Thq, joins up with origin? [Archive]

Skullcap

27th Oct 11, 12:59 PM

Mmmm, origin, where you accept there EULA and they can legally sell your details, collect your system information, the software you use and browsing habits all at the touch of a I accept, oh and there is no opt out.

EA Origin EULA
2. Consent to Collection and Use of Data.
You agree that EA may collect, use, store and transmit technical and related information that identifies your computer (including the Internet Protocol Address), operating system, Application usage (including but not limited to successful installation and/or removal), software, software usage and peripheral hardware, that may be gathered periodically to facilitate the provision of software updates, dynamically served content, product support and other services to you, including online services. EA may also use this information combined with personal information for marketing purposes and to improve our products and services. We may also share that data with our third party service providers in a form that does not personally identify you. IF YOU DO NOT WANT EA TO COLLECT, USE, STORE, TRANSMIT OR DISPLAY THE DATA DESCRIBED IN THIS SECTION, PLEASE DO NOT INSTALL OR USE THE APPLICATION. This and all other data provided to EA and/or collected by EA in connection with your installation and use of this Application is collected, used, stored and transmitted in accordance with EA’s Privacy Policy located at www.ea.com. To the extent that anything in this section conflicts with the terms of EA’s Privacy Policy, the terms of the Privacy Policy shall control.

Sentinel

27th Oct 11, 1:18 PM

Collection and Use of Information
By using Valve's online sites and products, users agree that Valve may collect aggregate information, individual information, and personally identifiable information, as defined below. Valve may share aggregate information and individual information with other parties. Valve shall not share personally identifiable information with other parties, except as described in the policy below

Oh no. EA are using the standard licensce that's been used by everything ever.

Why do so many seem to suddenly care about this? Why does it matter if 'generic faceless company' knows my computer specs? Why does it matter if they know my name? Why does it matter if they tailor their ads to be something that might actually interest me?

And where does it say they're storing all my browsing habits?

DeafMute

27th Oct 11, 1:26 PM

Difference between steam and Origin is Valve arnt assholes who are fucking over gaming like EA are. Pushing out under par products for full price.

Sentinel

27th Oct 11, 1:31 PM

What?

I don't even know how to respond to that.

Facts please? Not biased bandwagon nonsense.

Skullcap

27th Oct 11, 1:32 PM

Steam doesn't monitor all your software usage, doesn't check to see what has been installed and removed, steam also has a opt-out for hardware survey, steam also doesn't monitor what you have plugged into your computer hardware wise, nore does it need any of this information, so why should EA origins be monitoring all that kind of information and storing it on their computers alongside your personal information for account creation?

You can read more at the following links as to why its a issue with numerous amount of people:

http://www.gamespot.com/pc/action/battlefield-3/news/6330914/ea-origin-eula-sparks-privacy-concerns

http://www.giantbomb.com/news/eas-origin-service-is-basically-spyware-according-to-origins-eula/3616/

http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2011...more-sinister/

Well honestly, why would I want all that information in EAs hands anyway? Its none of there bussiness what I have installed on my computer, neither the keyboard or mouse I have installed or whatever else gaming equipment I might put on my system. I mean jeeze, if Sony's recent problem when they got hacked tells anyone people want LESS personal information from there computers in the hands of big corps not MORE.

Demonic Spoon

27th Oct 11, 1:32 PM

Not to engage in massive hyperbole like some people in this thread but...I have no interest in running multiple Steam-like clients on my computer and, based on EA's history vs Valve's history, I'm far more willing to keep Steam.

It's highly unlikely that I will ever install Origin for anything, and I highly doubt I'm unique. Nowhere does it say in the article that THQ, however, is selling anything exclusively on Origin, or selling anything that requires it. If they did, they would lose a bunch of customers, myself included.

titlams

27th Oct 11, 1:40 PM

Umm what? No where does it say EA will monitor external programs and mostly that clause refers to usage of programs bought through Origin. The exact same as steam does when it says you have played for 26hours or so forth. At no point does it seem to mention its going to track any usage except through Origin.

Edit:
In fact section 3 states

"EA reserves the right to monitor communications on the Application and disclose any information EA deems necessary making it quite clear they are referring to the application and not system wide.

Sentinel

27th Oct 11, 1:44 PM

@Skullcap:

I'm sorry, but if EA get hacked and all my personal information gets stolen, the last thing I'm going to care about is the hackers knowing my brand of keyboard.

I can't say why EA want all my external hardware info, maybe they want to know the prevalence of a brand of Keyboard, or the frequency of web cams. I'm sure they have their reasons, which don't involve the theft of my identity, or a doomsday device of any kind.

Origin also has an "opt out". Don't install, no problems what so ever.
The first article you linked adds nothing but sensationalism to the actual facts with baseless accusations that they monitor what illegal sites you download from and keep track of your browsing history.
If we suddenly get an EA branded German bondage FPS then I'll eat my words, but until then, I'll assume my browsing history is safe.

It's not about wanting EA to have my useless information, it's about being completely indifferent to them having it, because there is nothing that they can do with it that will have any negative effect on my.

DeafMute

27th Oct 11, 1:45 PM

Facts?
Valve - Steam is obviously the superior of the 2 services. Steam -Origin for reasons which should be clear.
Valve have a much more friendly image. Care about the products they push out (Episode 3 anytime now..) Whilst EA does not have a good track record. COnstantly pushing out shit and then trying to plug into the steam business, forcing peple to install origin to play there games. You also know that Origin has had afew issues recently like charging peoples accounts without giving anything in return?

Dont tell me anyone here welcomes using Origin.

Pocktio

27th Oct 11, 1:48 PM

I do.

It's not that bad, it's just lacking in features and decent prices but so far it has great potential.

My ex-clan have boycotted it and BF3 along with lines such as 'it threatens democracy' due to it being illegal, with regards to it 'invading' your system. Which is retarded, so I came to the point it's not that bad. Turns out they think the principle is worth standing for, despite the fact that most programs can look into your computer in some facet. So they should boycott every computer application with a network connection.

Hyperbolic idiocy really.

DeafMute

27th Oct 11, 1:50 PM

Pock. u been charged any payments you didnt put forth?
What about this bi-annual charge ive been hearing for having anymore then 4 games with origin.

Sentinel

27th Oct 11, 1:53 PM

Good god man, links!

I asked for facts, not hearsay and opinion.

And of course Steam is the superior service. It's had what, an 8 year head start, and isn't in beta. Origin has the potential to be just as good, it just needs time to find it's feet and iron out the kinks.

DeafMute

27th Oct 11, 1:57 PM

You judge a product by the company which built it.
EA are shit. Valve isnt was my point. No need links. Im stating facts.

-Check Mate.

Kryopsis

27th Oct 11, 2:04 PM

I am tempted to respond with an ad-hominem and present it as a fact. All I can say is, I really hope you're not being serious here.

Pocktio

27th Oct 11, 2:04 PM

I'd love to see proof of them charging without authorisation. I am incredibly doubtful it ever happened.

Methuselath

27th Oct 11, 2:06 PM

Uh, no. So far Origin is less annoying than Steam for me. Faster reply that Valve support, games doesn't need to be online to play, login is way faster than Steam.

