Half-Life 2 vs. Halo 2

[dino]

What I seem to be wondering about is the sheer stupidity of alot of people. Most of the people who I've talked to haven't seen the Half-Life 2 E3 Tech Demo but NOOOO, they've all seen the Halo 2 tech demo. They make the stupid decision of thinking that Halo 2 is going to be better than Half-Life 2.
Firstly I must say that Halo is a good game and, although not eagerly anticipating it, I am waiting for it's release and am expecting it to be good. But if it were to be developed for P.C., Half-Life 2, I believe, would kick the shit out of it.
Sorry if people have already put up threads about this.

[Death_Knight]

Patience is a virtue. Wait and watch.

[ShivaArchon]

Perhaps both will be awesome and we won't have to worry about idiotic fanboy leetspeaking crap.

[Ramrod]

half life 2 will be a nice return to the good old days of half life if they keep the gameplay similar. but seriously, you remember how the plot advanced in the original? neither do i, because it had nothing at all to do with you. i'm afraid that might be the same way it happens in this one. halo 2 will only be good because of riding the hog as opposed to driving it in sp for the first time ever. although, i want to know the end of halo! the end of marathon was a bit of an anti-climax for me.

all that said, my first pc game was doom, so i have a soft spot for doom3

[Retroboy]

but seriously, you remember how the plot advanced in the original? neither do i, because it had nothing at all to do with you. Speak for yourself, pal. I remember that campaign very clearly.

I thought the story was extremely involving and light-years ahead of its competition at that time. I wish more stories didn't have the main character as uberhero, but rather as a victim of circumstance or one of many grunts in a war that is much bigger than them.

For an incredibly distant and uninvolving shooter storyline, try Quake II.

-- Retro

[Starfisher]

Half-Life 2 might kick the crap out of Halo 2, if it would ever come out.

[No Surrender]

For an incredibly distant and uninvolving shooter storyline, try Quake II.

Holy crap! Quake II had a storyline?

But seriously, I'm looking forward to Halo 2 more

[Chrysophylax]

If Half-Life's 2 story is as involving as the original game was, It will definitely be on my game collection... Although Halo had better graphics and stuff, give me Half-Life anyday of the week... :)

[Moe]

I got a coupon for a free copy of HL2 with my gfx card. Now if the darn game would come out, I will play it.
Halo2 is for Xbox only, right? I don't own an Xbox. So I won't play it.

[ilia1986]

Most ppl decide which game is better for them according to the setting. Thats why games like C&CG have turned away many ppl (me included) from. Because if thier horrible and unoriginal or unattractive setting.

Now we have HL2 and halo2. Now, tell me what setting is more attractive? A geek scientist walkin in an imaginary city killing bug like aliens and fighting Federal soldiers, or a Cyborg with human senses saving the human race from destruction by humanoid aliens who fight the human civilization because of RELIGIOUS causes.

Yours to decide.

[LoCo]

Chrysophylax: Halo had better graphics becasue it came out how many years later? ... yeah.

I'm in the same boat as Moe ... no Xbox, and I don't intend to buy one just for the one game.

So go go HL2. (Hopefuly with some great co-op)

ilia1986: heh, if I was an alien I would fight the humans for a religious cause.

[No Surrender]

God, everytime two high profile games of the same genre come out there's always the "Game X is better than game Y" debate. Can't we all just play the games without saying which one is better or atleast hold off until you've played the damn thing to decide.

[ceejayoz]

God, everytime two high profile games of the same genre come out there's always the "Game X is better than game Y" debate. Can't we all just play the games without saying which one is better or atleast hold off until you've played the damn thing to decide. I don't think I could have said that any better.

[Starfisher]

Because then 95% of all data transfer on the internet would cease, investors would realize that it's a sinking ship, ISPs would close up and then where would we be? Face it, uninformed, biased and downright moronic speculatory flame wars ARE the internet.

[Retroboy]

Face it, uninformed, biased and downright moronic speculatory flame wars ARE the internet.And pr0n. You forgot pr0n.

-- Retro

[The5thElephant]

pr0n is uninformed, biased and downright moronic speculatory flame wars but with penises.

OK to make this thread a bit more intelligent instead of a stupid fanboi war let's get into the details.

The engine of Half-Life 2 (the Source engine as it is called) is far superior in terms of physics. I don't think that Halo 2 has ragdoll physics or the havok engine. Also if you took a look at the latest 9 shaky cam videos of Half Life 2 (released a few days ago, check www.filerush.com) it has very very nice environmental destruction. One of the vids shows objects being lifted with the grav gun and then launced at high speeds through a wood wall making very realistic holes through it. So a ball makes a ripped up round hole and a plate makes a slimmer ellipsoid hole. Very cool.

Graphically Half Life 2 will be able to support higher resolutions (cause its for computer) and has more advanced graphics technology (normal mapping etc). You could say that Halo 2 will ALWAYS run well for everyone cause its for XBOX but so will Half Life 2 cause it is scalable to DirectX 6 graphics (quite amazing for them to do that). Normal mapping is quite impressive to see, but only if it is used well. Normal maps are used in Battlefield: Vietnam and they are hardly noticeable for example unlike Far Cry where they are beautifully used. Halo 2 will have EVERY surface bump-mapped though, which sounds very nice and allows for low poly objects that still look great.

Gameplay wise, while Half Life 2 looks to have more interactive gameplay thanks to the physics engine, Halo 2 seems to have more vast gameplay, with whole cities of marines and aliens fighting and probably much more varied environments than Half Life 2. Half Life 2 AI has supposedly almost no scripts (just when to appear) while the rest is completely AI. I don't know about Halo 2 but I have heard it has excellent squad AI (notice the shield guys in the movie that form a traingle formation before advancing) and the original Halo had amazing AI anyway.

So we can't know right now, but Half Life 2 will be very moddable and will probably have a long life in gaming. I look forward to both and will get both.

[A176]

dolts

they will both own

[Soulblighter]

i will buy both and laugh at people comparing one to the other.

[Langy]

At the moment, Half-Life 2 completely trumps Halo 2 for the simple reason HL2 is for the computer while Halo 2 is for the X-Box.

However, if my roomy (and/or roomies if I get a three-person room:/) at uni this fall has an X-Box, I'll gladly play both.

[Kushan_Pilot]

i will buy both and laugh at people comparing one to the other.

:lol:

I hear ya!

[SquidDNA]

At the moment, Half-Life 2 completely trumps Halo 2 for the simple reason HL2 is for the computer while Halo 2 is for the X-Box.

Bingo.

[Deviance]

Now Im a big fan of Halo and I must say seeing the double sub machine guns in the E3 vid sent shivers down my spine, Im a real FPS enthusiast and Halo really takes the biscuit.

