They....they made the nebelwerfer... worse?.....*blinks*.......goodgod.
They....they made the nebelwerfer... worse?.....*blinks*.......goodgod.
A bit of pain never hurt anyone.
I'm going to have to back up blacky a bit on his shrek comments.
They seem to hit ALOT more now, most recent game I had 2 units of grenades tore a crocadile to pieces. Something close to a 90% hit ratio.
What with shrek effectiveness, FTFL+FTP, volks being able to build defenses, and the 88 hopefully not sucking there are alot of t2 centric idea's swimming around in my head atm.
They actually buffed teh BAR by 40%, the AT gun, 57mm got a cone matching the PAK, and no croc changes?
but the sherman clipping beeing fixed, i think its all good
can someone (maybe some hardcore allied players) explain exatly WHY 57mm needed a buff?
THIS UPDATE PATCH 1.5 IS NOT GOOD EXACTLY. Try to connect to chat in Omaha and listen about the problems of it. I got a huge problem with it because after installation i got all the time comunicate: "Please wait you got connection problems with relic " I/m asking why and what did you do with my best game why i can't play now?
Besides before i had informations that online players is about 1300 and now is about 450 so you got a big problems RELIC because yours patch is TERRIBLE WORST !!!
Yes, I wait with bated breath for a sensible explanation to this ridiculous change. Allied AT guns are just way too flexible, cheap and powerful. What a bizarre changelist, it was like reading an April fool, especially the Nebel stuff.
...Unless you play allies of course, where reading the changelog will be like Christmas come early.
At the moment a lot of people are downloading the patch. The servers ain't exactly stable now. That has nothing to do with the patch itself but the fact that many people are downloading it from Relic Online.
This just proves that there still are a lot of people playing the game that now all need the patch. Calm down and wait please.
I'm a big allied player and personally can't beleive that the AT gun got a buff. I Liked it the way it was and could be less effective vrs Inf. Not that i used it a whole lot as I play Armor most of the time. You'll have to wait on my .02 on the Armor Command restructure, till I get home and play.
can someone (maybe some hardcore allied players) explain exatly WHY 57mm needed a buff?
the 57mm buff is like buffing teh croc in 1.4, its mind boggeling....
I was under the impression that the "Off Map Support" of the Infantry Company was going to be looked at? I think I recall hearing the Relic Balance Manager saying, during a Tales of Heroes podcast, they were going to see about making an M-10 a guarantee because right now it is too random on what you get?
Maybe the idea was nixed or pushed off until a later patch?
i can't wait to get home from work (45 minutes left!) and try defensive doc T2 with all these changes... defensive T2 axis has been my favorite to play as, and now that it sounds like the shrek is fixed...
initially with 1.4 i was one of the people complaining about the croc... well, i learned how to deal with it, and now with 1.5 it seems i'll be able to kill it even quicker.
as for the changes to the 57mm? larger firing arc isn't too huge of a change even if it didn't need it. i'd of been fine with it if they upped the pak38 angle at the same time. i've said before they should double both firing arcs. and, AP rounds notwithstanding, the pak38 can dish out more damage per second... it's not as inferior as people make it out to be. i do hope they address the loss of camo ability when it's recrewed though.
1.5 just makes skipping t2 a bigger risk, which i almost never did anyway.
Some of the changes are indeed puzzling. Airborne is now by far the best commander in the game. Meanwhile, all defensive doctrine got - easily the weakest in the game - was a tiny buff to the 88. I don't mind the armour company overhaul. As is was, there was no reason to ever take the right side of the tree first. Now there's actually something to think about. Although it seems like the left side is still better overall, unless you really need that pershing sooner.
What's with all the light vehicle hate though? The M8 was already borderline junk, now 'shreks will absolutely rape them. The quad and puma now have an even smaller window where they be useful. The nebel changes are a big WTF too. It supresses better now, great. Wait, but now it REALLY can't kill anything. The officer might see more use now, if only just for supervision.