EA is a publisher predominantly, they have in-house devs but they are also prolific publishers. They make shit games as much as they make good games.

I say I welcome the competition. I pretty much buy games of Gamersgate anyway.

Why isn't Valve shit? Valve is no more better than Origin or Impulse to me. Hell, Impulse had waaaay better customer service than both of those companies combined and Valve official tech support forum is a shit-pan on fire. There have been cases of erroneous bans with Valve, I haven't heard any from Origin yet. Check-mate my foot.

TDATL

27th Oct 11, 2:07 PM

I'm not going to buy anything that needs another Steam like system. One is enough. Anything that requires EA's Origin nonsense I will not be using. I was going to get Crysis 2 until it got pulled from steam to be an Origin Exclusive. BF3 sounded tempting until it became an Origin exclusive. I've seen a game or two on Steam that I haven't bothered remembering their names because I noticed it required Origin installed under it's requirements.

I will tolerate Desura and Impulse to a degree but nothing that is as restrictive as Steam. I already dropped Impulse after it changed hands. Trusting the company is a major part of trusting such a distribution system.

EA is frankly stupid to be trying to compete with Steam at this point in this fashion. They are not going to be able to bully their way to success. All they are doing is wasting potential sales and reinforcing their reputation as the bully that doesn't care about gamers. They will get some business due to the weight of brands they have (like BF3) but they would have gotten that business anyway. More importantly they will lose potential customers.

Steam is the giant of the digital distribution scene. Cutting that market out of your potential buyers is simply stupid. They should have sold their products on both and made every copy sold on Steam useable on Origin. Then it only would take a few incentives here and there to help them build up a following. As it is they are needlessly dividing their market at best and aggressively alienating their market at worst.

@Methuselath: Steam/Valve have a lot of ways they can be improved. The problem isn't that Origin can't take advantage of that and be a legitimate competitor. The problem is the way they entered the scene. While they can turn their image around they have needlessly set themselves up on the back foot. EA already has enough PR issues that it doesn't take much to scare people off.

Bottom line is EA should have used "softer" techniques. They should have made it so people could easily try out their system and make it so people want to use their system. Forcing people to use your system forces you to overcome any anger they feel about that before you can reach positive reactions. Steam is not immune to such an issue but it has more history in it's favor as to it's relative stability (as in you aren't going to log in tomorrow and find that everything works different or that it was discontinued.) Origin has no such buffer and already has to overcome EA's rep as an unfriendly company. If that rep is deserved or not doesn't matter. All that matters is that is the perception. The same with Valve. It doesn't matter if they are just as bad. The perception is what you have to deal with. EA/Origin has done a very bad job of that.

Nalkor

27th Oct 11, 2:14 PM

@Methuselah - What do you mean you need to be online to play any games? Sure if it's multiplayer, but right under the Steam drop-down in the upper left, the second option is 'Go Offline'. So outside achievements, friends list, store, etc, you don't need to be online. It even says Offline mode is if you're about to go offline for any reason and still want to be able to play your games in single-player mode.

titlams

27th Oct 11, 2:15 PM

I've never seen people actively will a company to become a sole-distributor of anything. I thought monopolies were the route of all evil. This digital age truly is amazing.

Gorb

27th Oct 11, 2:18 PM

TDATL - but it's okay because Steam got there first?

Tell me, why do people rail against Microsoft for monopolising the PC market, and yet praise Steam for doing the same?

EDIT: ninja'd by the titlam, with exactly the same point.

sporty

27th Oct 11, 2:23 PM

This obviously indicates another DoW2 expansion, coming as an independent entry to the series with a new third-party online platform ;)

Guess we didn't derail enough threads with railing against the evils of Origin/EA yet, then again it is utterly despicable to provide an additional option where you could potentially buy those select few games.
Is there a better article than the one linked in the OP, by the way? Shortly after that page loads, it gets cluttered with multiple layer ads.

Wargrim

27th Oct 11, 2:25 PM

You judge a product by the company which built it.
Uhm no, at least you should not. You should judge each product independantly, by its own set of strong and weak points. As a matter of fact, companys change, people come and go, new teams do new things, and you might end up with something much better or much worse than you were used to.

( And the product itself can change too over time. Steam was a pile of shit when it first came out. Nowadays i like it, but i still dont buy games there because i mostly get them cheaper elsewhere. )

Methuselath

27th Oct 11, 2:25 PM

Nalkor, you could do that. But sometimes stuff bugs out and requested that you be online. I had that happen to me a couple of times, despite setting my laptop Steam on offline for ages. Dunno why.

TDATL

27th Oct 11, 2:31 PM

@Gorb: I wasn't praising them. I wasn't saying that Steam is "okay" while Origin isn't. I was saying I don't want another Steam. I really don't like Steam but I tolerate it. Origin has done nothing to persuade me that it isn't effectively Steam under EA or worse. Better the devil you know than the devil you don't know and all that.

Origin may be an amazing and better than Steam in every way. It doesn't matter because it has spectacularly failed in "selling" itself to me. There is also the issue of consistency. Steam for all it's faults is pretty consistent in both it's good and bad features. Origin does not have such a buffer and as such needs to do more to draw people in.

@Wargrim: In a perfect world, yes, you would judge each product on it's own merits. Unfortunately, it costs money to test such a product, flaws from such tests are aggravating, and other peoples reviews are not proof against being wrong or being outright lies.

In light of that people buy things based on the company's/product's reputation. I know Steam started off as a Steaming pile of crap. I was using it during that terrible period. Afterwards I left it alone for three of four years because of that. Likewise I really didn't like how DoW2 started off. However its progress up until the end of 2010 convinced me to get it during the Christmas sale on Steam. After that I judged it to have improved enough that I pre-ordered the Chaos Rising expansion and the retribution stand-alone expansion.

A big consideration in games is the company that sells them. A game can be utterly ruined by bad moves by the company. Be it through bad patches, invasive DRM, or simply shutting down multilayer support (something EA has done within a year of a products release on several titles) a game can be totally changed or ruined because of company choices. The same is even more true for a distribution service. It is almost entirely reliant on trust. How do I know it will be there tomorrow? The short answer is that I don't. Steam could go under tonight and screw everyone over. Do I trust them enough to take that risk?

Misiok

27th Oct 11, 2:50 PM

@Pocktio - courtesy of Reddit - http://i.imgur.com/tMR51.jpg this is one of many.

TDATL - but it's okay because Steam got there first?

Gorb - it's not only that Steam got here first, it's that Origin forces itself upon gamers by being the only digital distributor for BF3. Steam monopoly is bad and we wanting it to stay that way is bad as well, but when Origin does it it suddenly isn't?
Also Steam was first but also tried to do something amazing that changed the industry, while Origin is just trying to force itself down our throats dividing the community.

Sentinel

27th Oct 11, 2:57 PM

Origin has to force it's way into the market. If you could get BF3 off Steam, then why would anyone bother with Origin?

