Anyone read the Necron Codex?

[Griffin]

My friend just got this, and I was reading through it when I noticed it was talking about the incoming Tyranid Hive Fleet...

...the Hive Fleet completely bypassed and left the Necron tomb planets alone (thought they were too tough?) but still continued to attack the Imperium...

...which has defeated it like four other times.


What's with all these new Necron players everywhere? All the local gaming stores are swamped with Necron people, Necron this, Necron that.

It just a local thing? Or all over?

[Cashew]

Necrons are a very strong race. I think the nids bypassed their planet because they couldn't detect any life.

[Griffin]

Ah...I must have misread it, cause the way it was worded they made it act like they only bypassed those few select planets. (my thinking was the Tyranids would attack any planet regardless of who owns it)

Necrons are strong...just seems like the new FOTM --

[Ghost DB]

Or nids was aware there was some kind of intelligent lifeform, but not something they could eat? :S

[Kaptin Zed]

Tyranids are only interested in organic matter. Though don't kill for sport, they kill for food. :D

Thusly a tomb planet would be of no interest to them whatsoever.

[Griffin]

In that case...since Necron hate all flesh why didn't they attack the Tyranids?

[Cailet]

There is a rumour that a C'tan is behind the Tyranid race.

[ZzGashi]

tyranids only take orders from the hivemind. The nids would bypass any planet without organic life. and y would a somethiung such as c'tan would want the nids for?

[Athair]

Supposedly the Outsider made them as a replacement for Necrons, and that he IS the Hive Mind. Total rubish to me but... :werd:
Nids will take out any planet they come across, unless it is already dead (ie no life, oceans, atmosphere, etc). It's like driving up to a long deserted gas station.

[Dante]

but unlike the nids i would loot the deserted gas station :D

[SpitfireMK461]

The Necrons are an amazing race. Not only do they look cool, but they are quite strong.

I myself have some necs. I love them.

[Crested_Ones]

thier fluff is the thing of gods...

[ZzGashi]

the necrons seem to hate the eldar ALOT. personally i hope the eldar kick thier robotic arses back to where they came.

[Grendel Rose]

Yes well that kind of goes back the the war between the things that created the eldar and the things that created the necrons, neither of them go along so well, so neither do their progeny. Personaly I'm just wondering what will happen if tomb planets start to really open up and the necrons come out in force, would be doubly bad if the dragon woke too.

[Athair]

No, it was the war between the Old Ones and the Necrontyr (Necrons before they were robots). Most of the history is in the Codex, somewhere between the main army list, and the C'tan part.

[TS_ahriman]

It has rumored (and I feel that there is every reason why this rumour is worth thinking about) that the Tyranids are in fact the Old Ones taken to their evolutionary pinnacle. Here are the arguments, or reasons why it would be cool, that they are one and the same:
1) The Old Ones stated before they left our portion of space that they would evolve to the point that they would never become extinct (i'm sorry that i can't site a source for this particular piece of fluff).
2) The Old Ones and the Necrontry were radically different, and they hated eachother with a passion. In 'present day' 40k, no two armies are more different than the Tyranids and Necrons.
3) The Old Ones created the races we know and love. Orks, humans, eldar, etc...and we're all edible. However, a logical fallacy to this particular point is that the Old Ones supposedly created these races to help in their fight against the Necrontry/Necrons. You decide.
4) The Old Ones were masters of genetic manipulation. See a pattern?
5) It would be uncharacteristically witty for GW to tie Tyranids into the 40k universe in a far more meaningful fashion than "Here come the Tyranids! Don't know where they come from! Dont know where they go! Hope they leave soon!"

[NightBringer]

you lot are forgetting ong thing. THE OLD ONES ARE LONG GONE, no they didn't just move on and leave, they are GONE and the only things left of them are the slann(WFB lizardmen), the eldar and orks (i believe that they didn't spawn humans, and that it was because of their little accident with the warp that sparked a jump in human evolution to what they are now)

[pvthudson]

When you can field a unit of Arnorld Schwarzeneggers, why not play them?

How cool is that?

[TS_ahriman]

you lot are forgetting ong thing. THE OLD ONES ARE LONG GONE, no they didn't just move on and leave, they are GONE and the only things left of them are the slann(WFB lizardmen), the eldar and orks (i believe that they didn't spawn humans, and that it was because of their little accident with the warp that sparked a jump in human evolution to what they are now)

Yes, Old Ones are gone. They left a long time ago and went far far away. It's not like the Old Ones just disappeared though (i think that's what you're saying...not sure), they just packed up their metaphoric bags and left, vowing to return when they had acheived the pinnacle of their evolution.

[Ghost DB]

I dont know much about the old ones fluff, but I am assuming they was extremely intelligent, so it seem unreasonable to evolve from a self aware creature to a tyranid which is basicly a bug. They lost ability to "create" new things and have feelings, which is on the high end of evolution (according to our world today), and I don't think GW would screw that much around with Darwin..:D

[TS_ahriman]

The easy answer to that would be "since when did GW make sense or respect established theories"? (and yes, i'm aware that an established theory could be viewed as a paradox) However....

