Balcora Gate leads to Balcora. And Balcora is the center of the Galaxy - inside the Black Hole Cluster there.
Balcora Gate leads to Balcora. And Balcora is the center of the Galaxy - inside the Black Hole Cluster there.
So Balcora is the location, while the "Gate of Balcora" is the gate itself, which leads to the center of the galaxy.
The location of Balcora Gate, I held, was easily accessable to most non-progenetor races. They just didn't know where to find it exactly (Since Space, after all, is vast). It's one of the few devices that is capable of sending ships by hyperspace through a gravity well- the gigantic black hole at the center of Balcora. When the Hiigarans activated Sajuuk and the three cores, Karen was able to hyperspace the entire fleet out of the area by it's power.
Similarly the Eye of Arran and the super gate network is an extension of Hyperspace technology. The gates are massive and designed for mass-transportation between the galaxies (as the end cutscene of Hw2 depitcs lines reaching out to other galaxies). The nodes I listed are huge gates that had no clear interpretation of purpose before Sajuuk was exposed to the universe.
I agree somewhat with Yasotay's interpretation of the T-Mat. They are old, but only as old as the Bentusi. Wheras the Bentusi makes themsleves known to the lesser races, the T-Mat manipulates events behind the scenes in their favor. What they really want is the legacy of the Progenetors, but they don't know where to find it, and don't have the numbers necissarily to smash anyone in their path and do it themselves. They are Jealous of the Bentusi because they have a hyperspace core... but were willing to allow thier puppet Makaan to have one to seize all three. Then they'd take them from him when he had defeated Karen.
The T-Mat Starfish ships weren't just gifts, but also leashes. They would have activated on their own and seized the cores from makaan with thier full potential.
Author: Children of Kadesh, Children of Kadesh (book 2), The Taiidan Civil War, The Fire ,Tradition, Outcry (oneshot), Chronicles of the Nadiim-Basad,
and maker of the Map of the Homeworld universe, and the Homeworld 2 Grand Strategy Game. Responsible for Cataclysm 2nd. Also has a running short story collection.
This is the coolest Homeworld thing to appear in the Studio for a long time. The design itself it also delicious, although when I say I'd prefer to see it as a zoomable Flash map with pop-out details and stuff I suppose really what I'm saying is:
GIVE ME A HW MMO NOW!
Panth, we've been saying that for over the last 3 years.
I just can't wait to see the final version, the effort you put into this map is just mind-boggling! I AM NOT WORTHY TO BE IN THE PRESENCE OF SUCH SKILL! (bows and runs out of room)
But seraseoulsy, very good work.
Not to knock his skills or the praise down much, but the actual difficulty in doing something like this is not very much if you know your programs. I think it is the organization and the labor that makes it seem more difficult.
A HW MMO, now that would be interesting.
I was never a fan of MMORPGs to be honest. I thought they sucked up people's souls and didn't see much interest in them.
Now a HW flight sim... that might be worth some investment. Or even better yet, a ship simulator.
Atm, juggling Children of Kadesh, the Turanic map, and something else. I wish Relic would divulge a little more about the universe of HW2... or what their say is on my little idea of the universe.
Hey, that looks fantastic! I really like
Although techically it would have to be in 3-d, but then I think it would lose most of its charm.
I just realised what it reminds me of: The Defcon map! HOLY SHIT SOMEONE MAKE A DEFCON HOMEWORLD MOD! That would work, and would be unreasnobly awesome.
I made this a while ago, and its not as good but fairly similar, I used the galaxy M51, because I heard that that is the galaxy that homeworld is set in
Not to knock your misplaced sense of superiority, but in The Studio we are impressed by aesthetically engaging, interesting work. We don't give a damn about how difficult something was to complete or how many photoshop filters it took, it's the intrinsic artistic value that we praise.Originally Posted by Greenstone
Interesting idea Siguld. That could be doable in the hands of a skilled Flash programmer--to set up the HW2 map like Defcon with little fleet icons and battle images.
I think, Norsehound, it might be worth it to hunt around for a fellow artist with serious Flash experience when this is done, so they can help you build this as a Flash presentation. Given so many people are asking for it, and you might not have the experience to do it, it might not be a bad idea to consider getting ahold of someone with Flash experience who loves Homeworld.
Maybe someone else on the former PDS team could give you a hand there?
PS. Panth makes a good point--if it's quality artwork that impresses us, how many hours do we care the artist took? Granted, sometimes hours=efforts=quality. However, sometimes--if you know what you're doing, you can get it done in half the time. I have this with Photoshop. In the beginning, it took me longer to find filters and controls and settings. Now I can run through it at about 50% the time I used to because of the new Wacom and my knowledge of the program.
Yes! I know just the person with an experience in flash who may be able to help me, if I can't help myself that is.