Kryopsis

27th Oct 11, 3:04 PM

Gorb - it's not only that Steam got here first, it's that Origin forces itself upon gamers by being the only digital distributor for BF3.
You can buy Battlefield 3 from Direct2Drive (http://www.direct2drive.com/2/10557/product/Buy-Battlefield-3-Download?hph) or Impulse (http://impulsedriven.com/battlefield3). How about you tell me where I can get Half Life 2, other than Steam or retail? Modern Warfare 2, Call of Duty: Black Ops, BRINK, Civilization IV, Fallout: New Vegas, RAGE... all of these games require Steamworks. Of course, that's fine because Valve isn't evil but EA is!

Steam monopoly is bad and we wanting it to stay that way is bad as well, but when Origin does it it suddenly isn't?
Nice strawman there. We're arguing that Origin is no different from Steam, not that it is magically exempt from criticism.

Also Steam was first...
No it wasn't!

...but also tried to do something amazing that changed the industry...
Not it didn't!

...while Origin is just trying to force itself down our throats dividing the community.
HOW IS THIS DIFFERENT FROM STEAM?

Misiok

27th Oct 11, 3:13 PM

By forcing an AAA title to use it as a way to get more users? Please tell me I'm mistaken and that's not a marketing stunt.

And yes, EA is evil.

TDATL

27th Oct 11, 3:15 PM

Origin has to force it's way into the market. If you could get BF3 off Steam, then why would anyone bother with Origin?

Wrong. They could simply make any purchase on Steam valid on Origin (for EA titles.) That would have went a long long way to building a positive outlook on Origin. That makes it much less of a personal investment for the customer to try out Origin. If they know they can go back to the old system they are used to instead of feeling like they are being baited into a trap (even if it is out of another trap.) Why would I switch over if I'm just moving from one trap to another? What is my incentive? Game exclusives aren't incentives, they are irritations. Things like better service, cheaper prices, etc are incentives but if I am to aggravated by being forced because of "exclusives" I will never see that.

HOW IS THIS DIFFERENT FROM STEAM?

More importantly that being different is why would I want to switch. It doesn't matter if every action they take is a perfect copy of Steam. This is not about Origin being worse or not as good. This is about it not being better and/or it failing to give the impression that it is worth the trouble of bothering with it.

If it isn't substantially better or very easy to switch then there is no reason to switch. If there is no reason to switch then EA is needlessly limiting (and aggravating) their customer base.

I also don't like Steam exclusives. But, as I have already said, better the devil you know (and have an investment in in this case.)

Paladin

27th Oct 11, 3:39 PM

BF3 is also available through GamersGate... I know, because it pops up an obnoxious "Buy BF3 here!" bullshit screen whenever I go there to check if SotSII is unlocked yet. Pisses me off because I have no interest in BF3.

However, in my opinion, if your product/service can't succeed on its merits without engaging in manipulative sales tactics, it doesn't deserve to succeed.

That's not really relevant here, since they're not selling BF3 exclusively through Origin, it's available through other digital outlets.

Maktaka

27th Oct 11, 3:43 PM

By forcing an AAA title to use it as a way to get more users? Please tell me I'm mistaken and that's not a marketing stunt.That's rather like how Steam got its initial success by being required to get HL2 and CS:S, despite being utter crap at the time. Compared to Steam's launch, Origin is doing wonderfully.

Of course, Origin is competing with Steam NOW, not crap Steam from eight years ago. Origin's problem is that it doesn't really bring much to the table new or otherwise, and faced with the overwhelming goodwill Valve has generated combined with the huge breadth of functionality offered by Steam EA doesn't really seem to be coming out swinging like they need to. Maybe they don't plan to try to compete with Steam's feature set and are content to just be a store with random community bits tacked on, but this is quite a bit of effort just to launch a store. I assume something else is coming, but as it stands I just don't see the point unless you're getting brought in through BF3 or somesuch.

Gorb

27th Oct 11, 3:45 PM

@TDATL/Misiok: Why would Origin, a barely-launched service that people are apparently unwilling to even give a chance, be as good as Steam, a platform that has had years of development and business capital invested into it?

I severely dislike the attitude that Origin is being compared to Steam in terms of quality, and yet people are accusing it of muscling in on the market. Let me break it down to you:

1. If Origin doesn't "muscle" in, Origin will fail as a service. Everybody goes back to using Steam and you guys pat yourself on the back for defying the evil, soul-destroying EA corporation (even if they might actually be trying to provide something that could be construed as a positive, viable alternative for a monopoly on the digital market - that monopoly being Steam).

2. Origin is not going to be as polished as Steam, because Origin is new and Steam is not. Arguments such as "better the devil that you know" are completely asinine, and I'd love to see you justify using a Linux distro over MacOS, or heck, using MacOS over Windows. Unless of course Microsoft are the devil incarnate and the secret creators of the hell-spawned Electronic Arts corporation.

There is no such thing as "better the devil that you know". If you dislike digital distribution, buy from a physical retailer. If you dislike dealing with a physical retailer and disdain the methods of digital distributors, then you're probably not going to be gaming much. If you like the idea of digital distribution but aren't a fan of some of the practises employed by the leading distributors (Steam, GamersGate, Impulse), what is wrong with giving another platform a chance?

EDIT: derp ninja'd twice.

Kryopsis

27th Oct 11, 3:56 PM

By forcing an AAA title to use it as a way to get more users? Please tell me I'm mistaken and that's not a marketing stunt.

I named a half-dozen of AAA titles that are exclusive to Steam, not to mention every game developed by Valve. Isn't Valve using Half Life 2, Counter-Strike: Source, Portal, Team Fortress 2, Left4Dead, Left4Dead 2 and Portal 2 as a way to get more Steam users? Again, what makes Origin so evil in comparison to Steam? I am getting the impression that people in this thread are trying very hard to justify what is essentially brand loyalty by coming up with asinine arguments.

Basically, this is the impression I am getting from this discussion (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T0wm3JwXbLs#t=1m19).

Paladin

27th Oct 11, 4:12 PM

1. If Origin doesn't "muscle" in, Origin will fail as a service. Everybody goes back to using Steam and you guys pat yourself on the back for defying the evil, soul-destroying EA corporation (even if they might actually be trying to provide something that could be construed as a positive, viable alternative for a monopoly on the digital market - that monopoly being Steam).
This is a pointless argument. If you have to "muscle" into a market, your product isn't good enough and doesn't deserve to succeed. If the existing service is so good that no one is willing to give your new one a chance, there's simply no need for it in the market and you should go think of something else to do with your time.

Misiok

27th Oct 11, 4:23 PM

Maktaka/Kryopsis - that's because Half-Life 2 and CS:S/Team Fortress 2/Left4Dead 1/2/Portal1/2 were Valve's titles. EA is the publisher, not developer for BF3 though. I'm pretty sure Dice wouldn't mind their game being sold on 2 platforms. It's just EA trying to force Origin on users. I know Steam does this as well, except Steam isn't a shitty platform because it had 8 years to fix itself. And I don't care that Origin is new. It wants to compete with an 8 year old still developed platform then it shouldn't be a shitty alternative that's basically forced on you. It should bring something new/be a no brainer. What it does right now, is have an exclusive title (I know there are retailers, but you still need to use Origin to play it, right?) on a subpar platform.

