HW2 Models...

[Gearz]

errr.... Just as a temp thing ( my provider is on my case already) the Tai Frigates are here.

TaiFrigates zip 1.6 meg

Have fun.

[Sajuur]

i just got throgh making the crate (i no kinda dumb) and i couldn't believe how much harder these things r to actully make than what they look like. when i was first looking through this thread i thought i would be able to do a bunch tonight, but after just the crate i noticed these r not easy. while they look sweet, gonna take a good amount of time to make. great work getting all the stuff by the way. they look good flat, so can't wait for em to be 3d

[Montial]

Thanks Gearz. (that was quick....gotta love that dsl...)

[F'Lar]

i was just looking in the forums and i noticed that this thread has the most posts and the most views in this forum. damn, im proud of us

[Montial]

almost 10000 views...I wonder how many people are making 9or have made) some of these models.

[Norsehound]

Hello.

I've been in this thread with interest for the last week or so and first of all I'd like to say you guys are doing a nice job finally getting HW models out and into the 'real world'.

I've managed to assemble the 'test swarmer' posted a while back and it looks good, and I went as far as assembling Gearz's Taiid Frigs while they were still black and white. NEver got the ion part done though, and only finished one of the assault cannon parts. I managed to get it assembled correctly after a week of trying to figure out the parts. It works though :P

And now I'm waiting for Ent-E's Taiid HC. I have the carrier but I don't have much motivation to build the thing...I'd rather make the concept carrier

Lastly, if anyone's interested; I don't have any card paper. All my models were put together with normal paper and tape! Just goes to show that some of us will go to any lengths to have these models

Now if only I can assemble some table-top sized ones correctly and then I can make myself a HW board sim game.

Keep up the good work.

>Ceade

[Enterprise-E]

Im setting up a site for collecting and hosting all available paper models.

If any of you have pictures of folded models, please send them to me, i only have pics of my own models, Moebius' Kushan carrier, and Gearz' Research Station. No prob if several modelers send me pics about the same ship, then i'll make a "gallery" to that ship.

Site may be up with first models in max. 1-2 days, possibly today.

Ceade: the problem with my Taiidan concept carrier is, as with many other models, that i don't have Assembly instructions for it. I'll probably post the carrier on my site, but you have to figure it out how to fold. Later i may try to make AI's, like Gearz.

[Gearz]

Paper and Tape! That's pretty impressive Ceade, though using card was hard enough!. The table top idea is interesting to...mmm..guess everyone's worked out these little suckers aren't easy to make. For simple geometry, I'm kinda concerned when complex HW2 geo comes along.

Sorry.. the Tai Frigates are history. I've replaced them with the Junkyard Dawg, did a few last minute changes to the bitmaps. If you find any tabs missing, part numbers screwed up etc let me know.
Junkyard Dawg zip 2.2 meg
? don't ask me why its bigger than the Frigates file......

Have fun.

Enterprise-E interesting site idea! hosting is a real problem for me. I have to clear some stuff off the bench, after that I'm willing to give anyone help with their AI's if they'd like. It'll be a slow process but we can work something out. (That's If my AI's are clear enough, its a LOT of extra work! is anyone making them? )

[Enterprise-E]

The Paper Starships site is up!!

Gearz: I have your Taii Frigates already, so i can put them up any time. Can you submit me the pictures of them?
I got your Junkyard Dawg too. The Archive is corrupted. I was able to rebuild the archive, so all files work, except the reference.jpg! You probaly can post it to me separately.

It would be nice, when you help me making graphical AI's, or at least tell me how you make them (PM me if you want)

To everyone: send me all your ships, and pics of assembled ships, LET OUR ARMADA GROW

[Norsehound]

Ent-E: I will almost go to any lengths to make these models correctly. I stared at Gearz's cut-out paper parts for maybe half a week before I started to try to match them up and put them together. Consiquently, the conning tower of the Asault frigate was done first. The only reason why I don't have a complete color and textured model of the Assault frig is because I'm afraid I'd blow too much ink away. That, and I only print on regular sized paper

I thought about the tabletop idea last night and then it hit me: Why not print out Geometry figures for the low-res models? Y'know, when you zoom out the ships become VERY block counterparts of themselves....

