[*ToV*] New Enhanced Combat Leader: Beyond Overlord ver.2.9.4 Released!!

[hnunez]

here is the first new banner from tkross at the request of popadaddy the Enhanced Combat Leader: Beyond Overlord development teams graphics artist and mapper.

here is the link to the image for those people who are fans of Enhanced Combat Leader: Beyond Overlord

http://img404.imageshack.us/my.php?i...dcombatyg9.jpg

[hnunez]

The Panzergrenadier and Panzeraufklärungs battalions had Panzerpioniers, Panzerpionier units in the Pionier battalions of Panzer and Panzergrenadier divisions were 9 men squads, armed with Kar98 rifles and two MG34/42 LMGs. each armored unit rode in one half-track, while the Motorized units sometimes packed several teams into a single truck. Armored Panzerpioniers were the most likely to have Stuka zu Fuss rocket launchers on their transports. Fallschirmpionier units in the Pionier battalions of Fallschirm divisions were structured like Fallschirmjäger squads, so 11 men with Kar98 rifles and one MG42 LMG.

Some battalions had their own Pionier units strictly for supporting their own units. Panzer and Schwere Panzer Battalions had a motorized Pionier platoon in Opel Blitz trucks, structured like Panzerpioniers but with one less MG42. They created bridges, removed obstructions, and erected defenses, so that the Panzers could advance unhindered.

[tskross]

Actually...
I did those two banners for you, at poppadaddy's request
cheers
tskross

[hnunez]

@tkross wow thank you are extremely talented i appreciate the work you did to help this project out.

[tskross]

No problem, I'm really looking forward to this mod, as an old close combat player and CoH fan! Let me now if you need anything like loading screens, menu items etc..
keep it up

[hnunez]

@tkross Well in fact I do need your help, I have lots of images that could be used for loading screens and menus but need the talents of a gifted artist like you to make them have that great touch. I could send you an email with some images that you could use for the loading screen I have both the background and the foreground image layer the only thing you would have to do is make the logo that says Enhanced Combat Leader: Beyond Overlord and put all the images together.

[popadaddy]

Hey guys, Tskross thanks for the banners again, hope there good for you hnunez,

I never once said i created the banners though, i wasnt trying to steal your work tskross, just using it to help the progress of the mod. Basically the pictures are mine, however the labour and hard work is all your work.

Hnunez have you got any idea when you would like me to start mapping?

if so please pm me

ALso if you would ever like me to find some more pictures or videos for the benifit of the mod please say so, i have absolutely loads of Ww2 media on my comp. Also if you want me to research a specific unit(s) just say the word.

I can also make music videos of this mod if you like, i.e Windows movie maker + Music.
You should check my youtube acount biggydbluds for my normandy 44 mod vids, i have alot more videos in better quality they just take ages to upload.

Thanks

[tskross]

no problem poppa, didn't mean to imply that you stole anything, just wanted to avoid future confusion

[hnunez]

@popadaddy its great to have you on the team, I will get you a great map for you to start on right away, so you don’t get overwhelmed we will do one map at a time you should have the first one in your email already. The way im structuring this is that there are dog green, dog white, easy green, fox green, exit 1, la fiere, longues, louvieres, point du hoc, point percee, port bessin, trevieres, utah, and Vierville. We will start with the beach maps first and work our way inland from there.



@tkross thank you again for the help on this project your artistic talents are very much appreciated. You should have the latest set of images for the loading screen so we will start there.

[popadaddy]

Do you want me to get started with the beach map then from the picture you sent me?

[hnunez]

@popadaddy yes please do this one first because its the only one i havent started yet. it needs to be wide 256 x long 1024. thx

[hnunez]

German, American, and British forces had at least one engineer battalion listed in their tables of organization and equipment as a form of organic divisional support. In addition Germans had a Pioneer platoon as part of their regimental headquarters company, while US Infantry battalions had an ammunition & pioneer platoon as part of their headquarters company, and British Rifle battalions had a Pioneer platoon in the support company for the purpose of providing addition to support for combat related task. the US Engineer Combat battalion and British Royal Engineers that were organized into battalion strength at the divisional level.