Mokino

27th Oct 11, 4:30 PM

n0z3k1ll3r

27th Oct 11, 4:45 PM

Yes, but it includes an Origin install. Origin is mandatory for BF3 no matter where you buy it.Like every Steamworks game ever you mean?

CommissarRezail

27th Oct 11, 4:52 PM

Kryopsis

27th Oct 11, 4:53 PM

Maktaka/Kryopsis - that's because Half-Life 2 and CS:S/Team Fortress 2/Left4Dead 1/2/Portal1/2 were Valve's titles. EA is the publisher, not developer for BF3 though.
EA owns DICE. Battlefield 3 is an EA title.

FriendlyFire

27th Oct 11, 4:59 PM

The level of fanboyism here is approaching critical levels.

I personally don't give a damn where I buy my games. I have some with D2D/Comrade, some with Impulse, most with Steam and now some with Origin. I go where the prices are interesting; this is the best way to drive prices down everywhere. Competition is the only thing that helps the customer.

Now, I'd just like to point out a major flaw in many people's reasoning: Origin is not required to run in the background for most games bought on Origin. Unlike Steam, Origin is entirely opt-in for the developer. Hence, if you're pissed that Origin is tied to Battlefield 3, blame DICE and to a certain extent EA. Origin as a service has nothing to do with this. Case in point, my Bulletstorm install (which I got from Origin for 8 bucks, a steal compared to anywhere else that I could see) never needs Origin running.

Furthermore, this backlash towards stuff running in the background seems misguided at best. What exactly is the problem here? Most of you have upwards of 4gb of RAM. If you don't, RAM is the cheapest upgrade you can get for your PC; GET SOME MORE. You won't regret it, it won't be wasted because even outside of background applications there are tons of possible scenarios where more RAM is good. Heck I have 8gb and I'm thinking about getting another 8gb so I can run some games in a RAM disk. Outside of RAM, a background application takes up virtually nothing, so I'm not understanding the problem.

I'm giving Origin its chance, just like I give every single application. So far, it seems pretty good. It's not exactly as jam-packed as Steam but I didn't expect otherwise. The UI is clean and elegant, arguably more so than Steam's, and it takes up less RAM than Steam. If all you want is to stick with the status quo, don't complain when those in the position of power take advantage of the situation.

n0z3k1ll3r

27th Oct 11, 5:00 PM

Now, I'd just like to point out a major flaw in many people's reasoning: Origin is not required to run in the background for most games bought on Origin.Ok I've just decided Origin > Steam, purely based on this. And I doubt there's much anyone else can bring up now to convince me otherwise.

Still sucks compared to Gamersgate mind.

Paladin

27th Oct 11, 5:55 PM

Meh. I don't give every application a chance. That's asking for a bloated messed up registry. If someone wants to convince me to install a new application they need to provide me with something I need... Which Origin doesn't.

Mokino

27th Oct 11, 6:00 PM

n0z3k1ll3r, you are being awfully defensive. I was just telling Paladin that, while you can buy BF3 other places, it is like a steamworks title in that it forces a storefront program upon you for updates.

n0z3k1ll3r

27th Oct 11, 6:39 PM

What's being defensive? I value a minimalist client, and Steam is not minimalist, it's highly intrusive. If Origin isn't needed to run for most of their games, it's better for me. And Gamersgate has no client so it's better still.

Mantaray

27th Oct 11, 7:57 PM

although i do find it hilarious that after all this rubbish about how BF3 needs origin. BF3 basicaly runs out of your browser via battlelog and actually UN-INTEGRATES your origin friends list XD (having to re-add people as friends in battlelog to play together)

as far as im concerned. origin seems to run faster. and also
http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c318/mantaray9992000/steamvsorigin.png
doesn't use as much memory whilst idle

i used to be a fan of impulse before it became 'gamestop' you know they've put in a GBP localisation with an exchange rate that's MILES off. (im talking a good fiver here)
ive never been a big fan of having so much of my actual wealth tied up to a single account. eggs in one basket is convenient but far from safe. i dread to think what would happen if i lost my steam account.

valve AND ea reserve the right to without notice or reason terminate your membership without giving out any refunds at all. and to tell the truth. i think there both as likely and capable to do it.

Inskipp

27th Oct 11, 10:46 PM

Are you sure your steam is being idle?

http://i.imgur.com/RryDT.jpg

Cause mine is.

Promythyus

27th Oct 11, 11:32 PM

I totally agree with CommisssarRezail. THQ can do whatever the hell they want with their other titles, but if they touch our relic titles, christ. I'm not going through another DoW2/CR-GfWL load of crap, but this wouldn't surprise me.

On origin;
I am not one for monopolies. While monopolies are good for the individual person (it's great to have everything in a nicely regulated ecosystem where everything "just works", the same reason people buy Apple), they are bad for consumers as a whole. I very much dislike that certain games are steam only and *require* it. As a consumer, I hate being forced into something. You know what I hate more? Being forced into using a program that I'm only going to have on my PC for one game. I always get a slight pang of annoyance when I have to install impulse just to get updates for Sins of a Solar Empire, even more so now that it's owned by Gamestop (which brings up another point). That said, I find steam is the better evil. As mantaray mentioned, Origin and most other digital distribution systems have zero integration between the systems and their games. That's the biggest win for Steamworks games, I can be chatting with my friends, see they're in a game of tf2, right click their name and be in the game. Some games, like Retri, include stats which I absolutely love.

Steam is not the best at it's main function, but it has secondary functions that more than make up for it. And you know what else? Steam doesn't discriminate me because I'm Aussie (unless another publisher wants it to, but that's their fault, not steam's).

The other point is customer good will.

Valve have a metric fucktonne of it. People, including me, love them. They make great games, they make interesting games, they put a lot of work into their games and they have amazing post release support for their games. Who else would port an old and likely dead game (HL2) to a more updated version of their engine for free? A great dev would. They also don't price gouge, which makes me even happier. Now I realise this is totally unrelated to steam, but it's all in the name. When I see Valve, I think "awesome dev". I see a program/platform/ecosystem by "awesome dev", I think "awesome stuff!", do want!

EA have terrible customer good will. Apart from Activision, EA have possibly the worst customer good will amongst anyone that actually has a clue about the gaming landscape. You know why activision can pull the shit they do and still sell? They don't screw with their sales channels. EA's decisions make no sense. They say they want to take cod's audience, then make it harder for them to do so. I'm personally avoiding origin like the plague, because it is EA. I don't trust EA. I don't trust that they won't screw me over. I see the CEO of EA at E3, talking his talk, spinning the PR bullcrap, and I don't trust him.

I do trust Valve. Yes, you will say "lol trusting faceless companies over another", but Valve has a face, Gabe Newell. Gabe is the face of a company that makes me feel like I can trust it. Gabe says things in interviews that I like. I read an what Gabe says, and I think "yeah this guy knows what's up". Regardless of what actually goes on at valve, gabe gives the impression that valve will always be a company that innovates, but always puts the player (not consumer, the player. They know this has a better effect) first.

Cortlendt

28th Oct 11, 12:30 AM

This is a very bad news. I kinda like Steam, it works fine, updates your games, and has some great sales.

Origin, on the other hand, does not let me play the game I've paid for. Also EA does not seem to notice that some percentage of users are having trouble with Origin for months. You can check Origin support forums for that, there are some quite large and long lived threads.

