Multiplayer Blowout Consolidation Thread

[Misterpeanut288]

Alright with the multiplayer blowout almost upon us I thought it would be best if we tried to consolidate as much information as possible into one thread to make easy for everyone. If you have links to any articles, videos, or anything else related to the blowout post it here.

Pics:
http://img804.imageshack.us/img804/613/forthefour.jpg
http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/640/strikefromtheskies.jpg
http://img199.imageshack.us/img199/3610/igotsmehahammah.jpg
http://img97.imageshack.us/img97/6375/sidebysideagainbrothers.jpg
http://img593.imageshack.us/img593/976/sidebyside.jpg
http://img12.imageshack.us/img12/9912/chaoshb.jpg
http://img543.imageshack.us/img543/851/weaponshx.jpg
http://img580.imageshack.us/img580/6459/halved.jpg
http://img27.imageshack.us/img27/8151/ironhands.jpg

Vids:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ALMlPkddxnE
GT Space Marine Multi (http://www.gametrailers.com/video/multiplayer-interview/717664)
Seize Grounds GT (http://www.gametrailers.com/video/seize-ground-warhammer-40-000/717669?type=flv)
Annihilation GT (http://www.gametrailers.com/video/annihilation-multiplayer-warhammer-40-000/717667?type=flv)
Gamespot James McDermott (http://www.gamespot.com/pc/action/warhammer-40000-space-marine/video/6324531/warhammer-40-000-space-marine-multiplayer-interview)
G4TV Customization Walkthrough (http://www.g4tv.com/videos/54234/Warhammer-40K-Space-Marine-Customization-Walkthrough-Video/)
Space Marine gameplay (http://www.g4tv.com/videos/54235/Warhammer-40K-Space-Marine-Multiplayer-Gameplay-Video/)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IlurHvYx0Ro

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g2sCb8gia1o

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MWowZ2Lb_wk&feature=player_detailpage

Articles:
Hobbynews Spanish (http://www.hobbynews.es/reportajes/a-londres-por-darksiders-ii-y-space-marines-17521)
Hobbynews Spanish (http://www.hobbynews.es/noticias/space-marine-sin-cooperativo-al-principio-17907)
Destructoid (http://www.destructoid.com/preview-warhammer-40-000-space-marine-multiplayer-206532.phtml)
Capture and Control (http://www.captureandcontrol.com/2011/07/warhammer-40k-space-marine-multiplayer.html#more)
CVG (http://www.computerandvideogames.com/312305/previews/warhammer-40k-space-marine-multiplayer-hands-on/)
Shacknews (http://www.shacknews.com/article/69344/warhammer-40000-space-marine-multiplayer-preview)
Eurogamer (http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2011-07-20-space-marine-preview?page=2)
Gameshark (http://www.gameshark.com/xbox-360/previews/3519/p_0/Warhammer-40K-Space-Marine-Multiplayer-Preview.htm)
OXM (http://www.oxmonline.com/article/previews/s-z/warhammer-40000-space-marine-multiplayer)

[Nouw]

Almost? Have I missed something?

[Misterpeanut288]

Seeing as I posted this last night and the blowout isn't until 9 am this morning yeah almost is appropriate, but don't worry I will be changing it come 9 AM.




... It seems, according with a Spanish publication, that coop will be added LATER as a DLC for the game. It´s a big let down for me, I was eagerly awaiting to blast some orks with my younger brother. They said that the reason for this is because they´ve been working really hard in the story. There is no word if the DLC will be free or not.

Annihilation Mode is 8 vs 8, Chaos vs. Imperials; there´s a Deathmatch mode -of course-, and Seize Ground is about controlling strategic point on the map in order to win. After winning a certain number of battles, the player will be granted new weapons and enhancements, "making our character a true titan". And, of course, we could customize the character, it seems.



Source (scroll down to see a pic of a Raptor) - in Spanish: http://www.hobbynews.es/reportajes/a-londres-por-darksiders-ii-y-space-marines-17521

Source (no coop) - in Spanish: http://www.hobbynews.es/noticias/space-marine-sin-cooperativo-al-principio-17907



Ave Dominus NoX


A post over at the community forums and if he translated that right and the co-op is in fact DLC later down the road I am going to be a very sad Space Marine.
Oh by the way RAPTORS! TO THE HUNT!

[Caeltos]

WE SOAR ON WINGS OF FIRE

[Pocktio]

WE SHALL STRIKE THEM FROM THE SKIES!

In other words, MP seems to be as I expected. So I'm a little disappointed. Especially at the lack of coop DLC, reminds of 40th Day. The 'horde' style mode was retail shop specific and was never released to anyone else. Of course I don't expect such faggotry from Relic but I am still crushed by this. The DLC better either be free, or if it costs very comprehensive.

So we get TDM and Domination, with no orks. Should be fun, with customisation as standard.

[TheV3ng3ance]

Ruined you better come in here and say "But wait, theres more".
I wanted a free for all mode where its melee only called feast of blades.
Edit: Yes I will kill the hostages

[Blueliner07]

I am a bit confused. Just to be clear when we are talking CO-OP we mean some type of Horde Mode or does CO-OP mean campaign CO-OP?? Or both?? Relic already said there will be no campaign CO-OP right? Or is that what they are talking about when they say it will come as DLC? Or we don't know yet?

[Misterpeanut288]

We have no idea since Relic has never specified what their co-op was we only had a article that gave us an unconfirmed bit of information and was then edited out of the article some days later.

[SpaceMarineFan]

Everything will be cleared up in an hour.

[nanahachi]

first article I've found so far
http://www.destructoid.com/preview-warhammer-40-000-space-marine-multiplayer-206532.phtml

Info:

three classes of Space Marines - Tactical, Devastator (HB, Plasma Canon), Assault (jump packs, chainswords).
8 vs. 8 team battles in two modes, a deathmatch game called "Annihilation" and the control point-based "Seize Ground."
In Seize Ground games, you can choose to spawn at a control point held by your team.

More than thirty chapters of Space Marines are represented as base color sets but you're free to make your unique Marine by swapping out helmets, chests and individual arms and legs. Each component can be painted individually from an impressive range of official colors from Games Workshop's Citadel line of paints

Customizer also allows you to create custom loadouts. Each class has its own selection of weapons they can wield, along with a range of class and weapon-specific perks. There is plenty of variety among the perks, of which you can select two. Weapons and perks are unlocked through an experience progression system with over forty levels.

some sweet pics, I won't post them all here...
http://www.destructoid.com/elephant/photo-m.phtml?photo_key=189193&post_key=206532#prevnext

http://bulk.destructoid.com/ul/206532-preview-warhammer-40-000-space-marine-multiplayer/FinalMP_MultiplayerGameplay_Sho-620x.jpg

http://www.destructoid.com/elephant/photo-m.phtml?photo_key=189195&post_key=206532#prevnext

[Misterpeanut288]

Pulling picks now thanks Nana.

[Shuma]

According to the spanish website there's a gameplay mode called "seize the ground" which involves holding specific objectives in the map to win, sounds like well, obviously Dawn of War and Unreal Tournament's conquest(?) mode. They also mention the army painter although they don't go into specifics besides "they let you make your own character" it also confirms that as you play you unlock weapons and other stuff, they will latter have an interview with Relic up.

Edit:

Maybe i should've read the destructoid link first instead of just repeating what they said.

[Red Dox]

German Review @MP
http://www.gamersglobal.de/news/38188/warhammer-40k-space-marine-mulitplayer-modus-angespielt#new

-3 classes: Tactical - supposed to be balanced, mentioned plasmagun, sniper rifle, combat knife. Devastator - Lascannon, rocketlauncher. Ability seems to be switching between rapid fire or more powerful shots. Assault - Jumppack.
-TDM or a point capture mode, 8v8
-8 charakter perks for unlock (mentioned: faster regeneration, additional weaponslot)
-addtionial weapon perks unlock as usual, with kills, headshots, etc.

-----Red Dox

[Misterpeanut288]

IGN vid up.

[Red Dox]

3 Vids @ http://www.gametrailers.com/

-----Red Dox

[nanahachi]

Here's the link for the IGN vid Misterpeanut mentioned
http://www.ign.com/videos/2011/07/20/space-marine-multiplayer-video-preview?objectid=14352257

Gametrailers' vids (Thanks Red Dox!):
http://www.gametrailers.com/video/annihilation-multiplayer-warhammer-40-000/717667?type=flv

http://www.gametrailers.com/video/multiplayer-interview-warhammer-40-000/717665?type=flv

http://www.gametrailers.com/video/seize-ground-warhammer-40-000/717669?type=flv

[Shuma]

God.

Fucking.

Damn.

The Multiplayer looks fun as fuck.

[TheV3ng3ance]

Jizzed all over the place, So theres only two multiplayer modes?

Also the rengade chapter in the single player is called The chosen of Nemeroth.

[Pocktio]

Feh. Am I the only one feeling they've not done as much as they could? I mean ffs no voices? I can imagine those grunts will start to grate after a while.

They could have done a sweet Chapter customisation drop-down selection - Primarch. Giving you warcries, along with the basic For T'Empra etc.

Such a missed opportunity....they continue to disappoint me with their seemingly pretended 'adherence to fluff'

Also 3 classes? Most games have at least 4, think of the badass things they could have done. Sorcerors, sergeants, apocs, chaplains. Yet they go for 'standard' marine that is identical bar the arbitrary weapon restrictions imposed. So little variety.

And what the hell is with every marine having a shield..

Gah I wish I could be excited but this just looks added on with not much thought, the only saving grace is the customisation. Yet if they think that forgives the lack in other areas...feh.

Other than that it looks fun, just not as great as it should be.

Edit: Objective video watched. Not even an announcer. Seriously, what the fuck Relic.

[Misterpeanut288]

Pistol swipe at :40 of the annihilation gameplay.

@Pocktio: While I agree that voices other than the grunts would have been a nice touch it is not a necessity I find customizing my marine's armor with a new paint job and different model variations is far more important.

[Shuma]

Well shit man, maybe it's because it's their first shooter game(The Outfit never happened). I personally love the grunts, that's how i always imagined Marines and Chaos Marines sounding on the battlefield, pissed as fuck at everything. Regenerating health? AUGH! HUUUUUUGH UUUUUUUUUURGH! Bolter round to the chest? UUUUUUUUUUUGH HUUUUUUUUUUR, swinging your fist at the air? You better believe that's a HUUUUUUUUR UUUUUUUUUR AUUUUUUUGH!!!

I am a bit disappointed that there's no librarians, or anything else like Apothecaries and Chaplains(CHAPLAAAAAAAAAAINS) but sergeants? What would a sergeant do that the current classes don't do? Buff shit and use the same weapons assault marines use? Still waiting on Terminator armor stuff, i mean come on Relic spit it out already!

[Ruined]

We didn't show co-op by the way guys, it is a stand alone mode but this was only competitive MP :)

[Pocktio]

Yeah pretty much. I was gonna say Captain but it's not that likely to have lots of them running around, whereas you can kind of excuse multiple sarges, chaplains and apocs. I just wanted some sort of shown investment they really care about the fluff, they just haven't shown it so far, for me anyway. I have exceedingly, excessively high expectations of Relic is all. I know they make fantasmically wondrous things and games but this, as you said, is their first 'new' game in a while so I'd want them to go so all out on it. Even a CoD style Captain/Chaos Lord narrating the match would be enough. 'Capture that node, lowly minions' 'We are losing, Warp take your incompetent souls!' etc

You know what, I'd happily pay for 'super fluff DLC' where they add all of these options. Or I wonder if you could mod in your own dialogue. Though it wouldn't work for competitive multi, blast. One of my favourite things about DoW, as I'm sure is much loved by everyone, is the dialogue. Seriously, who didn't like hearing 'SANITY IS FOR THE WEAK' while playing as Chaos? It's just such an awesomesauce epic addition that makes a 40k game. Otherwise it just seems like a standard 'Grizzly Space Marine in Space' affair.

Editing in a whine disclaimer here - I am very much looking forward to the MP. Like, I want a raptor so bad.

Edit the second - So do you get full customisation off the bat? Or will a higher level Mehreen look suitably more shiny than a lower level Mehreen?

[Caeltos]

Multiplayer looks fun like hell, I can't wait to hook it up with friends. The customization is super sweet as well. <3 <3 <3

[Misterpeanut288]

If you haven't noticed yet the Blue Marine in the 4th picture from the top has a bionic left arm. :cool:

[Ruined]

We apparently have over 1.8 billion combinations with our customiser (worked out by someone much better at maths than me).

[Misterpeanut288]

Not that it has anything to do with MP but chaoswarband apears to be called Chosen of Nemeroth or at least that is the name of the armor that looks exactly like the SP CSM armor.

[Shuma]

We apparently have over 1.8 billion combinations with our customiser (worked out by someone much better at maths than me).

Just. Just. Just take my money damn it!

[Busby]

Objective video watched. Not even an announcer. Seriously, what the fuck Relic.

You really want an announcer?

The forces of Chaos are contesting a The forces of Chaos are contesting a victory location! Do not let The forces of Chaos are contesting We have taken the lead The forces of Chaos are contesting a victory location! The forces of Chaos have captured a victory location We are purifying a victory location The forces of Chaos are contesting a victory We are nearly victories Brothers! The forces of Chaos are contesting a victory location! One of our brothers is the manifestation of The forces of Chaos are contesting a victory location! Victory Brothers! The Emperor smiles on us this day!

[Misterpeanut288]

Just. Just. Just take my money damn it!

Can't say it any better than that.

[Bayard]

Higher level marine looks better / different than lower level marine. you unlock various pieces by doing things in the game. ( x many kills, x many revenge kills etc.. winning x matches. )

Customizer itself isn't available till level 4 ( which is only about 5-10 games worth ? depends how you play ). once you get there, colours are available off the bat.

I haven't seen mention of the BEST feature of multiplayer at lower levels. Copy Loadout. so, you just got owned by a level 40 marine who's all blinged out with upgrades? copy his loadout, now until you die, you've got all those perks too. ( doesn't mean you know how to use them, but you've got them ).

Different classes have different shield levels. also different classes have different perks that can make them potentially stronger. I started out not liking the tactical marine quite as much, now I play all the classes pretty much equally, depending on the map and what the team needs.

[Misterpeanut288]

I haven't seen mention of the BEST feature of multiplayer at lower levels. Copy Loadout. so, you just got owned by a level 40 marine who's all blinged out with upgrades? copy his loadout, now until you die, you've got all those perks too. ( doesn't mean you know how to use them, but you've got them ).

Well that is an interesting little feature not sure if I like it or not, but if it works like it should it evens out the playing field a little bit.

[ph03nIXx]

No apothecary? and whats that left arm on the IGN Video at 1:12 following? To me that looks like an apothecary's nathecium arm... so perk or eq option?