However, HL2 looks fucking brilliant, those sweet gorgeous, lush, sexy ass graphics that just make your mouth water with the effects on water, SOOO life like and the streets and walls etc. I got the beta-anon version and with a little scripting an tweaking I managed to get a fair bit out of it, the "seafloor" level is the best, it has a buggy in it :p It ran perfectly on my machine an I have a GeForce FX 5200.......exactly :lol:

I know it wasn't complete....in fact it was far from complete, I had about a quarter of the game, but if I got excited from just a few levels of a bug filled beta....then what will I be like when the full game is on general release? *falls over having fits on the floor*

||Deviance||

[No Surrender]

I will get both, I will play both, I will (probably) enjoy both and then make my judgement.

[The5thElephant]

Errr Deviance, I know you probably didn't know, but prepare to be banned by some moderator who reads that and sees you mentioned warez. Sorry. Read the FAQ/Rules next time.

[ShivaArchon]

Halo 2's double SMG didn't really do anything for me, the sound effect was way too weak to inspire awe. I loved that semi-auto rifle with the 2x scope though, that thing looked and sounded badass. Now if only it was for PC....there's no way I'm buying Xbox for one game.

[IgnusDei]

Errr Deviance, I know you probably didn't know, but prepare to be banned by some moderator who reads that and sees you mentioned warez. Sorry. Read the FAQ/Rules next time.


meh, according to his description, he pretty much downloaded a demo.

[The5thElephant]

There isn't a demo for Half Life 2. But I'm gonna leave it at that, I'm not an admin and I don't really care either way.

There are rumors that Team Fortress 2 may be the multiplayer mode of HL2. Do you think this is likely? And will there be a CS2?

[Falcrum]

Team Fortress 2 might be available as a multiplayer mode for HL2, like the original TF, but when it's coming out is beyond me. As for CS2, it's probable, after all its concept is just like the original CS with better graphics, a more realistic physics engine, etc.

[Pyromonger]

Halo 2 will invariably lead to many drunken rowdy nites in front of the TV with friends.

Half-life 2 will be a jewel of a game to enjoy on quiet nites. Probably MANY quiet nites. Very loooooong quiet nites.

Obviously I will have both. Ppl who didn't buy an Xbox have missed out on more than "just one game," but of course the same can be said for anyone who doesn't own every gaming system *shrug*

Doom 3 heh... anyone who played Doom can't not get this :P Forcing my jumpy g/f to play will be a fiendish joy ;)

[Death_Knight]

How many times do I have to repeat :

Patience is a Virtue. Wait for them to come, and THEN proceed to debate which is better.

[Retroboy]

Death_knight - you should be more patient with us. Remember, "patience is a Virtue." :loco:

-- Retro, instigatin'.

[Death_Knight]

Point noted. I should've stuck to my "No Comments" policy. It's better to listen than to babble.

That aside, I really like the HL2 trailer video where the man in black suit makes all sorts of facial expressions. Quite fantastic. :)

[SpinDizzy]

Gman!!!

Anyway, this may sound bias coming from me, but I'm almost certain Half Life 2 will win hands down and don't see this as any fair contest.

It depends on what you mean by which one is better, or wins.

If you mean number of sales, then Half Life 2 will obliterate Halo.

What has a fair chance is which title sells more copies on the xbox, can't do the same with the PC, since god knows when Halo 2 might come out on PC.

I'm not that interested in it myself, first one was surely better then your average game, not sure I'd rate it a classic though, but then I'm someone speaking who's never played the xbox version, and only seen it.

[littlegreencube]

since god knows when Halo 2 might come out on PC.

If Halo was any indicator, I pray it never does.

[Reignfire]

If Halo was any indicator, I pray it never does.

For as bad as I want Halo 2 to come to PC, I unfortunately have to agree with you.

[Ammon Ra]

PC version of halo was horrible. I was amazed by the xbox version, but the PC version was.... :yech:

HL2 wins, possibly not in all catagories, but when's the last time you say a modification for console games? :p

[Pyromonger]

Console games sales dwarf computer game sales, that's just how it is. There's only a few PC games that can compare to console game sales... like Myst, The Sims, and of course Half-life.

But for HL that's only if you include all the CS versions out. XBox Halo alone sold almost as many copies as every version of HL out for the last 6 years combined.

There should be 12-14 million XBox out by time Halo 2 is out. Gonna be hard for HL2 to keep up with Halo 2 sales... heh, they've both got 1 from me for sure, but there's just not as many comp nerds as there are console kiddies.

[LoCo]

I think it's more then that Pyromonger ... (Not saying anything that might get me banned.)

[No Surrender]

Well... HL2 is also comming out on Xbox (the only console that can run it, take that Sony and Nintendo!) too. That'll probably give HL2 a sales boost. Although I've yet to see an Xbox owner without a copy of Halo.

[Retroboy]

****Halflife hi-res movies now available via bittorrent (not sure how new this is) at Steam website!!

Checked out "striders" (which I have seen before, but in the 2003 500Mb massive movie, and it just didn't look nearly as good as this one), and my jaw just dropped.

clicky. (http://www.steampowered.com/index.php?area=e3_movies)

Idle comparative speculation or not, I can tell you that Halo 2's got its work cut out for it, based on seeing this film.

-- Retro

[ArrowHawk]

totally OT, but is Deviance really banned, or is that a new avatar I see ?

[Retroboy]

Read his post above, and then the forum rules (if you have to), for the answer. ;)

-- Retro

[ShivaArchon]

For the record, I loved Halo PC. It was the same game, no? Why the backlash?

I can only hope that Halo 2 will come to PC because I would love the chance to play it.

[ArrowHawk]

Read his post above, and then the forum rules (if you have to), for the answer. ;)

-- Retro

Got me going for a while there, lol. :D

Back on topic.

Saw the vid, same reaction. Doubt my current system can run it that well... damn.

[CobraCommander]

a couple of things.
firstly to the people saying that they wont get an xbox for one game, there are a crapload of good games for xbox, as well as the best versions of any multiplatform games exculding some pc ports and ea games (for now...).
mechassault, skies, shenmue, otogi, halo, kotor, ninja gaiden, gotham, orta, pandora tomorrow... its great.

as for halflife, the casual gamer doesnt know what half life is. and by casual i mean the kind of people who make madden the best selling game. when i was in high school id be talking about counter strike, and people would know what i was discussing. then when i asked how they liked halflife they were like "whats halflife?".

in my opinion halflife was better than halo, so halflife 2 will probably be better than halo 2, and while were on shooters, they will both be better than doom 3. but im buying all of them though so i dont care.

[Age]

Halo 2 will thoroughly Pwn HL2, but it's hard to say since they're both on two entirely different systems.

[Falcrum]

HL2 is coming out on Xbox u'know. And I think it's too early to make judgements, just wait till they're both out and we'll see.

[Dark Assailant]

Hmmm... to me... it seems HL2 and Halo 2... well they are all good...

[ilia1986]

HL2 and Halo 2 advantages (only the completely official ones)

HL2:

MAY (I repat MAY) have slightly better mission and level design. both MP and SP.
MAY have slighly better and more detalied textures
The manipulator (nuff said).
a higher selection of more realistic weapons.
The ability to control ally aliens with the spore nades.
MAY have slightly better AI.
May have more interaction with environment.