Tor a tabletop game fighters don't really matter as counters with groups of five fighters each could represent them. Bigger ships have the restriction of having to be small, yet big enough to be recognizable.

So maybe if someone can somehow extract the 'low-res' block models and print them I can try to assemble them and maybe start thinking about making rules (Or an entirely other thread) Devoted to tabletop gaming for HW.

Once again you guys are doing great. Now, i need to get at those other models (Taiid HC...mmmm....)

>Ceade

Edit: HW2 models? Yikes, and I thought part assembly was bad enough on the Taiid FFs! Still, some simple stuff like the destroyer's main hull shouldn't be bad enough, but it's the turrets that's the real nightmare.

[Koloth]

WOW!
Enterprise-E, thanks for putting up that site. It should be a great resource for all people interested in homeworld card modeling.

On the topic of using lower LODs for the smaller vessels, it does work, but the problem then really in't the geometry, it's the textures. At anything lower than the the highest detail level has unacceptable blockinessin it's textures.

I'm also worried about HW2 models. Their polygon count is probably in the several thousand for each ship. I don't know about you, but I don't like the prospect of folding that many polygons. I have been looking into polygon decimation algorithms, but none of them are quite suited for our task. I will keep working.

[W0ps]

Can't believe nobody's done the banana yet
however I have...
files are huge... 300 dpi a4, though printing on a3 would be better...
anyway, previews:


and the file:Banana

everyone, enjoy! ( and add it to your cardboard sites if you're happy with it (but do tell me I'd like to know) )


BTW, has anyone managed to set the colors in the textures?

[Amglco]

Originally posted by Mobius
to Gearz: No, I used some program called Lif2Psd (aka HWToolz), which converts them to layered photoshop format...then all I have to do is change the hue of the layers and save them as bmp. (Actually that's still pretty complicated.)

Thanx to Mobius, I learned of HWToolz. With *.psd files created by Lif2Psd, you can edit the 2 colors. When opened, you see three layers, one is the texture, the other 2 are for color. Just change the their color. But don't just draw in those layers, because they have transparent areas. So some form of change hue or something will do.

[W0ps]

thanks
I'm sorry my banana is so grey, but it was a lot of work with photoshop and tenkai, so I'm not going to upgrade it... at least not now...
But very nice, yes


BTW, I still haven't seen photo's of finished models...

[Enterprise-E]

Thanks for the Banana, i'll put it up.
All folks send me models, i will make our armada huge...

BTW, I still haven't seen photo's of finished models...

You can see photo's of assembled models on my site. I put up pictures whenever possible.
If you've made a model which has already a picture, send a pic of your version to me, and i'll put it up too, make a gallery to the models.

[Amglco]

Enterprise-E

Is the website you have up usually this slow? I can't get any of the images to load, nor can I download any of the files. I don't presume to know anything about webpages and their hosts, but may I make a suggestion. Try www.freewebs.com they offer lots of space. I havn't heard anything specific about them, but a few people don't like it. Also, if you wan't your own domain name for free, I think www.dot.tk will work. I don't know any of this for sure, but I hope it helps... Unless of course your website is perfectly fine and its just me.

[Montial]

Enterprise-E, I gave up trying, the site was very slow. Is it just being overused right now? Anyways if you want a fuzzy pic of the pride of my paper fleet so far, a taiidan assault frigate, made with normal paper and glue that stuck my fingers together many times, gimmie a yell.

[Norsehound]

The Bananna! I'm surprised nobody thought of that either...that's probably one of the most simple models to make (Next to the mines, the missiles, the drones, and the crate). And *WInces* Maybe good scale for a Mothership in Table top gaming...(The posted image one)

Then again it may be too small to be in-scale with other ships. I was thinking of simple models that would make the Taiid DD or FF (Destroyer and Frigate respectively) An inch long.

Koloth: My concern is a ship small enough to be recognizeable on a table top. While it may be asthetically pleasing to play with ships the scale of Gearz's Frigs, this would mean that a moderate size playing feild would be the size of a football feild and would take hours to cross the map. If somoene can just get me a test image of one of these LOD low-polygon count models (A capital ship...Taiid dest/frig maybe?) for me to print out I can see if I can assemble it and judge weather it's okay to use in a tabletop game.

