should they make ground units in hw2??????

[Cold)Hell69]

ive been thinking this through and i think they should add something where u can land on planets and fight each other with ground units and mine rus on the planets surface or some other kinda miniral that could be turned into RUs

i anoustly think this would make the game more challanging and fun(the only disadvantage is it would make games even longer then they allrdy r...) they could also make it where u could disable ground forces.

plz let me know what u think :monkey: :monkey: :monkey: :monkey:

[sajuukar]

Hmm interesting idea, thou it should be an option in mp just in case someone wants longer games or shorter ones. I have always been supportive of this idea, thou most of the game should still take place in 3D space, that's the primary idea behind it.
:angel:

[Cold)Hell69]

ya true most of it should take place in space but still being able to land on planets and harvets RUs or something could be real useful. cause u never know when the RUs will run out in space and u can always use the extra RUs:smash:

[milleniumfalken]

Personally i would like a Homeworld civ, starting when you reach Hiigara.And groundforces in HW2 = nothanks!:o

[x-crispy]

Planets = (really) Huge

HW Maps = Tiny

[ÜberJumper]

I don't think there will be ground vehicles in Homeworld 2 :-)

[Bazman]

If they have the time...make ground battles a mini game! Hell i wouldn't mind it if it looked like the original C&C even, extras can be fun :P

[Kamel]

PLZ no ground troops on HW2, we have thousands of ground troops strategy games to choise. :snore:

[Cold)Hell69]

true there r alot of ground games allrdy but still like bazman said it wouldnt be to bad to have it as a mini game

[Ryoken3D]

Make it a mix .. Half of the game Homeworld, Half Mech Commander


Naa..


Would be cool if in cutscenes you see your forces taking / loosing planets though .. MechC/Mech3/4 style Cutscenes



Ryoken3D

[Vaarok]

has anyone EVER read the NOT GOOD IDEAS list before demanding something like this?

[ArrowHawk]

Originally posted by Kamel
PLZ no ground troops on HW2, we have thousands of ground troops strategy games to choise. :snore:

They're all the same. Be it from Dune 2, CnC, RA, Dune2000, TibSun, or RA2.

Build powerplant. Build refinery. Build war factory, or now barracks, then war factory, pump out tanks. Build refinery again. Build defenses (flaks, SAM, rocket sols). Build refinery again. Another war factory. Another refinery. 25 tanks preped in 8 minutes (preferably less than 15 minutes) . Rush enemy base. You can also try the radar.

Watch wanton destruction as your 25 tanks roll over their infantries and destwoy their battle labs/tech centres/research centres (capture is an option) while you pump out more tanks. Then if he haven't sold anything, capture the rest (nukes, chronospheres, iron curtains are good stuff).

Then regroup, send your now 50 tanks against his ally. Watch the destruction and massacre as your kills increase to 1035.

[Sans_Shadow]

If you introduce this secondary element into the game, no matter how small, it will detract from the primary, making the overall game weaker.

But you never know... Relic could be developing both sides(!)
They said HW2 would once more revolutionise 3D RTS(!)

Think for a second - In HW, why don't cap ships fight upsides down or the like? Stop all this leveling off! It's not 3D! AAARGGHHH!!!! :boohoo:

:ninja: :hwpilot: :ninja:

[MrNonchalant]

Has anyone else besides me and Vaarok to realize that a good half this forum's apinion (this is their exact words) "ground forces= ghey."

I would support, however, a mission or two where you have to escort transports to planetary surfaces. That is all.

[Cold)Hell69]

i can see that every body had diff opinions. but i still am gonna stick with my original idea i do think they should have some sorta ground forces wether it be 1 mission or more or just a little mini game it would make the game more challaging..........

i wouldnt mind seeing some new forces in hw2...hey thats a good idea for a new thread....

[ozarkamax]

any body ever played star treck armada 2? they use the planets for resources... damn good idea if you ask me... keeps your harvestors in one place

[Mad_Scientist]

Originally posted by ArrowHawk
They're all the same. Be it from Dune 2, CnC, RA, Dune2000, TibSun, or RA2.

Hmm. While I don't know if ground combat is a good idea for HW2, there is some differences in ground based RTS games. Maybe the reason why the games you listed are all the same is because they were all made by the same company?
Of coarse, who knows what HW2 will be like.

[ArrowHawk]

Originally posted by Mad_Scientist

Hmm. While I don't know if ground combat is a good idea for HW2, there is some differences in ground based RTS games. Maybe the reason why the games you listed are all the same is because they were all made by the same company?
Of coarse, who knows what HW2 will be like.

I do play a lot of Warcraft II and Starcraft. The general tactic remains the same, generate as much peasant/probe as possible and build lots of combination basic units. Rarely do I employ more advanced (like carriers and the likes, usually i play as protoss) units in the field.