Origin is quite laggy, compared to Steam. Though I would not care, if it just worked. The more competition on the market, the better.

Paladin

28th Oct 11, 12:33 AM

I'd normally agree with the "more competition = better" concept, but it fails, crashes, and burns when it comes to applications you have to install. I never, ever, ever want to have more than one application on my system that serves the same purpose.

So, multiple outlets for purchasing digital games? Great. Multiple games library organizer/community/launcher things? Not a chance in hell. There can be only one, and every other challenger must be destroyed!

Hell, I don't even like having to have one. My computer has this thing called a "shell", that has a cool feature called a "file manager", which can be used to manage my game library quite efficiently without any third party applications, thank you very much.

Akranadas

28th Oct 11, 12:46 AM

I have a better application to organize and hold my games, it's call my desktop. Uses no extra ram, has these shortcuts that load the game plus whatever other systems it needs, when I'm done I simply close those tools and move to the next game.

Oh, You should also know that Arkham City is also coming to Origin, but guess what; Arkham requires steam to run, so if you buy it from Origin, you also have to install Steam.

Yankov

28th Oct 11, 1:03 AM

ah.. if only you can transfer purchases between various services.

but that would make too much sense for consumers and obviously no sense to the service providers.

sporty

28th Oct 11, 1:04 AM

You sure about that? Last I heard was GfWL for all PC versions, Sony's SecuROM and an extra layer of DRM for Steam copies only. Your point still stands though, as THQ's Saints Row 3 almost certainly employs Steam DRM, in spite of the backlash over highly restrictive region-locks in the game's last version.

Found this alternative snippet (http://gamasutra.com/view/news/38155/EAs_Origin_Service_To_Host_ThirdParty_Games_In_November.php) about the original news, apparently there's not much info besides the announcement during EA's latest conference call itself.

Akranadas

28th Oct 11, 1:10 AM

Whoops Meant GFWL :P

lizardmech

28th Oct 11, 1:33 AM

Origin is very bad news for consumers, the first thing EA did when they launched Origin was raise the prices of the games they pulled from steam in Australia and other regions. This demonstrates that they are not interested in winning over consumers by providing a better service or providing better value. If they legitimately wanted to launch a popular distribution platform they could have grabbed huge market share by selling games at a fair price globally or pricing digital products lower than retail as they should be since they have less distribution costs.

It's already obvious how EA intends to promote Origin, by forcing exclusive content onto origin. EA might be playing nice with North American customers for now but they are not doing the same elsewhere, Origin basically has a monopoly on digital sales of Battlefield 3 and Crysis 2 here. You can bet as soon as origin gains any traction they will be offering huge incentives to other publishers and developers to provide day one exclusive DLC or make games origin exclusive. Origin appears to be designed to appeal to publishers more so than customers.

I think this represents a bit of desperate move by EA and other large publishers to seize control of digital distribution before it completely disrupts their retail business model. My biggest worry is that if EA succeeds with Origin they can potentially crush smaller publishers and developers by denying them permission to sell on origin. Digital distribution is a large threat to companies like EA, if a developer can sell 500k - 1 million copies on digital platforms with minimal advertising why would they want to use any of the established publishers? This is an area where EA and origin are distinctly different to valve and steam. Valve has no motivation to make digital distribution difficult or costly, EA has a huge bloated retail business model that they have to protect no matter what.

This might be overly pessimistic but I think that if Origin gains significant market share it could kill PC gaming or severely damage it for 5-10 years. While Steam may have enjoyed a near monopoly for sometime and has copious irritating issues it hasn't been exploited to limit competition.

Paladin

28th Oct 11, 1:43 AM

I have a better application to organize and hold my games, it's call my desktop. Uses no extra ram, has these shortcuts that load the game plus whatever other systems it needs, when I'm done I simply close those tools and move to the next game.
All you did was reiterate the last line of my post with different wording.

Aesaar

28th Oct 11, 1:50 AM

It's funny how many people here seem to think that Steam was a flawless platform from day one.

If you compare performance on release of both Origin and Steam, Origin comes out so far ahead it's ridiculous.

Then again, half this thread consists of little more than "EA sucks but Valve is cool, so Origin sucks and Steam is god".

Sinogrim

28th Oct 11, 1:55 AM

So, howmany of you who are complaining or are radically against Origin have actually used the service yet?

I'll be honest here and say I had my doubts and was quite skeptical about Origin before I used it, but after using it in the BF3 Beta and pre-ordering BF3 on it, I can honestly say it's really not all that much different from Steam. It's a digital distribution platform. It sells products and forces DRM, just like Steam.

As for the "But I don't want multiple Digital Distributors on my computer!", well... You're basically saying, it's OK for 1 company to have complete control over the PC gaming market while everyone has been bitching about MS having too much control over PC Gaming and PC's in general. So what is it that makes it OK for Steam to take complete control over the PC gaming market?

If THQ decides to sell their games through Origin, I honestly don't care. If the title is worth picking up, I'll pick it up regardless wether it's on Steam or Origin.

Paladin

28th Oct 11, 1:59 AM

Steam doesn't have complete control over the market. There are many other digital outlets out there. I don't need more than one (At most) library management/community/DRM system however, and I won't even try a new one, ever. I'd get rid of Steam if it was feasible, but it's not. They don't control the market, because I can buy from other people, and developers don't have to use Steamworks if they don't want to. So there's no monopoly here. It's a necessary evil as long as a bunch of developers choose to use it for DRM. As soon as that changes, I'll dump it, but I'm sure as hell not adding more evil software to my system.

No thank you.

TL;DR: All applications that perform Steam's functions are inherently evil. I'm willing to put up with ONE piece of evil software until the day that developers realize they don't need DRM, but no more than one.

Akranadas

28th Oct 11, 2:09 AM

Paladin, you're speaking hyerboble now. Yes, I did just rehash your wording because your reasoning is flawed. A system like Steam, Origin or Impulse are there mostly for you to obtain games and provide publishers/developers with a DRM option. Saying that you need everything in one library or you won't use it is also silly when you have a machine that runs this that is more than capable of being your gaming library. As others have pointed out, Origin doesn't require you to have it launched to play some games, for the others it does it will launch automatically, the same applies for all other digital distribution services beyond Steam. Steam is the only distribution services that is currently used that require you to launch games from the steam platform, you cannot get around that in any way shape or form.

We need to stop looking at digital distribution platforms as our entire games library and look at them more like brick and mortar retail stores. We buy the games, install them and that's it really.

Pocktio

28th Oct 11, 2:14 AM

So because you personally don't want something it automatically becomes evil lol?

I don't usually want sprite in restaurants, I prefer using coke. Doesn't mean that it is evil.

That you think software can be defined as evil is hilarious and beside the point anyway, why is it bad that publishers use DD platforms as DRM? Do you remember securom, starforce? Now all we need is to activate it through an online application and we are away, it's so very painless.

Sinogrim

28th Oct 11, 2:14 AM

Steam doesn't have a monopoly on the market, you are right in that. Yet you already stated yourself that removing steam is simply not feasible. Yes, there are other digital distributors than Steam but I have not a single doubt in my mind that if Steam wanted it (and would be allowed to do such a thing legally), they'd be able to make all those distributors go out of business within a year or two.