Finally, a few glaring omissions: no help for KCH, only one tiny axis veterency buff, no nerf to Sherman upgun blast radius, no improvement for grenadier grenades, and a big one: Apparently you still can't remove the fog of war from replays!
I like the fact that u may not destroy your own tank traps and sandbags. But why can you still do so with the wires?
And the above post made me notice the lack of Potato Masher buff.
I just tested some stuff.
Now that shermans have no phase armor anymore.. they die soo fast by shrecks.
We tested 2 grens with shrecks vs a croc.
The croc got nailed down to the 5% bug. It even lost it's main gun, it only won the engagement by driving over the last guy who was alive.
Normal shermans stand no chance, it did get a lucky shot and killed 3 dudez at once.
But that was just one time. For the rest it missed alot.
Also smoke seemed to hurt it more then it did good. Shrecks just never missed.
There are some changes that arnt documented, so I suggest you guys play the game more before freaking out.. =) Forced Retreat is cheaper from the Officer.. Panzer can now beat an upgunned Sherman, yes thats right. A Panzer4 can beat an upgunned Sherman.
My guess is that with the kind of boost in possibilities that Axis T1 and T2 got, and the various nerfs to BAR supressive fire we're going to see Krieg + WSC as a serious counter to airborne.
Shermans are def. counterable with grenadier shreks now especialy with either Inspired Assault + zeal or FtFL active.
Crocodile.. I don't know. But a PAK with grenadier shrek support is going to be a very tough proposition for a Croc now, beacuse those shreks sure hurt
One other thing: Looks like they fixed the 5% no death bug. Almost every weapon in the game got a change to critical hit tables which ensures some sort of critical hit will happen when HP is low.
Yupz, panzers 4's 0wn from now onOriginally Posted by RayLiota
While I was testing we did a 1v1 between a pershing lvl1 and a panther lvl3
Panther won hands down. During ALL the testing, the pershing found it VERY hard to score a penetrating hit, most bounced of.
I dunno, but I have a feeling Relic pulled a april's joke on us. Doing all kinds of stuff with the allies.
Changelog really surprised me. Didn't seem like they changed much of what needed to be change but instead just fiddled with other things.
Why Relic? Why?
The new patch did a lot of good stuff. Try infantry based AT, you wont be sorry.
Shreks eat Shermans and Crocs.
The Nebby is a supression beast, and damageing everything near the impact. It doesnt to lots of damage, more like bleeding slowly.
The Pz4 can solo shermans of all colors with style. Its one mean tank.
Rangers are good, but die very fast. A great stop gap for pumas.
The M10 is cool, doesnt feel like a crappy sherman.
Volks + barbwire + sandbags + MG = sad Allies.
Axis infantry level one ventrency is very good. YOu can now see the units heal slowly. GOt a few to full heath in a normal lenght game.
The BAR is less mean, 2 guns that are 40% better. Supression is ok now, but not uber. Hard to supress more than 2 sqauds. Sandbags save the day.
Really its a good patch. Try some new stuff.
(read my tank testing thread, I'll redo that one with 1.5 though, if I get someone to help me out - pzIV wasn't that weak but it *did* get WTFPWND by upgraded shermans.).
Quick testing shows:
StuG is, indeed, nerfed against infantry. While the testing was brief I never got multiple kills with it.
StuH is, indeed, rather good against infantry, and seems rather effective against weapon teams - six shots against weapon teams, 3 of them wiped out fresh squads. Definitely more accurate and possibly more area as well. Disheartening that the first shot in the test was a rear shot against a retreating jeep - and it was deflected (!). (Later, a front shot killed a jeep in one hit though).
Schreks - not sure, didn't really get to try it much.
Early to say. We'll see.
So has anyone seen if crocodiles can still roast the whole axis t2?
I'm so overjoyed that the shreck bug (to all of you jackasses who kept saying "graphical glitch", HA!), I hardly care about anything else. That little fix makes Axis T2 so much more viable, which means that Shermans dominate less solo, and need their own infantry backup, which means in turn that allied players will have to face Allied combined arms for once. Talk about a sea change. Thank you Relic!