If there is one possible ground mission for homeworld2, I'd like it to be more like the starship trooper game, where you only go in with limited resource, complete the objective with as little casualty as you can, and get out.

[medamanx]

i dont know if any yall ever played IG2, but with ground combat i have a feeling that HW would become like IG2 and therefore reduce the overall play of the game, now im not saying IG2 sucks, i think it rocks, i just wish the MP for it was a little better, me and my bro never make it very far before an error..........

[Ryoken3D]

If there was groundcombat in HW2, it should be far more a computer functiuon that playing..

ie.. You fleet arives, the system is under attack.. You must defend while your troops get off the planet.. You could see the ground battle, but perhaps even order your fighters to provide cover.. but for most of it it would just be your fleet stoping enemy forces from landing, and protecting your dropships as they return with troops..
If this is a Prequle, this would be a great time to see the atomos depravation weapon like we saw in HW.. It could happen befrore you got all your troops back..


But Groundcombat should, if included, make up a Very small part..




Ryoken3D

[ADUN]

Originally posted by ArrowHawk


They're all the same. Be it from Dune 2, CnC, RA, Dune2000, TibSun, or RA2.

Build powerplant. Build refinery. Build war factory, or now barracks, then war factory, pump out tanks. Build refinery again. Build defenses (flaks, SAM, rocket sols). Build refinery again. Another war factory. Another refinery. 25 tanks preped in 8 minutes (preferably less than 15 minutes) . Rush enemy base. You can also try the radar.

Watch wanton destruction as your 25 tanks roll over their infantries and destwoy their battle labs/tech centres/research centres (capture is an option) while you pump out more tanks. Then if he haven't sold anything, capture the rest (nukes, chronospheres, iron curtains are good stuff).

Then regroup, send your now 50 tanks against his ally. Watch the destruction and massacre as your kills increase to 1035.

Thats cause all the games u mentioned are from the same company AND either from the dune or c&c series, dumbass

[ADUN]

Also, HW2 is suppost to be in space, not on a planet, Trying to put two opposit gameplay styles together dosnt usually work.
(Such as Uprising 2, lead and destroy)

[ArrowHawk]

Originally posted by ADUN


Thats cause all the games u mentioned are from the same company AND either from the dune or c&c series, dumbass

Read the other post dumbass. :flame:

[frstkor13]

Adun and Arrowhawk: do not post in this thread again.

[Sans_Shadow]

Aside from actual ground fighting, I would like to see fleets fighting in, say the stratosphere of a planet, or above the clouds with the sun shining on them or something.

It wouldn't be to hard to implement the effects of atmosphere on ship performance would it?

Oh... surface/city bombardments, debris and ships going down in flames and smoke would be.... :umm:.... nice.

[Zartax]

What would probably be a great game is a mix of HW, Ground Control och Populus: The begining (the round worlds from it, most of all).

Hw has great space combat. GC has great ground combat and Populus har the means to merge them together (i.e the globe worlds).

[Zartax]

[i]

Think for a second - In HW, why don't cap ships fight upsides down or the like? Stop all this leveling off! It's not 3D! AAARGGHHH!!!! :boohoo:

:ninja: :hwpilot: :ninja: [/B]

Because it looks better if all ships, or at least the majority, have the upside up and downside down. It doesen't affect the fact that HW is still true 3D RTS.

[mecha]

Sorry but having a ground based component would fail, some have said it should be a small part of the game, great! a small part of the game that takes up half the development sounds ideal. I'd rather have all the work spent on a single well realised hw2 environment, in space thx.

Why do people think that just adding every cool idea they have ever seen in a game will make something great? I know! How about an underwater element! OO! and how about you get to fly the ships, oh and maybe you can command the battle over a universe while taking part in FPS missions in a huge, online, mmorpg style world! and maybe there's some sort of dark chaotic techno organic threat as well! (how original) If you want that sort of thing then I'm sure Derek Smart would be interested in your custom

[Rent-a-Zilla]

Ok, the problem with this is that planets (or even moons) are HUGE. I don't know how big a typical HW map is, but the Moon has a diameter of 3500 kilometres!

So, either planets/moons will be distant background objects like Kharak/Hiigara or the research planet in Cata OR they will form the bottom of a vertical map with say 300'000 square kilometres of a planet's high atmosphere (approx 550x550km) making up the battle area. This wouldn't be a bad idea (atmosphere capable fighters could fly into the planet's atmosphere and evade sensors, before 'surfacing' elsewhere)

Here's my suggestion...

What about having large asteroids (megaroids) that are a bit bigger than an MS, say 8-9 kilometres across (not necessarily spherical)? By building a special (and expensive) mining platform, you could get a constant (and unlimited) amount of income from these megaroids. Megaroids could also harbour specific elements, or (given the PDA) may be the only way of acquiring enough RU to construct monstercaps(!).