[Pocktio]

Heh if you can customise yourself to look like a unique character I'll be happy.

And yes Busby, Space Marines aren't telepathic they need comms to be killy. I just want some sort of voice, like a localised cry of 'For the Emperor' from each loyalist as a point is secured. Not exactly annoying is that?

[Misterpeanut288]

Anyone else notice that the MP lascannon gets a power pack?

Just got another article with a snapshot of the weapons page in the manual.

[nanahachi]

As the IGN video keeps pointing out, the WH nerd in me is really damn happy with the Customizer.

I'm fine with 3 classes. I'm fine with 2 mulitplayer modes (it'd be great if others were added as DLC maybe). I just want this game NOW :)

[Pocktio]

Yar, and an ammo backpack for heavy bolters.

Anyone else noticed the Chaos terminator as the 'still' picture for the IGN video? So awesome....

[TheV3ng3ance]

Did you unlock everything for these guys to play with or just some of the stuff?

True grit fuck yes! Can the power axe be made to look like a crozius or the Hammer look like a axe?

[Misterpeanut288]

Gamespot interview with McDermott going up in a sec.

[Jager]

Finally!

[Ra owa]

Multiplayer looks fun :) Give me assault marine nowwwwww!

[Ramrod]

IF the multiplayer info is relea- oh, lookit.

PS. this is awesome

[TheV3ng3ance]

There are different shoulder barges?

[Misterpeanut288]

2 G4tv videos going up now in one of them you can see a marine with a tabard which is awesome.

[Jager]

Yup, lots of different badges for your left shoulder.

[Shuma]

This reminds me, will we have custom badges in the PC version like in Retribution and DoW I? yes? no? Can't say?

[nanahachi]

holy Terra the G4 vids are long, 19+ and 8+ mins each
http://www.g4tv.com/games/xbox-360/62098/warhammer-40000-space-marine/articles/75061/warhammer-40000-space-marine-multiplayer-hands-on-preview/

[whatsleft]

Although MP looks awesome, but i just cant help but feel sad for the lacking in content. Orks arent represented, which is baffling when they already have models and weapons for them. just use a shoota nob, stormboy nob and a loota nob, wala orks represented! game modes look really uninspired. its the old regular death match, capture points and shit, cmon give us something new! like escort mission cum attack/defense game mode.

here's 1 i thought up. space marines to escort a supply train to a factory, chaos to prevent them from doing so. once space marines successfully bring that supply train to factory, a new mission objective is issued which is to destroy a chaos space marine strong hold, in that strong hold is guarded by powerful auto turrets and ambush/choke points. but that supply train is key to the new objective. inside has parts for a dreadnought where it will be assembled at the factory(in a cool steampunk manner). any player can hop on(supposedly "sacrificed" so he cant hop out) for that extra firepower to break through. in the factory, the dreadnought can swap out ranged or melee weapons unlocking different modes, ranged dread can fire missiles and assault cannon. melee dreads can charge into the fray and dishing out insane damage at melee.

there's so much u guys can do to provide a proper SM experience, just so much more. but damn. still i would be lying if i said wouldnt be buying it.

cheers,
A very disappointed fan.

[Jager]

No user-created badges for ship, though it's certainly something we could look into adding. That said I can't get into anything about DLC (aside from confirming what Ruined said about co-op).

[Shuma]

No user-created badges for ship, though it's certainly something we could look into adding. That said I can't get into anything about DLC (aside from confirming what Ruined said about co-op).

Cool, thanks.

[Jager]

No prob, I'm stoked that this info has finally been announced. IMO our MP is ridiculously fun; in fact I'm going to be a douche and tell you guys that I'm firing it up to play right now =P

[Scarlet_Pimp]

Cvg preview pointing out some issues already hope they can sort the balance out before release.
http://www.computerandvideogames.com/312305/previews/warhammer-40k-space-marine-multiplayer-hands-on/

Also bit disappointed everyone will be random chapters rather than have teams of all blood angels or what ever chapter is on that map

[meepnight]

We didn't show co-op by the way guys, it is a stand alone mode but this was only competitive MP

So just confirming, there will be no coop (not even campaign) on ship and it will be stand alone dlc?

Will there be some more atmospheric sounds added later? haha some classic DoW raptor lines would just be epic.

[nanahachi]

I'm not trying to defend Relic, but something I think is getting overlooked is that this is Relic's first game of this genre (as said above) and that they are probably aiming for a wide audience in addition to us, the WH fans. They've essentially already appealed to our niche b/c it's a 40k game. For the non-Wh fans, simplicity is key , making it too complicated might not bode well for the casual gamers who can't figure out the different classes. Don't get me wrong, I'd welcome more variety, but we don't need a healer class (Apoth?) or a TF2-style engie/building sentry class (Tech marine) etc. Chaplains would be a damn cool upgrade for Tac/ASM though.

Also, from what I keep hearing in all these vids is the whole point of PARITY. SM facing CSM enables balance of weapons/etc between the teams. How many times have we seen people bitch and moan in compet MP that X team gets certain weapons and Y team gets certain other weapons, and one team ends up OP much of the time, etc etc etc. Having essentially 2 SM forces fight each other means that the SM don't slaughter the Orks/insert_race_here every round (although I suppose it could be all Nobs and not the rank&file sluggas/shootas). Maybe its too safe an approach, but I think its a FAIR one.

Also, re: playing as other races, Gears (to which the media foolishly compare this game) didn't let you play as the Locust in the first game either. Maybe the sequel(s) to Space Marine will allow for that.

[Shuma]

While i agree with pretty much anything, i don't think this:


Also, from what I keep hearing in all these vids is the whole point of PARITY. SM facing CSM enables balance of weapons/etc between the teams.

Would be a good argument to use against the whole "no more classes thing" i mean i'm pretty sure Chaos has Apothecaries and Chaplains too, the Word bearers certainly have the Dark Apostles, not sure about Orks though, but they do have the uh... Pain boys? To mirror the Apoths, that said, i don't think either of them would've been good choices(although a skull mask would certainly be nice for the a helmet) for classes, the one class that i am a bit sad isn't in the game are psykers, would've been awesome to play as Librarians and Sorcerers in MP, BUT, this is Relic, so i'm sure we can expect 10 sequels to the game so they have to save some stuff for those.

Edit:

Oh god, beakie helmet confirmed at 4.50 in the 19 minute long video of customization, also apparently the default armor is the mk 8 armor, that's curious.

[Supernaut]

I still think you missed a trick by not having Orks represented in MP. I can understand balance but these will be mirror matches. :(
More enemies makes everything better.

Definitely picking the game up though, I've had it preordered for a long time now, though the previews of the MP left me a little disappointed this will probably change when I actually get my hands on the game and try it out.

Of course if Relic are willing to keep adding to the MP with DLC (and there is so so so much potential there) I'll keep on playing.

[meepnight]

I'm not trying to defend Relic, but something I think is getting overlooked is that this is Relic's first game of this genre (as said above) and that they are probably aiming for a wide audience in addition to us, the WH fans. They've essentially already appealed to our niche b/c it's a 40k game. For the non-Wh fans, simplicity is key , making it too complicated might not bode well for the casual gamers who can't figure out the different classes. Don't get me wrong, I'd welcome more variety, but we don't need a healer class (Apoth?) or a TF2-style engie/building sentry class (Tech marine) etc. Chaplains would be a damn cool upgrade for Tac/ASM though.


Battlefield: Warhammer 40k w/ destructible terrain?

GET ON IT RERIC!

[Red Dox]

Wow seeing this
http://www.g4tv.com/videos/54234/warhammer-40k-space-marine-customization-walkthrough-video/?quality=hd
I must say, the customisation is well done.

-----Red Dox

[Shuma]

Man they really went nuts with the army customizer, i hope there is capes though, although i'm ready to be dissapoint and sad on that front. Still happy we got tabards, loincloths, or whatever those things are called.

Edit:

Blood Raven scheme with the battle scarred armor is delicious.

[nanahachi]

Shuma, I probably rushed my post.

I meant to say Apoths/TMs didn't seem needed to me gameplay wise, not for parity issues. Sure, other races do have similar functions/character types, I didn't mean to go there.

I do agree about psykers being absent, I was thinking Libbies/Sorcerers would be cool as well and would add a nice mix. Oh well

[TheV3ng3ance]

In game customizable emblems, deeper customization and more game modes in the future would be great.

[coldplay]

The armour you start with is Mk7 'Aquila' Power Armor on Space Marines, the Mk8 just happens to be at the top of the list :)

[whatsleft]

tm or chaplains can be easily represented through upgrades. like a player who is very experienced with 2handed weapons can become a techmarine, requirements would be a certain number of kills for every 2 handed ranged weapons in the game, not counting the ones for devastators. then he gets a skin change, turning into a techmarine. for those favouring close combat, they can turn into a chaplain, again once meeting requirements like killing x number of dudes and fulfilling some achievement like killing 4 players in a short time frame, though it would be fluffier if chaplains loses the jetpack for iron halos. as for those scoring alot of team points, they can turn into sergeants, eventually into captains, while everyone else remains a battle brother until they proven themselves to be slightly different.

[Bayard]

Cvg preview pointing out some issues already hope they can sort the balance out before release.
http://www.computerandvideogames.com...ayer-hands-on/

they're only claiming assault is OP because they hadn't played long enough and we're playing on very assault friendly maps from what i saw.

I initially thought assault was OP as well, but you just have to learn to how to deal with them, then you figure out just how fragile the little birdies are :p

at this point I play ( and get owned ) by all classes pretty much equally. I'm pretty sure all of us have gotten good at this game, but some of us have gotten really good. ( there's one guy who if he's got the lascannon is just brutal )

[TheV3ng3ance]

Multiplayer might not be the focus of the game but why so lenient on number of maps?

[Misterpeanut288]

THQSledgehammer's walkthrough of the customizer is up.

[Ruined]

I'm pretty sure, (though may be wrong as i'm not the biggest tabletop expert) that there are badges for all the chapters including the obscure ones. There are a lot anyway :)

[Caeltos]

It's like any "metagame", they're making assumptions based on very little experience, so claiming any balance accusations on this event is nothing short but stupid. Hell, I'll go on a ball and say that Assault Marines are probably the most reliable distrupters for capping, whereas you'll need Tacticals to get actually get the job done. Devastators sits in the back covering Tacs, and Assaults prepare for counter-initiate against the enemy team. It's great design & it's on even terms since they're rehashed classes & weapons, but the distinguishment of characters is sufficient for most people. Based on the level design as well, it's clever use of elevated terrain to help boosten the Assault Marines to ambush opponents, but also doing this creates a timing for Devastators to rain neverending hail of devastation. Tacticals being the swiss-army knife, can do pretty much everything- but I suppose they're a core function unit for the team to capture locations & etc. An overbundance of mobility isn't neccasarily always a good thing.

E-sport material, I'm calling it naow.

[konfeta]

Hm, my only complaint is probably aesthetic. I still don't like how weak/rapid fire the Plasma Cannon and Lascannon feel. DoW 2 is miles ahead in this department.

Any word on whenever PC will have dedicated servers?

[Ruined]

Also Bayard is right i started as an Assault Marine but now only play tactical. Once you get used to dealing with the flyers it really isn't a big deal swatting them out of the air and Melta = 1 shot kill if you hit them right with it.

Every class has benefits and weaknesses, new players just find Assault marines hard to deal with as they aren't used to people flying around the map :)

[Shuma]

Man, September seems so far away now, why do all the great games of this year come after august? Curse you time, move faster!

Anyway, i wonder, are we being shown everything that's in the customizer? Or is Relic still keeping some surprises? Like high end gear and stuff?

[Ruined]

The videos show all the standard gear available at launch. There are pre-order exclusives and a few unlockable sets (things like finishing the game / reaching max level) too

Sledgehammer is going to be doing an update on chapters vs pre-order items soon so keep an eye out for that.

Of course we are planning a bunch more content to be patched in as DLC too but it is too early to talk about all that yet :)

[Jager]

Assault Marines definitely aren't OP, I think the designers have done a great job with the balance.

Another thing to note is that 3 classes != 3 styles of play. Depending on what weapons and perks you choose, your playstyle can change quite a bit within the class itself. There are really a lot of cool options once you start unlocking some of the higher level perks.

[Caeltos]

By the way, will there be any demo out on steam prior to the release?

[Shuma]

God i hope so.

[Hirmetrium]

I gotta say guys, I'm loving this mass feedback. The customiser looks truely fantastic, and I look forward to messing around with it.

[cobaltlotus]

Please give us some kind of demo or something D:

Also, Ruined, are you saying that all the stuff seen in the video is there from day 1 the moment you play MP? Or will we have to unlock most of the aesthetics? I hope most of it is readily available..

[Ramrod]

Cobaltlotus, you can see in the 19 minute G4TV video that a lot of it has to be unlocked, around the halfway mark.

[Steel*Faith]

I don't know guys, I'm getting some mixed feelings about this. This MP kinda seems cheesy and tacked on. Some things bothering me...

- EVERY DAMN player has a shield?! What the hell is this, Halo?!?! They don't even have a Iron Halo or Refractor Field on them - where the hell is this shield magically generating from?! Sorry Relic, but this is really lame. I could see a Iron Halo , Refractor Field , or Rosarius item being one of the perks you choose at high levels, but this is just a default ability and it's unfluffy and lame. The shield doesn't even look like anything I've seen represented in the 40k universe either; this really just screams out Halo rip off to me - sorry.

- Melee seems so spammy and has no real skill or difficulty. I don't even see a defensive ability or block button to use when you're fighting in melee, it's just who can spam more melee attacks first it seems. The melee combat system just looks shallow - very disappointing.

- Probably my biggest gripe and let down - total lack of the classic voice work in MP. One of the best features of the Dawn of War series was the memorable and entertaining voicework for the units. There is a total lack of zealous, hate-filled banter between Chaos and Loyalists. I was totally expecting to hear the insane laughter, battlecries, and chanting of Chaos - but all we hear is "UHG!" or "GRRR!" - wow, really? What happened to dozens of memorable lines we grew to love in the DoW series? This is a huge missed opportunity to set apart the character and feel of this MP from the many other shooters out there, and show new gamers just how awesome WH40k really is - MISSED OPPORTUNITY RELIC!

The customization system is the one awesome thing about the mp, and I do appreciate the effort they put into it. Althoguh if the gameplay is going to be so streamlined and shallow, I don't think this game will be worth it, but that largely depends on how much quality and depth went into the SP as well. So I'm defintiely on the fence right now; my final decision to buy this game will hinge on whether there is a swarm mode. If there's no swarm mode, then I can definitely say that I will unfortunately have to pass this game up. Let's hope Relic didn't drop the ball on this title.