The Tyranid Hive Mind is completely emotionless because its sole purpose is to perpetuate. Perhaps the Old Ones sacrificed their humanity...um....oldoneity...to achieve total stability (which brings to mind 'Brave New World'). I can't answer with solid facts because Old One fluff is horribly vague, but from what read i think that their semblance to Tyranids is similar enough that it's a possibility. Maybe i'll just e-mail GW and ask them. I'm sure i'd get a straight answer *sarcasm*.

[Trickv2/BjornT]

any available sources of fluff for the old ones?

[NightBringer]

the only real sources of fluff about the old ones are warhammer armies book: lizardmen (old rules, not new) and codex: necrons.

no i wasn't saying that they disappeared, but the necrontyr wanted to destroy them (ie kill them all), and the original war ended with the huge disturbance in the warp occuring(creation of chaos gods). then there appeared to be two wars going on;

old ones + eldar etc V necrontyr+C'Tan
old ones+ krork(orks)/ Necrons+C'Tan V enslavers.

tho i'll have to re-read the odex to clear it up. my main point is that the old ones didn't say "screw you guys, we're leaving to carry on trying to achieve the pinnical of evolution (the old ones wern't trying to change themselves, but spawn the ultimate race)". that would be like german turning around and saying " WW2 is over, we're going home to develope something new" if u know what i mean. they were in a war, and losing, then they lost and (ok contradicting myself here) did disappear.

[TS_ahriman]

I can't dispute that.

Found a source for Old One fluff based mainly around the war in the heavens...
http://fortressofunforgiven.homestead.com/CH03_Ant_002a.html

[SpitfireMK461]

The Old Ones were the first beings to come into the universe after the C'tan. They figured that life was useful, so they created life.

They created the Necrontyr on a planet punished by a brutal star, which shortened their life spans greatly, but pushed the Necs forward in science. Soon, they started to colonize on other planets where they eventually encountered the Old ones. The Old Ones were superior to the Necrontyr in every way, and had MUCH greater life spans. This caused the Necrontyr to HATE the Old Ones more than anything, and they built their civilization around destroying the Old Ones and everything that spawned from them.

They eventually went to war, but the Old Ones were able to overpower the Necrontyr with webway portals. Then the Necrontyr came upon the star gods, who they called the C'tan. They created bodies for the C'tan, though it is unknown how the Necrontyr even communicated with them.

The Necrontyr began to worship the C'tan, and then the C'tan offered the Necrontyr immortality by replacing their bodies with metal. They agreed, and became the Necrons.

Now, with the C'tans, the Necrons were slaughtering all living things that they hated so much, and dominated.

The C'tan began to fight amongst themselves, until only a few were left. The Old Ones became desperate, and created warrior races like the Eldar. These races had great knowledge of the warp. Eventually, these races threw the warp out of wack, releasing warp entities, and the Old Ones lost many of their greatest achievements and such.

The most powerful of the warp entities were the Enslavers. They took control of the new races the Old Ones had created. They "scattered the last of the Old Ones and broke their power forever."

The C'tan allowed the Enslavers have the universe, and they placed themselves into Necron Stasis-tombs, that were to be locked and guarded by the Necrons for millions of years.

In the 40k universe, only 2 C'tan have emerged from stasis, the Nightbringer and Deceiver. They found that the warp entities still have a great influence. They now want to regain their position as rulers of the universe, so "the agents of Chaos must be overthrown; the Eldar eliminated, the great work completed and Humanity subjugated before the harvests can truly begin anew."

Summary from the Necron Codex. Quotes taken straight from the Codex.

[TS_ahriman]

The next two C'Tan are called the Outsider and the Dragon. I don't like C'Tan ("Let's use God to capture that table quarter!"), but I'm looking forward to seeing some cool art and models for these next two.

[The Collector]

The C'tan are the Outsider, the Deceiver, Nightbringer and the Dragon (the Machine God).

The Enslaver is probably chaos. Slaneesh destroyed the Eldar. Or it might be something else. What else came about with the increase in warp activity?

[SpitfireMK461]

The codex only describes how the Enslavers and other unnamed warp entities escaped, and that the Old Ones lost their greatest works.

[Crested_Ones]

I can't dispute that.

Found a source for Old One fluff based mainly around the war in the heavens...
http://fortressofunforgiven.homestead.com/CH03_Ant_002a.html


wow.. a really great read. it totally clarifies what the chaos gods really are and how the emperor prepared the space marines.

sounds like it would make a killer movie!

[NightBringer]

The C'tan are the Outsider, the Deceiver, Nightbringer and the Dragon (the Machine God).