However, before you could build a mining rig you would need to occupy/claim the asteroid by guarding it with a supercap (ships could be given an orbit command). The enemy could make a counter claim by destroying that supercap and replacing it with one of their own. I don't how this could be implemented, but if the megaroids were big enough you could make a long sensor 'shadow' that enemy ships could hide in (think of the sensors array like a lamp). The only way to get round this would be to put at least a dozen proxies into orbit (rather like a GPS net). Mining rigs would be vulnerable at all times to bombardment. The only scope for ground units would be automated tanks or troops that could be dropped onto the megaroid to steal or defend the mining operation

With a large map and one of these megaroids for per every 2 players, things could get rather interesting...

But ground units are a no-no. HW is primarily a space-combat game that takes place in one sphere (no warping to mini-games please); if you want to play at 3D ground battles, go buy The Moon Project and a very very fast computer (it's a good game, but ignore the crappy air units [they are effective, but look awful]).

[war]

that would take too long time to accomplish. And it would be too big, too.

[HWfreak11]

Star Trek Armada II has already made use of this idea in a way that would make it fit into an RTS 3D Game like HW! I have the demo and I have seen how they use planets:

1. They all have gravitational fields so that ships cannot use warp engines around them. The larger the planet, the larger the field.

2. Planets have been sort of "shrunk" so that they don't take up the whole map. It is similar to what they did in Starfleet Command. The distances are in 1000s of kilometers, but the ships are only a kilometer long, yet it looks like they are only 10 kilometers apart instead of 10,000.

3. You can do 2 things with planets in Armada II. You can mine metal from them with orbital processors (some planets have more than others), and you can colonize them. Some planets can be colonized and others can't. Once a planet reaches a certain population (I think) you can build ships from it. It serves as a foward base. Even more, you can add shields to planets, for a cost.

4. For those of you who think Armada is in 2D, it is. But Armada II (The one I am talking about) is in full 3D. Ships can not just go on X and Y axis, but they can move "up" and "down". You can move the camera just as you do in Empire Earth.

[Cold)Hell69]

i like your idea Rent-a-Zilla with the mining on astroids..

and actully i wouldnt mind seeing something like what HWfreak11 is talking about.

[Rebel]

I think it would be interesting if there was a level where you saw a cutscene of your mothership parking in orbit and then all your fighters zoom down to the planet's surface-> opening into a level where you have to support the ground troops, but where your fighters are always complaining about the fact that "Our ships are meant for space fleet command! We're just commiting suicide down here" at which point you get one level control over a nice Unit of kick ass tanks and infantry, until you finish researching a heavy artillery for your MS, which then pounds the hell out of everything on the ground. Then, after that level, which would just be a mini-game of sorts, you get extra pilots and commanders, e.g. double the ship caps.

[Sjet]

well its obviouse at least at the most I would like to see a NON-drawing mini movie I mean like yea the drawings are nice but why don't they ever put in real movies...that would be cool if they MADE a movie of homeworld and put it out in the theator but waiting this long for homeworld 2 to be out it better have alot better grapghics than the original:smash: or else:ninja:

[ADUN]

Makeing suggestions like this will just make hw2 as messed up as Cat. The flaws in Cat happend when BD started listening to their fans, they give you all the wierd stuff you ask for, and the game ends up sucking.

Even if its a minigame, this planetary battle thing would probably just turn hw2 into something like imperium galactica, it hase many different things, but not enough attention is paid to each component and your left with an overly complex game.

[iwanthw2]

No.

[Alpha_Monkey]

I agree.

The league of non-stupid-ideas starts here. Who's with me?

[Fissure]

Me.

Ground units in HW != A-1 SUPAR!

Note how it's usually the newbies that say these are good.

[Chaos Blade]

Yeah, ground combat it would be entirely impractical (actaully in space warfare the battle would preaty much end when the invaders take control of the planets low orbit, and deliver the ultimatum, surrender or die) cnsidering that a barrage rom orbit would preatty much 86 anything it hit on the surfrace.

though i'd like the mineing idea, could lax a bit the resource madness (but only if the asteroid has a limited albeit large cuantity of rp)


[newbie handle with care]

[Ryoken3D]

Originally posted by Chaos Blade
Yeah, ground combat it would be entirely impractical (actaully in space warfare the battle would preaty much end when the invaders take control of the planets low orbit, and deliver the ultimatum, surrender or die) cnsidering that a barrage rom orbit would preatty much 86 anything it hit on the surfrace.

Depends weather you wanna anhilate the planets population, or invade...

In Theory, ground combat is allready obsoleate.. Aircraft can bomb anything..