[Slade_Templar]

- EVERY DAMN player has a shield?! What the hell is this, Halo?!?! They don't even have a Iron Halo or Refractor Field on them - where the hell is this shield magically generating from?! Sorry Relic, but this is really lame. I could see a Iron Halo , Refractor Field , or Rosarius item being one of the perks you choose at high levels, but this is just a default ability and it's unfluffy and lame. This really just screams out Halo rip off to me - sorry.

YEA GIMME DEM HEALTH PACKS, MAKES MUCH MOAR SENSE!

Yes, there is a horde mode.

[Misterpeanut288]

I am intrigued by possible combination of these Tac perks:

Teleport Homer-Allies re-entering combat may do so at your position [as long as you remain alive]
+
Master Crafted Wargear:Increased wargear effectiveness [frag grenades, blind grenades, and combat stims]


Assuming combat stims are similar to the DoW 2 concept of stims this could allow you to be a mobile reinforcement point that can buff/heal the teammates already around you or give the people who are spawning that little umph to get back into the fight.

Failing that however you could take

Larraman's Blessing(Zomg nerf Apoth Reric!!1!)-Significantly improved health regeneration.

to keep you alive as long as possible so you can continue to allow your team to reinforce right into the field.

----------



- EVERY DAMN player has a shield?! What the hell is this, Halo?!?! They don't even have a Iron Halo or Refractor Field on them - where the hell is this shield magically generating from?! Sorry Relic, but this is really lame. I could see a Iron Halo , Refractor Field , or Rosarius item being one of the perks you choose at high levels, but this is just a default ability and it's unfluffy and lame. The shield doesn't even look like anything I've seen represented in the 40k universe either; this really just screams out Halo rip off to me - sorry.

Pretty sure that "shield" is in fact supposed to represent the fact that you are where power armor and yes the Devestator can take an Iron Halo which gives him an extra layer of defence.


- Melee seems so spammy and has no real skill or difficulty. I don't even see a defensive ability or block button to use when you're fighting in melee, it's just who can spam more melee attacks first it seems. The melee combat system just looks shallow - very disappointing.

Actually there is a roll/dodge command which is in fact a defensive ability and you can use your jet pack defensively to escape your attackers you see this in a few of the videos to good effect.


- Probably my biggest gripe and let down - total lack of the classic voice work in MP. One of the best features of the Dawn of War series was the memorable and entertaining voicework for the units. There is a total lack of zealous, hate-filled banter between Chaos and Loyalists. I was totally expecting to hear the insane laughter, battlecries, and chanting of Chaos - but all we hear is "UHG!" or "GRRR!" - wow, really? What happened to dozens of memorable lines we grew to love in the DoW series? This is a huge missed opportunity to set apart the character and feel of this MP from the many other shooters out there, and show new gamers just how awesome WH40k really is - MISSED OPPORTUNITY RELIC!
As a big fan of the voices I will miss them, but they were never a deal breaker not even in the DoW series especially since when you start reaching T2-T3 and frankly you just don't even hear them anymore because you are to focused on micro and it is drowned out by the explosions especially if you are playing a 2v2/3v3 game.

[Steel*Faith]

YEA GIMME DEM HEALTH PACKS, MAKES MUCH MOAR SENSE!

Who the fuck mentioned health packs?! Space Marines fucking armor is a damn health pack in itself. Sorry, but you can't justify the "Halo" shield on every fucking marine, it's totally unfluffy and is such a smack in the face to the fluff. If it looked like a damn WH40k shield, then it wouldn't be so bad, but it seriously looks like a bunch of Halo Master-Chiefs running around the battlefield - pisses me off.

[cobaltlotus]

Lulz. The 'shield' is supposed to represent your health bar. Who cares if it's unfluffy or not? If the game totally obeyed the fluff it'd be 100v100 with vehicles, titans, orbital bombardments, and killstreaks that would turn your Chaos Lord into a Bloodthirster.

WHO CARES IF IT'S TOTALLY UNFLUFFY OR NOT? God, some people are so spoiled lol. Space Marine is supposed to represent the WH40k IP in a mainstream, action-packed, third-person-shooter perspective, and I think it does a pretty good job. Getting so raging mad over the fact the shield looks like it came out of Halo just shows how spoiled you are as a gamer. Besides, none of this stuff is finalized. We'll probably see better voicework and special effects over the next month or so.

Be less ragey, please.

[TheV3ng3ance]

So only half the armor sets are shown in this video?

[Scarlet_Pimp]

Shields for all is total crap, why not just have the armour get damaged to represent health. Shield needs to gtfo

[Shuma]

I'm pretty sure the shield is meant to represent the power armor, and the health represents, you know, health. I can't believe people are whining about fucking shields, i mean fuck. If Relic added an Iron Halo as default on all backpacks would you stop whining? Because i bet you would then whine about how all Marines have Iron Halos on them. Fluff is important, but ultimately Gameplay>Fluff and it's hilarious to see how you make such a big deal out of something so small, i bet that if instead of shield it said armor you wouldn't be whining about it.

[Carl]

No user-created badges for ship, though it's certainly something we could look into adding. That said I can't get into anything about DLC (aside from confirming what Ruined said about co-op).



So bassiclly a confirmation at last that this will be a complely un-moddable game. Expected and i've still pre-ordered it and will doubtless enjoy it. But equally, still sad panda here.

The info is looking good though. Also anyone who's played UT recently and then tried somthing more modern like CoD should get what they mean with slower killing. CoD takes all of about 1 mag emptied accurrattly into somone to kill, and since you can empty m,ost mags in 2-3 seconds thats fast. UT could only approach this outside instagib mode, (the MP standard however), with a salvo'd rocket luanch, redeemer, or sniper headshot.

[TheV3ng3ance]

I'd dedicate the time to beat the single player on hardest difficulty for Graia pattern power armor.

[Steel*Faith]

WHO CARES IF IT'S TOTALLY UNFLUFFY OR NOT?

I CARE! Is it so fucking hard to ask for a WH40kgame that doesn't totally fuck up the story and feel of a beloved IP!? Notice how Gears of War is the same in MP as it is in the SP? Why can so many other games adhere to the story's IP in the gameplay, but when it comes to a WH40k game, it jsut isn't possible?

You know what, I'm really tired of people like you who don't give a fuck about WH40k - people like you are the reason Relic does this shit and gets away with it - ultimately though, I blame Games Worskhop (Yes, you're fucking incompetent at protecting the integrity your own IP). I'm spoiled as a gamer? What the hell does that even mean? This shit doesn't even exist in the WH40k universe, and it's a blatant rip-off of halo. Sorry, but you sound like a classic Relic fanboy coming to Relic's defense, when really, they need to be called out on this kind of dumb shit they couldn't easily avoided. The MP designer for SM must be a really Halo fanboy to be pulling this shit. This is what you call LACK OF CREATIVITY (aka plagiarism).

The SP seems to do a pretty good job of that; at least you don't see Titus glowing like the fucking Masterchief every time he gets shot. So why the hell can't Relic adhere to this in their MP portion of the game?


Gameplay>Fluff and it's hilarious to see how you make such a big deal out of something so smal

How about Gameplay <> Fluff, is that so unreasonable? This shit is getting really fucking old now. Look at a game like Gears of War and comapre it to this nonsense. The story/campaign and the mp are identical. I'm so sick of Relic saying they give a damn about the inegrity of the IP and pull this crap on Warhammer fans - I'm not just talking about the Masterchief shield either.


If Relic added an Iron Halo as default on all backpacks would you stop whining?

No, because it doesn't even look like a damn Iron Halo, it looks EXACTLY like the Spartan energy shield from Halo. Secondly, the Iron Halo is an extremely rare piece of wargear, given to only the decorated Space Marines - not the grunts as you are in MP. You nkow what I overlooked the fully automatic plasama guns and Lascannons - whatever - but when you start creating shit out of thin air and making it look like a rip-off from another popular game, I draw the line.

[Misterpeanut288]

So bassiclly a confirmation at last that this will be a complely un-moddable game.
Yeah doesn't look good, but than again I believe Relic said something similar when it came to DoW 2 and the modding community finally managed to mod the game. So I guess there may be some chance left of something however small that chance is.

[Caeltos]

Marcus gets raped by a lone Grunt in Gears MP. I call that pretty damn unfluffy and very uncanon. Preserving "fluff" into multiplayer balance is such a rare thing, and you're bound to make sacrifices in order to preserve a better balance for players. If you're into fluff & staying true to the game, then I'd suggest you take a good peak at the singleplayer, because it does a fine job at that, and so has the Dawn of War franchise done.

Stop being such diehard fans of craving a 100% interpretation of the fluff into a multiplayer design, because I wouldn't want to be playing as the squishy characters going up against a brutal onslaught of Space Marines. Quite frankly, not alot of people would have a fun time playing it, nor would it be even possible to do. So the whole "you're defending relic" is just absurd, you're being to bias of the WH40K IP to neglect on having a enjoyable & balanced multiplayer component of the game.

[meepnight]

Lulz. The 'shield' is supposed to represent your health bar. Who cares if it's unfluffy or not? If the game totally obeyed the fluff it'd be 100v100 with vehicles, titans, orbital bombardments, and killstreaks that would turn your Chaos Lord into a Bloodthirster.

So....awesome.

[Misterpeanut288]

This could all just be explained away with all of the flashes and such just being information being displayed to the marine through the hud of his helmet.

[Shuma]

This shit doesn't even exist in the WH40k universe

http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Rosarius
http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Refractor_Field
http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Iron_Halo

Herp derp, Relic could just say that every Marine is a veteran and carried a refractor shield on their dick if they wanted.

Edit:


How about Gameplay <> Fluff, is that so unreasonable?

Yes, because surprise surprise, if the game was completely fluffy it wouldn't be fun at all. At least i seriously wouldn't consider being blown the fuck up by like 2 bolter shells "fun" and Gears of War wasn't identical in SP and MP, and even it was it's way different to 40k, if 40k was fluffy, if the MP was like SP, it wouldn't be fun. That's like saying DoW II's mp would be good if it was a copy paste of the campaign.


No, because it doesn't even look like a damn Iron Halo, it looks EXACTLY like the Spartan energy shield from Halo. Secondly, the Iron Halo is an extremely rare piece of wargear, given to only the decorated Space Marines - not the grunts as you are in MP. You nkow what I overlooked the fully automatic plasama guns and Lascannons - whatever - but when you start creating shit out of thin air and making it look like a rip-off from another popular game, I draw the line.

You are not the authority on how Space marine shields look, i'm sure GW and Relic would know better how the fuck it looks, even in DoW II it doesn't look the same, Space Marine's one is blue, Chaos one is purple, and the IG ones are gold. And no one ever said you played as grunts in MP, hell they wear armor called Veteran, and Relic, and shit, i'm pretty sure they're NOT meant to be grunts.

Plasma Guns don't fire slowly, people fire them slowly because they overheat if you use them like a machinegun, which is what happens in the game, and the Lascannon doesn't fire fast either, it has to charge up, have you even watched the videos or are you just bitching for the sake of bitching?

[konfeta]

Also anyone who's played UT recently and then tried somthing more modern like CoD should get what they mean with slower killing.
A misconception, IMO. UT weapons kill very, very fast. Most weapons can kill in a second or in simply one shot. What makes UT different from CoD is that you can move fast enough to actually dodge most of the fire. Well, that and ability to pick up armor.

@Steel
Multiplayer matches are inherently destructive to lore. Given gameplay requirements, an energy shield is a simple solution that's easy to read, accessible to new time players, and doesn't take a crap ton of resources to model armor damage feedback.

[cobaltlotus]

Lulz. God, you're so mad.

The shield ONLY represents the durability of the power armor where; like Shuma said; the health represents health. It's a video game; no video game is perfect. The visible effects of the shield are going to represent when it's empty, and when it's recharging, as I've seen several times in the videos; I've ALSO seen in one of the videos a player with an Iron Halo. Not sure if that was just the backpack for the sake of aesthetics or not, but still.

You're spoiled; what this means is, in Space Marine's case, you're too ****ing blind to look past the fluff for FIVE seconds; which no game could ever possibly PERFECTLY adhere to because of engine and gameplay obstacles; for the sake of the gameplay, which is what really matters to players. This isn't a game meant DIRECTLY for the tiny fraction of gamers that are for 40k fans, it's meant for the larger demographic; a game where you can play a good story without having millions of hours of prep reading fluff and playing DoW1/2. It's meant to play easily so that it has a larger target audience, and more people will play it rather than overlook it. You have some kind of awful sense of entitlement that says "HEY, THIS IS MY IP, OBEY THE FLUFF OR BE SHOT"

Your attitude about the game is ridiculous. If ONE THING, the little shields on marines that pop up when they get shot, or it's charging, or it's empty, is going to stop you from buying the game, so be it. Relic is not making this game for you. They're making it so they can present the IP to people in a way that hasn't been done before, so they can expand the IP into mainstream crowds, and so they can- at the end of the day- make their due, and get paid. Gameplay comes first, fluff comes second. Also, I'm not a Relic fanboy, as you put it; I'm merely saying that you're spoiled, with a ****ty attitude, and you think the game is being made because YOU want it. Well, it's not. I love Relic, they're an awesome studio and they make some epic games and I expect no different from Space Marine. In fact, I KNOW it will be epic.

You need to hop off your high horse and get a better perspective of things. Gameplay will always own fluff until the day we can make games that present the IP perfectly so everyone will be happy. But you CANNOT hope to please every single individual. If you're going to ***** that much about the shields, or voicework, or other things that spoil the game so badly for you, go complain to Relic. I know this game is going to be epic and I'm having trouble just waiting to get my hands on it.

You're the kind of gamer that ruins it for the rest of us. Please sit down, put your seatbelt on, and kindly quit your pissing and moaning over the shield effects.

[Steel*Faith]

Hey you know what? Since we're going to start adding in shit from other IP's, and scrapping the WH40k IP, how about we get rid of chainswords, and add in Lightsabers!? So cool huh!? SM with Lightsabers!

[Misterpeanut288]

Relic could just say that every Marine is a veteran and carried a refractor shield on their dick if they wanted

Never heard of the great champion of the Ultramarines Evinius and his iron codpiece and how it protected him from a horrible fate at the hands of an ork armed with a power klaw?


Hey you know what? Since we're going to start adding in shit from other IP's, and scarpping the WH40k IP, how about we get rid of chainswords, and add in Lightsabers!? So cool huh!? SM with Lightsabers!

You are blowing this out of proportion steel just step back and relax take a few moments to collect your thoughts no need to drive yourself up a wall we can discuss this reasonably.

[konfeta]

SM with Lightsabers!
You mean Power Weapons?

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/archive/7/73/20110128203738!Trollface.png

[Shuma]

Hey you know what? Since we're going to start adding in shit from other IP's, and scrapping the WH40k IP, how about we get rid of chainswords, and add in Lightsabers!? So cool huh!? SM with Lightsabers!