Anyone interested in making a tabletop minitures game for HW? I've been tossing around some rule ideas in my head of how one can be made...but is there any interest for a HW minatures game?

Well, great job on the Bannana w0ps.

>Ceade

[EH_AceTFL]

Hmm there is one problem with making fleets - you cant resize model (unfolded models are random size) :/

[Norsehound]

Yeah but YOU try re-sizing and assembling Gearz's Assault frigates. I gave up on the smaller models posted earlier in this thread because THEY WERE INCREIDBLY SMALL! One thing about making SMALL parts is that the tabs are incredibly TINY! WHile the scale for those ships would work for tabletop gaming and good novelty ship-in-the-bottle size, their parts are a nightmare to assemble. I couldn't even complete one of the Taiid HC cruisers.

And shrinking is another matter. I would have to be EXTREAMLY carefull about re-sizing the models already posted because EVERY SINGLE PEICE has to be in scale with the others, or it's no go!

Nice idea ace, but it's simply not possible with the tech I got. As it is, I have no webspace, no webcamera, and not even any tag paper! And if I can't make small, inexpensive paper modles anyone else wanting to make a fleet for a tabletop game can't either.

>Ceade

P.s. Ent-E, are you going to post the Taiid HC? If there's one ship I want more than the others it's the T-CA (Next is the Taiid DD)

[Montial]

If you want to borrow my shrink ray, PM me. Otherwise i think the only way to go for an assault frigate an inch long would be to use a lower LOD. And even then i think it would have to be at least three inches to be manageble (the current model is about 5").

[Enterprise-E]

about the site: it's working for me fast and fine. If it's slow for you, that might be a temporary status only, try again later.

Taiidan HC, Taiidan concept carrier: some of you wanted these models, but i still have some problems: I have no kind of assembly sequence for the concept carrier, and that model is the hardest from all my models. It's far more detailed than a regular HW model. I can post it on the site, but nobody can then assemble it. The HC: i've made the model you see on the picture directly printed out of Pepakura. But the image i saved from it is too small, too pixelated. I will make a new model of it, which is larger, be patient.

PS: i want any picture of assembled models, and any new models if you have. The banana has 1 problem: it has toooo many fold lines. W0ps: could you make a refitted version?

[W0ps]

today I'm gonna print it in a printshop on A3, if I fail to make it I will refit it... However, I'd be interested in tabletop gaming, although there is one big problem, I believe nobody lives in the same city who does the HW:Tabletop game... (I live in The Hague, Netherlands)

oh and about the scale, in tenkai you can easily set the scale..
for my banana I used 0.0062 and then enlarged it by 2,5 in photoshop, and printed it in 300 dpi.(though on a3 it will be less)
But indeed, when I exported an ion frig the same scale, it got way too small... People, I think we need to make the mothership even bigger. And the only way to that with the limited resolution of tenkai, would be dividing the MS into seperate pieces in another 3d program such as 3dsmax. As soon as my new computer has arrived I'll try to make a mothership around 60 cm's long... (then the foldout model would be on like 5 pages heh )

[Enterprise-E]

ok, i'll put up the Banana, and i'll replace it with the refitted version, when you're done with it. Send me a pic of the assembled ship!!:-)

[W0ps]

oh and another thing, with a 60 cm long MS it will be quite neccesary to make some kind of wood or wire skeleton for it, also to make a standard for it.

come to think of it, every ship should have a standard... now I think a standard would consist of a small platform for the ship to lie on, and some sort of height adjustable pin so HW:TT would also be 3d!!

[Enterprise-E]

HW:TT what about mounting little fusion engines onto the height adjustable ships? then it would be 3D + ships would fly across the game area.
And what about mounting ion cannons on them? so they would be able to physically destroy the opponent ship. And last but not least, dont forget to build hyperdrives onto the paper models:-)))

[W0ps]

No I wouldn't like ion cannons, I mean, one ship is a lot of work, built times in HW:TT are substantially larger than build times in HW... And a hyperdrive would be fun, only it'd be a long walk to get your ship back... But a paper model could off course never be stable enough for this, so we better start researching on a more decent way to do a capital ship chassis... damn need a research ship first!

or, instead of standards, just stick a pin through your ship, then make a large grid above your playingfield where you can hang your ships onto! and you take more rope when they go lower, and you use like a rope with hooks on em every inch...

btw, I started my Banana and I've done the engines and the fighter hangar. It takes a lot of time, but it's quite simple since I printed it on a3 and it looks good!!!
But I don't have a digicam right now so no picture now.

