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I chose to make the maus mostly because it was easyone, so it's good for practising with the model exporter and secondly because at least relic probably woun't be making that one. Maus also has almost a mythical component to it.
PS. But i quess it will be a hard time to find any reasonable place for it in the game.
Models: King Tiger, Maus - show me
You could implement it as a late game break-through tank,it would draw fire while you could out flank enemy positions,and as an almost indestructable anti-tank platform.
Unbiased Ears?
Where Can I Buy A Pair...?
Please NO Maus. Its the worst idea for a vehicle to ever implent into a ww2 game. ALL games in the last 2-3 years that featured the Maus sucked bad. As much as i apprecheate your efforts but i still hope the Maus is just a joke. There are several other things that will not be covered by the expansion. Think about doing the "elephant" , "Nashorn", "JagdpanzerIV" , "Wirbelwind" ,"Wespe", "Luchs" and such.
The Ferdinand/Elefant strikes me as a nice alternative to the Koenigstiger. Ferdinand Porsche was so certain he'd get the Koenigstiger contract that he began work on the prototypes. When the contract went to another manufacturer, he converted the prototypes to a heavy tankhunter and produced more after the initial examples met with success. Very heavy front and side armour, even more effective than the Koenigstiger, and a PaK43 88mm gun (same as the Koenigstiger and Jagdpanther). The Ferdinand was fielded well before the Koenigstiger was deployed, and eventually was renamed to the Elefant.
christ thats big...... i never even new that thing existed. and nice job man pity to see u droped the king tiger even if relic is making there own one
@BlackLabel: Well, maus maybe a bad choice, but as i have earlier said i picked that one because it's such a box = extreamly easy to model. So it was easy to keep this tank simple(=less problems) and as such it is great for learning the usage of exporter and other tools. I still intend to make it to the point it can be included to the game with animations and such, so it wouldn't be inferior quality compared to the other stuff that already exists in the game.
@Sturmhaubitze: I will consider the Elephant as well as other tanks. I quess though that Elephant is one of the tanks that is already beign modelled by numerous of other modellers.
I love your signature
@spud..:It's one of the biggest tanks ever built, if not the biggest. My maus model has very accurate size in game.
Last edited by Skyward; 24th Apr 07 at 11:09 AM.
hum its been a wile now i was wondering if the maus had been compleated
Well, since the animations can't be implemented in the game yet, this thing is sort of in a limbo waiting that animations can be implemented...
PS. I will update this thread, when there is somthing to update.
Last edited by Skyward; 11th May 07 at 9:29 AM.
I just noticed that there were several mentions of the Elephant tank destroyer.
I'm not trying to hijack your thread Skyward, but I just thought I'd post a link to the Elephant I modeled so that those who want one in game can perhaps see that there is, in fact, one already in development. Its just a bit stalled at the moment.
http://forums.relicnews.com/showthread.php?t=119474
Unfortunately, the person who offered to texture it seems to have run off, which leaves me to do it, and that's what brings me here Skyward.
Your camouflage patterns are incredible, and I'm curious how you went about making them? I've played around in photo shop, but so far I've not managed to make any that look nearly as good as yours. So, if you don't mind my asking, whats your secret? I'd love to know. Thanks.
Last edited by Ariel; 14th May 07 at 11:26 PM.
Ariel, i'm familiar with your work. Actually it was mainly you i was referring to, that there is already people working on it. It's hard to answer your question with words, so i just basicly show my work process with images or layers if you will.
1. Making good and clear UV is the start ofc.
2. I start painting some platings, bolts, grills and so forth on the first layer. This gives the first details, and it's also easier to keep track on the cordinates, where things are, that aren't modelled.
3. Base color added to another layer under the one that has plating. Google around images of your tank to find color schemes and patterns you like. I used the pipette on images to get the colors i liked, and tuned the colors just a little bit and then used the Filter/Render/Clouds.
4.Next layer is over the base color layer and has the camo pattern on it.
5. Layer above camo pattern and below the plating layer. Use some brush that has some pattern in it, lower the opacity and start brushing places you think would get dirty and stuff.
6. You can still keep adding more layers of detail, like scratches and markings and numbers.
I like to keep everything in different layers, so when i screwup, it's only one aspect that i ruined. It's also good to start the textures on say 2048x2048 so you can do all the details you want, and then just shrink the texture to 1024x1024 when you are implementing it.