The Enslaver is probably chaos. Slaneesh destroyed the Eldar. Or it might be something else. What else came about with the increase in warp activity?

i dont think the enslavers were chaos itself, but jsut a race of daemons. slannesh didn't destroy the eldar, the eldar destroyed themselves, and resulted in creating slannesh. i cant remember where it is written, but the war in heaven was also partly the cause of the massive rapid increase in human evolution.


theres something missing in your post SpitfireMK461. when the enslavers came through into the materia universe, the old ones created even more younger races, one of them being the krork (or orks as they are called now) :nana:

[SpitfireMK461]

Yea, i didn't put it in because it wasn't really relevant to the topic at hand.

I apologize.

[Chaos-hates-u]

...the Hive Fleet completely bypassed and left the Necron tomb planets alone (thought they were too tough?) but still continued to attack the Imperium...

well know lets think shall we the nids fight people so they can eat them
so why would they fight the necrons?

simple! they dont what would be the point if they fought them they would lose lost of nids and gain nothing

[TS_ahriman]

Maybe they could eat the sand....mmm....appetizing.

[JStallion]

Well don't tomb worlds have at least some resource and minerals on them? They have to even if its only the tombs themselves that house the necrons. Isn't the whole point of hive fleets attacking planets to drain the world of resources to be used for the fleet? If so then Nids would still want the tomb worlds drained. If they only sense organic life on a planet then it wouldnt make much sense why they wouldn't attack a tomb world because it would look like a free planet, nothing defending it. Unless I missed something then thats my Q.

[CunningStunt]

tyranids consume all organic matter - hence they could attack a tomb (DEAD) world but why bother when there is no organic matter.

see also: pariahs and the necron anti-pysker thing - that would severly mess up tyranid synaps creatures - possibly a reason they steered clear

[Athair]

Thats whats nice about Nids-there Psychic powers are semi-invulnerable. At least I think so, judging that you may only cancel TPP if they require a Psychic Test (and since normal Warp Blast doesn't take one...). Tell me if I'm wrong.

[Spawncraft]

The old ones where destroyred in the end I think. The C'tan possesed the metal bodies and brought them to life and could talk and the last two I think the Dragon is on mars since it is the machine gods planet and a group of necrons in ships led a suicide attack 1 got through and just stopped ... and the other who is insane is near the eye of terror since it said the necrons had a suprising interesting in the campaign(even though they wanted something

[Apollo101]

I am a Necron player and have been since they were first released, the Necrons are not as invincible as people portray them to be, i have stated already on another thread that i have played some 400 + games useing Necrons and only won have those games.

Tyranids devour all life weather it be a marine, ork or tree, something that lives is seen as a potential threat to a Hivemind, if the story in my Necron Codex reads correctly, then it clearly states that the reason for bypassing the Tomb Worlds of the Necrons was because there were no life signs for the Tyranids to feed upon, therefore seeing no threat.

The Tomb Worlds are exactly what they say they are, a Tomb, planetary in size, deep within a Tomb World lies millions of inactive Necrons awaiting re-animation, when this happens the entire Imperial worlds will fall and so to anyone who stands in thier way, or at least thats what the story states.

Putting this on the TT however is another matter because Necrons dont win all of thier battles, i saw a TT game where IG took on a rising Necron force and where held back and eventually destroyed some turns later, i have also used my Necrons against a Tyranid army and lets just say 12 stealers took down a unit of 20 Necrons, needless to say i was quite surprised when non of them stood back up.

So the morale of this story is "Necrons can be beaten" :)

Double Post

Going on from my previous post........

Despite what the story`s say, Tyranids and Necrons are quite nasty and can be beaten with a good set of tactics, the story`s btw are there for our entertainment and also for us to base our games around if we wanted to re-enact the story lines :)

[Average Boss]

You have to read the whole codex (and more than once) to get this but.....

The Dragon is on the Vaul moon, near an Eldar forge world.

The Outsider is on......... Mars. Abadon has seen visons of the Outsiders tomb through the power of the warp and seeks to harvest the C'Tans power.

The only way to kill a C'Tan permanantly is to simoltaneously destroy every Tomb ship and worls and every thing capable of building one and the C'Tan at the same time. Otherwise they just return to the nearest Tomb complex and regain their strength.

Or......

Use a disk of Vaul, the Decevier has ALL of them and has stored them in a place where even farseers cant see/find.

Necrons hate Eldar because they fought each other after the birth of the universe. They hate Chaos because when Chaos emerged it destroyed most of their food source just as they were on the brink of victory. They then went into a deep slumper untill now. During that time the Nightbringers ultimate weapon was taken from him and sealed away (I forget where).

Nids dont attack Necron worlds cause Necrons have already used up all the natural resources on thier worlds usally.
Also Necrons are very passive when surprised (for a while). The best way to take down a Necron ship (if they want a kill your not getting away, their normal speed is faster than the fastest warp travel.) is to board it. They are slow to react as they relay the message as a collective (for all you trek's very borgish).

Just a summary on Necron tech, and C'Tan