She has more experience in web design than I do, and she's taken more visual communications classes (including, I think, flash). I'd have to ask her if she is interested in helping me, or at least find a book to teach myself.
Currently I'm going for something that's poster-ific. Flash can come later, but if it impresses everyone then (relic permitting), I can upload a full-size image of the full thing so that individuals can DL it and run to kinkos to print a full sized image. Of course, it wouldn't be for sale... but I would like appropreate credit placed where it's due (Relic, myself, et.all).
When it comes to maps, more effort is being put into the Turanic map and filling out the Kingdoms. Since it's entirely my own fan creation I more or less have no restriction in creating forces. The Kassites (Turan-Taiidan mix) are done. The nations are mostly already described (save one) and their leaders named. I know the character well of this batch of Turanic pirates- they will appear in a future chapter of Children of Kadesh, because of their 'present' role in antagonizing the kiith.
There's a little surprise I'm working on, also, behind the scenes. And I may just move on to make a regional map of the Taiidan spaces.
And an update on the Turan;
Last edited by Norsehound; 29th Jan 07 at 10:19 PM.
As I have said I will want a full size print of that, so Kinkos here I come. . .
Now in response to Panth and such, I was not saying that I was superior(why everyone thinks that I think I am is beyond my ken), or that this is a lame attempt and not art, in fact it is art, an art that has been around for ages called Cartography, this is something that I both love and enjoy, I was merely commenting that it is not as difficult on the technical side as much as intensive on the labor and design side.
heh... if there was instruction on cartography and mapmaking at my local college, It would have been likely that I would have taken it.
Sadly, most of the world has been mapped already. All that needs to happen is revisions.
The Fictional realm....well...let's just say this is my tribute to Relic for making such a thought provoking universe of intense interest
(And as a Side note, I REALLY REALLY REALLY REALLY WISH I could attend Relic's open house. Problem is, I have college and live really far away (California), and don't really think that I could qualify as Relic's "biggest Fan". It would be nice to actually meet Rob C in person- since he was graceous enough to respond to my inqueries about how to get into the industry
Next year, I guess....)
How big is the file size of this thing Norse?
The Turanic map posted is 842x1191 (pixels).
The Full HW giganta (!!!) Map, apparently, is 3927 x 2930 (pixels). 54x40 inches, roughly.
The full map is still all vector, so it can be re-sized appropreately after some tweaks.
Should make it bigger for poster-size printing.
Are those descriptions under the logos blind text or actual lore?
That's the intention, eventually. Problem is convincing Illustrator to cooperate during the save
Interestingly enough, the layer of the text is named 'Decorative text". It was supposed to be blind, but I had too much fun and wrote lore instead.
Edit: Y'know those instances where you can't seem to stop yourself from being creative, even though you're insane to stay up this late?
I start class in about six hours, and I just HAD to finish this.
I'll let you guys figure out what this has to do with the cartography efforts
Last edited by Norsehound; 30th Jan 07 at 3:42 AM.
He's like a machine!
Give me enough of this in print resolution and I too will be down at Kinkos. Not sure what the girlfriend would have to say about the bedroom being covered in Turanic raiders though.
All of Norsehound's work earns the Official Watsas seal of approval, the Highest honor that a Watsas can bestow. I'm looking forward to what's next.
Life goes on EXCEPT FOR YOU! ^^
Well... I'm honored.
It has begun.
So... do people like my ideas about how the Turanics turned out in the universe of HW2? It might be a cool map, but could you accept it as happening?
Focus is on the Turan map now, until i can think of something significant to do with the full HW map... Since the Turanic issue isn't strictly canon I have a lot more leeway there.
Last edited by Norsehound; 30th Jan 07 at 1:59 PM.
The only problem is I can't see the tiny words without a magnifying glass (which I don't have). Other than that it's Fu*king EPIC! In a very good way.
Just wait. When I'm done with one of the maps, I'll scale it up to a desired size and save it as a jpg or something for printing.
I don't have a pic, but I've done more on the trade routes for the main map. Sometime soon I should work on the arm trace things (the lines of dots), to get a feel of where the galactic arms are.
...Or do people want the Turanic map?
Last edited by Norsehound; 30th Jan 07 at 4:06 PM.
We're all eager, but don't let that impair your quality, or showing anything that isn't "up to spec".
*mildly disgusted with negative price discrimination*
people shouting for the map can be ignored
take you time
it will look nicer that way
it doesn't need to be 3d. a 2d map is a good representation of an otherwise relativly flat galaxy, and a 3d map would be significantly more complicated aswell. :-]
Plus, you can't print a 3d map on paper.
On a serious note, the galaxy is mostly flat anyway. While there is a dimension of depth present, on the grand scale of things width and length are much larger than height, and make much more of a difference on a political scale.
When I have this all figured out I might do a side-view of the universe to locate significant landmarks in terms of height on the galactic plain.