I hope this helps you.
Last edited by Skyward; 15th May 07 at 5:36 AM.
That is extremely helpful. Thank you Skyward.
I do have one more question about your texturing method though, if you don't mind. In step 4 you mention painting the camouflage pattern over the base color, but I'm curious, how do you come up with the camouflage pattern? Do you draw it in by hand? Or do you have a better way?
And thanks again Skyward. I appreciate your help in this matter.
I recently painted (as in physically painted, with a paintbrush) a camouflage pattern onto a StuG III G model recently, and did some research on German camouflage patterns before hand. I'd just use the paintbrush tool in Photoshop and just draw in some thick lines if you want the "stripe" pattern. All the German crews did was quickly use the compressor and spray on the paint in whatever pattern they thought was good, so patterns varied a lot from company to company (or even platoon to platoon). I'm a fan of the stripe patterns, as it's simple for me to do with a paintbrush and doesn't make the model look too "noisy" from a distance. There are certainly more complex patterns you can do ("ambush" pattern involves lots of tiny dots on top of big blotches, "peadot" is a similar pattern that was used on camo uniforms), if you wish. The only common factor is that the factor almost always base-coated in Dunkelgelb (dark yellow), and so the crews painted their camouflage over top of this base coat. The actual shade of dark yellow varies from production run to production run, since the paint was thinned with different chemicals and so could vary from a sandy yellow to a more dirty greenish ochre yellow.
This is probably more than you asked for... so uh... use the paintbrush tool, and probably a Gaussian blur to make the edges smoother.
I just paint the pattern to separate layer with paint brush that has lowered opacity. I have refrence image of the pattern in my second monitor, and i try to copy the pattern the way it is in the picture and the parts that aren't visible in the picture i improvise.
Excellent. Thanks you both. With this information I have no doubt that I'll be able to make a decent texture for my Elephant. It'll be nice to finally finish it.
And again, thanks. I really appreciate the help.
Nice, now i don't need to make that one
ah nice to see those things took shape...
let me show you some:
The elephant are important...forget bout the KT for a sec...if you want to make it look used and grinded up use the *destroyed* textures with light light option in PS to overshadow the model and giving it a use look. This helps alot and saves you time. Also, scale model sides are a good resource if you need inspiration for camo patterns. The 3rd panzer on this pic is a recreation of a acctual camo pattern used in KURSK iirc...but like with uniforms its hard to do this stuff 100% accurate. Also let me show you THIS LINK..(tutorials on the left hand side ).its great tutorial but i prefer a diffrent way of doing Zimmerit.
If there are any questions of camo during specific time periods feel free to ask. I have loads and loads of sampels and photos i use for reference...also...if you do a complete new texture its allways helpfull to have the blueprints ready...
big image
Hope this helps..and GOOD LUCK !!!!!
Last edited by Corsix; 18th May 07 at 2:39 AM. Reason: image is big
Skyward, I got some realy nooby questions but i realy need some answers to them so please if you can explain to me this:
1. How do you make details mirrored and with proportions on each side, i mean, thouse details on the Maus side skirts with the round shape, how do you make them mirrored right in the place they need to be, do you make it by hand copy the stuff and place it as much correctly you can or is there a "Mirror" option i don't know off?
2. How do you make texture with paint scheme like that not just go nicely with 1 part of the vehicle (like the Hull in this Maus case) but as well as with the turret, do you merge UV maps somehow in order to get that?
You can see the camo paint go nice and continues from the Hull to the Turret area, this is what i mean.
I hope you could reply to this mate, i realy need to know about and would help a lot with my modeling exp.
Last edited by IDF-Godzilla; 17th May 07 at 2:32 PM.
Danny Palatnik,
Freelance 3D modeler for game modification projects.
http://idf-godzilla.deviantart.com/
Think i can help...
1. It depends on the UV map unwrap if things get mirrored. If you have booth sides unwraped, just copy that detail with PS to the other side. PS has mesurements to help you with this.
2. You have to think 3d while doing 2D textures. It also helps if you have the Turrent UV ( IF it comes on a extra UV map ) open at the same time. Just have a look. At the end its alot of testing between 2d and 3d to get the desired look. I also have the sample i go from open, also a 3d or at least 2 screenshots of the model because sometimes it can get a little confusing.