Last edited by Misterwight; 14th Feb 07 at 3:49 PM. Reason: Typo
I have no complaints so far. The 88 is awesome now and rangers are really worth the mp, both being part of my preferred doctrines. The 57 buff makes sense when you see that shermans are not super tanks anymore. Axis t2 can beat them so allies will need some more firepower against axis armor, especially p4s wow...
Ok, I'll have to check the new schrecks. The way it read, it was merely a cosmetic change. If this is now fixed/improved, along with better tier1 volks, we might actually have something to be happy about.
Im wery suprised tehy didnt fix the Fog of war in replays... did they just forget it? =P
Timeless, the schrecks have definitely been fixed, I checked it just now.
Too soon to tell for sure... but it looks like it may prove to be easier to get more Inf. to survive into the endgame....which would be good ...atm it is often a case of first to the death star option.
"If you can keep your head when all about you are losing theirs and blaming it on you - you'll be a man my son".
.......................................Rudyard Kipling , Afganistan, 19thC.
"If you can keep your head when all about you are losing theirs - you may have missed something very important".
.......................................Royal Marine, Afganistan, 21stC.
The Pz4 is freaking scary. It mauled a Sherman with no problem. The game has a lot of new life. Axis really got some strong loving this patch
I'll admit, when I first looked at those balance changes I was about to uninstall CoH. It seemed littered with Allied buffs and Axis Nerfs, plus a few fixes to near-useless units.Ok, I'll have to check the new schrecks. The way it read, it was merely a cosmetic change. If this is now fixed/improved, along with better tier1 volks, we might actually have something to be happy about.
However after reading some posts (notably Plan6's), I'm beginning to feel a lot more confident about this latest change. Really, i'm dying to test it out but I wont get a chance until Friday now
To me, it seems Allies got a plethora of new buffs just to help them keep up with the awesomeness that is now THE PANZERSHRECK and the PIV.
The Sherman and BAR have been tricky things to deal with, given that they're comprise the majority of the Allied forces. I'm pleased with Relic's approach so far, although admittedly I haven't tested it myself yet. Grens have been fixed/buffed along with PIVs to counter Shermans; and the BAR Suppression is only the "I WIN" button in certain circumstances; leaving it still a worthwhile upgrade without being overpowering.
Anyone else happy now that goliaths can molest allied tank traps? I was pissed before when I sent 2 of them at a mass of tank traps on vire river middle point and did no damage.
The real beauty of the Panzer IV is how many AT gun shots it can take. You can easily flank them with it, either ripping them to shreds from behind or exposing them to a quick puma/infantry assault when they turn to cover their asses.
Have there been any undocumented changes to the Allied Offmap Call-in ability for the Infantry Doctrine? Everything else seems to have been covered except that; which really made the Infantry doctrine suffer.
SCHREKS ARE GOD-LIKE. They said they took a nerf to building damage, IIRC, but the still maul building, and anything with wheels should be frightened.
My first impression when I saw the changelog was that as an Allied player the Axis would be pissed, but I wouldn't comment until I played it (I still haven't played it, so I'm breaking my own rules), but it seems from ppl who have had a go that Axis is still strong so i'm happy. Its always the same really, until you game up, the black and white of a changelog means feck all.
The thing is, the way misses work in CoH, even a miss can still be a hit. When a projectile misses, it gets scattered from its intended target in a straight line. Anything in the way can get hit and will take damage from that projectile, so even if the weapon "misses" the scatter may make it pass by close enough to the target to still hit its hitbox and register as a hit (For example, if you have a Stug in front of your AT gun and it shoots at a sherman, if it "hits", it will pass through your stug and hit the sherman. If it misses, there's a pretty big chance it'll hit your stug in the ass).Well, but I'll have to test that because to me and others, it reads that it's merely a graphical change. If so, the schreck will still miss/deflect/whatever more against the Sherman than any other tank, including the Pershing.