In Fact.. It is and will remian one of the most important elemnets in warfare..



That's not to say playable groundcombat is a good thing in HW, the more I think about it, the more I say no..
( I still think some cool groundcombat cutscens should be there whenever you take / lose a planet )



Ryoken3D

[skibb]

this idea of ground units and the people who support it is idiotic =[

[ozarkamax]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by HWfreak11
[B]Star Trek Armada II has already made use of this idea in a way that would make it fit into an RTS 3D Game like HW! I have the demo and I have seen how they use planets:

1. They all have gravitational fields so that ships cannot use warp engines around them. The larger the planet, the larger the field.

2. Planets have been sort of "shrunk" so that they don't take up the whole map. It is similar to what they did in Starfleet Command. The distances are in 1000s of kilome......



^ this wasnt exactly who i expected to see the light but i guess this works... yes... mining the planets AND using their gravitational fields ..... nebulas that have chaotic effects on ships.... geez... if only armada 2 and hw would combine then we would have ... GASP HW2!!!!

[Chaos Blade]

you could probably put out any focus of resistence, and then invade with verly light ground troops (ocupation rather than combat), and still use orbital bombardment to put out what ever remains hostile (it is quite diferent to bombard from low orbit than use aircraft)

[Vaarok]

We can flame him?

Sweet.

Dumbass ideas like yours are what tend to make great concepts go pants. Homeworld is an RTS about Epic Space Battles. If you remove Epic Space Battles from Homeworld, you're left with something... else.

Space 'terrain' like asteroids, nebulae, or such, implemented in a way that they're denser and impact on the map play or visuals (ships fighting through thick fog/clouds sounds good though) is acceptable.

Fighting on the ground is completely different from homeworld and negates the reason we want Homeworld2. We want Homeworld2, not some bloody Star Trek Armada or Earth 2150 hybrid. If we did, we'd buy those games.

[Captain Hagen]

HM multi can be boring sometime. Ground units is a brilliant idea. How about a surface based laser gun?

At least HM needs big planets to hide behind, more asteroid feelds. To play som hide and seek

Remember old Battlezone?

:ninja:

[skibb]

no its a horrible one sorries

lets just ruin one of the main things that makes hw so great with ground units k?

i dont see it in space, nor do i see 3d movements with the ground crap

[Liberator]

How about just a hint of Grnd Frces? Let it be Fleet's job(thats you) escort landing craft and cover them. Kind of like in Cata but break up the action with a cutscene that show the LC entering the Upper Atmosphere, then back to battle for a few minutes, then another cutscene that shows ultratech ground assault craft blasting their way into a heavily fortified compound or a pitched battle between rival armies from a low orbit ob.sat. if done correctly that has the potential of be SWEEEEET.

[IgnusDei]

Hey look a dino.



And BTW:



<---- I want ground forces! yipee!

[Ash]

Ground forces would really ruin the concept of Homeworld's 3D fleet tactics RTS.

It would be fine if you had to escort ships down to a planet's surface or even could have orbital facilities or mine planets for minerals.. but there is one problem

SIZE
Planets in HW1 were 2D... you couldn't move around them and you didnt know the distance so you couldn't see the ships' sizes in perspective with the planet

They would be either HUGE or would be 'small,' which means Heavy Cruiser and Mothership-size ships should have their own gravitational fields/atmospheres/etc.... which wouldnt really work

ALSO, if you had full size planets you would have to have some way to put ships in orbit around them or something to maintain the semi-real physics that HW1 had.

[Liberator]

Originally posted by Asheshi
Ground forces would really ruin the concept of Homeworld's 3D fleet tactics RTS.

It would be fine if you had to escort ships down to a planet's surface or even could have orbital facilities or mine planets for minerals.. but there is one problem

SIZE
Planets in HW1 were 2D... you couldn't move around them and you didnt know the distance so you couldn't see the ships' sizes in perspective with the planet

ALSO, if you had full size planets you would have to have some way to put ships in orbit around them or something to maintain the semi-real physics that HW1 had.

Okay, granted, planets are frickin' huge! But remember, size is relative, you can have ships the size of the Mothership and still have small planets, visually speaking. The Mothership is at most 1-2 Kilometers tall and a small fraction wide and deep. Space is vast. Look at the picture of Earth as veiwed from the moon. You could put a ship a Kilometer long in between and lose it real quick. Relativly speaking the ship in HW and Cata are quite large, but they are still tiny in relation to planets. So you could have large scale fleet engagments and still have small planets.

On to my Idea, how about spliting the fleet. Take the planet into account. Put the resourcers on the opposite side of the planet with a small garrison. This not only divides your opponents attention, it allows you build your forces with fewer distractions of harrasment forces and throws some interesting tactical questions at the player.