Though only the Germans fielded Pionier companies as formations that could fight independently. Other nations used them as support, so they usually split them into platoons and assigned to other units as needed.

As for what engineers of all nations can do, they'll be able to do the following:
- Remove barbed wire, sandbags, tank traps
- Place demolition charges
- Build basic defenses (barbed wire, sandbags, tank traps)
- Use demolition charges or mines to assault tanks at close range
- Rebuild bridges
- Detect mines (with a minesweeper upgrade)

(NOTE: all engineer units can do everything from the above. For example, the motorized Pioniers for a Panzer battalion can remove obstructions and rebuild bridges, but receive a building time penalty for constructing defenses and placing tank traps)

All infantry can build sandbags, slit trenches, barbed wire and place land mines but cannot build anti-tank obstacles or fortifications. Infantry also receive a significant time penalty when building fortifications (increase the time it takes to build fortified defenses while making the ability to build them standard.) US engineers will receive the addition of an Engineer Sergeant which will decreases their build time for fortified defenses and make additional structures they can build available such as mortar pits, mg nests, anti-tank nests, anti-aircraft nests, and artillery nests.

Howitzers have movement capability but will have very limited mobility and will require a long setup time before firing.

[popadaddy]

Hi Hnunez, im about 1/5 of the way to completing the d-day map. Would you like me to post screenshots?

Also how would you like me to build the back end of the map up, i.e further in-land from the forticifations. WOuld you like me to build field and some tres and houses or just muddy fields?

I need to know, because with your 256x1024 requirements, it means there isa hell of a lot to fill up.

thanks

Here's a screenie

[IMG][/IMG]

[hnunez]

@popadaddy I’ve sent you the next image of the map remember that this is the Charlie beach sector so it’s the upper left area of the map, there are numerous small fields displayed on the map, make the fields on the game map large, spread the houses apart widely don't clump too many buildings up in one area instead spread them out evenly and when you clump them together only use a few buildings in small clumps. Don’t forget to make the entrenchments for the Germans make weapons pits and zig zag pattern trenches; also post more pictures so I can get a better idea of where the placement of objects are on the map. Once again your doing a great job thank you for all your hard work.

[newBAUS]

Man that map would be awesome to see in CoH, although i have doubts about how realistic it will be due to the game engine (people shooting through the cliff to people at the bottom/top at impossible angles, which will be a problem for increased ranges)
Really hope you can pull off this great mod.

[hnunez]

@newbaus the solution to that problem is shot blocking there is a flag in the game engine files that can be modified with the corsix editor that allows you to use shot blocking for objects to prevent unrealistic shooting angles, this eliminates the unrealistic effect of small arms fire travelling through terrain.

[hanz gooblemien]

lol...hnunez...gotta love that top left image....its gotta be a Close Combat map..! (invasion normandy perhaps?)

hope the alpha/beta is ready soon..as im tired of drooling on my kb.

[Cody03man]

Wow, this looks very interesting...I'll keep my eye on this, keep up the good work HN..

[Genya]

Looks amazing, best of luck to you.. I will be keeping my eye out

[hnunez]

Dont worry Enhanced Combat Leader: Beyond Overlord fans you will not have to wait very long for this mod popadaddy is making the maps and I am working on the lua, code development, tskross is doing the graphics and the mod will be an open beta for all to play and give feedback on this thread so expect to see an early release in about two months, along with a map to follow as soon as popadaddy is done making it, when we have enough multi-player maps I will package everything together into a mappack and release that for you guys.

It will eventually include all the Landing beaches of the normandy campaign, each landing area will be divided into a seperate beach sectors and wil be SCAR coded for multi-player games that will follow the historical information while providing players enough flexibility to allow them to build up bases and get further reinforcements as they fight all over the map.