Halo 2:
A combination of UT2004's assault and CTF MP combination.
A more epic feel.
Better rocket launcher (Guided this time, so no more Bunshee thog or ghost whores running you over and over again) (on side note: the RL also deals more dMG now).
More vehicles.
Double wield weapons.
completely destructible vehicles.





Ok. Now the improvements over their predecessors:

HL2:
Graphics, Sound, MAYBE level design, MAYBE AI, A cool and Uber original gun, real ally chars fighting alongside you, new aliens, and enmies, vehicles, and a bit more epic feel.


Halo 2:
Graphics, MP level design, more weapons, older weapons become more useful, solving of problems with the prev game (Vehicle and bunshee whores), faster running speed, higher jumping ability, Ability to have dual weapons, more vehicles, completely destructible vehicles, and more epic feel.



Stats based on on the Gspot preview for HL2 and the Halo 2 pre e3 vid.

[The5thElephant]

Thing is while I'm sure Half Life 2 will be very well done, the Halo 2 team releases weekly updates on their progress which are quite funny and really make you look forward to the game. Tells you about all the new tech and graphics tricks while not ruining anything in the game. For example they talk about the different ways of tweaking warthog handling or the one guy obsessed with gun reload animations. Go look for them.

[CobraCommander]

i just saw the new halo 2 video at www.gametrailers.com , and holy crap... thats going to be the best game ever.

[littlegreencube]

Awesome. Now explain why.

[Martian]

I wish more stories didn't have the main character as uberhero, but rather as a victim of circumstance or one of many grunts in a war that is much bigger than them.

-- RetroAgreed.

I wanna be a soldier in the War of the Ring :[

[Mugsy]

I'd have to say Half-life 2.

have you ever seen a game that would last until 5 years and still going strong in MP? a game where some guy was inspired and made Counter-strike, a one man project which is still now being played by the millions worldwide?



Well, you know what im talkin' about.



i have to say also from watching the video of HALO 2, it is very impressive, cool ass graphics and stuff, i can't say which Game will "own" which.

[Fang]

I think personally that Half life 2 will (granted it follows the spirt of the original and is just as creative and fun to play) have a the better single player elements and be a great single player game (this is barring any cs like mod thingys) Halo 2 however (granted it follows the spirit of halo1 and is just as creative and fun to play) will have a much better multiplayer element and probable be the sh**t to play mutliplayer.

So which is better neither in imo they would be equally balanced, Halo being the half life of consoles and half life the well you know of computers.

So my opinion- Half-Life 2 = Singleplayer goodness
Halo 2 = Multiplayer goodness


That is just my 2 cents

[Direwolf]

Halo 2 will get a bigger following than Half-Life 2 since it has way more fanboys. If half life had come out alongside halo. It wouldn't have done nearly as well. The only reason halo did so well was because there was no OTHER offerings. Most x-box players don't even know much about half-life. Halo for x-box itself not that great a game in several aspects. It's just that there was nothing better, hence the huge following.

I just hope both games turn out awesome. :D Maybe Halo 2 will have actual decent level design!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[The5thElephant]

Oh sweet mother of whatever you believe in as long as it's the mother. I just saw the E3 Halo 2 movie. WOW.

Go Here NOW! (http://www.filerush.com/download.php?target=halo2_e32004.wmv)

Destructible parts off of vehicles, entirely destructible map (read the IGN preview), bump mapping on everything, SEXAY!

[SvK]

I think it's great that the two sides can wield each other's weapons. I also praise Bungie for the phrase "dual-wield" instead of the dreadfully common malaprop "akimbo." Maybe in the future there will be hip-mounted guns, but I digress.

[Mac_Bug]

until i can play halo2 with mouse and keyboard...

[ilia1986]

5th, its not ENTIRELY destructible map, but only in the "weak spots". Didnt you see tha part with the rocket launcher? That rock which was hit by the rocket, was not destructed. you can only destroy "Weak spots" which are quite specific per map.

[Death_Knight]

I'm confused!!! Well we can't have too much of anything. I'm only sad about Halo 2 being released just for the XBOX. :(

[richieelias]

If you're comparing graphics, HL2 wins hands down. But that isnt even remotely fair, since PC's are now up to 2.5 Ghz, and an Xbox is... what... 800 Mhz? with a tiny hard-drive and a dated non upgradeable graphics card. (and btw, according to valve, Halflife 2's graphics settings can apparently be scaled down to run fine on a 700mhz computer)

Also, sorry, but the mod community alone will make HL2 soar above Halo2.

One good point for Halo2 is that it is extremely difficult, if not impossible, to cheat in online multiplayer on a console. So no little 12 year old snots ruining your day with aimbots.

Oh yeah, and nothing beats split screen multiplayer. Somebody really, REALLY needs to make this available for PC users with video out video cards. Its one thing to talk smack to some faceless guy across the ocean, and another to talk smack to a guy in another toom, but nothing compares to actually seeing the look on the guys face when you repeatedly plaster him across the wall with <insert gun of choice>.

I cant imagine any console shooter ever rivaling the pure immersion that you got in Halflife and will most likely be continued in HL2. I mean, from the HL2 E3 video, it looks like you'll really be interacting with the characters in the environment, and the AI and physics just looks BADASS.

Also, since ports in general fair pretty poorly, I'm not considering an Xbox HL2, or a PC Halo2. I have little doubt in my mind that Halo2 on Xbox will beat HL2 on Xbox, and HL2 will do the same to Halo2 if it ever gets ported to PC. But, that aside, I think that HL2 will definitely be a better game overall.

[Alex Drake]

I don't understand why evey one of these debates essentially devolves down to; PC fanboys claiming superficial superiority of a title by virtue of the fact that it resides on a PC, while the other does not, then lamenting about how stupid people are for buying console games, then wrapping it up by completely denigrating and cheapening the accomplishments of both games either by making such unfounded assertions as "what would have happened if this circumstance had differed in this way", or blindly asserting that because of one small feature or another, one game "completely annihilates the other and eats its babies".

Lets get something straight, games are about having fun and occasionally challenging your brain. Almost every point I've heard made about either title is completely superficial. Yes its nice that one title has this "crazy unique feature" that the other lacks in some respective way, but personally, I, and many people I know, don't run and fetch game titles just because the box said "totally radical land deformation technology!" or "super awesome graphical rendering system!", we buy and play titles that are fun and enjoyable, rather then boring and frustrating (the latter being infinitely more important then the former).

I can stand fanboys, just not the "fanboy mentality" of "well, my game is a little bit different then the rest, and the community is pretty active, therefore its the best thing in the world and nothing can ever match and/or surpass it". Thats just foolishness. Yes, Half-Life was an amazing FPS that revolutionized the genre and affects every title being developed now in some way. Yes, it had ALOT of great, even revolutionary features and its presentation was top-notch .....for its time. Let me reiterate that one, for its time. Comparing Halo to Half-Life is like comparing a 67' Cadillac Deville to a Mitsubishi Lancer EVO IV, their different cars from different eras designed for (ostensibly) different purposes. Sure, they all have the goal of getting you from point a to point b, but their completely different beasts beyond that.

