What is the actual amount of SM personel they can carry?
Printable View
What is the actual amount of SM personel they can carry?
10 marines or 5 terminators or 1 dread
Sounds easy enough:
By the mods fury this thread will know the Emperor's Lock!
Actually in IA:2 the number of SM available to drop pod is 5
Why's that? Seem's like a resonable question for both fluff and tt discussion.Quote:
By the mods fury this thread will know the Emperor's Lock!
Edit: My apoligies I thought you meant it should be locked for it being a rules question... Just realised you meant that the question was answered and doesn't need to continue.
Allow me to explain something. Legit questions, though they may not have many responses, do not get locked. If this were a "Who would in in x vs y" It would be locked, and such.
Ok since we're on the topic of drop pods here I may aswell ask a question...
Drop pods seem extremely vulnerable to enemy fire on their way in, considerring their payload would be deemed as valuable are they particularly well armoured (both to take the impact and weapon fire)? Or are the drop pods only deployed in an area after it's been hit by artillery/or it's anti-air weapons have been taken out by some other means?
Aren't there several types of drop pods? not just one generic one?
There used to be 'powered' drop pods called thunderbolts or something like that were like small craft that plummeted extremely quickly to earth but were piloted. Presumably such devices are used by SMs in particular because they can take the additional Gs (I would have thought!). Kind of like Thunderhawk Gunships without the guns or wings but capable of carrying similar numbers of troops.
Drop pods are deployed at extreme speed. They don't simply float down to the planet. They are fired in the same manner as a bullet is fired from a gun. They move at speeds too great to be intercepted effectively by anti aircraft defences.
Unlikely. There will be defensive batteries that can target drop-pods. Maybe not everywhere, but they will exist, especially where the enemy in question has faced drop-pods before. They won't get them all, but they will at least make the ride a bit bumpy.Quote:
They move at speeds too great to be intercepted effectively by anti aircraft defences
Plus, the drop-pods have to slow down a bit before they hit the ground, surely. Marines aren't tough enough to survive a sudden impact at several hundred miles an hour, even with airbags.
Sholto
This is a bit off topic, but sorta still on the idea of drop pods, do the chaos legions use thunderhawks as much as the loyalists do? Or do they just use dreadclaws, though theyre for a different purpose. I know they can use thunderhawks in BF Gothic, but on a 40K scale would it be fluffy to see on on the tabletop?
Straight from Codex Space Marines. They come down at tremendous speed and only slow down when their altitude is so low that anti-air isn't effective anymore. It isn't the most pleasant way to travel but Space Marines don't have a habit of complaining:pQuote:
Drop pod are capsules which are literally "fired" at the battlezone and arrive so quickly that it is impossible for enemy flak weapons to stop them.
Of course, occassionally one will get shot down but the for most of the time it's a fairly safe way of deployment.
Also drop pods are usually preceded by several deathwind drop pods, which are drop-pod sentry guns/missiles that neutralize the area they impact prior to the much more valuable marines hitting the dirt.
Not to mention, seeing as drop pods are AV12 on all sides, this means that most things short of a direct las-cannon hit are going to have a bit of a trouble dammaging a drop-pod and its contents, and las cannons aren't exactly known as good anti-aircraft weapons.
Although I vaguely recall this having been answered quite some time back in this forum, I believe that this question fits with this renewed thread on drop pods. Ahem... Are drop pods considered expendable, or do the chapters eventually come down after a battle (if possible) and recover the drop pods for later use?
Since most tech is valued by the Imperium as priceless, I am guessing they will salvage any drop pods possible if the circumstances allow it (the place is secured and they actually have time to bother with it.)
What CAN kill a droppod? I'd assume Skyrays would do a fairly passable job with their hunter seeker drones.
do drop pods have seatbelts?
Harsh words from someone who can't even spell "Emperor" right in their sig.
On topic though, isn't the Ultramarine assault drop on Nimbosa described in that short story on the GW site an attack to knock out an AA sight to reduce casualties for the rest of the drop? Of course it's against the Tau, who probably have the best tracking and targetting systems for shooting down drop pods, but it would suggest that drop pods CAN be taken down, given the opportunity. Although some armies(I'm looking at you, Khorne followers!) probably wouldn't WANT to shoot them down- less skulls to take and blood to spill that way.
if drop pods dont have seatbelts for normal SMs what happens to them then? do they shake violently and their faces distorted while the pods being launched? do they "jump" up forcefully and hit the roof of the pod when it hits the ground?
Drop pods don't have seatbelts because seatbelts simply wouldn't be strong enough to hold power armor in place.
As for the Ultramarine drop on Nimbosa, you should keep in mind that the Tau are one of the armies capable of making "spray and pray" a viable AA system against most incursions. Drop pods may be heavily armored, but a lucky hit can still take one out of commission. Since the Ultramarines don't like to leave things up to chance, they'll try and remove as many factors as possible from the battlefield.
Right I tried to answer this before but nobody seems bothered so I will do it in depth:
The standard Lucius pattern drop pod is a 5 man, five petal drop pod used by almost every chapter, this is supported by dreadnought and limited 10 man variants.
