On Landraiders

[Starfire]

Hi. This is my first post here (though I've been lurking here everyday since the demo was released).

Since DoW isn't out here in Australia yet, I've been playing the Demo skirmish and Beta tutorial to death.

I was just wondering if anyone out there finds Landraiders of any use? Since it costs five points, one can have a Predator and a Dread for the same amount of points. Since a landraider only has a twin-bolters (or chainguns?) and two twin-lascannons, that makes it weaker than a Pred and a Dread combo in terms of firepower, doesn't it? It might make up for it in terms of armour, but I consider armour secondary during an assault. I've hardly ever had a Predator die on me (unless it's a 1 vs 3, and even then it's rare).

Thanks.

[G6killer]

YO Yo this is my first post to. I have been around since demo time also :beer:
But i think landraiders own more then predetors do in terms of base/building destruction. They can take out infantery also wich makes them valluble to have.
Hmm i think i should post a screenshot with their stats.

[Dante]

they can also transport things right?

so they are hard hitting and BAM they release a squad to support them...its like a surprise!

[Starfire]

they can also transport things right?

Well, since the SM have deep-strike capabilities, the necessity of transporting troops into battle is virtually nil. So far, I've seen no advantage in fighting your way into an enemy's base when you can just sneak in a cloaked scout team, and then drop your troops right behind their defences.

Ok, here are some stats.

One Landraider:
2 x chaingun
4 x lascannon (two on each side)

One Dreadnought (chaingun upgrade) + 1 predator (lascannon upgrade):
1 x chaingun
1 x flamethrower
4 x lascannon

[sverkuijlen200]

Also starfire don't forget that the pred alone has almost as much hp as the LR let alone the extra hp the dread brings along.

[calgar1728]

i think preadators are better with the 2 lascannons and 1 twin linked combined with a dread, but the landraider is far cheaper overall with 2 twin linked lascannons and heavy bolter. 490 455 vs 170 405 and i dont know the cost of the preadator, but it is ~500 power and ~200 requistion to upgrade all the lascannons.

[Guilliman]

IMHO, preds are better then landraiders, though there more expencif, they are a better investment.

T think LR should get a dramatic increas in Fire-power for there lass-cannons
They should do more damage;

They should own buildings (but will not do well against infantry), yet they almost do no damage to buildings or othere vehicles..

LR suck, the only use is Useing em as a Wall, thats all there good for (a wall with a room in it :smash: )

[sverkuijlen200]

LR suck, the only use is Useing em as a Wall, thats all there good for (a wall with a room in it :smash: )

Don't they call that a house? XD

[Guilliman]

Prehaps an "Armoured Mobile Home" (AMH instead of LR :s)

[Starfire]

Also starfire don't forget that the pred alone has almost as much hp as the LR let alone the extra hp the dread brings along.

That's true! Good point.

To Calgar:
A Pred+Dread combo may take more resources and time to build and fully upgrade, but by the time I start building Preds, resources are rarely a worry anymore. My usual build for Space Marine (against Orks) is:

Squad 1:
1 x SM with 3 h-bolters and 1 rocket launcher (addon FC)
1 x SM with 2 h-bolters and 2 rocket launchers (addon Apothecary)
1 x Terminator with chainguns upgrade (addon Apothecary)

Squad 2:
1 x SM with 3 h-bolters and 1 rocket launcher (addon Librarian)
1 x SM with 2 h-bolters and 2 rocket launchers (addon Apothecary)
1 x Terminator with chainguns upgrade (addon Apothecary)

Fire Support Squad:
2 x Whirlwinds

Assault Squad (against troops/vehicles):
4 x Dreadnoughts with Chainguns
1 x Dreaadnought with Lascannon

Base Assault Squad (against buildings):
2 x Predators with full lascannon upgrades

[D2F]

Well, i got a more important question:

Did the LR damage get put on par with the predator annihilator by now, or does it still do only about a third of the pred's damage?

That is the one thing i REALLY want to know...

D2F

[CenturionCajun]

Well, I think the primary use for the Land Raider is as a transport for Terminators. You combine I fully teched out Terminator or Assault Terminator Squad with a Land Raider and you'll be putting a hurting on the enemy real fast. If you just want a standard battle tank the Predator is probably the superior choice as it can be customized to the occasion.