The same goes for games (and in this case, the Half-Life and Halo franchises). Halo is good at presenting things in its style, its a congruously designed game (in all aspects) thats easy to learn and spectacular to observe. Its designed with theatrics in mind, to give the player the obvious feeling of "wow, that was fuckin' hard but.... goddamn, wanna do it again!". They accomplish this by presenting a slick game with widely varied environments, neat rendering tricks and epic themes to give you a feeling of the depth of the world you're in, even if you're only active in a small corner of it. Thats why Halo was popular, not because (as someone idiotically suggested) "it was the only game out at the time", because it wasn't (need I remind you of Red Faction, Time Splitters, etc). No, it succeeded because it took the genre and added a refinement and attention to quality and detail sorely lacking for some time(and this goes for PC AND console games, just because the PC port was botched doesn't make the game bad, you're not an idiot, you know what the game was like BEFORE it was somewhat ruined, why not use that for a comparision rather then its retarded PC first-cousin). So to boil it all down, Halo 1 did everything it set out to do leagues better then its contemporary competition (comparing it to Half-Life 1 is stupid, the games are generations apart in terms of development capacity, complexity, and architecture), and Halo 2 looks like it might do exactly the same thing.

In contrast, Half-Life 2's focus is more on the what then the how. It too is a very tightly designed (as evidenced from the HL2 trailers) and meticulously thought out, its clear from what I've seen that the developers were more interested in making a game (like the original HL) that gave players the freedom to experiment with a wide variety of approaches to gameplay. More to the point, they wanted to make something that crammed as many cool gameplay features as possible into one packaged gameworld and let the players run wild. This is great because open-ended play is the way of the future (Deus Ex2 et al). To say that Halo will "destroy" it, or vice versa, is dumb because both games strike off in different directions in the FPS genre. It would be FAR more apt to compare HL2 to Far Cry then Halo. In terms of graphics and design continuity, I'd say its a mixed bag. On the one hand, it keeps with the style presented in HL1, without departing too far into the realm of wierd. On the otherhand, it does not possess the same sort of vibrancy and polish found in Halo's gfx (due to Halo 2's use of extensive bump-mapping in combination with alot of other tricks to make low-poly models appear to look alot better then they would otherwise). This does not make the engine "inferior" rather, its simply a different feeling.

As for the PC fanboys.... theres nothing wrong with holding PC titles above all others, thats a respectable personal choice, as in fact there are a wider variety of quality titles available on the PC then console systems. But even the most devout compgame follower has to admit that the power and progress made by console games in relation to PC titles is nearing the point where it will be difficult to distinguish the two from one another. Eventually, as in many cases now, there won't be much difference. The fact that you have access to Half-Life 2 and not (however deliberate, snobby, etc the reasons might be) Halo 2 should only mean one thing, you probably won't be in a position to play and evaluate it. Thats all, no game (and you can quote me on this) is necessarilly horrible because it appears on a certain console. EVERY system in existence has had atleast few amazing games on it, so its impossible to say that a game's potential is limited by anything other than money, time and the creativity of the designer.

In the end, games are all about one thing, having fun. And you've never need a keyboard or a hard-drive to do that.

[Sabin]

IMO, I probably wouldn’t pick either over the other, as they’re two games designed for two distinctly different platforms with different hardware limitations and markets to appeal towards.

I’m sure both games will be great, they both look great from the previews, and will eventually wind up in my game collection at some point down the road. :kami:

[Death_Knight]

Alex, I was trying to accomplish a similar task, only in a different manner, in that I tried to postpone the debate until both of them arrived, but I was made to :stfu: in a very polite manner. So I decided to flow in the same direction of the discussion instead of opposing "fanboy mentality", albeit in a different manner.

The main point is I agree with you.

[Alex Drake]

I'd have to say Half-life 2.

have you ever seen a game that would last until 5 years and still going strong in MP? a game where some guy was inspired and made Counter-strike, a one man project which is still now being played by the millions worldwide?

look at your own example, more people play CS then the original game itself. Why? Certainly not because CS is a HL mod, its because CS is a better [multi]player game then Half-Life. But by some of the logic expressed on the board, CS should be inferior to HL (as its sooooo godly). Again, not true, CS is great because its fun to play, it has the exact same engine as Half-Life, but its goal was to make a fun, somewhat complex multi-player game. it succeeded stylishly thanks in no small part to the dedication and creativity of the developer. But what that proves is that its the gameplay that makes a bigger difference in how "good" a game is, not the extraneous bits (including the gfx engine, etc).

[richieelias]

Alex:
Just two comments...
1. And you're against people expressing thier 'Opinions' about which game they think they will like better..... why?

2. Nobody here is saying anything along the lines of PC owns Console or vice versa.

[ilia1986]

Listen, lets NOT turn this into some Console VS PC thread Ok? There are enough threads like this in GaySpy forums.

richieelias, we are comapring games as they are. So no mods should be included in the comparison, as they are not official parts of the game.

In addition, Halo 2's textures are quite fine. Maybe the lelvels dont have as many objects like HL2 has, but that doesnt make it's graphics (Halo 2) inferior. I believe that the texture quality is about the same in both of the games.

And no, it doesnt matter that the box has only 800 MHZ. In case you didnt know, some strong and heavy games are capable on running on the box, such as Unreal 2 and Doom 3. Can a 800 MHZ PC run Doom 3? You got me laughing.

Mugsy, even though there are like 300,000 playing CS every day, Halo on the Xbox is still quite popular, and may i add, was much more popular in 2001-2002.

But again, Mods do not count here in game comparisons.

[richieelias]

K, mods dont count. And as far as PC ports to consoles, they generally tune the graphics down on them. HOWEVER, games also run smoother and faster on an Xbox or similar console than on a PC with the same specs since the console is a dedicated gaming platform with no variance in hardware. But thats all besides the point anyway.

As far as graphics goes I was commenting on geometry detail. The textures are pretty much on par with each other in both games, so that was the only real variant that I could see.

All in all, the real deciding factor for me between the two games (minus the mod issue) is that I just like HL story, and the way the original game actually made me jump out of my seat at points while playing it. The immersion was just sublime. So, IF HL2's... uhhh.... player immersion factor as good as, or improved over the original, then I could see myself playing the HL2 single player game for alot longer than Halo 2.

[ÜberJumper]

Play FarCry. IMO, it's going to give HL2, Halo2, and Doom3 a run for it's money. The game's absolutely amazing.

[Ramrod]

its a little hard for casual FPS players, though, uber. i've been playing shooters since doom 2, and i had a lot of trouble in the first two levels. the learning curve isn't too steep, but its a real shell shock to finally play a first person shooter that is hard. farcry is great, but not for 'teh nübs'.

[richieelias]

Hmm, never really paid much attention to far cry. Might have to read up some reviews on it.

I'm just waiting for stalker to come out.. looks pretty good.