[hnunez]

A Grenadier company would consist of the following troops and equipment listed in the table below:

Company Headquarters
Company Commander Officer MP40, pistol Bicycle (2);Horse (2);cart & trailer
Company Troop Leader NCO MP40
Combat Vehicle Leader NCO MP40
Medic NCO Pistol
Messenger Private Rifle
Messenger (2) Private Rifle
Signalers (4) Private Rifle
Horse leader * Private Rifle

Heavy Machine Gun Section

Section HQ
Section Leader NCO MP40 Horse (3), cart & trailer; wagon
Messenger Private Rifle
Gunsmith Private Rifle
Wagon driver Private Rifle

HMG Squad (2) each
Squad Leader NCO MP40
Machine Gunner Private Pistol, MG34/42 (HMG)
Assistant Gunner Private Pistol
Rifleman (3) Private Rifle
Horse leader Private Rifle

Rifle Platoon (3), each

Platoon HQ
Platoon Commander* see note MP40, pistol Horse (3); cart, wagon & trailer (2)
Messenger (2) Private Rifle
Stretcher Bearer Private Pistol
Wagon driver Private Rifle
Horse leader Private Rifle

Rifle Squad (3) each
Squad Leader NCO MP40
Rifleman (5) Private Rifle
Machine Gunner Private Pistol, MG34/42 (LMG)
Assistant Gunner Private Rifle

Company Train
Train Leader Hautpfeldwebel
NCO Pistol Bicycle; Horse (8), wagon (3) & trailer (2)
Field Cook NCO Rifle
Pay Clerk NCO Rifle
Company Clerk Private Rifle, MG34/42 (LMG)-
Gunsmith Private Rifle
Shoemaker Private Rifle
Tailor Private Rifle
Field Cook Private Rifle
Wagon driver Private Rifle
Wagon driver (3) Private Rifle

*all wagons, weapons trailer and Bicycles are abstracted (there are no models for them in game) however they affect the recharge rate of munitions based abilities, the build, and reinforcement time for units by reducing the values for the respective statistic by a small fractional value.

[hnunez]

A player will need to use Assault Engineers to destroy enemy obstacles, structures, and Infantry. They can construct sandbags, wire obstacles, tank-traps, and can lay mines. However, they cannot repair vehicles or build advanced structures. You may upgrade your Assault Engineer squads with Flamethrowers, Satchel Charges, Wire Cutters, and Demolitions.

Bunkers will also have limited garrison capacity (holds (9) men; (2) slots; of varied squad types add new tactical elements that enhance game play as well as provide for added realism.) with the added penalty of taking longer to build. Medical bunkers provide radius of effect health regeneration aura, as well as being reinforcement points for infantry. Repair bunkers permit german vehicles to upgrade without having to return to base in addition to providing vehicle repair capabilities. Listening Posts will become rally locations for your infantry where routed squads can regroup without having to return all the way to your base but with the added penalty of taking longer to build.

[popadaddy]

[IMG][/IMG]

[IMG][/IMG] here are some updated scrrenies, i have completely overhauled the map since last time, enjoy...

[IMG][/IMG]

[hnunez]

@popadaddy Nice work its looking very good, cant wait to see what it will be like when its done. there are just a few details i could see that may need some minor tweaks the big naval gun should have a rocky out cropping in front of the concrete super-structure but that is the only thing that i can see that would need modification. other than that its looking really good. youre doing a great job I appreciate all your effort and am really glad to recieve your help.

[hnunez]

Headquarters units provide the following modifiers: weapon reload, weapon cooldown, weapon accuracy, received suppression, to the all units within radius of effect. These bonuses increase incrementally as the command unit gains experience. Squad Units gain sight radius, maximum health, movement speed, received accuracy, received damage, as they increase in veterancy

[Cody03man]

Any screenshots of the new units?

[Monkey Soldier]

Im really impressed by your map

[popadaddy]

Thanks m8, just 1 question for you ww2 buffs, does anyone know what the germans trenches/fortification on omaha beach at Charlie sector looked like? i cant find many images on google.

