starcraft fan sites.

Starcraft wasn't incredibly popular because of its setting, it was incredibly popular because it is the most balanced RTS game in existence and provided incredible gameplay (gameplay which will be nothing like DoW). So I wouldn't bank on Starcraft fans automatically liking DoW, especially considering that the only similarities between the two are humans in powered armor with guns (who are also Imperial Guard equivalent in both the quality of the person and their use on the battlefield) and aliens which are entirely biological.

[Beelzebuddy]

Is is not the most balanced game in existence. It was, however, the first RTS to come around with easy access to internet play and fairly balanced to boot (i.e. there really aren't any units that no one ever uses). For that reason it was popular - people played it because there was nothing else, then because so many other people were playing it.

DoW promises to bring us damn solid gameplay, and Relic has a good history of balancing games right. If they can avoid IC's faux pas of having scads of useless units (which is a much smaller mistake than most gamers perceive it), we're looking at a game that can easily outpreform Stracraft.

SC borrowed heavily from 40k. Here's a hint: Zerg = Tyrannid, Terran = Space Marine, Protoss = Eldar.

Blizzard struck gold with the Diablo series, but Starcraft was highly unoriginal, and Warcraft 3 contributed absolutely nothing new to the genre.

[Gorechild]

What is popular at this moment in time seems to be Battlecry..
I think this is a rip off of Warhammer Universe.. but then again most games would be as it be very hard to think of something that Warhammer hadnt allready..

And sorry about grammer/spelling and cursing..
A - i type to fast and i hit keys Early/Late..
B - I swear alot but not to offend just general..
C - I ask questions allready been answered because im new here and havnt had time to read the FAQ thouroughly and im just a little excited..

[Soulblighter]

a. slow down

b. dont

c. read the faq

adapt instead of make excuses.

[Rikesgard]

Well Apollyon, I really do hope DoW is good enough to dethrone Starcraft, but after this long nobody has done it, at least not in terms of the multiplayer gameplay. Here's to hoping though.


SC borrowed heavily from 40k. Here's a hint: Zerg = Tyrannid, Terran = Space Marine, Protoss = Eldar.

Terran Marine = Space Marine? How are they similar? The Terran Marines are just space cowboys, basically. Convicts conscripted into the Terran Confederacy military, pumped full of self-destuctive battle stims, and sent into battle as cannon fodder. They're treated even worse than Imperial Guard are in 40k. Imperial Guardsmen at least weren't mildly mind controlled and given chemicals that would eventually kill them in order to make them somewhat more effective in combat. The Terrans also had that Confederate, Johnny Reb sort of theme to them, most having a southern accent and so on. The only similarity I can draw between them and Space Marines is that they both wear armor that can withstand vaccuum, and they both carry weapons. Beyond that they're really not alike whatsoever. And it isn't like 40k invented powered armor, so I don't think this is an accurate comparison at all.

Protoss aren't really that akin to Eldar either. Both were technologically advanced, but the Protoss were incredibly strong psychically and had a very complex code of honor. I guess in a way the Eldar Aspects are somewhat similar in their zeal, but overall Blizzard did enough work to make the Protoss different from whatever their inspiration was that to call them Eldar ripoffs isn't right. It wasn't a revolutionary race concept by any means, but it's far from a direct and obvious ripoff of something else.

But the Zerg I can't argue with. I think it's pretty certain that the Zerg were inspired by the Tyranids. I don't know if anyone did a totally biological alien race that used bioweaponry before the Tyranids did it, but the Zerg are all that, plus the Hive Mind, plus the massive swarm that incorporates lifeforms into their own species. They're obviously a take on the Tyranids.

[Triceron]

Well SC was also a huge hit overseas. They held huge SC tourneys out in Korea and it's practically incorporated in a part of their pop culture.

But suffice to say, this is looking up to be the best Warhammer game ever to be made. Finally GW is letting a REAL developer take a grasp at the lisence.

[BirdyNumNum]

i agree with Souldblighter and mr mirch in their notion that a selective beta test would be better than a public one.

to Rikesgard,
i totally realize where you're coming from, and i'm not one to judge things superficially, but i try to be as informed as i can about the strategy genre, so i was just saying that based on the information given out by other strategy games, DoW is shaping up to be a top contender, the only real threat to DoW's category being Black & White 2.

[davidbowie]

black and white 2, art thou insane, i hated the original what would be different than the first, its as bad as the sims. Whilst Sci-Fi as a genre is fairly new, fantasy is not, considering that fantasy has it's base in myths and fairytales.

[Rikesgard]

to Rikesgard,
i totally realize where you're coming from, and i'm not one to judge things superficially, but i try to be as informed as i can about the strategy genre, so i was just saying that based on the information given out by other strategy games, DoW is shaping up to be a top contender, the only real threat to DoW's category being Black & White 2.

Believe me, I hope you're right. I just find it so hard to have faith in developers these days :(

[Triceron]

If this game expects to be popular amongst the masses, the game will ultimately have to be fun. That's all it really comes down to. Whether it be the game itself or a kickass mod to support it, the game has to be fun to be played.

I think Relic is taking a note from some of the current FPS games in keeping the action fast paced and furious. Taking a look at the control points and guys being blown into the air, I swear I was looking at a Battlefield 1942 mod. With holding different control points and spreading your armies thin as you expand territory, I'm sure there's going to be a lot of strategy involved to keep the action fast paced.