[Master Chief]

Halo 2 shall be infinitely better! Halo was the best game ever IMO, and Halo 2 will be even greater! It shall be a landmark to greatness! Not to mention a really cool game. :)

[The5thElephant]

ilia, you are wrong. The trailer doesn't show it but read the IGN article, they say that almost every part of the level can be destroyed with explosives (like Red Faction) except you can't make the building collapse or anything. Read the article, it tells quite a bit.

[Kovac]

Halos story and gameplay was pretty good but ugh, the level design was horribly repetitive. It's like they decided that they wanted to extend the playing time but didnt want to spend the money working on it so they just padded it out.
Maybe they thought console games are meant to be repetitive.

Half life on the other hand was an amazing game which im sure most gamers will be remembering as a major development in games.
As long as HL2 lives up to that it will be great.

On a side note, I would have no problem with consoles if they would stop taking games that were being developed for PC and making them console exclusive. Xbox is the worse for this.
They havent quite done that with Doom but they have done a good job of screwing over the multiplayer by making it so that co-op is available in the xbox version only.

[The5thElephant]

Bungie knows about the repetitiveness and promised it won't be like that in Halo 2.

[Retroboy]

FarCry = teh challenge! Two punches from one of the rather common monsters in the later part of the game will kill you dead - and they travel in packs. Plus, the graphics are stunning.

I must admit, though, HL2's environment does seem to have more impacts from your actions, with more breaking stuff than what I see in Far Cry, and I'm not as fond of games where grenades don't leave craters. Not sure how much of that is scripted, though.

Pity Halo's only xboxian - I'd have a great deal of fun with a rocket launcher in a fully destructible terrain. :D

-- Retro, with some obvious aggression to work off...

[The5thElephant]

Holy.....holy.....holy shit.

New E3 video out for HL2! Low quality (shaky cam) but it includes Counterstrike gameplay on the source engine!!!! While yes we all hate CS, it looks AMAZING. They even said that all the popular mods from HL will be updated to the source engine (maps, models EVERYTHING). And that includes HALF LIFE AND ALL ITS SEQUELS ON THE SOURCE ENGINE! :!: :!: :!:

I can't emphasize enough how much Valve has just gained back all its value in my eyes. I was doubting it, but now. Holy shit.

VIDEO NOW MMMMM (http://www.filerush.com/download.php?target=half_life2_counterstrike_source_demomovie.avi)

:wow:

[Alex Drake]

On a side note, I would have no problem with consoles if they would stop taking games that were being developed for PC and making them console exclusive. Xbox is the worse for this.
They havent quite done that with Doom but they have done a good job of screwing over the multiplayer by making it so that co-op is available in the xbox version only.

In my opinion its not screwing it up if atleast one group of players gets the good features.Also, Xbox exclusive pc titles warm my heart, makes me feel like my investment in the console was a sound one. So cry on PC-gamers, its not like an Xbox costs more then your shiney new videocard...

[Ramrod]

They even said that all the popular mods from HL will be updated to the source engine (maps, models EVERYTHING). And that includes HALF LIFE AND ALL ITS SEQUELS ON THE SOURCE ENGINE!


:bow:
i am now valve's willing slave.

valve = god.

[Alex Drake]

wait till you have to download steam.... and then let IT download whole games that you can't actually play till you pay $50 for a reg code when you're not paying attention (A la Condition Zero).

[Kovac]

You are talking about one of the best games in PC gaming ever. Surely the focus should be on the platform with the largest most dedicated fanbase.

Not only that, the game is best suited for PC anyway.
You can get a better look from it, the controls are better for FPS and it is better suited for multiplayer.

And it is screwing up the PC version which was my point.
Its not like there is a need to remove the co-op, there arent some hidden benefits to it. The game was developed for PC first, the only excuse for it is marketing.

Making console gamers feel better is the worst excuse I have ever heard

[LoCo]

I'll challenge anyone here to beat me. Me on PC them on Xbox, we play a FPS and see who has the easier time of it. (Can you hook them up? Is it possable?) FPS games work better with the PC controls. A mouse and k/b beats a controler any day of the week ... and twice on sundays.

It's not about "Oh, I play on a PC that makes me leet". It's about facts. It's easier to look around with a mouse, faster and more acurate. Controlers just don't have those things. Likewise a PC is not the best for areana fighting games ... It doesn't work as well.

And THAT is what made Halo suck. It was going to be for PC, but then they changed it and in so doing messed the controles up. So when it was ported the controles didn't have the right feel. You couldn't "do" what you could ... no, what you SHOULD have been able to do.

Halo 2 may end up being a good game, but if it were made for a PC in the first place, then it would be better. But they aren't worried about what's better, only what sells. And Halo 2 will sell ... (I think it's mainly due to the fact that it was hyped so much and *gasp* given free with a lot of Xbox systems). The game was given away. Who would say no to a free game? And because of that, Halo 2 will sell. They say it's better then the first, (And it most lightly is) and so everyone that played the first will go for the second. And because it was given free with so many Xbox's, MANY people played it.

Good marketing does not a good game make.

Now HL was a good game. I dare anyone to say otherwise. It was good, in fact it was great. It had two "spin-offs" or rather continuations, and many mods. Anyone that thinks HL deathmach is dead is either stupid or trying really hard to be. It's not only about it's mods, the game it's self was great.

HL2 could just be the same game with better skins and stuff and it would be one of the best games this side of time. But it has more then that and it's on a gaming platform that can use everything in it to it's fullest. It's got no restrictions with it's controls. For it to have a better control system it would need to come with a VR suit or something.

Anyone had a look at the Phantom? It's a gaming PC. What control system does it use?

I seriously can't see how anyone would play with a controler over a mouse and k/b if they were given the choice. What if you were given the choice to play the newest FPS and it was able to be played with both controler and k/b mouse. I think the choice is obvious. Soon the k/b mouse would be worn out and the controler would be broken because of all the dust it had collected.

So to end my rather longwinded post. If HL2 and Halo 2 were to both come (Developed ) on the PC, and NOT ported, then it would be a hard call to say which was better. They would both benifit from the mouse k/b system and would both shine.

Consoles should stick with what runs best on them, just like the PC does.

[Alex Drake]

No lengthy reply here, but I'd be interested to know what your opinion is of the thousands who picked up and played Halo for xbox and found its control scheme to be easy to use and intuitive (eg; workable). I'm not doubting the additional dexterity utilized by k/b + mouse combos, but Halo's controls worked just fine for the 'box. Just because it started as a PC game is no reason to put it on blast for control issues that most would acknowledge are neglible at best. Plus, no one was arguing whether HL2 would suck or not (we all know it will kick ass).

[Master Chief]

You have to admit, even if you are a Half-Life fan, the E3 trailer of Halo 2 was pretty sweet. The game looks AWESOME!

[Genetic Bryy]

Any way to transfer Mr. Half Life 2 vid to quicktime? The file won't work or something.

[richieelias]

You can get mice and keyboards for consoles (at least I know you can with PS2)... but I dont know anything about whether many games support them or not (or how well they support them)....

But yeah, thats been the one thing that completely turns me off of console shooters... precise aiming with those little joysticks is a bitch and a half.. So far most shooters just have the games either auto-aim or make it so the enemy cant hit the broad side of a barn.. both solutions make the games quite boring.