Thanks

[hnunez]

@popadaddy I would go with the way they are made in the d-day landing map of the first mission of the US campaign It looks the best and allows you to make weapon pits for things like FlaK, ATGs, mortars, and HMGs also remember to use the logs for the pathing along the inside of the trench line.

[Monkey Soldier]

It was a labyrinth of trenches there.

[hnunez]

screenshots of all the new units will follow in about three weeks, just keep checking in for further updates.

[hnunez]

Since there are alot of armor comparison charts being produced about Armor values for company of heroes I decided to discuss the issue about how armor values are calculated in Enhanced Combat Leader its a simple mathematical model, by adding all armor values in mm from the front {lower, upper superstructure} + {turret front, mantlet} then dividing by {the sum of all sides} to calculate the frontal armor value.

The side {lower, upper superstructure} + {turret side} rear and top then dividing by {the sum of all sides} to calculate the rear armor value. Penetration values are calculated from historical documentation and then modified by the type of projectile fired by the weapon, and range of the gun from its target so the penetration value of a gun becomes higher as the range decreases. For top hits, I use modifiers for blast radius, so that a direct hit has a higher penetration chance than a hit that lands nearby. Same for hits from mines, so that a tank driving over a mine is penetrated, but a mine that goes off nearby has next to no chance to cause penetration.

[hnunez]

Enhanced Combat Leader uses a mathematical model that changes the fundamentals of how armor values are handled by the game engine to produce a much more realistic feel; these changes also equate real world values of armor thickness in mm/cm, slope/curve, and material/construction quality to determine the health, and penetration modifiers[+/-] for the target type tables.

[hnunez]

The ratings aren't a direct comparison to each other either, except within their own chart.

Basically, if an anti-tank rating is equal or less than an armor rating, it has almost no chance of penetrating (1% chance, in the event that it's possible to penetrate the rear, because of how the game engine calculates penetration values). Just being 1 point higher means there is barely a chance for the round to penetrate. Every point above the armor rating provides a 15% chance of penetration at point blank range, if the penetration value is 7 points above the armor rating the shot will have approximately 105% chance to penetrate the armor rating of the target at point blank range.

This makes the Pershing tank a very valuable asset for the allies and since very few of these tanks were available before the end of the war. Allied players will have to provide adequate support to their tank forces and apply a combined arms approach in order to succeed in engagements against heavier better armed German tanks.

[whitewolfmxc]

shouldn't King tiger be on the top of the list ?

[Monkey Soldier]

That list is of VCoH, not OF.

[Sturmhaubitze]

That list is one I posted in my Fortress Europe thread, and does not show the default penetration of Company of Heroes. Those are the values for Flames of War, a tabletop WWII miniature wargame, which I have been using to ballpark all my gun vs. armour figures. Since they've gone through all the trouble of simplifying penetration values down to a single number, and CoH uses a single number, I thought it was a good starting point. Or even a good ending point. They have far more historical research resources at their disposal than I do.

The basic math behind those numbers is that a tank that's hit by a gun rolls a six-sided die and adds the result to its armour value for that facing (even if it's 0, 0 just means it's armoured but barely, or that it's armoured but has openings like an open crew compartment). If the result is higher, the shot deflects. If it's equal, then a partial penetration or some exterior damage was dealt, and the tank is temporarily halted (crew bails out in fear, crew is stunned, crew hops out to inspect the damage, etc.). If the roll is under, the tank is penetrated and a second roll is done to see if the tank is knocked out or just bailed as per an equal result.

So if the AT rating equals the armour rating, there's no chance of hurting the tank. It would need to exceed by 1 to have a chance, and preferably by 3 or more. At long ranges the effective armour value is increased by 1, to account for a drop in velocity.

I took down the chart as it was causing some confusion, and I was going to replace it with one that had percentages rather than vague numbers.

