Historical Skin Mod (v1.0) - 2.62 Compliant

[luciferum]

Ok.
I will fix it too. Started to work on Luftwaffe soldier and made a cap with real photos' textures...

[NordLand]

To my last post:
forget about the smock, it looks great as it is now. But the trousers don't really fit to the smock, the green is too strong. The colour should be LIGHT, dark green, here's a better pic:

[luciferum]

Here is the the 'remake' of the luftwaffe field division soldier'
Modifications are:
- M43 cap in blue grey;
- Splinter B camo smock;
- Blue grey trousers;
- splinter A tent (not displayed here);
- green colar patches as they were used for field divisions.

Comments welcome and release of the modified mod. soon.

[NordLand]

Good work !!

[AnyKey]

Excellent work once again luciferum! I have a quick question, do you plan on doing any work for the Wehrmacht units? or just concentrating on the Luftwaffe and Fallschirmjager as of right now?

[luciferum]

next work will be on Panzer grenadier after doing some tuning of the previous skins?

[Monkey Soldier]

Are you also going to add some ranks? And did the Luftwaffe soldiers also had smock camo? But its a good skin! excellent work lad!

[NordLand]

Of course the field division soldiers had smock camo.
Here's a wartime pic:


one more:

[luciferum]

Monkeys: According to what I read, Luftwaffe soldiers used a camo jacket as those you can see in pictures 'Nordland' posted but also the 'smock' that fallschirmjager used too.
What is also interesting to see on those pictures is that the same jacket can be more or less bright on two different soldiers. Some jackets can be more washed or coming from a different production...

[AnyKey]

Hey Luciferum, did you just release your skin mod?

[luciferum]

Mod with fallschirmjager and Luftwaffe soldier will be released today I guess.
I'll post a message when done.
Anyway, It will be written on my web site download's page which version is avaible for download

[Monkey Soldier]

No, I probaly mentioned it incorrectly. I meant that swamp camo thing. For the Luftwaffe ground forces

[NordLand]

Swamp camo was never used for any Luftwaffe unit. Swamp camo was used by the Heer, and (I'm not sure about that) by the Waffen-SS. Luftwaffe soldiers (Feld Division(ground forces), fallschirmjäger) used spinter b.

[Monkey Soldier]

Meh

[luciferum]

A v0.15 of HSM Mod is avaible for download

V0.15 (01/04/08)
- Luftwaffe Field division soldier with blue grey trousers and M43 cap, Splinter B jacket, and splinter A tent.
- Fallschirmjäger trousers and tent color adjusted.

Next version will include a new OF/Panzer grenadier wearing HBT (Herring Bone Twill) and new camo helmet (splinter A). Still wonder about trousers.

[luciferum]

Anyone knows how I can do to move or ask to move this thread to 'the ammo box' which seems to be a more proper location ?

[Monkey Soldier]

pm corsix or an other admin

[Treizoz]

Love the new FJ but im a little resistant to the new Luftwaffe infantry skin because of how blue it is. Is that how it was traditionally worn, a luft uniform with a camo smock over it? Seems counterintutitive...or is it just your artistic interpretation? When you do the rest of the PE I hope you give the infantry different camo, and Id love to see a panzer grenadier in an all black, SS like uniform

[luciferum]

Treizoz:Sorry but you won't see any black SS uniforms as they were only worn for ceremonies... except those for tank crewmen.
Field division soldiers really used blue grey uniforms and camo smocks over those were used to improve the camo. So I guess I'm right with this interpretation even if it could seem a bit weird.
Well, it's also known that Luftwaffe field division were supplied by wehrmacht so it's possible to see them with field grey uniforms.

[Treizoz]

I just think the blue is TOO blue, perhaps if you toned it down and made it more grey.

Honestly I do like the vanilla stlye luftwaffe uniforms in the full camo, if a HD and better looking version was made with that, I think it would be neat.

Good point on the SS, but a man can dram can't he?
Perhaps they put on their best clothes to die in

[Lethal Dosage]

Well i want a red santa suit for the german officer, and while were at it, little elf suits fopr the KCH. Anyone wanna try it? Please???????

[Ships]

i like your skin very much.

thats great^^

[luciferum]

I'm back with the first work on tank buster from Panzer Elite.

Modifications are :
- Camo helmet - as a lot of german helmets weren't grey anymore in 1944;
- The soldier is no more an NCO. I used the standart panzer grenadier collar patch;
- The buckel belt has been remade even if the picture result is not so impressive. A real 'god mit uns buckle as been used, a green painted one and not a shining silver one... I guess fighting units were avoiding to wear too bright equipments !!

All work has been made with photos.
.dif and .nrm have been changed ... Actually .spc too but as the shoulder ranks are not visible, it's useless.... It means I changed the shoulder rank too :s

New Camo blouse to come....

[Monkey Soldier]

Looks good, but can't you remove the panzerfaust, that thing is just so ugly on such a nice skin.

[luciferum]

A minor change to the Mod:
The flak crew are now Luftwaffe soldiers as shown on the picture.
Anyone knows how to remove this kind of square back pack ?