Jesus christ you're not even making sense, Space Marines do have Shields, Thunder shields have them, refractor shields are used even by the IG, Iron Halos project shields, Rozarius project shields. 3 Of these are even in DoW II for fucks sake.

And there's also lightsabers in 40k:

"In the early part of his career, Eisenhorn carried a power sword of unusual design; instead of having a conventional metal blade as the focus of its energy-field, the blade was itself made of pure energy."

http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Gregor_Eisenhorn

Maybe you're the one who doesn't know anything about the 40k ip. Deal with it.

[Nouw]

First off, minor nitpicks, don't reply to me if you're not going to read the entire post.
-Two game modes feels a little small. Actually no, this needs to be fixed. There could have been Capture the Flag, an Assassination style game-mode, a defence and offence style game-mode, Chaos Taint/Zombie mode and hell even a Land Speeder race one! I feel underwhelmed by only two.
-Customizer is brilliant but not perfect. Colour seems to be the main thing but physical properties feel a tad lacking. I'm sure they can include more of them once you gain experience. Also, this has bugged me with many games but why can't we just choose our own custom-scarring option? You know, so you can choose your own way of looking badass?
-HUD feels a little messy but this isn't really important.
-Voice acting and lack of choice of 'battlecry' feels a little disappointing considering the awesome that was in Dawn of War.

Complaints aside, they've done a good job and I can't say jack about this until I try it.

[Hirmetrium]

Steel*Faith, you need to calm down. It's an adaptation of the Intellectual property. Considering GW vetted this, and shield itself sounds like a misnomer (it might as well be called "armour") I think your being very unreasonable.

It's like shitting bricks because the harry potter movies didn't follow the exact words and plot line J K Rowling wrote in her books. It's called artistic license, and happens every day.

[Ramrod]

And there's also lightsabers in 40k:

"In the early part of his career, Eisenhorn carried a power sword of unusual design; instead of having a conventional metal blade as the focus of its energy-field, the blade was itself made of pure energy."

http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Gregor_Eisenhorn

Apparently that's what they were like back in the RT era, according to an old reply by retired fluff guru Robert Frazer to a question I had. Eisenhorn's sword seems to have been a tribute to that by explaining that such swords were "ancient and rare."

I'm nervous about the possible lack of moddability. I already preordered it on PS3 in the hopes that there will be local play (there will be, right?), and on PC in the hopes that it would be moddable. I'll be disappointed if one of the two features is not in. I'll be pissed off as Hell if they're both not in.

[Shuma]

1: There's 3 game modes, conquest, or hold objectives, or whatever it's called, deathmatch and anhilation, which i assume means FFA and team deathmatch. But i agree, needs more modes.
2: Well they said there's 1.8 or something billion possible combinations of wargear...
3: Custom scarring, i don't know how you could even make this work since it would involve new textures or models so i don't see how you could do this in-game.

Edit:

Yep, point is they still exist in canon.

[Carl]

A misconception, IMO. UT weapons kill very, very fast. Most weapons can kill in a second or in simply one shot. What makes UT different from CoD is that you can move fast enough to actually dodge most of the fire. Well, that and ability to pick up armor.



You obviously haven't cracked it out in a while ;).

Very few weapons have that capability they don't fire fast enough nor have enough damage per shot. There are a couple like that of course ;).

Your right however that dodging, and more importantly, the impossibbility of tracking even a steadily moving target accurratly, with most weapons also played a very key part in things.

Also i think it's pretty dammed obvious the "sheild" is supposed to represent armour, they just used the sheild name because in the campaign it represents an Iron Halo effect. in MP it probably represents the armour + if your a Dev marine and have an Iron Halo, the effect of that.

[Misterpeanut288]

-Two game modes feels a little small. Actually no, this needs to be fixed. There could have been Capture the Flag, an Assassination style game-mode, a defence and offence style game-mode, Chaos Taint/Zombie mode and hell even a Land Speeder race one! I feel underwhelmed by only two.

Correct me if I am wrong but you would include co-op in this list no? If so than they have it it just apparently going to be released a little bit after the games release since they wanted to continue to polish the mode or at least that is what has been suggested in the Spanish article in the OP. I do have some rumors though from the C&C article take a look. (mind you it is not official)

DLC:
There were a few hushed hints at future DLC. Somebody mentioned to me in passing of five man multiplayer missions and levels…but with the 40k universe the sky is the limit on what we might see.

[Steel*Faith]

I'm calming down now....

Ok, I just received an interesting message a MP designer at Relic. So they chose the visual, "Halo-esque", shield to represent the armor meter so players understand the difference between an armor hit and a health bar hit... err ok.

So what in the Emperor's name were you thinking though Relic? If a SM is taking massive damage, and the weapons mange to penetrate the armor, then what the hell do you think is going to make more sense to portray? Blood or some magical shield that appears molded around the body? If you got through the damn armor, obviously blood splatter is much more WARHAMMER, and less Masterchief Halo. Can you even imagine this shit in the Dawn of War games?!

What would've been much better was visual gore, and an audible effect from the armor breaking and the Marine saying something in panic. For example, the marine could scream out "Emperor, protect me!" , and this would've given the enemy player a clear sign that he has got through the armor. It would've been more consistent with the grim-dark and brutal atmosphere of the Warhammer 40k IP.

Besides the terrible shield idea, let's not forget the severe lack of voice work in MP and the simple melee system. We all know how awesome it is in DoW MP - why couldn't we get this in such an important game as SM?! And we couldn't even get a block button to defend yourself against spamming melee attacks? I'm hoping this is in the game, but it wasn't shown yet in the videos.

[Shuma]

Because blood splatters when you're losing health, not when you're losing armor? I mean gee, could that be the reason? I mean last time i looked armor didn't bleed.


Can you even imagine this shit in the Dawn of War games?!

Yeah, i see it every time when i buy an Iron Halo for my FC, or activate the Commissar's refractor shield, or the Inquisitor's rosarious, or...

[Caeltos]

Steel*faith is a big troll, or just flat-out stupid.

Sorry, just voicing what people are thinking. )

[Shuma]

Sometimes someone has to say it, you're credit to the team.

[Nouw]

I have no idea how to quote so my apologies.

So there's going to be 3 modes? Oh well, 3 will have to do for a bit.
I read 1.8 billion and realized that this is achievable through colours, not armour itself. I'm betting it's going to be much lower for armour but still it's just a way of getting it from good to great.
So it's impossible? I thought a scratch of silver on your armour wouldn't be too hard but thanks for clearing that up anyway.

[Shuma]

Well if you watch the 19 minute video of customization, there's A LOT of wargear pieces to choose from anyway.
And i don't know if it's impossible, i just don't know how you could do it, or to be more acurrate, i don't know how you could do it AND make it look good.

[konfeta]

You obviously haven't cracked it out in a while .
I sure did. Most weapons are capable of doing 100+ damage in 1 hit (one hit kill on freshly spawned players), and those that aren't instead do obscene damage per second (Link Gun, Minigun) to the tune of being able to kill in 1 second or less. The only guns that deviated from this were starting weapons (Enforcers needed to be akimo and/or headshots to kill in a second; Assault Rifles had a spread that made the Flak Cannon look accurate). Weapons are insanely lethal in UT. Difficulty of tracking moving targets was most of the reason why fights could take a while. The remainder was armor pick ups.

I honestly doubt Space Marine will feel anything like the frantic non-stop hopping and dodging of UT. Players move much slower, models are much bigger, and it looks like a Space Marine can absorb more punishment. The gameplay videos are giving me the impression that, at least shooter aspect wise, this game will be focused more on positioning and less insane reflexes/mind reading.

[Carl]

To quote type the following with the ( and ) removed [(quote]placetexthere[/quote)].

I don;t think steel F*ith is being trollish TBH, he just cares about the flfuf a lot so i think he's letting that plus some overly literal tendancies send him off on a crazy spree :p.

@Steel F*ith:

I think your confused.

The red bar, representing health represents damage to the body, the Gold Bar, the Sheild represents damage to the armour and/or Iron Halon sheild, (if Iron Halo is present).

@Konfeta: you obviously haven't. The only weapona capable of a one hit kill without a headshot was the redeemer and flak cannon spread mode at point blank (i.e. standing next to somone), range. Rockets are set AFAIK to 75 damage base, Shock beams are 25, Shock cores i'm not sure on, a bit higher than the beams. As you say Assault rifles and miniguns had big spreads that made getting every round on target nearly impossible at anything over short range. Bio Rifles and Link guns theorectilly capable of it, but needed the same right next to somong setting as the flak cannon to be accurrate.

Dodging certianlly exsaserbated things. But UT weapons where not generally that destructive, and the few that where whern't very accurrate at longer ranges. Of course if you played primarilly close quaters maps that wasn't so much of an issue. But on the more normal maps there where plenty of longer ranges to shoot at where weapon accurracy mattered. Not that UT had a great weapons balance mind, which is probably skewing perceptions on both sides here. The Rocket Launcher and Flak cannon are the preffered non-instagib wepaons for a reason, and instagib was popular because it cut out the wepaon aquistion stage, helping MP balance on certian specific maps.

[TheV3ng3ance]

Can I true grit with storm bolter?

[konfeta]

@Konfeta: you obviously haven't.
We seem to have different preferred game modes/UT versions, I guess. In UT classic Impact Hammer, Shock Rifle (via combo; regular shots needed 2 hits), Bio-Rifle, Rocket Launcher, Flak Cannon, Ripper, Sniper Rifle were potential one hit kills. Pulse Rifle and Minigun were reasonably accurate. I would agree that on large, open maps with flat terrain most engagements occurred at ranges where direct or near direct hits were impossible. I generally played closed DM and CTF maps, where close-medium range fights were the norm.

But, point is, look at Space Marine gameplay and any of the UT version gameplay side by side. Compare movement. Compare crosshairs. Compare feel of the weapons. I am just not getting the classic high octane death match vibe. It seems more like a cross of Halo (the first one) and CoD.

*bah, had to edit the names 50 million times. Unreal has a serious name consistency problem.

[temprus]

I doubt it, only saw a trait for bolter true grit.

[TheV3ng3ance]

How the hell am I suppost to get 200 assist in multiplayer? I need that beakie helmet right away.

[Carl]

Like i said it depends on the weapon you used. I admit i'd forgoten about the good old melee "weapon" though :p.

Your correct that a few things where capable of it, (i'm guessing your thinking of Bio Rifle secondary fire there, becuase primary was not a one hit kill or even remotly quick), but the rocket luancher is 100% not a 1 hit kill unless you have prior damage, (that said it's a lot, i think 75, but it might be a bit higher, it's less than 100 but not by much). Shock combo i can't comment on, nothign ever held still long enough for me to set it off close enough to check, certianly if it dosen't go off right next to them it's not, but it still hurt a lot. Flak cannon cetrtianly was if the fights where close enough, i used to love it for that ability :), SNiper worked if you could headshot, but otherwise needed 2.

When i said the link gun and minigun where innaccurrate, i meant at anything but fairly close rnage the spread degrades their damage from near Flak cnanon values to somthing more comparable with what we've seen of the HB.

As you say i think map preferaces coem in here, another factors is that a number of weaposn where very close to 1 shot, but had a slowish RoF, so if you had any incedental damage on you allready, they would one shot you, (rockets, short but not point blank flak cannon, Sniper rifles, and 2 shot shock cores being examples of this in my experiance), but without it they where quite slow killing. Most of my favorite maps from 1 where custom ones, but i was very fond of Facing worlds on every Ut i've played bar the last one, and in the second i quite liked the tokara forest DM map.

[Misterpeanut288]

Well just caught this article doesn't technically have much to do with the blowout, but everything to do with the franchise link (http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2011-07-20-space-marine-2-discussions-have-begun).

[Kaldaris]

Calling it now, flash bangs are ruining the game

[TheV3ng3ance]

Chapter specific armor isnt mixable? I saw it under Chapter sets but not under Armor. Ok maybe a announcer and the occasional "Reloading" would be nice to break the silence.

[konfeta]

In classic, rocket did 110ish damage with both primary and secondary fire on direct hit. Though, speaking of situational one hit kills, one of the Reric posters said that a Meltagun could snipe an Assault Marine in one shot. Is that a body shot or a headshot? Seems a little heavy handed if you can punish melee opponents like that on a body shot.


Calling it now, flash bangs are ruining the game
Only if you can team flash.

[Carl]

In classic, rocket did 110ish damage with both primary and secondary fire on direct hit. Though, speaking of situational one hit kills, one of the Reric posters said that a Meltagun could snipe an Assault Marine in one shot. Is that a body shot or a headshot? Seems a little heavy handed if you can punish melee opponents like that on a body shot.



Hmm, wonder hiow UT1 did it's damage model, i tended to hit limbs with my shos a LOT, could be the blast damage was calculated with the centre mass as the distance vector, so only body or head hits did the full 110. Certianlly i've seen a tendancy for non-one hits with them myself. Then again i got my disks second hand, and the guy i got them off, (they where a spae set he had, nice guy actually :)), also copied me the patches onto a CD as i didn't have net at the time, could have been one of those was an unofficol one as well thinkng about it, i just assumed they where all officiol

Regharding meltagun: remeber it has to be chargedm, from SP thats a several second job. Great for ambushing somone or if you know they're coming, not so hot for rapid combat. I'd be moe worried about the Stor Bolter myself. Seemed to cut through health real fast, (a full health and partial sheild in the time it takes to charge into melee range).

[southlegion]

Looks pretty cool, saw a video that says there won't be sync kills.

Why?

Tougher to balance, but not impossible and more violence= more goodness.

----------

Looks pretty cool, saw a video that says there won't be sync kills.

Why?

Tougher to balance, but not impossible and more violence= more goodness.

[whatsleft]

where are gibs? im sure a marine 1shotted by melta guns gets to blow up, like bewm. gah sad there isnt any voices. imagine marines shouting in panic under shock from losing his fellow battle brother, under fire from lascannons. still i wish melee combat was kinda like fast paced demon souls, with blocking, rolling, dashing and backstabbing

[TheV3ng3ance]

Is there some kind of secret revolving around the number 41?

[cobaltlotus]

41st Millenium = Warhammer 40,000 :O

[Blueliner07]

From the CVG preview.


Space Marine still places emphasis on getting the upper hand through smart, calculated positioning and movement over twitchy aiming and relying on classes that are tooled up to the teeth with weapons and perks for every scenario.


melee moves are closer to God of War than Gears of War. There's no cinematic one hit chainsaw kills or kerb stomps - instead players have to use light and heavy attacks to chip away at their prey's health. But unlike the AI, humans will no doubt be employing all their skills to evade incoming attacks and force errors, so melee is often a huge risk. One mistimed swipe could provide the enemy an opening to exploit. With a lock-on the melee would be a little more balanced, but without it there's a nail biting standoffish quality where you're waiting for the other person to make a mistake.