For the curious, the Kingtiger has a front armour of 14, a side/rear of 8, and a top of 2. It's main gun has an AT of 16. Jagdpanther has same armour as Panther, and same gun as the Kingtiger.
Marder III M, Hummel, SdKfz 221/222/223, and all SdKfz 250 variants have same armour as 251 half-track.
Jagdpanzer 38t "Hetzer" has (unofficially, it hasn't shown up yet in Flames of War) front of 8, side/rear of 2, top of 1. PaK39 has AT of 11.
British Shermans have front of 6, rest the same. 17 pounder has AT of 13.
Churchill Mk IV has front of 8, side/rear of 7, top of 2. It's 6 pounder has AT of 10.
Cromwell has front of 6, side/rear of 4, top of 1. It's 75mm has AT of 10.
Churchill Crocodile has front of 13, side/rear of 7, top of 1 (They were a variant of the Mk VII, not the Mk IV).
Stuart has front of 4, side/rear of 2, top of 1. 37mm has AT of 7, as per Greyhound.

[hnunez]

@sturmhaubitze thank you as always for your input, its always appreciated.

ASL also had a system similar to flames of war for resolving armor penetration but it seems a bit too abstract for a realism mod. however, I agree that it does simplify the calculations of resolving damage by using a simple mathematical model, the only problem I have with that is that the mathematical model is based upon a random digit between 1-6 on a sided dice this effectively invalidates the results in a realism based game that is why I decided on using a different mathematical model that i felt better suited the game mechanics of Enhanced Combat Leader: Beyond Overlord the new mathematical model that i use actually gives results with values that are much more realistic than the plain vanilla Company of Heroes: Opposing Fronts by rescaling the armor,penetration, and damage ratings for all weapons and vehicles.

[whitewolfmxc]

good to know you guys have the idea on how to make it real and fun XD hope to see beta soon XD

[hnunez]

the first beta release will be along very soon, just getting all the data in order so that i can streamline the debugging process, I've got alot of coding done so far so it should be released very soon so just keep checking in for more updates about the release date.

[hnunez]

Abilities like camouflage become standard for all infantry and support weapons (as well as certain types of vehicles.) permitting these units to automatically camouflage themselves in light or heavy cover, recieve bonus modifiers during their initial attack on enemies, and decrease the time they remain visible after firing at enemy units (dependent on cover type) for all command units, infantry, HMG Sections, Mortar Sections and anti-tank guns. German Aufklärungs, American Divisional Calvary Scouts, and British Reconnaisence Infantry Squads recieve the ability to reveal units on the game map through fog of war within a radius of effect beyond their maximum visual range (see tank awareness) recon units also detect camouflaged units at 65% of max sight range.

Motorcycles and schwimmwagen Type 166: generate an area of effect aura which provides friendly infantry units with a bonus to both their capture rate and supression recovery rate. They can also detect camouflaged units at 65% of its max sight range and have the abilty to both fire ap ammunition burst, and supression.

Kettenkrad: Has an area of effect aura which doubles the rate at which munitons dependent abilities are replenished; doubles the rate at which construction or unit upgrades are completed (See supervise bility). It also has the ability to do rudementary repairs, and salvage wrecks.

Panzerspähwagen SdKfz 223 (Fu): armored car is a recon headquarters command unit which has an area of effect aura that improves the capture rate of infantry squads, increases suppression threshold, recovery rate, and pinned threshold within 35% of its visual range. This unit is a recon unit and has the ability to detect camouflaged units within 65% of its visual range, as well as the ability to divert enemy resources, fire ap ammunition burts, cause suppression, and button enemy vehicles*. It can also follow nearby friendly units automatically by the maintaining its command range.

However, recon vehicles now have very slow capture rates, and their area effect abilities require the player have at least (1) sdkfz. 250/3 or company hq squad built.

[Jordanman]

sounds cool

have u completed yet and is there any download links yet??
thnx

[hnunez]

Enhanced Combat Leader is still in early alpha stage of development, however there will be a public beta release version for the community to beta test, players of the game are encouraged to post their feedback on this thread. please leave detailed descriptions of the error(s) encountered along with both screenshots and the errorlog generated from the game if possible. replays will also be very appreciated and they can posted on this thread as well, that way i can resolve all technical issues quickly and release updates to the game sooner.