[Mossa]

Uses LR’s to transport assault termis

:D :beer: :D

Originally Posted by D2F
Victorious warriors win first and then go to war, while defeated warriors go to war first and then seek to win.
- Sun Tzu
:D :beer: :D

[Dagg]

what about soul skill? it makes them hard as...well..some hard armored unit thats is umm hard to kill..

drive into the enemy units , use the skill and take the punishment while your troops are doing the damage , if the enemy used atack move command hes screwed , if he focused on LR that buys you some time , if he ignored him , well LR still can do some funky damage and since hes in the middle of the fray he can target the most important units.

pack in some workers and use them after the fight to repair all damaged mech units , its a great way to keep the workers safe and your army kickin'

[Crasster]

Running a landraider up to a group of Dark Reapers and dropping a full squad of assualt termies is what makes the land raider worth using.

[Iurius]

Still a Land Raider is an awfully impressive sight.
Could be better in firepower, predators are usually more worth the investment. It is a lot of work to get it available anyway.
A LR Crusader would be interesting......

[[Loki]]

so far i've found that my LR willlast as long as my preds.. and the LR is very good at taking out uber units and deamons (like the avatar).. i never really checked out the stats, but they sure don't suck.

there's even a replay in the battle archives .. a 3 vs 3.. and with simply 2 landraiders he managed to hold of all 3 opponents for a good + mins when he had nobz suqads, eldar (the whole Sc, Fs and the rest), etc... so they do stand their ground.. plus their transport ability is great as well.. and can't always be dropping ur squads behind the lines.. cause once they are dropped.. then what? run them back to your base? lol..

-Loki

[Gerog]

Yeah, In the TT game Lascannons owned the Avatar..
Havent got the full game yet, but if thats anything to judge by, Landraider > Avatar
The game is in the post as i speak, damn australian postal system.. the UK pwns you

[Fritz]

And you can have 4 Land Raiders and only one Avatar or Bloodthirster :)

[MadJackMcJack]

Having been on the recieving end of a Land Raider firing on my Boyz from behind the lines, I can honestly say that they can tear holes in your squads and vehicles something awful. In fact, if it wasn't for my Marine ally dropping a Dread behind it, it would've torn up my Kanz before they cleared a path to it.

[Iurius]

']
and can't always be dropping ur squads behind the lines.. cause once they are dropped.. then what? run them back to your base? lol..
-Loki

Start walking boys...hehe

[Spacedragon1234]

NB: Dreadnaugnt 'chaingun' is not the same as the Land Raider one. LR has twin heavy bolt guns; Dreadnaught has single assault cannon. I dont understand the armour penetration stats in the game data files but the twin HB looks better. Mind you I still think the LR is not that good even with machine spirit

[FatFish]

From what -I- have seen by actually playing around with the Land Raiders and the Predators is this: Predators do more damage against buildings and vehicles, Land Raiders can take more damage with the Machine Spirit. My Two Land Raiders took out more enemy infantry than my Two Predators did. Plus the Land Raiders lived in the end result.

HOWEVER

Don't really listen to me, I haven't played much against real players... And as I've seen all across the gaming community, it's your standing on the forums/ladders that count, not the testing. (Seriously. People who use the tactics know more than people who test specific aspects)

[Sanguinius_nz]

LR's are just tougher, during the beta I ended up pitching 2 fire prisms vs 1 land raider, had I not jumped them out the LR would have hammered them both into the floor without losing even half its HPs a predator would have been dead.

[D2F]

I said it during beta and my opinon hasn't changed.

The damage of the Landraider should be brought up on par with a full upgraded Predator Annihilator.

$ Lascannons are 4 Lascannons. Period. Also, the insane requirements of the Landraider Do warrant that amount of firepower.

Now you may say "But you can have 4 Landraiders rather than just one"

True, But i can Also have an Avatar and 10 Fire Prisms. Guess who's gonna win?

D2F

[Fallout]

Does upgrading a predator to all lascannons reduce it's efficiency against infantry? Is it a dramatic change or not? Also, are lascannons more effective against heavy infantry than the standard weapons?

[FatFish]

From what I have seen so far, I must agree that the land raider's damage should be brought up. Not -quite- to par as the Predator, but pretty close. It takes less time and effort for a Predator with just it's turretted laser cannon to kill something than it does for a Land Raider (The cost is insane for just more armor and the Spirit).