Sounds a little more tactical than most shooters and some challenge and tactics involved in melee. Sounds Awesome!!

----------
ShackNews preview.

Nothing really new but yet another positive story on multiplayer.

http://www.shacknews.com/article/69344/warhammer-40000-space-marine-multiplayer-preview

[Vuther]

Looks like great all around I'd say. Did anyone see the multiplayer interview on gametrailers.com? The criteria to getting battle-scarred power armour all involve getting killed. My favourite one's "No Surrender, No Retreat", which requires getting killed 50 times by explosives. :lol: Makes me imagine Imperial guardsmen getting fragged while their commissar tells them to stop being pussies and getting blown up (not in those exact words, of course).

[CommissarRezail]

I wonder how long before orks, eldar, and ig get added into multiplayer and yes i said ig :). I got a few ideas how to add them muahah

[Shuma]

Trophies in the shoulder pads of Chaos terminators?

[CommissarRezail]

Is there some kind of secret revolving around the number 41?

Well , a little, getting closer and closer to the time of ending well real close.

[Misterpeanut288]

Details on co-op coming soon according to the space marine twitter so hopefully in this case soon means in next couple of days, but for now I think its finally time to go to sleep so tiiiiired!

[CommissarRezail]

I wonder how come the plasma cannon doesn't work like the ones in dow 2, they fire kind of fast, and no aoe explosions. Maybe just the guys in dow 2 over charging their guns every time they fire, so they do it real slow

[Nouw]

@Shuma

Brilliantly said.

[Steel*Faith]

Because blood splatters when you're losing health, not when you're losing armor? I mean gee, could that be the reason? I mean last time i looked armor didn't bleed.

Obviously I was talking about after the armor breaks, and is penetrated, the SM starts to bleed - so if you're not drawing blood, you haven't got through the armor yet. Loud sounds of weapons deflecting off the power armor, and visual effects of that would be an obvious way to know you're hitting armor anyhow. Obviously this concept is too hard for some of you to understand.


Steel*faith is a big troll, or just flat-out stupid.

Ha, aren't you a smart ass. Oh, so if I haven't jumped on the bandwagon to support non-fluffy bad ideas, so that makes me a troll or stupid? I'm not going to take this further because it will just get us banned or the thread shut down. Sorry guys, but this personal shield thing doesn't even exist in fluff in it's current form. If it's meant to just be a visual representation of armor damage, then there were better options they could've gone with that were more faithful to the IP. Relic knows this is like Halo, and they seem to think that's fine - no real Warhammer fan should be ok with this - that's my opinion.

Still no challengers as to how shallow this melee system is though? Unless I've missed something, what more to it is there other than spamming the attack button? No counters or blocks at least?

[whatsleft]

Still no challengers as to how shallow this melee system is though? Unless I've missed something, what more to it is there other than spamming the attack button? No counters or blocks at least?
not a challenge here, but i totally agree with you. even rakion (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OqACYh8pcgc)(cant believe i actually enjoyed this) has a better melee combat system.

[CommissarRezail]

Wait where did you see the full extent of the melee system? Second how do you know thats the full extent of it.

[beefprophet]

These are Space Marines we're talking about - they don't have style, they don't have finesse! They are there to beat the total crap out of their enemies and SCREW the consequences! No Space Marine worth his salt would block if he could chop through the other guy first!

By the way, I'm extremely excited for this game and I'm happy with the classed-based system. It seems as though this allows for variety between marines while still keeping faithfully to the fluff of the Astartes (that doesn't suck anyways). Hopefully the weapon selection will be balanced enough, though - with guns like the Melta nad the Lascannon that pretty much murder marines I'm failing to see exactly what is the point of a standard bolter in all this?

[CommissarRezail]

These are Space Marines we're talking about - they don't have style, they don't have finesse! They are there to beat the total crap out of their enemies and SCREW the consequences! No Space Marine worth his salt would block if he could chop through the other guy first!

Yeah they do, its called fighting techniques, its where you learn how to properly and efficiently land attacks, block, and counter other attacks, Space marines learn and become superior melee fighters because of that. Parts them from mindless orks. Hit 1 parry 2, kill 3 and repeat or Block, kill, block , kill.

[whatsleft]

Wait where did you see the full extent of the melee system? Second how do you know thats the full extent of it.
i'd rather not put too much hope on relic for holding back information, many times i did, every time i get disappointed. so yea, past experiences and the lack of confidence. its better to be practical and accept what it is right now, since chances are there isnt really much more to show. but do realize im not bashing relic at all, just pointing out my view that it could have been better.


These are Space Marines we're talking about - they don't have style, they don't have finesse! They are there to beat the total crap out of their enemies and SCREW the consequences! No Space Marine worth his salt would block if he could chop through the other guy first!
not when the other dude he is trying to kill is a chaos space marine, who supposedly has more combat experience and deadier than a regular marine.

[Nightwolf]

Happy with the detailed customization, not happy with the lack of voices,taunts. I gotta agree with steel faith, the combat system does look shallow with all that spamming attacks. Another mistake is no orks in multiplayer,wich could have been easily implemented. All in all the multiplayer is not anything special, curious to see co op mode.

[Hirmetrium]

Guys, this is a preview build of a game which is a third person shooter. Your talking like you expected something.. different. I mean, what exactly where you expecting?

The melee looks like you need to make calculated swings. There is a video of one guy who goes crazy and misses two CSM that could of easily torn him apart. I think melee will take a lot of skill to perform, especially under fire.

As for voices, I imagine they are still being worked on. Whole month or so left.

[whatsleft]

better implementation of the game, thats what i'd expect. its 40k universe man, awesome is being mass produced there, but the game's lacking it.

[Gorb]

"awesome" is a rather subjective measurement of a game's quality, you know ;)

[Ramrod]

I thought "awesome" was a basic component of any potentially good video game. Like "rendering engine" and "CD case."

[whatsleft]

a game with solid gameplay with a good engine but no awesome eg. crysis2/fear 3/red alert 3.
a game with solid gameplay, good graphics and with added awesome eg. battlefield 3/tf2/company of heroes.

space marines is still lacking awesome. that means gibs, MP orks, more game modes.

[ricolikesrice]

customization options look awesome, rest looks pretty mediocre and 08/15 - but at the end of the day probably cant judge it till i played it so maybe i m unfair .... then again they shouldnt have made such a big secret ouf it if there s so little interesting (of course highly subjective :rolls: ) to reveal....

and to be honest .... there are some really damn great player vs player MP shooters out there , more than i could ever play in my free time so space marine not being another of them wont hurt much...

my hope has always been and still is on the co-op/survival modes. 1-4 Space Marines fending of waves of orks or heretics is a recipe for awesome so if they get that right and have as awesome customization options to boot they can take my money, if nots its a bargan bin title for the SP campaign, not like it matters much considering the next
12 months are full of great games to play.

[Scarlet_Pimp]

Steel*faith is correct the people on this forum are mostly relic fanbois so will never admit that relic arnt perfect.
They could represent an armour hit by having armour break off or have sparks fly rather than borrow master chiefs shield.
The melee does seem pretty boring looks the same as the CoD melee system just mash the melee key till the opponent dies or you die. Should be a counter button if you time an counter right you get a nice animation, and occasionally you should get a sync kill like DoW.

[No Surrender]

They could represent an armour hit by having armour break off or have sparks fly rather than borrow master chiefs shield.

The fact of the matter is that the visual styles that you and Steel Faith propose simply aren't obvious enough. A lot of people don't have the luxury of playing on a huge TV or a LCD monitor and they still need to tell at a glance whether the enemy they're shooting at is on armour or health. Consider a scenario like a devastator facing down a charging assault marine. The devastator needs to know whether he's shooting a a wounded assault marine that can be finished before he closes or whether he's shooting at someone who's still on armour and will likely make it into melee and murder him. If you're shooting at range and on a smaller TV or monitor, the time it would take you to slow down and squint at whether or not there are sparks would put the devastator at a severe disadvantage. It's a concession to gameplay and one that makes sense for a lot of people. If it really enrages you that much just pretend that they found a huge cache of refractor fields in storage during the campaign and put them to use. The game does take place on a forge world after all.

[Ramrod]

As NoSurrender said, I prefer the HUD to tell me what is happening.

You know what's shittier than taking small* liberties with the fluff? CoD-style colour fade, or GoW-style bloodied screen.

*And make no mistake, Steel*Faith, it is a small liberty considering the fact that there is fluff precedent for personal shielding, as Shuma has extensively laid out for you and which you have done a fine job ignoring.

[Scarlet_Pimp]

Shielding is not a small liberty its massive if every marine is going to be using a shield, that's supposed to be a rare item in fluff.
And the excuse about people having small screens is poor to say the least sounds like someone desperately trying to justify this load of shit.

I'm getting the game still, just very disappointed that relic are dropping the ball on the multiplayer front, something that in modern games is so important its what will keep players coming back to your game years after the single player is done. I still play DoW cos its so good DoW 2 not so much since the multi is not as much fun. Space Marine multi from what weve seen is taking liberties with fluff, has a shortage of classes and game modes and a poor melee system so is quite underwhelming at this point so.

I'm only making this point because I care about relic and the 40k franchise, I think the game needs to make a good impression so we can get more 40k games, and its not doing that at the moment.

[Caeltos]

Durp hurp, I want a game where I'm a Space Marine in MP that can go 8vs1000 tyranids and have fun ))) they should have made synckills in the game and that would be very fun if you needed time to get away you would be stuck in a synckill and ultimately die from getting overwhelmed (did we not learn anything from dow sync kills about timings?) but oh well anything for immersion and completely disregard any sort of enjoyable balance which is super essential for a long-thriving multiplayer component. SP is so unfluffy bcuz dat lascannon is a sniper and lolthatsaboutit or wait i forgot to mention about plasma cannon only firing once every 10 second because that would be a really easy weapon to balance in a mp perspectiev with slow projectile slow reload but super duper damage because thats really nice lol i have no idea what balance is and i totally only want 100% immersion and no balance because thats what makes a good game )))) LOL )))

Yes, I missed commas and punctuations on purpose just to annoy you. I hope to god you don't turn out to be a game designer, because you'd be dreadful at it. Completely scrapping balance for the sake of an immersive WH40K is not the way you'd want to approach a multiplayer design (Which seems REALLY REALLY hard for you to grasp), and being annoyed because they left out "PREFERABLY" stuff does not make the game any worse. It's a third-person action RPG, having both a fully fledged melee & ranged combat is not the easiest task to be dealt with, considering you need to configure a button-layout for both aspects of the game. Remember that it's configured for Xbox360,PS3 & the PC, so limitations are bound due to the console gamers.

And nagging on the fact there's only 3 classes makes up for the fact there's a wide-variety of weapons to choose from, combined with perks & cosmetical visual appearance that goes up in the millions of differential looks & hundreds (possibly thousands) way of how to actually play with your guns- then it's the playstyles that will differ. Tunnelvisioning a number and not factoring the additional utilities you're given, very common for your average gamer. If you were unimpressed by the melee combat, then you'd have to go back to the point where I stated that it's very dependant on the player's skill if he can make it look good or not, most of the time gaming journalist won't be 100% ace super hardcore gamers and make the game look super smooth, but given in the hands of someone who's got an idea how to play- you're bound to be more impressed. For an example, you can argue how shitty CS would look with an avg.n00b would play it- but given in the hands of a pro, it looks ace. Just a comparison.

I'm sure once people find out how to melee propertly even, it's going to be super awesome- I even get the feeling that rolling away from incoming Raptor/Assault Marines adds up to great immersion for the melee aspect of the game. Again, another metaphor sort of, but a likeable scenario.

----------

Durp hurp, I want a game where I'm a Space Marine in MP that can go 8vs1000 tyranids and have fun ))) they should have made synckills in the game and that would be very fun if you needed time to get away you would be stuck in a synckill and ultimately die from getting overwhelmed (did we not learn anything from dow sync kills about timings?) but oh well anything for immersion and completely disregard any sort of enjoyable balance which is super essential for a long-thriving multiplayer component. SP is so unfluffy bcuz dat lascannon is a sniper and lolthatsaboutit or wait i forgot to mention about plasma cannon only firing once every 10 second because that would be a really easy weapon to balance in a mp perspectiev with slow projectile slow reload but super duper damage because thats really nice lol i have no idea what balance is and i totally only want 100% immersion and no balance because thats what makes a good game )))) LOL )))

Yes, I missed commas and punctuations on purpose just to annoy you. I hope to god you don't turn out to be a game designer, because you'd be dreadful at it. Completely scrapping balance for the sake of an immersive WH40K is not the way you'd want to approach a multiplayer design (Which seems REALLY REALLY hard for you to grasp), and being annoyed because they left out "PREFERABLY" stuff does not make the game any worse. It's a third-person action RPG, having both a fully fledged melee & ranged combat is not the easiest task to be dealt with, considering you need to configure a button-layout for both aspects of the game. Remember that it's configured for Xbox360,PS3 & the PC, so limitations are bound due to the console gamers.

And nagging on the fact there's only 3 classes makes up for the fact there's a wide-variety of weapons to choose from, combined with perks & cosmetical visual appearance that goes up in the millions of differential looks & hundreds (possibly thousands) way of how to actually play with your guns- then it's the playstyles that will differ. Tunnelvisioning a number and not factoring the additional utilities you're given, very common for your average gamer. If you were unimpressed by the melee combat, then you'd have to go back to the point where I stated that it's very dependant on the player's skill if he can make it look good or not, most of the time gaming journalist won't be 100% ace super hardcore gamers and make the game look super smooth, but given in the hands of someone who's got an idea how to play- you're bound to be more impressed. For an example, you can argue how shitty CS would look with an avg.n00b would play it- but given in the hands of a pro, it looks ace. Just a comparison.

I'm sure once people find out how to melee propertly even, it's going to be super awesome- I even get the feeling that rolling away from incoming Raptor/Assault Marines adds up to great immersion for the melee aspect of the game. Again, another metaphor sort of, but a likeable scenario.

[Scarlet_Pimp]

You mad bro?
I never mentioned a marine vs 1000s of enemies, fact is it marine vs marine.
I'm posting from my phone so no time to check spelling and punctuation.

[whatsleft]

lol, phew, someone snapped.

aesthetic changes dont affect gameplay my young child. they were mainly going on about how there are halo-esque shields look weird when sparks and blood trails can do the trick. i was disapointed for the lack of orky counter parts which in general its all about just changing skins and weapons sounds. 'uge hammers -> thunder hammers, chain swords -> choppas, twin linked shootas -> storm bolters, etc. then there were some going on about having no voices cept random marine grunts. dude, all these add immersion without even touching gameplay.

their melee already looks like tf2-only-melee servers. mash buttons until something dies.

no gibs in 40k? something is wrong here.