What BlackLabel said.
Here is my whole uv incase you wanted to see.
Finished diffuse map. To make the stripes continue from hull to turret, you just have to test and guestimate to get them in right place. And that is again why it's good to have camo stripes in their own separate layer...
Any help, or would you like to know about how to actually make a good uv map?
Last edited by Skyward; 18th May 07 at 4:42 AM.
Something that just came to mind....I use the original base layer as the last layer over everything. Make a copy of the base layer and put it on top of everything. Now make it black/white and give it a light option ( maybe light light 60% or something that feels feasable ). With this way you still have all details crisp.
Thanks for your replys BlackLabel and Skyward i got more or less the hang of it, again thanks
If you can Skyward then explain how to make a good uv map, i know how to do it i just don't know how to make my uv mapping skills good
Oh almost forgot, i have another question for you Skyward, how do you paint these nice stripes of black and grey on the model?
Most of the time i see my line work go off and not in the correct position on the edges.
I use to actualy make "lines" on the UV map but that turns out realy bad and not as nice as this, is there a way to make them in a better way then mine?
I belive you are working on too low resolution to actually get any accuracy on things.
So increase viewport texture resolution by going in to
customize/preferences/viewports/configure driver
and in there increase texture sizes
Also increase uv edit resolution by going in to
options/advanced options
and in there increase render width and height to say 1024x1024
With these increased resolutions the textures should appear exactly were you meant them to. Not just almost.
Also some random notes, which you have probably already noticed
When uv mapping, the "normalise clusters" usually ruins the proportions.
For boxy stuff like tank turrets and hulls the "unfold mapping/walk to closest face" works pretty well.
A quick test on an M1 Abrams model i made.
I still don't realy know how to give it the effect of dust and mud/crap that usually seen on every tank.
Things like the surface texture, things like that.
For your devine gugdment judgment Skyward.
Dosent look that bad for a first try.
I posted this before but i found this tutorial very helpfull : CLICKY
Good Luck !
BlackLabel you are the man!
Thanks for this fantastic link, i realy learned a lot more in this tutorial, too bad that the "Tracks" tutorial link is down.
Anyway here is what i came up from that great tutorial!
very usefull link indeed
Maus and convoy
Finally did some progress with the shaders, you notice that it isn't irritatingly bright anymore. As it was in the previous screenshot i posted while back. Oh and tracks are now included, but i managed to pick view angle like this
The fact that my max file corrupted at one point and had to do some stages again, has been slowing down my progress, but now i'm almost ready to start seriously considering what to model next.
UPDATE:ingame screenshots
Last edited by Skyward; 21st May 07 at 7:47 AM.
Good grief man. Thats awesome.
I looks abit out of place with that skin. Other than that...nice work getting there !
Yes a bit, but could you pin point what it is that makes it look out of place?
It's too smooth and lacks contrast. The Relic skins are much "noisier" in comparison. The edges need to be highlighted more, so that the paint looks almost worn off there. The camouflage stripes should be a bit darker, or the base dunkelgelb a bit lighter, or both.
Thanks sturm, i see what i can do. And if someone want's to give the paintjob a try, just ask and i post both my 2048x2048 PSD and 1024x1024 DDS.
Maus Paintjob
Did quite a bit changes to diffuse and some minor stuff to gls, spc and nrm maps aswell. Will it blend? That is the guestion.
thats looking a fare bit better than before
Last edited by advarntek; 23rd May 07 at 6:17 PM.
It's good, don't get me wrong, but it's still waaay too clean. It does not blend with the other tanks. Kind of lacks a real metal "texture," or "feeling," if you know what I mean. It feels a bit like cardboard right now.
i think one problem is that the lines are to crisp. the tank seem to be smooth and a peace of fine art the lines need to look at bit more like weldding. but it is still a hell of a lot better than anything i could do.
I think the problem with the Maus is not exactly the texture.
As we all know, the Maus was never actually fielded. It was designed, built and blown up before the russians got it. It never saw any action outside myth and legend.
So why is that a problem? Quite simple. The Maus, as we know it, is just a design study! What we know as "the Maus" is not an actual battletank. It is a battletank design-study prototype. A Maus that is supposed to see any action is completely fictional, since no Maus ever did. Still following me?