Origin however, is different from those "smaller" distributors because they are capable of putting highly desirable AAA titles on their platform and their platform alone. Something only Steam has been capable of doing in the past years basically.

Nurizeko

28th Oct 11, 2:38 AM

Origin has to force it's way into the market. If you could get BF3 off Steam, then why would anyone bother with Origin?

Why should anyone care?

People should be more concerned with the business of selling games rather than being grumpy old fucks because they themselves can't dominate a market so start using their testicles like conkers fighting over digital distribution.

Sell the game where-ever you can, bugger platform requirements (I.E. not needing origin) and count the money you like so much.

Not that I expect much from EA in this regard, they are after all an abysmal company kept in undeath by their ceaseless sales of mediocre games bought by sports-fans.

I've been waiting for EA to go out of business for ages now, wish they would oblige.

Blahblah this, blahblah that, end of the day I have some money and one DD system I use. In my ideal world I should be able to buy every game I want off of that store, just as I expect to at an old brick and mortar shop. That's the ponit of DD, part of it, convenience.

All this silly DD warfare is getting old now, I actually yearn for the day when you loaded up a game and joined the online lobby. Now apparently just to buy and play a game I got to choose sides in another silly tiff in the gaming industry, which frankly needs to die so it can be reborn as a grown up adult industry.

And no I don't care if Microsoft control the dominating share of the computer market either. Mac's in my mind suck nuts and uniformity has its benefits to.

Akranadas

28th Oct 11, 2:46 AM

Err. Nurizeko. You can buy pretty much all of EA's games from various Digital Distribution sites, Origin is just another. Only 1 Game out of their catalog requires Origin to be installed as a DRM method.

titlams

28th Oct 11, 3:41 AM

Nuri, I like how you bash EA completely because they make there most of there money from mediocre sports games. A company which knows how to make shit tons of money, even if it is by selling rehashed games year in year out they are still not even close to being a "abysmal" company, there just a company who sells games you don't enjoy. Out of the hundreds of faults EA have, that is not one of them. Oddly, I trust EA vastly more than valve with there ridiculous hat scheme and day-0 Portal 2 DLC. EA > Valve in my honest opinion as a company. But Steam > Origin in DD.

Aesaar

28th Oct 11, 5:12 AM

I don't get why people hate EA so much. They made some terrible decisions in the early 2000s, but have gotten much, much better across the board, and have released some of the best games in recent memory.

Sentinel

28th Oct 11, 5:28 AM

Everyone hates EA because with the exception of Battlefield 1942, Battlefield 2, Battlefield 2142, Battlefield 3, Bad Company, Bad Company 2, Burnout, Crysis, Crysis 2, Dante's Inferno, Dead Space, Dead Space 2, Dragon Age, Dragon Age 2, Freedom Fighters...etc, all they make/publish are stupid sports games.

How they keep their doors open I'll never know.

Gorb

28th Oct 11, 5:36 AM

@lizardmech: you can purchase BF3 elsewhere - not just on Origin. Valve hosts exclusive content and sale prices on Steam . . . what is wrong with Origin going down that route?

Please, less of the hyperbole.

@Aesaar: People hate on EA because it's cool to hate on EA. People love Steam because it's cool to love Steam. Regardless of Valve's track record with certain games in the past, people still seem to think they can do no wrong. They're just a company guys, a company like any other. I like them, but to refuse to believe that they could do anything bad, and comparing their public image to EA's and thus basing the quality of the Origin service off of that . . . really? Really?

I wonder what the public reaction would be if EA had released a semi-stable product, ignored all cries for support and updates (barring a new Campaign and some additional content) and then released a sequel later with everything requested and more. I don't know, but I imagine that people would crucify EA for ruining yet another game and forcing consumers to buy the newer "model" in order to get what they want.

Just for the record, I'm talking about Left 4 Dead - a game I like, and own (both the original and the sequel) - however that doesn't excuse Valve's (lack of) support for the game. People just overlook it because Valve did well with L4D2, and for some reason if the company is a good company you can ignore every single fault they make. Ironic, I know, considering my long history of defending Relic Entertainment, but hey. I don't have blind faith - I criticise Relic's attempts where I consider criticism useful. It's not like I actively bash Valve either - this kind of spiel only occurs when I see people hating on EA and/or praising Valve, simply because of the name-recognition associated with the two companies.

I like Valve. I like Steam. I don't mind EA that much; they haven't killed my puppy or anything, and I've gotten a few games from them that I enjoy (casually).

@everyone: anybody who complains about EA support evidently hasn't been through the online Steam support service. Though, as subjective as the experiences are, it's entirely possible you had a decent experience with Steam Support. Heaven knows I haven't. But it's okay. Continue to complain about EA support. Continue to complain that Origin isn't perfect, and has issues.

Whilst you're at it, how about you complain about Steam issues? Steam bugs, and glitches? It doesn't have many any more, but Origin is the new kid on the block here. Give it a chance.

Also, I am confident that Paladin is running Win98 SE with IE6 as his browser.

Cortlendt

28th Oct 11, 5:46 AM

Whilst you're at it, how about you complain about Steam issues? Steam bugs, and glitches? It doesn't have many any more, but Origin is the new kid on the block here. Give it a chance.

Steam was pioneer back then. Origin bugs are unforgivable :)

titlams

28th Oct 11, 5:53 AM

Sentinal have you ever considered the majority off people love sports and love sports games. Just that you don't mean there wrong or worse than amy other company.

Cortlenda: Steam never pioneered anythimg ever

Gorb

28th Oct 11, 6:01 AM

Steam was pioneer back then. Origin bugs are unforgivable :)I'm afraid that doesn't even make sense.

In fact, it makes as much sense as "The developers of Pong were a pioneer back then. Any bug present in a game released since then is unforgivable.". Tell me, does that make sense?

lizardmech

28th Oct 11, 6:13 AM

@lizardmech: you can purchase BF3 elsewhere - not just on Origin. Valve hosts exclusive content and sale prices on Steam . . . what is wrong with Origin going down that route?

Where can I buy it? D2D REGION BLOCKED, Amazon REGION BLOCKED, Impulse REGION BLOCKED?
I'm sure I could find a complicated way to bypass them however I could have my origin account banned for importing games.

Also I have had very large issues with losing games on the ea download manager, I bought Crysis war head on it and about 6 months later when I got a new computer I couldn't move the game across and I was unable to download the game again.

Gorb

28th Oct 11, 6:29 AM

I'm sure all of those services have customer support, you know.

Cuddles

28th Oct 11, 6:51 AM

titlams, I think/hope Sentinel was being sarcastic.

Origin is up against what steam is now, not what it was like. Just because its new doesn't mean anyone should have to give it a chance or put up with the issues that come with it. In an established market place you don't get a change by being new, you get it by being innovative and doing things your competitors can't or don't. Origin does this with BF3 to an extent. Don't like it? Tough crap. It is a valid tactic to get a customer base, you show your disdain for this by not buying the title and avoiding it completely, not by grumpily giving them you’re hard earned.