[Shaverman]

You could try to use an alpha channel and make it invisible.

[luciferum]

Here is the "pre"-final version of the tankBuster PanzerGrenadier.
He's wearing a hooded splinter A pattern smock.
Trousers have been lighten to look more field-grey...
As it was done previously, helmet has been repainted in a 3 color camo (used photos and real helmet I own), belt buckle made to 'Gott mit Uns' one and collar patches more like those Panzergrenadier were wearing in 1944.

Probable last changes will be the MP38/40 AMMO POUCH which will be no more in black leather...

[wagnerr]

It look too clean

[Lethal Dosage]

That looks really, really, really, good. But granted it does look a little bit too clean, perhaps he just get back from the dry cleaners?

Could you somehow remove the Panzerfaust from his back, and the big drum from the LuftGF's? I know halftrack has done that sorta thing with his Pio's and the Sdkfz 251.

[Monkey Soldier]

Nah, I don't think it is too clean. Its looking great. I like the helmet too, it really gives me that realistic feeling. As LD said, please remove the uber ugly panzerfaust.

[luciferum]

Hi...
Following your advises I removed panzerfaust and gas mask box...
Actually, tank buster teams have panzerschrek and no panzerfaust, so they are useless.
And as far as I know, gas attack was not considered as a threat against allies so gas mask tend to disapear at the en of war...
The splinter scheme has been slightly desaturate to look more real and some dirt added (very few).

I'm also proud to introduce a new skin for the hetzer...(the original one was ugly (to me).
This is the 3 colors camo inspired from 'Squadron Signal - Panzer Colors, camouflage of the german panzer forces 1939-1945'
So I've no doubt about the colors... The brown looks brick red as it was possible to saw it...
The paint reproduce the 'ambush scheme' seen in France during 1944.

Comments welcome, as usual...

Release of this skin mod update imminent... let say tomorrow !!!

[[]inveigle[]]

OMG the Jag camo makes me smile.

[Lethal Dosage]

He he, the Hetzer camo is funny, although strangely it does look quite appropriate, did you have to look long for a spot where the camo would look right?

Good to see the Tank buster there, but is ther ea way for him to keep his Zeltbahn and Mess tins? I reckon he did look better with them than the plain back.

I want to play with the new Hetzer! Waah Waah!

[hnunez]

i would make two versions of the panzer grenadier one with the panzer faust another without the panzerfaust but both should definitely have the gasmask canister moved or remove from the model if you decide on moving it move the canister to his rear and if you decide on deleting it well you eliminate the canister altogether but i like the idea of the model including the panzerfaust because it give the model a unique look that in my opinion is very cool.

Also i want to add in closing that you are extremely talented and i admire your work; its great to see new skins that have such attention to detail your work definitely complements other artists work on these forums and the fact that you take your timeout to produce such wonderful work is something that this forum needs more of. I look foward to seeing more of your work in the future.

[luciferum]

The mod is now released with the Tankbuster without panzerfaust.
I could make an update later and squads will include diversity so that in the same squad, some PG won't have PanzerFaust and some do.

To download the Historical Skin Mod v 0.17 please go to this page

[Monkey Soldier]

About the Jadpanzer...Can you maybe remove these ugly blue numbers?

[luciferum]

Hi...
Here is a preview of the marder III new skin... Dark sand yellow background colour was the basic one from 1943... M.III were seen in france in 1944 with this base colour with green stripes over it.
Guess Panzer Lehr division or 116 Pz. Division used this kind of camo.

[AnyKey]

Grade A work once again , may I suggest something? This camo looks more like a Desert one, rather than the base color with green stripes you've mentioned I think is a better choice. Would look more suitable on the battlefields of CoH.

[hnunez]

I think its a nice touch to use the camoflauge that you chose but you have to remember that the unit in the picture was shipped from africa after rommel withdrew his forces to europe the marders from the africa Korps were tranfered to the panzer abteilungs of the Korps commanding the normandy sector that is the reason that the camoflauge schemes have so much tan on them it stems from need and expidience so you could use the dotted pattern while i find some alternatives, or in the meantime go with what works and continue to do the great work that your talented mind is motivating you to create until there are more historical alternatives provided to you.

[luciferum]

Anykey and hnunez:

We're used to see german vehicles painted in grey. They're shown like that in many, many movies. Those movies are right when they try to represent germans before 1943. But after 1943, german base colour for vehicle was sand yellow (sand braun).
That means that when a vehicle went out of the factory, it was only painted in sand yellow even if this vehicle was designed to fight on western or eastern front.
Over this sand yellow painting, local commanders were free to apply green and brown camo pattern.
But supplies for those paints wasn't prioritary so that often only green or only brown was applied.
Over paint was also often made by the vehicle crew itself using their own means. Most of the times, the paint was mixed with water or petrol and sprayed with a compressor avaible in most engine compartment of german panzers. So that the brown or green pattern shape could very different from a vehicle to another one. And colour darkness changed too.
Allied reported that the brown was : light brown, dark brown and brick red (!).
To conclude: My Marder is not painted for Africa, it is for France !!!