[CommissarRezail]

No doubt Orks, Eldar, ig, necron, and Tau will come in later through dlc or expansion. Its probably csm sm because its easier to do, also they are working on dow 3, so this and dow 3. They have a lot on their plate.

[Caeltos]

You mad bro?
I never mentioned a marine vs 1000s of enemies, fact is it marine vs marine.
If I recall correctly, you're upset that the game doesn't meet your criteria, so I assume that's quite an ironic assumption to make. I'm just baffled by your sheer stupidity & lack of common sense. Adapting a fully-fledged melee combat into a third-person action RPG with a parry/counter/block/melee/special-attack and all misc is just not doable due to button-layout restriction without presumably faltering the third-person shooter aspect & movement controls. You also complain about very trivial things such as;

They could represent an armour hit by having armour break off or have sparks fly rather than borrow master chiefs shield.


The melee does seem pretty boring looks the same as the CoD melee system just mash the melee key till the opponent dies or you die. Should be a counter button if you time an counter right you get a nice animation, and occasionally you should get a sync kill like DoW.
The fact you even compare the melee as CoD gives you 0 credability. CoD has no melee except for the knife function, that's all. There are no combos, there is literally, no melee combat at all. This is Space Marines, not Batman Arkham Asylum (Or Spider-Man). And again, Sync-Kill in AN MULTIPLAYER is such a terrible way to go, far often you'd hear reviewers give negative score to whereas you do a "sync-kill" in Gears online, only to have a Grunt stand behind you, waving his Lancer anxiously to kill you after your Sync-Kill is done. And hey, look- there's Sync-Kills in Singleplayer. Rejoice \o/

TL;DR: you are either a troll or stupid. I say the latter.


aesthetic changes dont affect gameplay my young child.
First off, I'm not a young child. And also, it's quite the contrary, visual effects does have an impact on gameplay, altho not very super noticeable. For an example, I'm going to use Heroes of Newerth as a comparison, which features some silly looking heroes- but then they started shipping out DLC with alt-skins that made them look more badass. These heroes immediately started getting picked more frequently, and were found nice to be played with. If an unit gets a cosmetic change, it'll get a more frequent use. If you are potrayed more bulky & armoed, you're bound to think you're an unstoppable killing machine, whereas if you're light-weighted, you'll be more defensive & agile instead.

There's a reason character concept arts and & etc are important to character design. If you're portrayed as someone that's meant to take an unfathomable amounts of damage, you're going to need the visuals to back it up. It's pretty much the same if you're going to be playing this game and customize your character to your preferred playstyle & gameplay of your class. If you're going to be less reliant on getting into the thick of things, you might tweak your armor visuals somewhat. Aesthetic changes have a much more significant impact on different genres, such as more or less hero-based & unit based, more-so than an the 3rd person- but it's still a very important aspect nontheless.

[SPEZZMAREN]

Dragging us back from this argument, can I just say.

OHMYGOD this is so awesome. I'm looking forward to meeting (and hopefully crushing, though knowing my game skills, probably not) you online!

[No Surrender]

Shielding is not a small liberty its massive if every marine is going to be using a shield, that's supposed to be a rare item in fluff.
And the excuse about people having small screens is poor to say the least sounds like someone desperately trying to justify this load of shit.

Shields aren't necessarily a rare thing in the fluff. Imperial Guard Veteran Sgts and Junior Officers (Lieutenants and such) could take Refractor fields in the previous edition of the IG Codex. In the current IG codex Company Commanders (i.e. Colonels and the like) come bog standard with them. Given that there are around one million Space Marines and literally countless guardsmen, it seems strange that energy shielding technology would be too rare to hand out to the Astartes but not so rare that the commanders of hundreds of millions of guard companies could each get one. That said, the Codex Astartes doesn't issue refractors to Space Marines for whatever reason. For all we know there was a refractor field shortage immediately following the Heresy when Guilliman wrote the Codex. The point is that if a Space Marine squad found a crate of the things lying around on a forgeworld they're probably going to pick them up and strap them on.

Also I think this militant adherence to "fluff" is absurd. The entire premise of the 40K hobby and universe is that the IoM is so massive that just about anything can happen. Indeed, many tabletop matches would violate fluff. For example, the lore states that Grey Knights have never fallen to Chaos and never betrayed the IoM. What happens when two Grey Knight players want to fight each other on the tabletop? The entire hobby is based off of hand-waving and thinking up excuses for why things that happen happen.

As for the small screens argument I take serious umbrage at your attempt to dismiss an argument by merely saying "it sounds like an excuse". Do you dispute that some people have small monitors? According to the most recent Steam Hardware Survey (http://store.steampowered.com/hwsurvey) around 26% of people are playing on machines that have a primary display resolution of 1280 x 1024 or less. That's a pretty damn low res image and those people need clear visual cues that flying sparks simply aren't. In addition, people are increasingly playing games on laptops and given that even the largest laptops are around 17" or 18" tiny visual cues like sparks or parts of armour falling off become damn hard to see. As for this being "a load of shit" as far as I can see there are two explanations for energy shielding. Either A) Relic has made a conscious decision in terms of gameplay or some other relevant factor to have shields as an obvious visual cue or B) The developer who's made 2 Dawn of War games, numerous expansions and who's employees play 40K on the table top (see their studio tour video on Youtube if you don't believe me) decided to take violate the lore for the sake of it. Oh and then they somehow got GW to sign off and approve of it. Yeah... you decide which is more likely.


I'm only making this point because I care about relic and the 40k franchise, I think the game needs to make a good impression so we can get more 40k games, and its not doing that at the moment.

Which do you think is the bigger demographic: Fluff purists who can't bear to see a piece of technology which the IoM has access to handed out to Space Marines or the Gamers who want a well balanced compromise between fun, accessible, game play and the Lore of the 40K universe? I'm guessing that for every person who doesn't buy the game because Marines have "shields" a hundred people will see the game and think "holy shit, Space Marines stabbing Orks with chainswords? Sign me up!"

[Thorno]

Might as well contribute...

I love how they run!!!

[CommissarRezail]

I love how they run!!!

I second that.

[Malachi]

No gibs makes me sad. Customization is sweet, on the other hand. Haven't watched the videos yet, but can Chaos Marines wear Cult Marine armor? Like Plague Marine or Noise Marine? And would it be possible to mix and match parts of it?

In other words, can I play a Raptor with Noise Marine style human skin covered armor?

...please?

[Thorno]

can Chaos Marines wear Cult Marine armor

I'm 90% sure I saw Plague Marine style armour.

EDIT: 13 seconds into the IGN video. And 18 seconds for full sexy sprint action.

[SPEZZMAREN]

I second that.

And I third it.

[whatsleft]

There's a reason character concept arts and & etc are important to character design. If you're portrayed as someone that's meant to take an unfathomable amounts of damage, you're going to need the visuals to back it up.
and for dishing out unfathomable amounts of damage, there is no gibbing? am i the only one disturbed by this fact?

i think my concerns are well justified. gibs are needed in a 40k game. orks are just another race, pretty much just cosmetic change, if relic aint gonna give me that, no one is gonna die, im still gonna buy the game. they already chosen csm and made achievements for them, so orks are probably not in the MP, kinda weird to see spacemarines against orks and csm. just sad that they didnt choose orks as an adversary in MP.

ill say again, i think the core gameplay is fun, but the variety is not. thats what makes it so disappointing. cap points, deathmatch. wut? gimme more game modes like escort missions, i have already written down 1 idea back in the 1st or 2nd page, not sure if anyone read it.

[No Surrender]

i think my concerns are well justified. gibs are needed in a 40k game. orks are just another race, pretty much just cosmetic change, if relic aint gonna give me that, no one is gonna die, im still gonna buy the game. they already chosen csm and made achievements for them, so orks are probably not in the MP, kinda weird to see spacemarines against orks and csm. just sad that they didnt choose orks as an adversary in MP.

I personally wouldn't like Orks as a simple skin change for Chaos Marines. It wouldn't make sense from a fluff point of view since Orks come in huge waves that defeat marines by overwhelming them with their numbers, determination and tenacity. What I'd like to see for Orks in MP is either some sort of cooperative horde mode (which isn't off the table since they haven't done the coop reveal) or a custom game mode like the versus mode in Left 4 Dead where one team of players play the Marines who have to accomplish an objective while being assailed by AI orks and Nobs/Mekboys/Kommandos/etc controlled by the other human players. That would be a great expansion or DLC!

[Slade_Templar]

I don't think Space Marines get gibbed by bolters very often, at least not in the novels.

Now if you were firing something like a battle-cannon at them...

[Shuma]

Obviously I was talking about after the armor breaks, and is penetrated, the SM starts to bleed - so if you're not drawing blood, you haven't got through the armor yet. Loud sounds of weapons deflecting off the power armor, and visual effects of that would be an obvious way to know you're hitting armor anyhow. Obviously this concept is too hard for some of you to understand.

Funny you say that considering i've posted and proved to you like 3 fucking times that Space Marines do have personal shields, even the fucking IG does, either you're too fucking stupid to be able to comprehend that or you're purposely ignoring it for the sake of trolling.

And i'm pretty sure hearing *CLANK CLANK CLANK* each time a bolter shell hits you would get annoying really fast.


Shielding is not a small liberty its massive if every marine is going to be using a shield, that's supposed to be a rare item in fluff.

They're not rare in fluff, they're just too good to be wasted on every random space marine grunt, and no one said the Marines you play as in MP are supposed to be grunts. Everything else that could be said about this has already been said, you can keep whining if you want but fact of the matter is that no one will sacrifice gameplay for fluff in a videogame, if Relic did, it would be very fucking stupid. That's what the campaign and singleplayer are there for.

This whole argument is pretty stupid considering we all know GW watches over their IP like fucking hawks, so everything that's in the game is as usual, approved by them.

On another topic, i also love how the Space Marines run "the ground trembles with every step", as for horde mode, and article had confirmed it in the past but it was later removed, so it'll probably come as DLC.

[whatsleft]

I don't think Space Marines get gibbed by bolters very often, at least not in the novels.

Now if you were firing something like a battle-cannon at them...

i know but, in-your-face charged plasma shots, plasma cannons, power swords, heavy bolters. something tells me they would still get blown to bits.


What I'd like to see for Orks in MP is either some sort of cooperative horde mode (which isn't off the table since they haven't done the coop reveal) or a custom game mode like the versus mode in Left 4 Dead where one team of players play the Marines who have to accomplish an objective while being assailed by AI orks and Nobs/Mekboys/Kommandos/etc controlled by the other human players. That would be a great expansion or DLC!

this, i like.

[TheV3ng3ance]

Why cant the pre order bonuses be customized? I know why GW wont let anybody else play with "Official" symbols and trademarks.

[Shuma]

Did you... Just ask yourself a question and answered it in the same post? What?

[TheV3ng3ance]

Yes, Now is it possible to do the quartered color scheme?

[malklavious]

> Fluff purists who can't bear to see a piece of technology which the IoM has access to handed out to Space Marines or the Gamers who want a well balanced compromise between fun, accessible, game play and the Lore of the 40K universe?

I'm definitely a "gamer who want a well balanced compromise between fun, accessible, game play and the Lore of the 40K universe?"

As for gibs/gore, watching the videos I saw sprays of blood from assorted attacks.

[Carl]

They're not rare in fluff

Wrong. They're much rarer than power wepaons fluff wise, and fluff wise it's extremly uncommon for even a well equipped basic marine to have a power weapon. For guard, even for extremly high ranking officers it's virtually unheard of, (gaunt for example is noted as being very unushual for having a power weapon). It's just that for the sake of giving people options this isn't represented in codex's. Tha said the game explicitly states in various traits (including the iron halo one), that what is being called a sheild actually represnts the armour, unless it's a Devestator with an iron halo no actual force feild is present.

Also am i the only one looking forward to playing as a devestator moe than an assault?

@Ruined: Currently thanks to an excellent 19 minute long customiser preview we have seen the efefcts of most traits, however several of the wepaons trait effects wheer not displayed as those weapons where not equipped at the time, any chance we could have a list of all the weapon perk effects from you so we have the complete set? Likwise i've yet to see any vids with plasma cannon usage in them, i'd kind of like to see a vid or two of that in action, any chances there?

[CommissarRezail]

Screw compromise , I WANT IT ALL lore At all times 24-7 as soon you get into the game, the game makes you type in imperial dogma, in order to gain access to space marine side, and chaos side makes you killing people around your house in order to gain access to them. When i die in multiplayer i better turn into a dreadnought and start gibing people. If i don't see it i go crraaazzzzzyyy!! Heh :) ahh oh the Emperor is laughing at us this day.

People just want it be close to fluff, and it can be fun and close to fluff, and have reallistic damage, buuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuut, a few things stands in that way. Its call the Chaos gods of Law, Money, and Tzeentch which i believe he can manipulate time. Those gods well always plague games people make, except for 2 exceptions, Half life 2 (episode 3 ) and Duke Nukem forever.. apparently.

As for power weapons, why do you argue? itss a game, they allowing to have access to marine stuff guys geez, so you saying you don't want to play with power hammer or have the famous sheilds? Is that what you saying?

[Slade_Templar]

Tzeentch decided that all marines should have Iron Halo's in this game because he knew we would then argue about it, obviously.

[CommissarRezail]

Oh here something to chew on,
Priests often wear a rosarius, a potent device commonly used throughout the Adeptus Ministorum as it has a religious aspect as well as a protective one in that when the field is impacted it gives off a great blast of white light, leading some to believe that the Emperor himself is protecting the priest.1 They have it and it says its common, sound like a shield to me.

http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Ministorum_Priest

[dd14]

Just wanted to drop in and say Space Marine looks like an absolute blast, Relic. I hope there is more to come of course, but what's been released so far is very cool!

[Misterpeanut288]

i know but, in-your-face charged plasma shots, plasma cannons, power swords, heavy bolters. something tells me they would still get blown to bits.

You don't get gibbed by any of those with the exception of maybe the heavy bolter but you wouldn't really see the gibbing since it would be contained within the armor.

[Shuma]

@TheVengeance:

I don't know, but there's a halved scheme so i'd assume a quartered scheme is also possible.

@Shield thing:

Rosarious, refractor shields, iron halos and storm shields all project, well, shields. They're not uncommon, they're just not given to the average grunts. Besides that's not the point, the point is that Steel is arguing that there's no such thing in fluff, what i'm saying is that there is.

[CommissarRezail]

Steel just been reading too many tau books, where they believe pyskers are tricks to the eyes. :) heh jk

[silencer]

You don't get gibbed by any of those with the exception of maybe the heavy bolter but you wouldn't really see the gibbing since it would be contained within the armor.

would be fun to cut open the armor after the plasma shot if it really blew the body up, though not much appreciated by his friends I think. :D

now I really want to play this game more since those videos BTW:
not much new but still.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g2sCb8gia1o

[Misterpeanut288]

Eurogamer preview added beware it has some minor SP spoilers.
Gameshark article added.