Right now the only reason I even own a PS2 is for the GTA series, Gran Turismo 3, and soon, Gran Turismo 4. Well worth the investment in my opinion.

Just bought Far Cry, and that game is pretty awesome so far (I dont think it's overly difficult at all on the default difficulty level). I dont think that it will beat (...read carefully now...) what valve is saying HL2 will be. After all, how many times has a game not lived up to the hype? :D

[LoCo]

Alex Drake: Read richieelias' post to see my reply. Halo for Xbox "had" auto-aim on it, so that is why many people found it so easy to get used to. It was even set as default on the PC ... That and the enemy AI in Halo was good, but they were worse shots then Storm Troopers. You could stand still and take maybe three hits while you take out about 10 baddies. On the later lvls you had to duck out of sight a few times because of the amount of fire going on, but you never really were in any danger of dying.

I'd be intrested to know your opinion of RTS games on consoles. C&C for instance ... any thoughts?

[The5thElephant]

RTS games on consoles = nono because RTS games require more buttons for fast gameplay and it is difficult to bandbox etc with a controller.

But I disagree about FPS on consoles, Halo while yes it had auto-aim, it was very slight and didn't detract from the games fun. It wasn't woops there goes my crosshair a foot from where I was aiming and now I am aiming at an enemies head. It wasn't even close to that.

richieelias - HL2 hasn't not lived up to the hype, it just has been delayed a lot. There hasn't been much hype of what will specifically be in the game and now that we see a lot it is VERY impressive. Look at the link I posted of the latest HL2 video. It is absolutely amazing.

Also you can aim fairly precisely with those little joysticks, it just requires a little patience and lack of butter fingers.

[A176]

In Halo, enemy Accuracy is dependant on difficulty level. If you're playing on easy, of course they're not going to hit you enough to kill you in a matter of seconds.

As for aiming, it all ends up in the skill of the players. Some can use thumbsticks, and some can't.

[Starfisher]

Everyone goes into these technical details about what makes one game superior to the other, when the primary goal here is to entertain. Halo entertained, and provided the best multiplayer experiences I've ever had. You can't call one better than the other because to do so requires you to invent some standard of video game good and bad which is totally relative from one person to the next.

And in the end, you can talk about all the nuances of control, graphics or whatever that you want, but you can't possibly make me forget how much fun I had playing the game. So you lose. No matter what you do.

[Kovac]

I think that were pretty retarded with HL2 actually.
If they had released it shortly after the well known video they would have recived HUGE sales. Not to say that wont still do well, but now there are a number of games that compete quite well with what we saw.
It's almost like they are pulling a Duke Forever.
They had better not :)
But im sure if it has a solid storyline and good gameplay it will be worth buying.

btw, you are wrong.
You may think you had fun, but you didnt.
Not as much as if the game had been on PC and properly developed like it should have been and not had a rushed development for the xbox.

[Alex Drake]

Indeed fisher, thats exactly my point.

[The5thElephant]

Fisher wins.

Kovac, I now think (after seeing the 15 minute new E3 video) that HL2 in fact has many things that other games DONT offer. Yes Far Cry has gorgeous graphics and great gameplay, but it is mostly running and gunning. Half Life 2 has an entire city to explore with NPCs that can be spoken to etc. Also it has an even better physics engine (destructible objects etc). Sadly it looks like Half Life 2 doesn't have dynamic lighting. At least that is how it seems, no one has mentioned dynamic lighting for it yet (as in real time shadows).

Watch the video.

[Kovac]

Arent they both still essentially using the havok 2.0 physics engines?
Probibly used differently but in the end still the same engine.
And im not saying that HL2 isnt better, just that compared to what there was when the video came out it isnt quite as impressive.

Got to love the gman and the detail in those faces though :)

Sorry Elephant, you arent the judge.

[richieelias]

Yes, HL2 has dynamic lighting (you can tell in the video. Especially looking at the G-Mans face), and some damn good lighting at that.

[littlegreencube]

http://www.penny-arcade.com/images/2004/20040512h.gif

[Soulblighter]

You may think you had fun, but you didnt.
Not as much as if the game had been on PC and properly developed like it should have been and not had a rushed development for the xbox.

actually i am pretty damn sure i had fun.

[Kovac]

I think I would know better than you.
Just trust me, you didnt have that much fun.

[Alex Drake]

You're an idiot, you don't think you are, but I know better then you. Trust me.

The only place that logic works is within communist/fascist dictatorships.

Halo for Xbox is fun, and alot of people recognize that. Its a fact, deal with it. If you don't like Halo 2, prove it with your wallet and don't buy it and avoid instances when you might be able to play it. But if you don't buy it, and you don't play it, then you can't complain about it, because you know nothing about it. You can stick to Half-Life's amazingness, and life will go on, but whats the actual point of denying yourself a potentially awesome gaming experience? Honestly, sometimes I wonder if people are in love with games, or are they really just in love with the systems they play them on.....

[No1lives4ever]

I like(d) both.

[Ramrod]

You may think you had fun, but you didnt.
Not as much as if the game had been on PC and properly developed like it should have been and not had a rushed development for the xbox....

...I think I would know better than you.
Just trust me, you didnt have that much fun.

wtf? who the hell says something like that?

even though i am not a fan of halo (as i believe it is merely a shadow of what bungie had intended it to orignially be for mac and pc), it was a fun romp, on both xbox and pc. it was simple, yet not super easy. and for multiplayer, if you can find a nice server not full of whiners, its one of my top ten.

and although i am disappointed with the game (in comparison to how much everyone else loved it) its still a great game, and i'm glad i bought it. the fact that i felt let down doesn't mean that everyone else should also have felt so. therefore, just because you were disappointed with the game doesn't make you the benchmark to measure one's satisfaction with the game.

anyways, even though i somewhat dislike the xbox (i consider it a crippled pc more than a beefed up console), i am still buying halo 2 on it, and a keyboard and mouse for it, if there are any available. and half-life 2 for the pc. i don't understand why there are so many console-haters. consoles are a complement system to the pc, not a replacement system. no need to be xenophobic.

so, i will enjoy both games. whether i enjoy one more than the other will depend on how i have changed from now to then. right now, i would actually rather be playing doom3, whereas five years ago, i would rather have had half-life 2. i think everyone is going to feel the same way. there is no reason to start bashing games with great potential simply because you are a fanboy of its rival.

[Kovac]

I wonder if people are in love with games, or are they really just in love with the systems they play them on.....

That would make sense if I didnt love playstation any many of its games.
I havent used xbox quite as much but there seemed to be fewer worthwhile games to make me want to part with my money.

And actually I dont think Halo 2 will be bad, the video that I saw looked very impressive. But there are many reasons that it would be "better" on PC.
No sense repeating those reasons as they have been made quite clear.