The Maus lacks all the myriad of small additions that were added to other tanks over the course of time and without which almost no tank would actually hit the field for combat!
Towing cables, spare track links, fuel cans, wrapped up cammo netting, basic tools, climbing handles, smoke projectors, radio antenna and so on and so on and so on. Another thing are markings. Numbers, unit insignia, kill marks, service markings,...
Otherwise the only thing it is credible for is the "get produced, drive a few meters and then get blown up by your own engineers" scenario.
If the Mouse is supposed to look and feel like it belongs among the other tanks, it has to be infused with a shot of mass production detail and life.
You like Allied War Machine? Forget AWM! Wait for a Mediterranean expansion and behold the power of Italian War Machine. Get one new German tank for every two of your own tanks retreated off-map. ^_^*
That's all true, but I stand by my critiques anyway.
TheVOID is 100% correct. The latest changes to the texture have made it look as close as it can with the current mesh, and the only steps that will bring it further are to incorporate all the details into the mesh that the design would gain if it went to mass production. Copying some of these from the Panzer IV or Tiger I and applying them intelligently on its surface will go a long way.
Yes, i have pretty much done my best at diffuse, normal, glossiness, specular and dirt maps. So with my skills that texture is hardly getting any better than that. I have done some changes to it after that last screenshot, but nothing drastic.
About the mass produced looks, i don't know if i want to make it look like that. Just as i don't quite know if there is any reasonable role for it in the game to begin with. Probably not.
Metallic looks and cardboard. I don't know, but i'm quite happy with the current surface. It's shape makes it look cardboardish, but that is not up to me, since i'm not the one who designed it
Night stalking
Candy land
I had some fun with atmospherics. I'm still trying to make it feel a bit more metallic, but it's quite painfull trail and error with spc and gls maps.
PS. I stop posting pictures for a while
Last edited by Skyward; 25th May 07 at 9:02 AM.
It looks much better close up because you can see the fine detail clearly. From a distance it can look a bit flat, because of the lack of stuff like TheVoid has mentioned. I personally would like to see that kind of stuff added, but it's your model.
I guess i gotta look in to adding some of that extra stuff to it then, there is not much room for those in the maps, but some will fit i'm sure.
After maus i seriously don't know what to start working on, since relic is going to include most of the relevant stuff anyways. So maybe doing early war stuff could be an option or simply start doing modern warfare stuff T-80s, M1A1 and so on.
The bad news however is that i'm going to army july 9th. So there will probably be no updates from me for a loooong looong time.
uhhm Sky..thats unfortunate...could i give the Maus a shot , texture wise ?
ofc, just tell me what you need and i try to upload those in the site.
Skyward, something that I am really missing in the game and that would be worth making is the Kübelwagen! I would definately do it myself, but unfortunately, I don't own 3ds max. I am working with Cinema 4D and XSI.
Kübelwagen, Kettenkrad, 2cm Flak 30 (afaik already partly done within the light Puma), 75mm Pak 40, Flakpanzer Wirbelwind, all the neat and lovely SdKfz 251 variants (light howitzer, mortar, anti-tank gun, med evac),... Lots of things the Americans too, of course.
There is so much that could be modelled and put into the game, even with OF comming.
Too bad you are going to the Army.
hey skyward
do you have any pics of the maus firing its main gun? i wanna see this baby in action! O_O
heres a funny thought tho, since you're already creating huge tanks, why not create the almighty Landkreuzer P. 1000 Ratte Tank?! LMAO!:
Last edited by Kou Uraki; 14th Jun 07 at 3:46 PM.
Co-Leader of the Table-Top Round Up Mod
Animations still can't be added, so for now i can't get you a screenshot with any neat action going on.
Ratte joke still going?
That is a nice illustration you posted, though it looks too small in that doesn't it? Here is another pic of Ratte
I'm working on somthing, but at this point all i'm going to say is: prepare for the king to return.
if you look at it right, its pretty might the same size. its just that its zoomed out more, and you can see the top of it more clear. wait, "prepare for the king to return"? uh oh, that cant be good for the allies... *gulp* if you're talking about the king tiger though, isnt that projet cancelled according to you? why you would cancell such a beatiful peace of bling is beyond me, but its your model not mine.
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