[cobaltlotus]

Eurogamer preview today seems to confirm co-op shipping with the game.

[TheV3ng3ance]

What happend to the bolters with the little skulls ontop of the barrel.

[Misterpeanut288]

Yeah forgot to mention that Eurogamer does seemingly confirm co-op to be present on release so who ever wrote the spanish article must have mistaken the absence of co-op in the version of the game given to the press as co-op not featuring at release.

@V3ng3ance: Pretty sure those were a pre-order bonus that is still in, but most people we see play didn't use your standard bolter from what I noticed.

[Vuther]

Also agreeing the way the marines pound the ground is cool, and wondering about gibs myself...but if there's enough blood, I'll be satisfied. Space Marines don't fall apart too easily, suppose...

[Nouw]

Tactical Genius? Ahem!

Just a question, what the hell is 'gib?'

[Jager]

Re: Can you do quartered colour schemes? Yes, absolutely.

[Misterpeanut288]

Tactical Genius? Ahem!

Just a question, what the hell is 'gib?'

Originates from UT, but it generally means to blow your opponent into chunks of meat similar to Gears you can see this happen.


Re: Can you do quartered colour schemes? Yes, absolutely.

I also saw halved schemes and the Iron hands appeared to have their hands colored paint scheme in the customizer as well, I will try to pull up some pics for you guys to fawn over for awhile.

http://img27.imageshack.us/img27/8151/ironhands.jpg
http://img580.imageshack.us/img580/6459/halved.jpg

[Vuther]

Originates from UT I believe it generally means to blow your opponent into chunks of meat similar to Gears you can see this happen in DoW when one of your units gets reduced to meat bits by explosives.
Now I suddenly wonder I've never heard anyone ever called the series "Gibs of War". Because, it's got a lot. And they roll off you when you walk over them.

[ricolikesrice]

of course there will be co-op / survival (horde) - they are probably saving best for last. relic/THQ often enough hinted at suprising us players etc, you think that these generic two 8vs8 modes is all they bring to the table after all that secresy? i doubt they meant "suprise" in a negative way ;)

horde/survival modes gained alot of popularity lately and 40k (especially a game called SPACE MARINE) is *THE* perfect setting for that kind of gameplay. if they want their own piece of the multiplayer pie its not enough bringing out a "Gears in 40k except with only half the features" game and they likely know that.

i d personally bet that their take on horde/survival is gonna make horde mode of gears look like shit and they are saving the suprise till gamescom for maximum impact.

just imagine all the possibilities:

-4 (maybe even more?) player co-op with tons of interesting classes ( tactical, assault, devastator, scout, librarian, apothecary, techmarine, terminator, assault terminator etc. etc. ) , the more powerful ones would obviously have to be balanced out by some drawback.

-deep character customization and unlock options for longterm motivation.

-an endless variety of enemies to fight against (could add more and more via DLC, i.e. lets say the base game starts with 3 maps where you fights orks of all types and another 3 maps where you fight chaos troops of all types ... then they ll add a DLC pack that introduces nids as enemies, another adding eldar , or they could add chaos DLC that allows to play co-op with chaos against imperial guard. more than enough options.

-plenty of different modes from a simple last stand to cleansing a hulk of xenos.

-boss fights (4 SM taking on a demon prince and his minions, or a waaghboss, or (later) a hive tyrant.

etc. etc.

hell they probably have even better ideas ! and if not ... if there s seriously no co-op/survival or just half-assed co-op/survival ..... well luckily there are many other great games comming out but i ll probably facepalm once or twice about the wasted potential and move on. there d still be Dark Millenium to look forward to concerning the 40k license as well.

[Shuma]

Indeed.

I wonder if you can also use the quartered and halved schemes with Chaos, i can't think of any warband that uses the halved scheme but the Sons of Malice do use a quartered scheme.

[Misterpeanut288]

Rumor from the capture and control article says 5 marines no idea on the veracity of said rumors however.


Indeed.

I wonder if you can also use the quartered and halved schemes with Chaos, i can't think of any warband that uses the halved scheme but the Sons of Malice do use a quartered scheme.

You read my mind Shuma! :p

Though I do have a pic a Chaos Marine with a paint scheme similar to the Iron Hands 6th pic down from the top green CSM boltgun grey hands.

[Pocktio]

Well it looks like you can customise down to individual armour pieces, so I guess if you set the appropriate sections to whatever colour you'd end up with the same effect. Just not with an official setting.

[Misterpeanut288]

Well it looks like you can customise down to individual armour pieces, so I guess if you set the appropriate sections to whatever colour you'd end up with the same effect. Just not with an official setting.

In some of the videos I noticed a Turn off/on pattern assigned to the X button so perhaps you can somehow select certain patterns or toggle through the patterns that are relevant to the section of armor you are painting?

[Shuma]

Well it looks like you can customise down to individual armour pieces, so I guess if you set the appropriate sections to whatever colour you'd end up with the same effect. Just not with an official setting.

Well yeah, except for the chest and backpack.

[CommissarRezail]

About the back pack, is it really called the backpack, and what is said in this back pack. I ask this because i thought that was the power source to the power armor . Unless i mistaken somewhere.

[Misterpeanut288]

No it is what contains the power source of space marine's armor you can use backpack and power pack interchangeably, and they probably went with backpack since your average player wouldn't know that the pack is supplying power to the armor.

[CommissarRezail]

http://forums.relicnews.com/showthread.php?261373-Multiplayer-Blowout-Consolidation-Thread&p=1045274495&posted=1#post1045274495

Do you guys think they will add the mark 8 Errant power armor into the game, or as dlc?

[TheV3ng3ance]

Mk 8 is already in the game, I saw in under the list "Armor sets".

[Kevs02Accord]

I am just going to wait for more game play footage, or a demo. The game is something I have been looking forward to for several years and it looks awesome. But for now that's all I can see, looks. The footage I have seen doesn't encourage me to buy the game. Would it be fun to play, yes. Would I want to keep playing it, over and over again, as it is now, no. Its like a high quality mod for another fps, no campaign co-op yet is insane, imo, with how well it works for l4d and how much sense it makes in 40k. I guess I will just have to see, but for right now, unless I see otherwise this isn't something I am going to pick up right away.

[CommissarRezail]

Mk 8 is already in the game, I saw in under the list "Armor sets".

Oh yeahhhhhhhhh, now i can't wait to get my hands on this game. Little things like that makes my day :)

[TheV3ng3ance]

Now that we've seen all the standard weapons, show us the "Exotics".

Edit:Why doesn't the Crimson Fist have a crimson fist?

[Misterpeanut288]

OXM article added.

[Carl]

@ TheV3ng3ance: we've seen the exotics too. They only exist in the campagin though as actual exotics, (the Heavy Bolter and Thunderhammer have been confirmed as campaign exotics), in MP they're just normal weapons.

[CommissarRezail]

How do you make weapons to be exotic in well multiplayer, other then making it paid dlc so not everyone will have access to it heh.

[TheV3ng3ance]

Will lightning claws be exotics? Can someone remind me why Co op being delayed?

[Misterpeanut288]

Will lightning claws be exotics? Can someone remind me why Co op being delayed?

Lightning claws aren't in the game so no and co-op will in fact release with the game according to Eurogamer, but if you are referring to why they delayed releasing info on it we have no idea.

Edit:Er wait is THQ at comic-con perhaps a little bit of new information there?

[Akranadas]

I feel kind of underwhelmed from what I saw.

I mean, it looks like it'll be fun but at the same time; How Long will it stay fun?

Melee looks clunky and frustrating with nothing more than wild swinging on melee weapons than the more precise melee combat that was shown in the single player version. The gun play looks to be sound, with a variety of weapons, but at the same time sitting at the back, firing a bolter at wildly flaying Assault/Raptor Marines doesn't exactly excite me.

Neither do the limited 2 game modes, Deathmatch and Conquest in all but the name.

I want to have my misgivings blown away, but a part of me just sees this as a mild distraction that won't hold interest for too long (possibly because I don't like Space Marines :P )

----------

[Misterpeanut288]

Just saw Gamespots live schedule for tomorrow and we will apparently be seeing Space Marine there.

Is it just me or are the forums been a little clunky recently resulting in double posts?

[TheV3ng3ance]

Just for prosperity how many time will we be falling from the sky in single player?

[CommissarRezail]

I want to have my misgivings blown away, but a part of me just sees this as a mild distraction that won't hold interest for too long (possibly because I don't like Space Marines :P )

Yeah, what if they add eldar 2 weeks after with one of the playable characters being Talldeer?

[Carl]

Then dear arkandras is going to go nuts and probably the whole forum will give him hugs :p. It's been too long without our resident farseer :D.

[Vuther]

Yeah, what if they add eldar 2 weeks after with one of the playbe characters beign Talldeer?
Well, if they do that, people would probably be really mad about them somehow managing to make a buncha quality artwork assets and animations in two weeks as DLC that should of been attempted to be added in the game rather than saved a wee bit later...if they work right. If they don't work very well, people will obviously be mad about that. Also, isn't Taldeer a soulstone now?...though I don't doubt playing as a Wraithguard or Wraithlord would be fucking awesome if they could do it.

[Shuma]

The way i see it, that's just more excuses for GW to cram mechas into 40k. Taldeer, future gundam.

I for one welcome the eldar, more crap to bash in half with a giant hammer.

[Akranadas]

She's Dead. Nothing more to say.

Eldar, IMperial Guard or even Orks would have mixed multilayer up a bit. I know they want to go for balance fights, but balance also sacrifices style.

Also, Wraithseer.

[CommissarRezail]

Yeah i love if they add guard, Each Class has 4 npc men forming a retinue. Heh it really shake up their balance muahahah.

[Vuther]

Yeah i love if they add guard, Each Class has 4 npc men forming a retinue. Heh it really shake up their balance muahahah.
They'd probably have to save that for another game. Which I'd be cool with since a fluffy Imperial Guard tactical shooter pervades my dreams constantly.

I'm kidding, I don't really remember what my dreams are. Though I wouldn't be surprised if that was in it...(make this also, Relic Entertainment, I will pay you money!)

[TheV3ng3ance]

Wasn't a boss fight supposed to be on Xplay today?

[Misterpeanut288]

Xplay will be showing a new boss fight at 7 PM EST tonight.

[dd14]

After taking some time to digest the new multi-player information, I have to agree with those saying more races could (or should) have been represented in multi-player, especially Orks.

I'm not exactly the most knowledgeable when it comes to 40k fluff, but aren't they the most comparable on a unit for unit basis when it comes to Space Marines or Chaos? Couldn't they have a Nob Stormboy for the Assault Marine mirror, a Commando Nob for the Tactical Marine mirror, and a Shoota Nob for the Devastator mirror? I figure Nobs are comparable in strength to a Space Marine, so this wouldn't be too much of a stretch for fluff, and it also wouldn't change the mechanics of movement speed/health/damage within the game, so the only real difference would be the art. But that would just be Orks, I have no idea how you would represent any of the other races without changing the mechanics of the game to incorporate their style, unless you force the game mechanics on the other races which would end up being terrible.

Regardless, I'm still very excited for Space Marine, it looks like the first great non-RTS WH40K game since...ever?

[Akranadas]

Having no mirrored mechanics also breaths some originality into the game, at the moment in Space Marines Multiplayer, it doesn't really distinguish itself from the likes of Gears of War, which will be its main competitor in the 3rd person action game genre. Adding other races into mutliplayer would allow the game to stand out more than it currently is. Like, with Orks for example; You don't need to make them the same as a Space Marine, they could have their own quirks that make them fun to play. They might be weaker in terms of health and damage, but you could compenstate the Ork team by giving them extra respawns in Annihilation to simulate the Orkish Horde and in Cpature Point mode, lower respawn timers. Combine that with Waagh! where, Ork players should stick together for bonus' (promoting team play) you could make it a far more interesting game. You could use the same method with Imperial Guard, they don't need Jump troops when you could be more range specialists.

Eldar on the other hand would present a whole new style of play, with them being fast moving Psykers. Howling Banshee's running in an slicing Space Marines up, Warp Spiders teleporting around the battlefield, Dark Repears standing at range spewing death from their guns. It would have been nice if they went beyond the simple 3 classes and raised it closer to 5, and made the other races fit into roles rather than the same class.

Sigh... I long for a game where I can play a Farseer, shooting lightning from my fingertips and killing people with my mind.

[Misterpeanut288]

Anyone watching Xplay?

Actually Orks would fit right into the mechanics of Space Marine with very little stretching to fulfill roles, perks, and wargear especially with most of their weapons seemingly represented in game. The biggest problems I see with getting orks into the game is first the most obvious reason, hitboxes, the ork body shape proportions namely the head a lot bigger than a space marine head. Secondly, with the amount of customization Relic has given Space Marine would need to be also given to the Orks which is easier said than done. You would not only need different completely different armor variants for a just one of the classes and seeing as unlike CSM or Loyalists who basically just swap out different weapon loadouts you would need distinct armor for each Ork class, and I highly doubt Relic had the time or money to get such an undertaking done in time for release.

Lastly, how would race selection be done when Space Marine has been built around 8v8 concept? If you leave the game to randomly decide what races are chosen to represent each side you could possible not see one of the races for an extended amount of time which would be quite irksome for someone who wants to play a particular race. Letting players vote is going to have a similar result with orks being drowned out by SM and CSM players since most people gravitate to those races the most just look at DoW2.

Personally I think we could possibly get Orks brought into MP through DLC since most of these problems can be solved with proper development time and funding, but frankly I am not expecting more races until they release a sequel building off what they have developed so far.

[whatsleft]

Relic has given Space Marine would need to be also given to the Orks which is easier said than done. You would not only need different completely different armor variants for a just one of the classes and seeing as unlike CSM or Loyalists who basically just swap out different weapon loadouts you would need distinct armor for each Ork class, and I highly doubt Relic had the time or money to get such an undertaking done in time for release.

mostly done in dow2 just need to import them properly. orks having their own perks is a good idea, increased health regeneration. chance to revive after death. and waaagh. still as long as there's a ork horde mode, be it l4d style or not, i am happy.

[Ramrod]

just need to import them properly

Why? The devs have come out and said that none of the DoW2 assets were reused. The quality would be too low for a high-def game like Space Marine. Upscaling them (polycount, texture res, animation etc) for HD might even take more time than creating them from scratch. Terrible suggestion, you should feel bad for making it.

[Carl]

She's Dead. Nothing more to say.