There is no Terminator variant as they use teleportation or thunderhawk. - fresh from Imperial Armour 2 the bible of SM tech.
Drop pods are extremely small and fast, making them hard to track with AA and almost impossible to intercept with aircraft - they are a one way express to the planet, being recovered after the battle.
The reason drop pods were deployed on Nimbosa was to secure the AA sites, much like the Taros drop by the Raptors, so that other drop elements (Thunderhawks are a drop vehicle- think drop as in terms of assault from orbit) could deploy. The main problem with drop pods is they can't carry anything bigger than a Dread, meaning you have to secure an LZ to be reinforced or even extracted.
They don't have seatbelts although they appear to have a restraining bar on the models - much like a rollercoaster ride.
Hope this answers the questions
Touristo the marines were ordered to destroy the AA batterie so that the thunderhawk could be deployed safely:"Thunderhawk gunships were en route with yet more warriors, and the Tau anti-aircraft guns had proven uncannily adept at shooting down Imperial aircraft."So i guess that drop pods are extremely hard to hit...
what happens to a normal person riding a drop pod?
Normal people don't - you would most likely die from the Gs. The IG never drop assault so we just don't know.
IG do sometimes drop assault (grav chutes) as far as I remember.
Unless you mean it as in "they don't use drop pods".
That was what I meant Xan, they don't do any rapid assault from orbit in small drop pods, only in very big ships that stick out like a sore thumb.
I'm going to suppose that the most effective form of anti-droppod weaponry would be fast firing Hurricane Bolters or some larger calibre equivalent. Simple flak weaponry would be ineffective (using the real-world definition of flak) as such weapons are by their nature slow to fire.
I would surmise that the most effective localised deterrent would be twin-linked assault cannon in an AA mount, however the short range would be problematic. Most effective AA weapon against fast moving targets is probably a Manticore SAM / Skyray / Hyperios or Hydra/Firestorm spraying an area with autocannon burst. The SAMs are sufficiently fast to intercept a drop pod while the cannon fire of hydras is sufficient to engage the area of the drop pod, probably having a good chance of hitting as the pod falls through your beaten zone.
However the best solution to drop pods is to have preset DFs on likely drop sites and then have stand-by artillery ready to DF the position / + or - that position. This could hit the SM as the doors open on the pod and cause mayhem.
Wouldn't a laser be even more effective against fast targets? Like, a beam travelling the speed of light?
I would think a Hunter Killer missile would down fast moving targets quite fast.
Yes, but the Imperium doesn't have weapons like that. The Lasgun comes close, but it doesn't fire like we expect a laser to. It's actually a plasma-like bolt and not concentrated light. Some true lasers do exist in the imperium, but their not readily available to the forces of Chaos or Ork agressors. Eldar? Who can say?Quote:
Wouldn't a laser be even more effective against fast targets? Like, a beam travelling the speed of light?
A missle would definately not be capable of intercepting such a target. Not only do you have to get a lock on the target you are hoping to destroy, but you must be able to catch it. Missiles are fast, but they aren't going to catch a drop pod.Quote:
I would think a Hunter Killer missile would down fast moving targets quite fast.
If they were fired from the ground they would overshoot the Pod (assuming you could ever get a lock on it) then have to turn around and follow it again. Assuming it managed to keep targeted on the drop pod after it overshot.
fire a bunch of AA rockets and guns at the pod will be the best choice, the tau might use their rail weapon since they are really fast. Or the easiest one will be destroy the drop pod once it hit the ground, kill the marines that are still on it!
Since most forces (sans the Orks of course) use a hefty amount of psychic troops, wouldn't it be a safe bet to think that some Chaos forces or Eldar teams use telekinetic ability to cause drop pods to crash? I would imagine this would be a boon for the Thousand Sons.
if the psyker has enough time to concentrate, its possible.
Ahh, my apologies...knew I should have re-read that story before posting about it. Psychic powers though, hmm. My impression has been that typically neither Chaos nor Eldar pyskers focus on telekinetic powers, Eldar being more interested in directing their own troops and/or attacking the minds of their enemies than influencing inanimate physical objects(wraithbone aside). Chaos I suppose would depend on the individual psyker, so perhaps some might be able to force drop pods into crashing. However I'd bet it would take a lot of effort, and even if you succeed, well congrats you just took out a whole 5 marines, and while you're recovering from that exertion there's 10 more marines who just landed nearby and boy are they angry!Quote:
Touristo the marines were ordered to destroy the AA batterie so that the thunderhawk could be deployed safely:"Thunderhawk gunships were en route with yet more warriors, and the Tau anti-aircraft guns had proven uncannily adept at shooting down Imperial aircraft."So i guess that drop pods are extremely hard to hit...
Cause a small warp storm to stop a group of drop pods seems to be a good idea!
Problem with las-cannons and other heavy weapons shooting down drop pods is time to bring the weapon on target, target tracking, range, and rate of fire. Chances are, your going to miss on the 1st shot, and unless you want to have a light show effect going on for a drop pod, your porpably not going to hit 'em. Not to mention, it travels bloody fast, and propably is sending out enough ECM to scramble the sensors on the other side of the planet to boot.