I wouldnt care so much about FPS games going to console if they would just not brutalise the PC versions for their clever marketing. :\

I was joking about telling you guys if you had fun or not.
Perhaps you werent being serious with your outrage, but just in case I decided to clarify :)

[Retroboy]

Roddy666, you obviously missed the "yanking Soul's chain" part of that last post you quoted. Go back and read it again. ;)

[edit]nm - Kovac already 'splained hisself too.

-- Retro

[Ramrod]

lol, flew right over my head. oops, hehe.:slow:
for a sec i thought someone was honestly saying that.

and simply "Rod" will do, thanks. :D everybody calls me that, including my parents.

(maybe they think i'm a dick...:(. yes i know, that is a lame pun, but everybody else makes the comment)

[Soulblighter]

yea guys relax... kovac and i were just having some fun, i mean why else would he make some little comment like he did. heh.. sarcasm.. sigh.

[Alex Drake]

EDIT: I was pretty steamed, but in retrospect, it was too idiotic to be anything other then a joke. Still, I've heard PC fanboys say the same thing seriously IRL, so it wasn't as far-fetched as some might imagine.

Anyway,

For the record, I don't have much esteem for most PC titles (3d and otherwise) because to me, alot of their atmosphere and enjoyment is proportional to the specs of the system their being played on. I don't like the fact that someone who can afford to buy a $3500 rig complete with liquid cooling, the latest video-card/memory etc will experience more of the game simply due to the fact that they can afford to put more cash into their system.

Alot of the work I do is designed to close the digital divide (I work at an inner-city tech-center) and most importantly give people without access to technology the training they need to become proficient with it. As a result, my gamer persona has a tendency to uphold console games because; no matter what your means, you're playing the exact same game, the exact same way, on the exact same system, as anyone else playing it. And when you want to talk about relative skill, you can't use hardware as an excuse as to why you won or lost (or why the game was uber). So when someone says "well X games are better on a PC because yada yada yada" I have to counter with the question "what PC?" because if I buy HL2, and my machine doesn't have all the specs to run it properly, I'll be disappointed with the game and sad that I'll miss out on the experience of other gamers (basically, it makes the shortcomings of your hardware alot more painful to recognize). Plus, the cost of keeping your PC at the highest market standards is more then you'll ever shell out on console products in a year (sans the games themselves).

I can buy a brand new Xbox + 5 of the latest hit titles (at full price) AND every major peripheral necessary to trick out my system (4 controllers, DVD remote, etc) for almost half of what it costs to buy the lowest end commercial PC + warranty. Even if I throw in a 21" TV and some speakers it would STILL cost me less then said PC. Thats why I find it hard to stomach hardcore PC gamers bitching about the woes of the console gaming industry and how its either stealing "their" games (as if games belong to anyone but the people who create them), or filling the world with whiney fanboys who hate them and live heckle and taunt honest and virtuous PC gamers with their exclusive titles (but of course when said titles are released, the PC-fan instantly screams that they are intrinsically ruined, like so much spoiled milk, so in their minds it no longer matters that the games are on console anymore because they are "teh suck"). PC gaming acts like its an underground scene rather then the wildly popular industry that it is. As long as the titles stay native to the comp, they're accepted. But the moment one "sells out" and moves to a console (eg; a more readilly accepted medium), its hated and reviled. So what if Halo started out as a PC game, it ended its life as a console title, and it kicked ass. So suck it up and be grown men (or women) about it.

Someone asked about RTS games on console and yes, I'd have to say their usually shitty, but, IMO, not because of the controls, mainly how shallow, short, or poorly made they tend to be (Kessen was a great example of an RTS that could have been alot better, but its lack of polish, design, open-endedness, length, and depth prevented it from being a truly awesome title). That said, there actually are some RTS games that look like they'll be right at home on the console (I'm speaking of my personal, ignored, korean favorite; Kingdom Under Fire: The Crusaders), which nominally looks like the most awesome RTS game I've seen in a looooooong time (Nexus excluded), AND its an Xbox exclusive.

So anyway, I think consoles level the playing field and are home to awesome games that no one who seriously calls themselves a gamer (eg; one who enjoys playing games) should be missing. While PC games get more and more abstract, offering gamers more features and novelties then actual fun, just remember its GAMEPLAY, not graphics that really define a title. And if you think PC games have a higher standard of truley intuitive and enjoyable gameplay then console games, I suggest you take a hard look at ALL the titles released in the last few years. Nintendo alone kicks the collective ass of most of the PC industry (in terms of developing games that are actually FUN to play, and don't require a PHD in uberl33tness to pick up, understand, and excel at).

[ilia1986]

For the record, I don't have much esteem for most PC titles (3d and otherwise) because to me, alot of their atmosphere and enjoyment is proportional to the specs of the system their being played on. I don't like the fact that someone who can afford to buy a $3500 rig complete with liquid cooling, the latest video-card/memory etc will experience more of the game simply due to the fact that they can afford to put more cash into their system.



Welcome to Planet Earth, and to a place called Real Life.

I second you though.

[Alex Drake]

It sucks, it is reality, but that doesn't make it justified, especially when its not like we (who cannot afford such things) don't enjoy and support games any less then the ones who can. :(

[Master Chief]

I tried to view the HL2 video someone here posted a link to, but I didn't get any video. The Quicktime Player just played the Audio. Can anyone help?

[Ramrod]

yeah, same thing happened to me a few months ago. all you need to do is update the codec. www.apple.com, the dl the newest quicktime. if that doesn't work, i dunno what could :/

[The5thElephant]

I actually don't think that Half Life 2 has real-time shadows ALA Far Cry or Splinter Cell. For example in one of the latest E3 videos where the large crane picks up the crate, the shadow of the end of the crane is visible through the crates shadow (looks bad in fact, needs to be fixed cause it isn't right at all) where they darken where they overlap, that wouldn't happen cause the shadow is being cast from same lightsource so the shadow couldn't pass through the object. Also the shadows don't seem as defined as real-time shadows usually are.

[adwight7]

If you ask me, Halo 2 is being way overhyped. You guys think you know big fanboi's? Ha, your dreaming. I live in a neighborhood where everyone besides me owns an xbox. I have a gamecube, and all I can say is that my GC owns their XBox any day. Sure Halo is a fun game, but it doesn't even compare to the godliness half life is. The dudes in my neighborhood give me a hard time about not having an xbox so I can get this great game they call halo 2, honestly, i don't care. I'd rather have my cube any day, Metroid Prime 2 and the Legend of Zelda will own Halo's ass.

[richieelias]

EDIT: I just went back and watched the video again, and there most definitely IS a shadow under the big container that he picks up with the crane. Everything is casting shadows, there is in fact dynamic lighting.

Well, first off, the quality of the video itself is pretty piss-poor, but even so you can still tell that there is dynamic lighting. Pay close attention to the people and their shadows. Even in such a low quality video I can tell that the lighting system theyre using is even higher detail than far cry.

Alex, correct me if I'm wrong, but your opinion on PC's seems to be "Equality or nothing"? Or more specifically, you would rather all games graphics be lowered untill they can run smoothely at their highest settings on a low end system? I'm sorry, I'm just having a difficult time grasping the logic there.. I must be misunderstanding something. It could be that I just dont understand the problem you're discussing there since my job involves alot of CG and 3d animation, and thus I always have to keep my computer fully upgraded.