However, with the sherman this was not case, because for some reason it was immune to all shots that did not register as "hit" right away, so all those misses that still passed close enough to collide with the sherman just passed through inflicting no damage.
So basically, now the shreks are evil because there is no longer any clipping and due to their low scatter most misses are still going to hit the sherman.
Is anyone able to post pics of the new maps, from the command view or just in game screen shots? Im stuck at work for the next 7 hours and wanna see them!
Well I must say when I saw the Changelog I was about to start crying What horrible changes. But I see now that the allies were buffed in order to cope with the Panzer IV which is now a lovely piece of machinery and not a complete waste of resources.
Also the shreks work a lot better now, still quite worried that all this goodness will be gone by the next patch Seems a bit too good to be true.
Thanks Relic so far.
I'm not really sure why they decided to uber buff 2 units of the Axis and then buff Allied units just to compensate... So what is the game going to break down into a PanzerIV + Grenadier + Zeal spam vs. a somewhat balanced Allied mixup?
Liberalism: death of logic
The 105 actually got a buff, not a nerf. It was used against defenses I had in the FOW, and the scatter nuked a lot more troops than it would have this morning -- I moved troops away after the first hit, and still lost a ton. It's more of a crapshoot, but for both sides. It may become somewhat of the allied "forced retreat," because of how variable it was... nothing in a fairly large area is safe now.
OTOH, less useful for base nuking.
Now they're as good for stormtrooper as for riflemen.
Agreed with uberjumper completely.The 57 firing arc is really the only thing that caught my eye as being "WTF?" I've always held the impression that it had that narrow arc because it was so damn effective (with the AP round) against armour that the arc was limited because of that.
It'd be really cool if the motorpool produced AT gun had the AP round and the narrow arc, and the Airborne AT gun had the wide arc but no AP round.
I'm happy or unsure with most of the patch changes except for the following complaints:
1. as above, wtf with the 57 buff? where's the pak buff? i was hoping for a 57 nerf.
2. croc still napalm nascar.
3. sherman 76mm gun still owns infantry.
4. axis vets still too expensive. kch and volks still receive nothing at lvl2 vet.
5. bike nerf? no one ever complained about the bike... also, where's the jeep nerf then?
6. allied war machine buff? it was already devastating before, now i can see m10 spam plus awm. also, all the munitions for calliope barrage can now be spent on awm.
7. no allied grenade nerf or axis grenade buff.
Well, I just did the "Off Map Support" 6 times in a row and every time I got at least one M-10. Not a valid test, by any means, but I don't recall ever getting an M-10 that often. Yes, the rest of the units were all random (got two M-10's on two tries).Originally Posted by Fonic
'Guaranteed' M-10 with Off-Map Support? Maybe this is an undocumented patch change?
Well if it is, that's great given the nicely buffed M-10s
Watch out for those Panzershrecks though :o
Anyone have any idea what to do about sandbags now? I'm not saying it's a bad thing that you can't delete them, but now my "workers" tend to box themselves into places with them.
I used to build squares around open MG's to make sure no one ran inside the sand and took out my guys, but this no longer works...but the main concern is how do you get your men out of there if it happens by choice or mistake?
Originally Posted by FonicBazooka tooOriginally Posted by Changelog
Or did you mean something else? I found nothing else in the CHANGELOG
And that maktes PZ4 "awesomeness"?Originally Posted by Changelog
Here's the tech @1.4 (from Planet CoH Unit Guide):
- Panzer IV Accuracy Whilst Moving: 0.5%
- Sherman Accuracy Whilst Moving: 0.5%
...and the same on Panther, Tiger, M10 etc...
And where now is the difference to 1.5?
great patch, hope it doesn't break anything :o
im nto sure if i like the ability to not delete traps or wire
word!!Let Bridger & Vitensby do patch 1.6 -- "The Comeback!"
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