I wsn't aware, (given that goto seems to have been declared non-cannon with the way they've taken things in DoW2), her fate was ever elaborated on beyond the endings, so depending on the order she could conciviablly be somones prisinor or even, (given the Eldar are ulikliy to leave any farseer in lessers hands for long if possible), back on her craftworld, though i agree it's probable that even if she got back she took to the dome of crystal seers. Just that i wasn't aware we'd ben given an oficiol anwser on her fate, (anymore than we have on several other Dow1 and DoW2 characters).


To come back to the topic at hand. I think several people are understandably concered, i doin't thnk the whole swing at mid air will be an actual issue once people get used to the melee mechanics, as one reviewer identified, they're used to functioning under "lock on" mechanics for things like melee and melee + shooting interactions. When people get used to aiming melee attacks without that i think we'll see a lot less of that random swinging. Beyond that however i echo many worries. The current melee system despite a few obvious combo's and the obvious counter-stomp, does look rather simplistic. Likewise for all that i'm excited by the devestator, and others by the assault, i can't help but worry that their limited primary weapons options are going to result in them becoming stale fast. There just dosen't look to be a lot of variation in how they'll play. The tacticial class actually appears to have a fair few diffrent weapons, each with unique upsides and downside beyond the simple "good vs armour, good vs sheild, good vs all but slow" thing the other two classes appear to have.

The limited game size, and thus probable map sizes are another concern of mine, and have been since it's been announced some months ago. the video's did littile to alliviate that, combat seemed on many occashions to devolve into simple 1v1, and anything above 2v2 looked to be rare except at chokepoints. The feel of an epic experiance just wasn't there. The lack of game modes was also a serious concern. Those kinds of modes have largely been done to death in other games atm.

All that saidn i think their coment make it clear that due to time constraints and their reletive newness to this they had to keep all of this simple to let them balace things out. Larger and new game modes are likliy in future so long as the code base supports it, likewise i suspect extra non-mirriored faction will appear over time. That said even their, there is only a limited number of factions that coukld have sufficent variation to actually fit into the current model of play, and thats a concern for fans of the many races who wouldn't fit well.

[Pocktio]

L4D Versus mode. Team of Space Marines versus horde of standard orks/nids/hrud/squats with enemy players controlling 'special' characters, nobs/warriors/hrudsuperman/supersquat. ]

Yeaaaah. That's could work. Totally.

They need more variety otherwise the game will perish. I mean GoW is so good now because it has a shitton of maps (albeit many from map packs) and many many different modes. It's all very fresh, throw in horde and you have a great MP experience.

[Hirmetrium]

Let me get this straight, a second.

So people are complaining that "Warhammer 40,000: SPACE MARINE" has multiplayer that is focused on.... Space marines?

I think I'm losing the will to live here. Relic have been pretty transparent as to the fact this game is about... Space Marines. And now people are complaining that, in fact, the game has Space marines and they wanted to play orks, or eldar, or something.

Hurrrr durrr.

You guys really need to wait for the Sequel - Warhammer 40,000: ORK WARBOSS.

[whatsleft]

Why? The devs have come out and said that none of the DoW2 assets were reused. The quality would be too low for a high-def game like Space Marine. Upscaling them (polycount, texture res, animation etc) for HD might even take more time than creating them from scratch. Terrible suggestion, you should feel bad for making it.

o, dont get me wrong, my fault for not explaining myself clearly. the designs and ideas are already there in dow2. relic can easily create them from scratch without even the need to conceptualize it.


So people are complaining that "Warhammer 40,000: SPACE MARINE" has multiplayer that is focused on.... Space marines?

wut? we were saying....bah, l2read thread. hint* its more we wanna fight orks, or eldar, or something.

[Carl]

We've had it confirmed since day 1 that Orks where going to be part of the SP expiriance, most of us expected them in MP. Then that got canned. Ok there's still CSM so at least we'll have 2 factions to play. Except they're mirriors of each other, they may look diffrent, but they play exactly the same.

Whilst as i say i can read between the lines to see why this was necessery, there's no question it greatly cuts into the amount of times we'll be able to play this before becoming bored of the same gameplay over and over. The small battles and limited game modes are only going to decrease the gameplay veriaty.

[Chompster]

Lastly, how would race selection be done when Space Marine has been built around 8v8 concept? If you leave the game to randomly decide what races are chosen to represent each side you could possible not see one of the races for an extended amount of time which would be quite irksome for someone who wants to play a particular race. Letting players vote is going to have a similar result with orks being drowned out by SM and CSM players since most people gravitate to those races the most just look at DoW2.they could have done it BF2(and maybe BF3?) style where it depends on the map on who's fighting who, which i personaly find a awesome way of changing the game but a bit(and sad that so few games use it especialy those like SM with few armies). so have 4 maps be SM vs CSM 3 SM vs Orks and 2 or so be CSM vs Orks. but im sure people would start complaining that that cant play as SM on that map or as Orks pn this map blah blah you cant ever please everyone. thats a fact. hvaing said that im also kinda disappointed with quit a few things. no gibs, very sad. it doesnt even ahve to be from a sync kill just have it cut the arm or leg of if the last hit kills the player.

was also wondering will landing ontop of someone when comming down with jumppack hurt/stun them?
and a few other im just gonna say

also sorry if i missed it, but the second screenshot in peanuts first post shows a CSM with a 2 handed maul but no jump pack.. errhh how? did he pick it up?

Melee looks very clunky
blind nades look annoying as FUCK
really really loving the customizer
Crimson fist devastator right here. :)

[Hirmetrium]

Sorry, I was trolling a bit. But you have to admit its ridiculous your now starting to complain about MP because of your incorrect presumption.

For example, Carl says: "We've had it confirmed since day 1 that Orks where going to be part of the SP expiriance, most of us expected them in MP. Then that got canned."

They have never, ever, ever said anything about Orks being in multiplayer, or the like since day 1. That is an assumption. They have said that "they tried it, and it didn't work" because their obviously trying to retain some of the game play from the single player (that you are ridiculously strong) and they couldn't replicate that in MP.

Personally, I'm very pleased with what we're seeing. The current videos remind me in an extremely positive way of War for Cybertron (which was an excellent 3rd person shooter) rather than Gears, as there is no cover mechanic whatsoever. In fact, I'm now fully under the impression that the gears comparison is pointless and wrong, and Space Marine is starting to look like its own game (which is what I have hoped since day 1). The idea of SM vs Chaos doesn't turn me off because it is a classical and appropriate fight between brother and brother. Hell, you could easily reskin it into the horus heresy, if PC modding is possible.

I'm also annoyed your all judging the melee from some videos of what I can see are very poor players. Have any of you played the game? No. So how do you know that the melee is "spammy"? is there a preview directly stating that? As for blind grenades they are doing the job their supposed to. Blinding you.

[Pocktio]

You could always get 8 people and plan out your armour setups. Recreate a mini Istvaan. So awesome.

Melee looks like it is in WFC but a bit more indepth, You miss a melee swipe in that and you'll be overextended and faceraped.

[Ra owa]

WFC?

[Chompster]

thats why i said LOOKS. LOOKS. LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOKS. i never said it WAS clunky.

and that doesnt change the fact they're annoying as fuck. like they are in every game
devastators are gonna get screwed over big time by assault/raptors with blind nades

[Carl]

@Hirmetrium: Thats like saying:

DoW 3 you'll be able to play as marines in the campaign vs Eldar, Tau, and CSM. Then later finding out you'll only be able to play as CSM and SM in SP, but CSM will have the exact same ubnits, exact same costs, exact same upgrades, and exact same stats in every way as SM, so that they're nothing more than a re-moel + re skin of the SM faction. But you where never told you could play as Tau, Ork,s or Eldarin Mp so why are you complaining.


Are you telling me the DoW community wouldn't be going Ape the same way people here are, (only louder :p)?

The issue more than anything is that where getting 2 mirrior factions. It would have been better to just make it loyalist vs loyalis TT style and leave CSM out as using them over other loyalists adds nothing at this point to the actual gameplay.

Also we know what the melee is going to be like barring the reiviews inability to aim :p, one of the reiviews has allready told us where getting just a Stomp, Heavy, and Light melee attack. Thats not agreat deal of options, even if we assume there's basic combos in place. Maybe we'll be proved worng, but ATM all indications are that there will be a lot more depth to the tacticals ranged options than their will be to the assaults melee.

[No Surrender]

The issue more than anything is that where getting 2 mirrior factions. It would have been better to just make it loyalist vs loyalis TT style and leave CSM out as using them over other loyalists adds nothing at this point to the actual gameplay.

Except for the awesome customization options that we'd be missing out on. Balancing a multiplayer shooter is hard enough as it is - just look at how shot to hell the balance in Modern Warfare 2 was and that's with two sides that are functionally the same. Adding in a different race like the Orks or even Cult units from the Chaos army would necessitate a lot more balancing and fine-tuning, not to mention content development. The upshot would be that we'd probably have to wait until next year to play the game. I'm more in favour of later add-ons with DLC, which is the way THQ seems to be going anyway. Besides, mirror factions is pretty much the norm in the multiplayer shooter market these days anyway so I don't see why everyone is so demanding, especially given that we're going to ave customization choices that blow every other online FPS right out of the water.

[Carl]

Except for the awesome customization options that we'd be missing out on. Balancing a multiplayer shooter is hard enough as it is - just look at how shot to hell the balance in Modern Warfare 2 was and that's with two sides that are functionally the same. Adding in a different race like the Orks or even Cult units from the Chaos army would necessitate a lot more balancing and fine-tuning, not to mention content development. The upshot would be that we'd probably have to wait until next year to play the game. I'm more in favour of later add-ons with DLC, which is the way THQ seems to be going anyway. Besides, mirror factions is pretty much the norm in the multiplayer shooter market these days anyway so I don't see why everyone is so demanding, especially given that we're going to ave customization choices that blow every other online FPS right out of the water.

1. i think i was allready clear on the fact that i understand why, it's clear from their own statments that their own newness to this genere necessitated a lot of effort on non-faction related stuff, which in turn left them insufficent time to balance things with diffrent factions. I'm not screaming "i hate you, your family, your dogs, and everything about you because your a crappy game dev" at relic here. In fact the very fact that we haven't seen to much of the "Attention Deficit... Ooh, Shiny! (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/ptitlem4f37xq499gk)" school of game design is deeply encouraging. I'm simply disapointed a littile.

2. So wha if mirrior factions are the norm? For me thats at the core of what is wrong with so many FPS these days, it's why despite finnially getting the net i barely if ever play any online. The online play gets stale very fast. I won;t deny tough that it's a tough balancing act, and as we get more factions i can see things getting arkward quite easilly. Thats why i'm understanding towards the reasoning, dosen't mean i'm pleased, but i'm not nerd ragining here, (i know some others are ;)).

[No Surrender]

I'm not accusing you of nerd rage at all, I was just giving my opinion as to why sometimes mirror factions are actually preferable to varied factions :)

I think in a perfect world Relic would be able to incorporate two or three races in to MP and do justice to all of them in their wargear, traits, perks, etc but since we don't live in a perfect world I predict that the trade off in this regard will be balance vs variety. While I think variety would be very nice, I would rather prefer a balanced MP experience. There's nothing worse than getting assigned to one team or the other and knowing that you're going to be at a disadvantage because of the assignment. Also I would be livid if the dual-wielding shotgun insanity "balancing" of MW2 made its way into Space Marine's MP.

[Gorb]

The issue more than anything is that where getting 2 mirrior factions. It would have been better to just make it loyalist vs loyalis TT style and leave CSM out as using them over other loyalists adds nothing at this point to the actual gameplay.It adds to the immersion, and as Chaos Marines feature (heavily?) in the SP game mode, it makes sense to add them to the MP as well.


Also we know what the melee is going to be like barring the reiviews inability to aim :p, one of the reiviews has allready told us where getting just a Stomp, Heavy, and Light melee attack. Thats not agreat deal of options, even if we assume there's basic combos in place. Maybe we'll be proved worng, but ATM all indications are that there will be a lot more depth to the tacticals ranged options than their will be to the assaults melee.This isn't an RPG. You're not meant to have 2,004 different forms of attack.

Three options is more than adequate, especially if you can chain them together. Remember, you're meant to be beating them up, not executing a flawless 100-hit combo ;)

[CommissarRezail]

Three options is more than adequate, especially if you can chain them together. Remember, you're meant to be beating them up, not executing a flawless 100-hit combo

Yeah but the Emperor will surely smile upon that maneuver

[Misterpeanut288]

Judging from the gamespot liveshow I am going to bet that we won't hear anything about co-op until gamescom and there was no MP gameplay new SP footage though.

[SPEZZMAREN]

I don't think i'll be back on here much until release. I get to excited when I see all this stuff.

[Steel*Faith]

So is the MP going to be like last stand, in the sense that every weapon in the game will have it's uses, and won't jsut get replaced at higher levels? For instance, will the chainsword have it's benefits over a power axe?, or a bolter have it's advantages over a storm bolter? I hope so...

As for item choices. Can the assault class choose to get rid of the jump pack for a different item or advantage? I was hoping there would be a way to make a pure melee class that didn't use a jump pack. I think I saw this in one of the screenshots with the Chaos player using the power maul - or maybe I just missed his jump pack? Also, any idea what kind of melee weapons the Tactical class will have access to?

What the situation with the power sword in MP? Is it going to be for select pre-order players only, or for everyone? And is anyone else surprised that there's no Flamer weapon option inthe SP or MP?!

As for the SM vs CSM MP theme, I think it's one of the right decisions Relic made; Chaos vs Loyalists is iconic Warhammer, and a great way to introduce the Warhamemr franchise to new players. I am hoping for Eldar, Orks, Tau etc in the future though - like a 3rd person shooter version of DoW MP.

[Shuma]

1: Well the Bolter is more like a rifle, while the storm bolter is more like a machine gun, so i suppose the bolter would be more acurrate but fires slower. Maybe the Power Axe does more damage but is slower?
2: I don't know, but supposedly the tacticals are the "middle" class so i'd expect them to be able to use at least chainsword and boltgun, but i wouldn't be surprised if they only used rifle-like weapons. The Chaos Marine you're thinking of was in SP though, at least i never saw an Assault Class without a jump pack in the MP stuff.
3: As far as i understand it, just for pre-order.

[SPEZZMAREN]

Actually I tell a lie. I would never pass up this banter.

I noticed they had MK4 armour, which I love beyond belief. Can't wait to get customizing, though I do tend to play more SP or Co-Op than MP, but this time I will make an exception I think.

[CommissarRezail]

Despite this game faults my excitement is up, and its going to stay thar stay thar stay thar, for a long while.

[SPEZZMAREN]

Also, I expect to see some really good 40k machinima.

*Glares at the video makers on this forum*

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This video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g2sCb8gia1o) Shows the tactical marines melee weapon at about 1:05. Looks like a combat knife type thing to me.