AA weapons would need to be directly under the pod. OTherwise u will miss 99% of the time.
Instead of focusing on shooting them mid-flight, I'd just computate their trajectory to predict the LZ (not -that- hard to do) and order artillery strikes to the region. Sure, it's not going to kill everyone.. but even marines will face nasty losses and will be less mobile with round after round of heavy fire hitting 'em.
Little note: keep in mind that the Drop Pods most likely are supported by orbital bombardment or at least some sort of aerial attack. While the enemy concentrates on shooting down aircraft/takes cover from big bombs falling from the sky the Pods come down. Before the enemy even has time to respond they've already landed.
Hence why the best reposte is to DF the area
Well, I'm guessing this is under best conditions (i.e. Drop pod, anti-drop pod thingy and nothing else) are used for these "experiments".
What makes you say that? The lasgun as described in fluff is pretty consistent with how a megajoule-range laser pulse should behave. At those power levels, you'll get electrical breakdown of air (causing the beam effect as well as the crack-sound), and the description of wounds caused by lasgun fire is consistent with explosive vaporization.Quote:
Originally Posted by solidzaku
Well the thing is, the Drop Pod has to break very, very hard before it hits the ground so that the impact does not kill the passengers. That critical few seconds there would be the ideal time to attack. I.E. you see it slowing down, blow it to hell.
Fortunetly, full-scale combat drops also include DeathWind drop pods that saturate the area with firepower. They will likely hit first, and while the enemy concentrates on killing the targets shooting at them, the Marine pods should land safely and disgorge their precious cargo.
However, a savvy commander with nerves of steel would order his troops to ingore the Deathwind pods and focus on the pods that are about to land... luckily for the Space Marines, there are a fortunate lack of troops that have survived a drop pod assault to learn that lesson.
In any case, 40k Universe =/= Tabletop rules.
Drop pods drop at high speeds, but this is negated by air friction which will limit the maximum velocity a projectile can assume. A freefall object will hit terminal velocity at some point, and while you can argue for sustained acceleration, it's going to be a waste of energy and you still need enough fuel to brake or your drop pod blows up. I believe an Apollo capsule took...three minutes to effect re-entry?
Should a Space Marine force attempt to use drop pods it is possible one could attempt to use nuclear SAMs to destroy them in transit. The Soviets made designs for nuclear tipped SAMs to destroy American strategic bombers. The consequence is EMP...a double edged sword, or a hindrance if the Marines are EMP shielded.
Nextly is combat studies relating to airdrop over defended sites. Most everything on a AA mount has a maximum elevation, and Army studies (can't remember the date) indicated that the best way to minimize losses was to drop as close as possible to the air defense site rather than a few miles away, which is basically getting shot up in a gallery. The problem is if said site is well-defended, but with the Space Marines this is not a problem.
The use of Deathwinds would help in this case. One problem is that landing Deathwinds means your drop can only deploy /after/ the Deathwinds finish up. It'd be suicide to deploy in the middle of your own Deathwind deployment, and your enemy would die laughing their asses off.
Collector you miss the point of Deathwinds, they deploy a few seconds before the 'real' drop pods impact, you don't have to wait until it stops firing to launch the marines, they generally fire a deathwind then a couple of seconds later launch the main drop pod force.
Deathwinds unleash everything in a couple of seconds and so when the main force arrives the Deathwinds are already silent and anything capable of assaulting the drop force within range is removed.
about the psyker powers, the Eldar generally don't hold a planet. They use craftworlds, and when they do go planet-side, they generally are the "attackers" or are going after their own intentions, using the war as a cover so they're not spotted.
I may be wrong, so correct me if the Eldar hold//held a planet against an invasion recently.
If you have functional radar you should be able to re-lay your guns and shell the living hell out of a Deathwind site. You could probably identify a Space Marine drop zone by tracking the "waves" of drop pods. There's little point to pulsing Deathwind waves, more likely is a huge first wave followed by a second wave of drop pods. You could track this pattern, attempt to predict Space Marine drop sites and annihilate them before landing.
A dispersed enemy force would be little effected by Deathwinds. Basic field entrenchment should enable enough troops to survive, or alternatively they could displace behind cover and move up again once the shooting stopped. The other alternative is field entrenchments that are "good enough" to withstand a Deathwind assault, which is unlikely.
From what Ia Drang appeared to indicate from air assaults, LZs do not have to be held and fortified by a defending force if they are close enough and can deploy before the landing force can consolidate.
Ia Drang was different to drop pods - the helicopter is not a one way instrument of insertion but I can see where you are going.
The point is the enemy is not defending the SM LZ until the SM drop on it, by which time you are fighting for your life!
Deathwinds drop at extreme speed and so the chances of everyone running into cover instead of being shot to pieces are minimal, meanwhile the drop pods with marines impact and they have a nice 'cleared' exit down the ramps until whats left of the enemy pops-up.
The idea of a deathwind and any drop pod is surprise, speed and shock value.