But still, almost every 'good' PC game is playable on lower end computers with graphic options turned down.

[Alex Drake]

No the point is that; Regardless if someone needs a suped up PC to be an effective creator of media content (in this case CG), you, the end-user/viewer, don't need the latest TV to see the animation the way it was rendered. The problem I'm adressing is the tendency of PC games to be inaccessable to a variety of gamers for many different reasons. While i think its unfair, my main gripe is that the innaccessability is so often used as an excuse as to why PCs are superior. Obviously developers should not compromise quality if there are a fair number of users who can play their games at the intended level of detail, but at the same time, if the specs of a game are so high that one needs (on average) a $300-400 investment to play them properly, I'd say the devs should rethink their approach. Also, try playing UT2004 (which I thoroughly enjoy) at the lowest possible gfx setting, then at the max, they are completely different games (which also is an example of how much "good" PC games are more wrapped up in their graphics engines then actual gameplay).

[The5thElephant]

richoeelias, please actually read my post.

Yes there are shadows, but that doesn't mean dynamic shadows. If you notice the crate that is lifted you can see an unrealistic shadow of the crane being cast THROUGH it. That doesn't happen in any game cause it's wrong. Also look at the part where a Combine Soldier is walking down a hallway, his shadow doesn't change as he walks past lights right above his head. That means no dynamic lighting.

[richieelias]

Definitely not going to argue this point anymore....
go here: http://www.halflife2.net/engine.php

(its a good read at any rate... and damn... I didnt know they have real time radiosity in there.... thats just FREAKIN INSANE!)

...and Kovac, HL2 doesnt use the HAVOC engine. It uses the source engine that Valve built.

[The5thElephant]

The Havok engine is only a physics engine elias, it isn't a game engine, it can be built into any engine you want.

[richieelias]

Be that as it may, everything I've read leads me to believe that Valve designed the entire source engine, including physics, themselves.

hmm... seems to be going slightly askew from the origional topic...

[ilia1986]

If you ask me, Halo 2 is being way overhyped. You guys think you know big fanboi's? Ha, your dreaming. I live in a neighborhood where everyone besides me owns an xbox. I have a gamecube, and all I can say is that my GC owns their XBox any day. Sure Halo is a fun game, but it doesn't even compare to the godliness half life is. The dudes in my neighborhood give me a hard time about not having an xbox so I can get this great game they call halo 2, honestly, i don't care. I'd rather have my cube any day, Metroid Prime 2 and the Legend of Zelda will own Halo's ass.




Ahh, a GC owner! A long time since I saw 1 of these. Go. Stick with your gamecube, with yor shooting rabbits, bouncing ninjas, and your buzzling Fairies and Dragons. with all your arcadish games.

Yuo say GC owns the box? Nah. A GC cant and wont run such things as Doom 3 or HL2.

you say HL2 is better than Halo 2 and even cant compare wih it? Have you even seen the videos of Halo 2?

[sheng]

HALO 2 is really amazing, but HL2 also are. They are both good games, and one for PC, one for console. Halo 2 is someway I think is less amazing compare to HL2 and for a console FPS game, it will be a winner. Thing also goes for HL2 for PC.

No one win just different...................

[ASnogard]

I think at the end , the main thing is that there is extreme competition pushing developers to greater heights...irregardless of the platform.

I think this generic pigeon holeing of games is the cause for a lot of 'fanboi flammable speculation' - HL 2 and Halo 2 are both classed as FPS, however despite this they are completely different games, have different goals and different appeals. If I were say to examine HL and Halo, I would look at the gameplay type rather than the tech/GFX etc.

HL 1 is based on a ' normal dude goes to work, shit hits the fan and now you gotta sort it out...and hope to stay alive'
Halo is more ' super soldier gets a rude wake up call, aliens caused some grief and now its pay back time. '

HL 2 is still the 'getting kicked into the deep end and having no clue whats up' scene, while Halo 2 is still 'super soldier + ass kicking = fun' (<- no disrespect intended).

Nothing wrong with either game, merely depends on your taste - I prefer the ' normal dude in a bad situation' scene to the ' super soldier dishing out some trained ass kicking'

Unreal and Unreal II are the perfect examples of how the above paragraph work - Unreal 1 puts the player in a downed spacecraft, in the middle of nowhere, unarmed and in hell. Unreal II puts the player into a marine-wannabe-spacecop's boots, with some toys and dropped off to dish out some pain. I didn't enjoy Unreal II much, much prefered Unreal 1.

[sheng]

I agree with you ASnogard. But I like to put it:
HALO = typical American action films (For all)
HL = a good film with deep thoughts (For most)
Unreal = a ok-poor film to show case new stuff (For some)
Doom 3 = a ok-poor film to show case new stuff (For some)
Postal = sick film (For sick people)

[The_Assimilator]

ASno, I agree completely. For me, it's the game's storyline/atmosphere that sells it, not necessarily excellent GFX and sound. I'm currently playing Half-Life SP again (like, the 4th time) and the atmosphere is THERE. That's what makes it so good.

[dino]

I agree with The_Assimilator.

[dino]

I should also add Unreal 3 in this (yes, the sequel to the badly rated Unreal 2). This looks alot better technically (and fucking kicks HL2's and Unreal's ass by the simple looks of the graphics. I haven't actually seen any videos of this and don't know anything about the physics engine (a game with graphics this good has to have a physics engine of HL2's caliber).

Here's a screen shot page from IGN
http://media.pc.ign.com/media/670/670283/imgs_1.html

Here's a vid which you can download it's a windows media file (I haven't seen this yet and will post up when I do)
ftp://ftp.edome.net/mirror/beyondun...nreal3_0002.wmv

Here's the Unreal 3 thread on this website (where I found out about Unreal 3)
http://forums.relicnews.com/showthread.php?t=26720

[Starfisher]

Please note that those shiny new graphics are so resource intensive that the system needed to show them at 30 fps only came into existence in time for this year's E3. Graphically amazing, yes, but we won't be playing that for years, so don't get too excited yet.

[sheng]

game engine is like a form of art, Unreal 3 engine = HL2 engine. Unreal 3 looks good at first but it does get old fast, if you want to see will use of bump maping look at HL2.

[richieelias]

The only thing that made the Unreal single player kinda boring to me, was all the over the top action with uber guns and odd looking anime styled characters (all personal preference). Of course, that same stuff always seems to make the Unreal multiplayer a blast.

Guess I just like to feel like I'm actually there in singleplayer, and just want to 'blow stuff up' in multiplayer.

[zippy]

well HL was screwed in the engine coz it had a bottle neck in teh code which restrict modding and pumped CPU usage up, now hopefully they will be sorted in hl2.

HL2 and Halo2 will both be popular but HL2 will win hands down to the fact it's modding potential making it still be around for yrs to come like HL when halo2 dies with xbox :)

[NovaBurn]

dude don't bump 3+ month old threads.

[SquidDNA]

lol i agree