Sentinel

28th Oct 11, 7:23 AM

Haha, yes, Titlams, I was just taking the piss. I wasn't being serious at all.

boolybooly

28th Oct 11, 7:39 AM

I hate swapping CDs more than I hate EA.

But I hate reregistering on upgraded retail databases even more than I hate swapping CDs.

Spore...+....Origin (nice name, excellent Stargate associations) = oh no not again!

At least it explains the whale.

titlams

28th Oct 11, 7:53 AM

Sorry Sentinal its just I saw pretty much the same post above and just assumed you agreed. Sorry.

FriendlyFire

28th Oct 11, 8:09 AM

@lizardmech: Gamersgate, local retailers? If ALL are blocked from selling BF3, then I'm sorry but where the hell do you live?

@Paladin: If I get it right, your logic is that since Steam came in first, it automatically is the sole program allowed to reside on your computer performing said function all because of hypothetical registry and filesystem issues arising from installing applications?

@Cuddles: Actually yes, I'm willing to give it more leeway because it's new. Look at how indie games are received. They're new to the market and often bugs and problems are overlooked where they would cause utter indignation coming from established developers. It's not because EA is a big player in the publishing market that it should be treated as a big player in the digital distribution market - it is not. I'm willing to try them out honestly, with no preconceived notion of good or bad because competition fosters lower prices. I've already gotten deals out of Origin and I cannot even believe people are being such backwards about something which can inherently only cause prices to go down. If EA decides to lock down their games and only allow them on Origin, they'll go down in volume dramatically and will need to back off. If they don't do that (which is the more logical approach really), then it's just another store which can compete for prices. One way or the other, it's a win-win situation for gamers as long as they don't scream of Valve fanboyism.

Kryopsis

28th Oct 11, 8:23 AM

Don't worry, Sentinel, it's getting harder and harder to determine who is being serious here and who is trolling.
In fact, I can't help but imagine the first page of this discussion going like this (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JHy3ZhY9VKs).

Also, for the love of God, stop claiming Steam came first. There were several digital distributors before Steam, notably Stardock's precursor to Impulse. It's just that Valve decided to make Half-Life 2 available exclusively through Steam, thus causing an uproar back in 2003. Eventually, they had a number of publishers join the platform and that number has been growing ever since.

Misiok

28th Oct 11, 8:39 AM

Look at how indie games are received. They're new to the market and often bugs and problems are overlooked where they would cause utter indignation coming from established developers. - they're treated that way because they're usually a small team that's paid by donations/pre-orders. EA is a gigantic company that swallowed lots of developers and has literally a shitload of money.

It's not because EA is a big player in the publishing market that it should be treated as a big player in the digital distribution market - it is not. - Then how should we treat them? As an indie dev? Please. Steam gets leeway/priority over it because it was first to do what it does and succeed, and because Origin has, more or less, what Steam has, but it's in a shitty state because it's new. You don't give leeway to competitors in sports because they're new on the scene. They either surprise you by outclassing their opponents, or fade into memory.

I'm not a Valve fanboy, I just dislike EA for what they do to games/companies.

Kryopsis

28th Oct 11, 8:42 AM

I'm not a Valve fanboy

Steam gets leeway/priority over it because it was first to do what it does...

There you go again :rolleyes:

Paladin

28th Oct 11, 8:45 AM

So because you personally don't want something it automatically becomes evil lol?
If the maker of that something forces me to put it on my computer? Fuck yes.

I am a performance miser. I go over my process list with a fine tooth comb periodically. Running a ton of background processes, even just idle and doing nothing, is the bloat that turns gigabeast Hulk rigs into puny Bruce Banners. Companies constantly trying to force everyone to put in their update manager software, their launchers, their useless systray bullshit, and so on, are just fucking evil and they all need to die horribly.

FriendlyFire

28th Oct 11, 8:45 AM

If you don't give leeway then don't complain when they muscle themselves into the market, since at that point it's their sole possibility of entering it properly.

EDIT: Paladin, you're a performance nut yet you run Windows? Bahahaha.

Kryopsis

28th Oct 11, 8:48 AM

Actually, Paladin, nobody is forcing you to do anything at all: you don't have to install Origin or play Battlefield 3 or even post in this thread! In fact, could you perhaps go and assert your moral superiority somewhere else for a bit? We're trying to have a discussion here. :)

Paladin

28th Oct 11, 8:50 AM

I'm not installing origin, and I never will, no matter what games they have on it as exclusives. I'm pointing out that Steam is evil as well, but you obviously didn't see what I was replying to.

Also, take your "lulz if yu don't agree with me go away" crap and stuff it up your ass.

Sinogrim

28th Oct 11, 8:57 AM

Paladin, may I ask you why you installed Steam in the first place if you believe it to be "evil"?

Misiok

28th Oct 11, 8:57 AM

If you don't give leeway then don't complain when they muscle themselves into the market, since at that point it's their sole possibility of entering it properly.

And tell me, forcing an AAA title to use Origin is not forcing itself upon consumers? They knew people will want to play BF3, they hyped it like it was going to be the best PC game ever, a CoD beater. And they decided it has to use Origin to work.

Really.

@Kryopsis - you cut the most important bit of my 'first' sentence. The 'and succeed' part.

Starblade

28th Oct 11, 8:59 AM

The thread needs to chill the fuck out. Who calls for deaths over a damn software manager? Seriously people. Calm down.

FriendlyFire

28th Oct 11, 9:16 AM

@Misiok: Thus aping Valve with Half-Life 2. Your point?

Nurizeko

28th Oct 11, 9:20 AM

I don't get why people hate EA so much.

Hate is such a strong word and at 26 I wouldn't waste the feelings on a bloated company.

But EA have well earned my suspicion and instinctual distrust with their years of folly and greed which has made mugs of the average games consumer and made allot of decisions which have turned the games industry for the worse.

People who say "lol its just cool to hate EA" need to get a better tune which sounds sweeter to my ears because the song they're currently playing just sounds like "I don't care about being shafted and neither should you" or "You've never heard of the band 'Cool To Like EA', it's not mainstream".

I have my reasons to not want to use Origin and frankly AFAIC they are rock solid, even if some of them are essentially about my own convenience.

Talking of fanboyism some people seem to feel as if every gamer owes some company or another a huge debt of gratitude, and give them benefit of the doubt because "business' aren't charities and are out to make money".

Well I'm out for profit to. The profit of a good convenient cheap deal. I don't owe charity to EA any more than they owe me, but at the end of the day I can survive without EA, said company is a little more invested in earning our money.

I want BF3 but it's not as if its a unique shooter, they're a dime a dozen in this 'original' and great industry after all, and no doubt Steam will have a sale with something I want sooner or later. :)

ph03nIXx

28th Oct 11, 9:50 AM

Well, this thread is what I thought too after reading this article:

http://www.spiegel.de/netzwelt/netzpolitik/0,1518,794600,00.html

Since it's german, a short version for you guys:

Many parts of the user agreement violate european laws on data privacy / data protection.