[Gearz]

Re the table top idea, I tried reverse engineering the lod0 textures to fit the lod3 geometry and gave it away as a bad joke. BUT you can overcome the low detail tex problem, while fiddling with metasequoia I loaded a correctly textured .cob frigate then [insert]ed its lod3 geometry .cob file. META assigns the material names mat1 mat2 etc to any geo imported after the first set. So you end up with original PLUS a lod3 geometry with some of the lod0 textures assigned to it. = Clear as mud?
by [select] ~ [belt] in meta you can re assign any material to any face, so with a bit of fiddling the right/better lod0 tex can assigned even to the reduced poly count.

The short answer, improving the texture detail on a lod3 model is doable......it will need a dedicated fan to follow through with this one.. Because of the required small size its going to be reeeallly time consuming, even the lod3/lod4 geo needs modification to make a ?? 1 inch model. Guess it all depends on how simplified you want the thing to be. Disappointing but I'd have to say just a flat coloured silhouette of the respective ship would be a lot easier. Size and ease, one area where 3D card really falls down. Killer idea though. Keep working on it.

Carved blanks and casting them would make one hell of nice set. ...maybe cast/carve them, print the tex and glue them to the pieces...? Saw a company on the net that could reproduce just about any shape in resin, just had to supply them with a ? dxf / geometry file...easy way the get all the pieces in one hit. Anyone got more info or a link on that $?.

[Norsehound]

*Shrugs* Whatever.

I'm starting to cook up some HWTT rules about now, and I'll probably need to start a whole other thread to discuss it; after all this thread is dedicated to paper models...

But I don't think HWTT should be 3-d despite HW being the 'definative 3-D strategy game'. HWTT is a good alternative to Moding the game itself and trying to make new maps, and plus you can do some interesting stuff in board games that aren't possible in the game (I.e. special terrain rules that would take months to render in the PC). The best way around the 3-D aspect of tabletoping was assuming that ships NEVER collide unless it's intentional, and even then unintentional collisions in homeworld don't happen that often.

Another idea of the HWTT I was planning for was a bigger focus on the ships and managing them instead of making a gigantic Armada.

Cast/carve...well I don't have any materials to do that so I can't be of any help. Sorry

And I don't have a webcamera to take pics of my completed models, either. Sorry...

>Ceade

[tri]

enterprise E,
junkjard dawg seem to be corupt.
anybady else have this problem?

[F'Lar]

ya

[Enterprise-E]

i have recompressed the Junkyard Dawg for my site, it should be correct...

[W0ps]

this was my idea for the ship's standards:

[Norsehound]

It looks like a good way to display models....but almost impossible and expensive for gameplay.

The adavntage of a 2-d Tabletop surface is the idea that movement is easiest expressed in this form. Movement and speed charted is easy to do on a 2-d surface, especially when Hexes are involved. In a 3-d space, things get complicated. Measurement in height would have to be explained and movement calculations have to be made to determine the distance a ship can go in an x-y-z axis.

For simplicy of gameplay, I'm going to make a format based on a 2-d playing surface.

Well, enough for the gameplay. Good idea W0ps, but I don't think everyone here can make such an elaborate playing feild to simulate a quick one-hour skirmish.

>Ceade

[W0ps]

well it's less work than the ships themselves...
anyway, it could be simpler, just taping the ships to the magnets, and have em all on the same height with their center. It would look very good I guess and isn't too much work, you only need an iron surfaces and lots of magnets... I think ships on pin standards would topple very quick.. unless you'd use a cork playing field...

[ToastedLightly]

hmm... if someone could make a good sized fleet (scaled nicely), maybe we could make some plaster molds...... tin ships....

[Gearz]

Ooops ..sorry bout' that! The Dawg was corrupted at my end, its fixed now..ENT-E want to grab it again for your site..its got the reference shot and model pic.
Dawg zip 2.18 meg

[Norsehound]

W0ps; ships on pin standards?