All those datas are coming from many books. I recommend : 'Panzer Colours - Camouflage Of The German Panzer Forces 1939-45' from Squadron/Signal Publications.

For exemple:
Below is a Marder III photo taken in Belgium in automn 1944. No doubt, the marder is in Sand yellow with no overpaint.

[AnyKey]

I must admit I have no knowledge of such, that explains why you did what you did, I apologize if I insulted your intelligence




Luciferum, since you have more experience than I , would you happen to have any good web site links to uniforms/years used by German troops? As for the Waffen-SS divisions (17.SS & etc)/Wehrmacht divisions (Volksgrenadier squads) ? I would be more than greatful since I am trying to build some good knowledge before I take on my skin pack.

[luciferum]

Anykey: No need to apologize, this is a place to share knowledge ond opinions.
My documention comes mainly from books but I also internet sources. Historical military associations provide goods sources especially with with 'link' pages.
For exemple, check the link page of the 9th Panzer division Hohenstaufen association. From page to pages, you can get whatever you might seek.

[hnunez]

I think that the marder you are working on looks great and whatever choice you come up with will be well researched and have the historical accuracy that makes your work so impresive. it will be great to see what you decide to release in the next skin pack. heres some more info to help you out by providing some clarification on the stripes issue.

Late-war years
On 1943-02-18, it was ordered that all vehicles were to be painted in a base coat Dunkelgelb nach Muster (except for small equipment pieces, which were to retain the former colours). Over this, a camouflage pattern of Olivgrün (an RLM colour), Rotbraun RAL 8017 and Dunkelgelb nach Muster consisting of stripes was to be applied by the maintenance sections, according to the terrain. For this purpose, the paint was delivered as a paste, which could then be thinned with most liquids, and applied. Dunkelgelb nach Muster was later re-named Dunkelgelb RAL 7028, and Olivgrü was re-named Olivgrün RAL 6003.

On 1944-08-19, it was ordered that the tanks should be painted at the factories, in order to achieve more standardized patterns. The pattern used, called Hinterhalt-Tarnung, consisted of a base of Dunkelgelb RAL 7028, with Olivgrün RAL 6003 and Rotbraun RAL 8017 stripes. On top of this pattern were added small dots of all three paints.

In mid-September 1944, the tanks were were left in the red primer as the base coat, with only limited camouflage applied by the factories. On 1944-10-31, this order was expanded to include that both Dunkelgelb RAL 7028, Olivgrün RAL 6003 and Rotbraun RAL 8017 should be applied in limited amounts over the red primer, and that Dunkelgrau RAL 7021 could be used in stead of Dunkelgelb RAL 7028 is no Dunkelgelb RAL 7028 was available. There is no evidence that Dunkelgrau RAL 7021 was ever used, though.

On 1944-12-20, it was ordered that the base coat should be Dunkelgrün RAL 6003, with a hard-edged pattern of Rotbraun RAL 8017 and Dunkelgelb RAL 7028.

here a useful link for those interested in more info.
http://www.track-link.net/articles/78

[Monkey Soldier]

But were the Panthers and Tigers also painted in Sand Braun?

[luciferum]

Monkeys:
Of course. Some early tigers can be seen in grey but most of panthers and tigers came after 1943 so they had sand braun as base colour... and many kind of camo stripes over them...
hnunez:
Thanks a lot for this documentation :-)

[AnyKey]

This is probably off topic, but in topic, slightly? Now that I think of it all those damn stupid Hollywood movies are history incorrect, not that they were never anyway. In Saving Private Ryan, I can't remember if the vehicles seen in the movie we're theses colors schemes? since the movie did take part after July 6th 1944 I assume it should.


Thanks for the info luciferum/hnunez.

[luciferum]

It's not totally off topic... This place is 'Historical skin mod' so we need to find the more historical informations...
If I remember well, the Tiger of 'saving Ryan' had the right paint scheme... I have to see again this movie... quickly !
Band of brothers was quite good too except some mistakes...

[AnyKey]

You know the funny thing about SPR and BoB was that they had military advisers to get things done correctly, but I guess no need for WW2 historians to get the other most important details right .

[Lethal Dosage]

Luciferum, the Marders ok, however, could i suggest a bit more gerrn and some brown?

What i do like actually is camo pattern of the SPAT in the pic of the book that Hnunez supplied.

BTW Luciferum, i love you hetzer and am using it in my private mix of skins ATM, but it too could perhaps use a tad more green and brown in there, it looks alright in towns and around lighter dirt fields and desert maps, but it still doesn't look right in the majority of Normandy and Holland style maps.

Also, have you noticed that it has a gold plated roof MG?

[luciferum]

Hi all,

the v0.18 of the Historical Skin Mod will include the following changes and addon shown below:

- New Marder III skin (some brown has been added);
- Luftwaffe field soldier smock colour adjusted in order to look more splinter B real colors - Trousers and cap with a lighter blue grey;
- Tank buster Panzer grenadier hooded smock colour adjusted to be closer to the oldest splinter A colour scheme (1931 design) ...

v0.18 will be released within 2 days.