Upgrading a Predator to full Las Cannon status doesn't seem to hurt it's efficiency against infantry by much. One and a half salvos of las cannon takes out just about anything I've messed with so far. I usually have a fully upgraded pred, and one with just the turrets upgraded during midgame. Late game it's all las cannons for base destruction.

This little smilie is so freakin' sweet. ----> :Slap:

[Penitent]

The land raider has its virtues, I would take the dreadnought and pred over it though anyday.

What weapons the dread has aren't important, it can fight in close combat! Winner!

And the dread with lascannons is more powerful than a land raider anyway.

The land raider is good for taking horrendous amounts of fire away from the rest of your army though, especially with machine spirit. But personally I just ignore the thing until everything else is dead, then concentrate all my fire on it.

[PHoenix_UK]

Dreadnaughts assault cannot is effective against vehicles and infantry in TT, whereas the twin linked HB's on the Landraider are really anti-infantry weapons. In TT this made the land raider rather a mixed bag, and it seems to have carried over into DOW a little. Yes its effective against vehicles, and at the same time the HB's let it dish out a fair wack of damage against infantry... it really is a multi-role transport... and thats the important word. At the end of the day, guns or not, it is a TRANSPORT. If you do not take this part of the land-raiders capabilities into account you are not making the most efficient use of the vehicle.

Sticking a land-raider in the middle of your battle line is a great way of anchoring your assault. Its HP, and its variety of weapons make it a hard vehicle to counter, as it can deal with armour and infantry simaultaneously. With a little support to counter the inevitable focus fire, they really do smoke.

I've also found them to be a marvellous delaying tactic vs uber units... they just sit their with machine spirit active, taking the punishment while your infantry and other vehicles deal with the avatar/squiggoths backup... ok you will probably lose the LR to the uber, but by the time its gone, you should have chewed a good hole in the enemy, certainly enough to finish of the uber with your force.

What i would like to see implemented is some form of tank shock... when a land-raider drives through an ork mob, i want to see SQUISHING HAPPENING!

[Starfire]

After testing out the land-raider in a couple more skirmishes, I must say that they have great hit-points but sucky weaponry. They don't have anywhere near the building-killing capability of a Predator, nor the infantry-killing power of a Dreadnought. I gugess what Phoenix says is true. They are ultimately a heavy troop transport, an "uber-Rhino" in a way, but most certainly not a heavy tank.

[CenturionCajun]

I use em like they are meant to from the fluff. Load em up with Terminators and drive them into the middle of the enemy formation. Then you dump the Terminators and both of them proceed to eviscerate the enemy. Tis beautiful if done right. :D

[GRIMGORGRIMGOR]

but most certainly not a heavy tank.

I would call it a heavy tank 2 twin linked lasscannons with a twin linked heavy bolters F*** this I am going home

What about when it 2 on 1 build 4 tank shops and when you reach the 20 tanks cap build 1 landraider in each send in your army to die and then you have got 1 new army

landraider are faster to build and are cheaper then a pred and a dread and no upgrades so there ready to battle

[D2F]

I would call it a heavy tank 2 twin linked lasscannons with a twin linked heavy bolters F*** this I am going home

What about when it 2 on 1 build 4 tank shops and when you reach the 20 tanks cap build 1 landraider in each send in your army to die and then you have got 1 new army

landraider are faster to build and are cheaper then a pred and a dread and no upgrades so there ready to battle
There is just one problem here:

Those 2 Twin linked lascannons don't do the damage of Two twin linked lascannons (actually they do about the damage of ONE Twin linked lascannon).

That is what they ned to change and i am happy.

The Land raider is not only a Tank, but a relic unit as well.

It needs to be comparable to other relic units. But if one of your regular Tanks has double the firepower already and almost comparable health values, then somethings gotta be wrong.

And just to mention it:

Squiggoth is a Vehicle as well, does about 5-7 times theamount of damage a Land Raider does AND can transport troops as well.

So, why not up the damage of the landraider? It would certainly not unbalance them any way.

D2F

[GRIMGORGRIMGOR]

Those 2 Twin linked lascannons don't do the damage of Two twin linked lascannons (actually they do about the damage of ONE Twin linked lascannon).

That is what they ned to change and i am happy.

:werd: well they would put it in a patch soon I hope :beer:

also it can trasport troops a rihno cost 2 so it just a pred and a rihno

[verbel]

everybody else only has 1 relic unit though so mabye this is their way of making up for the space marines having 2. This is just a guess though.