Tabletop gaming, FYI, is sometimes played with minatures glued to bases (Some of them are hexagonal for ease of play) and then placed on the table. Height is not an issue, and you can go find Battlefleet Gothic for some example of a Tabletop space sim game (I haven't played BFG, but I have played a ship simulation game by the name of Starfleet Battles, and working on grabbing Avalon Hill's Wooden ships and Iron men).

Your method of hagning models from the cealing seems to indicate play would have to be made from looking up at your armada and sliding it across a metal playing feild to the desired area. It's Much easer and less expensive to have small LOD models printed out, assembled, and then pasted to a base and then placed on a table rather than making the elaborate hanging system. It's much easier, less costly, not as cool, but sufficient. Your way of play would be fun and do-able depending on what kind of system of play is used for HWTT.

I think I'll go start a thread based on HWTT. Anyone's free to discus it in here, as this is where possible miniatures would come from. Again thanks to everyone who's actually trying to get the LOD/smaller models out on paper to print. I can see armadas of card ships being formed for Tabletop play.

Though I wish there was soemthing more I can do...

>Ceade

[Amglco]

Here's my suggestion for this HW:TT game you guys are developing:

Use stacked boards... Like that star trek chess game.

Not sure how it was played in the show, but you can stack the boards(preferebly clear material) to represent different "heights" in the game.

[Montial]

its called 3d chess. click

[Gearz]

HWTT...mmmm experiment 237.464553525262662 / 4 I think this is about as small as you could make one practically. Its lod3 geo simplified to about lod7 with lod0 textures.. the tex still looks a bit weird and there's some missing, haven't worked out the rails/waist etc on this one yet. If anyone wants to try it, print it "as is" on a std page ~ A4 or letter. Not sure what size it will make ? = small.. Let us know if its a workable size for a HWTTG.

hwtt01 gif 91k

[EH_AceTFL]

Originally posted by Gearz
hwtt01 gif 91k

hmmmm well... this dont look so good.. only lod0 looks fine..

(try cataclysm models if Homeworld one dont works)

[Norsehound]

Gearz, if it's small I'll give it a shot.

There's a seperate thread up for HWTT if anyone's interested. I've already hammered out something that can pretend to be an alpha rules set. Retro provided some interesting info and I'll have to go back and make revisions. And I'll be snooping HWS for stats to translate to a TT game.

A 3-d chess approach to make would be a nightmare. LOS would be almost impossible unless you had clear boards, and this is not widely available to everybody. When I thought about making HWTT, I wanted it available to anybody who wanted to play. Only people with a lot of money can manage to afford a clear and easy to use 3-d system. As of now, it would be a nightmare to completely track ships on different 'altitude chart' boards. As it is, Retro suggested using a Hexagonal map because of it's ease to play. This is what I'll do.

I'll get around to assembling the Ion Frig miniature. Though as it stands now Miniatures might have to be used with seperate 'No hex map' rules, unless they can fit on a hex (!)

Well, thanks for showing interest in my little pet project, and hopefully it'll fly.

>Ceade

[Enterprise-E]

If there's demand for it, and i get some micro-ships, i can open a separate section on Paper Starships for HW:TT models...

[Norsehound]

Well Microships ARE a good idea for assembling small paper model armadas, and for those of us who don't have the ink or large paper to make them.

>Ceade

Okay, about now I've finished the tiny Ion cannon frig. The whole thing's about four inches long *Shrugs* Good enough for Tabeltop gaming I think. But a good ship-in-the-bottle model and if the textures could somehow be 'faked' into the rest of the model then it's a good tiny one.

Well I'll be unavailable for the majority of tommrow, so see you guys later.

[JAL-18]

Gearz-Check your PM's.

[Gearz]

Sorry.. trashed some stuff, try it again.

[W0ps]

was away for a few days...

I think the problem with plastic bases will be that some vertical ships such as the mothership (wich is the only vertical ship) will be way higher, so that's why I suggest sticking a pin through m and sticking that pin in a cork board... with a hex print on it...

further on, good thinking with those rules and stuff!

[Norsehound]

Thanks w0ps.

Well if the entire model is PAPER (I.e. Light) Then a moderately heavy hex base should sollve the problem, unless you want a breeze to make your Mothership spin out of control.

Now I need a Taiid CA mini and a Kush Carrier mini to have the former destroying the latter...

>Ceade

[Gearz]

Jal-18 ... PM! .....