So at first I was "So what, nobody really cared for STEAM to do the same...at least not that much to call the damn thing 'Spyware'." But then it came down to this: Most interesting for me was this point of the user agreement - because it ties in with EA having a bad standing PR-wise (Full User Agreement can be found here: http://tos.ea.com/legalapp/eula/en/en/ORIGIN/):

C. License Validation.
The Application and an internet connection are required to validate the license for certain products distributed by EA. You acknowledge and agree that the Application can automatically validate license rights for some or all EA products without separate notice to you. This means that in order to use the Application and certain EA products, you must leave the Application installed on your computer. You acknowledge and agree that the Application may use information regarding your computer, hardware, media, software and your use of the Application to validate your license rights and to update the Application.

So basically, EA tells me that they are not only allowed to check on Origin games but on my licences on all EA games I have installed? While I am not advocating piracy, forcing a copy protection on all EA published games ever through the backdoor is pretty... WHOAT? At least it shows that it's not only about Origin Applications being monitored but also about EA published applications.

That's the point that is noticably different from STEAM for me and that is making me WTF? STEAM doesn't check if you got HL1 or stuff like that installed, you could put it into STEAM, but it doesn't check on you.

roflmao

28th Oct 11, 10:13 AM

Companies constantly trying to force everyone to put in their update manager software, their launchers, their useless systray bullshit, and so on, are just fucking evil and they all need to die horribly.

Agreed. Although, I must say, Origin isn't as low a toolbar or update manager software.

Croaxleigh

28th Oct 11, 10:33 AM

I don't, care what thq does with its other games, just leave relic out of it. Leave my 40k, and my c.o.h. out of orgin. I seriously don't want ea involved in with either of those. However if they want to sell wwe game on origns, by all means go ahead, I don't play that crude anyway.

The way they handle pre orders is not customer friendly.
Out of curiosity, where in that article did it say that THQ was making Origin the exclusive distributor of anything? You're acting like THQ software won't be available anywhere else EVAR when all it seems that they're doing is selling their games on Origin as well as Steam, D2D, the god-awful THQ e-store, GamersGate, and every other digital distribution outlet that they already use. It's like throwing a fit because your favorite brand of socks is going to be sold at Walmart as well as Kmart. Doesn't mean that you can't shop where you always shop, and the availability of products in distribution outlets that you don't use doesn't affect you in the least.

TDATL

28th Oct 11, 11:54 AM

There is no such thing as "better the devil that you know".

It is called an idiom. Look it up.

Pocktio

28th Oct 11, 12:08 PM

Preordering BF3 has been a much smoother experience than I've had with Steam or eTHQ.

It just worked, the preload was fine. There were zero issues. No Steam bullshit about unlock times, you get an email early telling you when yours will be available. Then you get all the relevant emails as you start playing. It's a great system.

n0z3k1ll3r

28th Oct 11, 6:19 PM

Maybe when Origin decides that what I really, really want to play is in fact an old beta version of a new release game instead of the actual game then I might view it in the same contempt I'm currently feeling for Steam.

Starblade

28th Oct 11, 6:33 PM

Man, you have the shittiest luck with Steam n0z3. Which game? And did you ever get offline mode working?

n0z3k1ll3r

28th Oct 11, 8:00 PM

SotS 2, as the giant clusterfuck in that thread is probably indicating. In fairness it's probably largely Kerberos' fault in this case, but the part that's getting to me is that it's Valve's stupid DRM solution that's forcing me to use the broken Steam version. I have an up to date release version from Gamersgate, but it has to run through Steam and Steam "fixes" it to the wrong version. And uses 4.5 gig of my net quota doing so.

Paladin

28th Oct 11, 8:32 PM

Honestly I lean towards blaming Steam, rather than Kerberos. Just because the last few games I bought that involved Steam all had deployment issues, whereas this is the first time I've had this sort of issue with a Kerberos product.

n0z3k1ll3r

28th Oct 11, 9:34 PM

Pally: I'm inclined to agree, except Mecron seems to be saying it's their fault for sending Steam the wrong release.

n0z3k1ll3r

29th Oct 11, 12:00 AM

UPDATE: Nope, Kerberos just pulled out some stops to get this fixed, but Steam have uploaded the beta version again. This time the DLC works though!

This isn't Kerberos' fuckup. It's Steam. And this is why games should not require Steam to function when I buy them from Gamersgate.

Ammon Ra

29th Oct 11, 4:17 AM

Disable automatic updates under game options.

ontopic.

All this silly D(igital)D(istribution) warfare is getting old now, I actually yearn for the day when you loaded up a game and joined the online lobby. Now apparently just to buy and play a game I got to choose sides in another silly tiff in the gaming industry, which frankly needs to die so it can be reborn as a grown up adult industry.

Emphasis mine, which i agree with to some extent with regards to BF3 being mutually exclusive with steam.
Ubisoft's From dust was launchable from steam, with the overlay, but also had that ubisoft launcher program.
GTA4 Had the rockstar community login (optional now iirc), GFWL, and steam overlay.

Of course it doesn't work the other way around because gfwl is built into the game and i'm going to assume that its impossible to get any non-gfwl game working with Live. gwfl just doesn't work like that, it never was. As far as community/friends goes, its the closest thing to "steam" but doesn't even attempt to remove steam from the equation because some clever guy at microsoft realized that they would only shoot themselves in the foot.

I'm also going to assume that many origin games can be launched through steam, as many of you have mentioned some games bought through origin not even requiring it to run in the background.

NOTE: If this is the case, then there is nothing wrong with THQ releasing their games through other distribution channels.

Steam isn't picky about the games, or any program really, want to run photoshop through steam? no problem, but the overlay may not work. wordpad, word, ping, all works fine.

The big negative "aura" around origin is mainly to do with BF3 being mutually exclusive with steam (overlay & community). One part of the reason is battlelog being the central hub of bf3, the game not having a main menu, and ergo not working with steam overlay. One part anti-piracy, one part to encourage the origin/battlelog friend/group system/mechanic.

This is where EA/origin shot themselves in the foot so to speak, because in the eyes of many, steam community has become the de facto community/organization/group place to be. recreating that on origin is a simple pain in the ass.

Bad analogy time:

Its like farmville splitting from facebook, creating its own website, with its own facebook clone system.

FriendlyFire

29th Oct 11, 8:15 AM

Funny you say that, Ammon. (http://www.keynoodle.com/zynga-unveils-new-games-and-new-platform-project-z/)

sporty

29th Oct 11, 11:38 AM

Excuse the offtopic please, but I'd like to know if there's more to Ammon's point than just a misunderstanding.

See, as far as I know people could get that overlay functions to work with the beta of BF3, presumably this applies to the final game as well. Despite the Steam overlay actually being quite "picky" with games, from the top of my head early DoW2 versions crashed unless you disabled it.
So what's up with "mutual exclusive"? It's not sold there, that's all there is to it. Also, Battlelog certainly doesn't actually promote Origin (those mentioned community features being completely independent), so I don't see why that should be a "political" move. Additionally, Battlelog was announcend and well in development before EA fell out with Valve Corp. over Steam's revised DLC policy, this again doesn't exactly make it look like a ploy aimed against Steam.
Of course those community features also work independent of Steam, that's a given and no different from GfWL. You're not suggesting the alternative to "shooting oneself in the foot" being Steamworks integration (esp. in this case), right?