Norse, i don't disagree at all with your story treatment of the Turanic clans.
Any group of (in the traditional sense, but also space-pirate style) bandits left alone for even a second will declare themselves kings of their respective realm, if only to give them a sense of moral reasoning for their banditry, heh.
A side view would blow my mind. You really should think about overlaying a shot of whatever galaxy it was that relic used as a guidemap.
Anyways...simply phenomenal work, man.
Also......you might as well go nuts with the lore, dude. If people don't like it they'll let you know, not like you can't change it later......and in the meantime, you can REALLY flesh out the universe not just with ideas and words, but visualizable locations on a map with which to attach them and give them meaning.
Like the location where the kushan fleet encountered the turanic base, the mission that was cut fromt he retail.
intruiguing. ill be watching this thread.
Norsehound i really think you should enter the biggest fan contest, you would get my vote with this project.
keep up the awesome work!!
EDIT: i just noticed its past the deadline for submitting i bet some other people put in good words for you
Norsehound, your map is beautiful.
Just to let you know, I'm gonna be posting this on the thread for my Homeworld Boardwar, I'm just tell you this so if you don't want it posted there, you can tell me and ill remove it.
Where can I can the massive version? With all the kingdom info and such?
I took the liberty of overlaying the map with the homeworld galaxy render, mostly for the people in my boardwar at the moment but just thought I'd show you, seeing that it is your map.
Homeworld Map with Galaxy overlay
Last edited by Rabid.Gerbil; 31st Jan 07 at 11:37 PM.
Rabid.Gerbil- By all means, I'm honored that my map is being used for boardwar!
Someday I may decide to overlay the "provinces" of the larger political entities (Kingdoms on the main map, for example), but I think doing so now would just increase the file size of my main HW map. As it is, I wonder how much more I can add without Illustrator freezing on me angrily for opening the monstrosity. Fortunately I have a new faster processor from christmas that I have yet to install...
Your render is beautiful, by the way, and gives me comfort that things are in their proper places
And for those who may/may not remeber the Turanic Corvette side I did... I was browsing through the HW archive and came across this
It's annoying, because I had to reconstruct the entire side-veiw of the stupid corvette entirely from a cutscene screencap. Supposedly line-arts for the HW1 ships must exist in some form for the reasearch manager... I would love to aquire them somehow.
*shrugs* But that's a side-thing to the mapping (and CoK). So...yeah.
I have photoshop and am getting to be quite experienced, so let me know if i can be of any assistance.
I was thinking about doing this myself until I was this but hey, I would be do such a good job as you. If i have much spare time, Ill try and work on a side on map, though it wont be that amazing... I mean come on, theres only so much detail you can put in one ONE SIDE of a galaxy, the on the flat axis, not alot would be visible.
Good work mate.
EDIT: Here we are, this took me the better half of 20 minutes. Its pretty shitty but it didn't take much time.
Side on map
Sorry for stealing it away from you for a few seconds Norse, was just really bored, hope you don't mind.
Last edited by Rabid.Gerbil; 1st Feb 07 at 4:24 AM.
Neat stuff Norse - very impressive. I too would like a copy of the complete version if you're unable to link to it on here.
Gerbil- don't worry about it. I'll be making my own if I get there, anyway.
Did some work on the Main map and the Turanics map. Sometime soon I need to get the spiral arms in, but at the moment I'm just naming things and adding discriptors for when you guys can eventually read this
For the meantime, progress has been made;
Mathmaticians may define the universe as a set of lines...
But sometimes, I see spirals;
Not really happy with how it turned out, but I tried lining up the lines with the HW1 expanded map to get them right, and went from there. I might re-make them altogether, but here's proof that they're there.
Still not complete, but this is how the rest universe looks now (Without the arms)
this looks like it could be a foldout poster
that comes with National Geographic
very professional looking
What's the white thing just below "Nirvana" with all the lines emegrating from it? Eye of Aran & network?
Yes, that's the Eye of Arran.
It's the hyperspace supernode for this galaxy. IIRC, networks also made it to other galaxies. They are not represented here, but lines from the outer gates streatch to these networks.
Or maybe only Arran does...
Whatever the case, China Gate (Eye of Arran), is the central node for the gate network. Else why would Karen take Sajuuk there?
Thats beautiful Norsehound. Keep up the good work.
Waiting for the finished (massive) product .
Fantastic work Norse- But that one hyperpoint well to the.... southwest on the map seems to be outside the galactic bounderies. Nothing bad really just seems a bit far out.
Ancient Clan of Hex&Square
That outer node leads to two seperate galaxies. At least that's what I imagine... and since it's not set in stone it's easy to correct should I choose to.
"It's comming together...looking good..."
You know for a second, just a second, I tried to zoom in on the picture.
This thing has godly amounts of detail.
Last edited by Elixir; 5th Feb 07 at 4:29 AM.
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