[hnunez]

Take advantage of the mobility your halftracks provide to gain ground. All Halftracks also provide protection to nearby troops (If your troops are unmounted within close proximity from their halftracks they will recieve a cover modifier [+] so as to make themselves harder to hit and less likely to get either supressed or hurt.) This simulates the tactics armored infantry used to capatilize on the benefits of protection provided by armored halftrack vehicles during the phase in which they dismounted into battle. Additionally, only halftracks armed with heavy machineguns as their primary armament have the ability to fire ap ammunition burst, suppression, or to button enemy vehicles*.

Sdkfz. 250/3 halftracks provide command and control for reconnasience units by providing an area of effect aura that improves capture rate, suppression threshold, recovery rate, and pinned threshold for infantry units. Additionaly this unit acts as a mobile rally point for retreating units. The Sdkfz. 250/3 also has the ability to secure friendly sectors, and call artillery smoke barrages*

Sdkfz. 250/10, 251/10, platoon hq halftracks differ in that their abilities allow them to fire pzgrnt 39/40 ap ammunition, or engage targets with focused fire*.

Sdkfz.251/7 pioneer halftracks provide additional vehicle build/ repair bonuses[+] that permit faster construction and repairs of both buildings and bridges (see supervision ability) it also is the only unit that can construct the goliath remote control demolition unit.

Sdkfz.251/8 armored ambulance, are halftracks that dont have weapons or carry infantry squads but provide an area effect aura which both heals and increases the health regeneration rate of nearby friendly units, and provides the ability to reinforcement nearby infantry squads.

However, all other halftracks are no longer able reinforce infantry squads and their area of effect aura abilities have a required squad prequesite that must be met before it can become automatically activated (player must build either a Company HQ squad or a HQ command vehicle).

[hnunez]

German units may research the ability to obtain shipments of disposable antitank rockets and fashion improvised explosives from materials on hand. All German infantry gain the Panzerfaust abilities. Grenadiers VolksGrenadiers, and Panzer Grenadiers, gain the Panzerfaust ability, these abilities use up ammunition resources and have increased ability recharge times, Pioniers can also toss Panzerknacker antitank grenades in close range.

[hnunez]

US Armored Rifle Company (ETO: 1944-45)

• Armored Rifle Company Headquarters platoon, with:
  
  • 2 Willys MB 1/4 ton. 4x4 Jeep (.30-cal M1919A4)
  • 2 M3A1 Halftracks each carrying one Armored Infantry Company HQ squad
  • 2 GMC CCKW 6x6 2-1/2 ton. (G-508) Truck [Logistics & Supply
• 3 Armored Rifle platoons, each with:
  
  
  • 1 M3A1 Half-track carrying one Armored Infantry Platoon HQ squad
  • 2 M3A1 Half-tracks each carrying one Armored Rifle squad
  • 1 M3A1 Half-track carrying one M2 60mm Mortar team
  • 1 M3A1 Half-track carrying one .30-cal. M1919A4 Light Machinegun team
• 1 Armored Machinegun section, each with:
  
  
  • 1 M3A1 Half-tracks carrying two M1917 Machine-gun teams
• 1 Armored Mortar section, with:
  
  
  • 1 M3A1 Half-tracks carrying one M1 81mm Mortar team
• 1 Anti-tank Platoon, with:
  
  
  • 1 Willys MB 1/4 ton. 4x4 Jeep (.30-cal M1919A4)
  • 3 M1 57mm Anti-tank guns
  • 3 M3A1 Half-tracks carrying 3 anti-tank gun crews
• 1 Corps Anti-aircraft Artillery (SP) detachment, with:
  
  
  • 2 M16 MGMC AA Half-track
• 1 Divisional Calvary Reconnaissance Detachment, with:
  
  
  • 1 M8 Greyhounds
  • 2 Willys MB 1/4 ton. 4x4 Jeep (.30-cal M1919A4)
• 1 Combat Engineer platoon, with:
  
  
  • 2 GMC CCKW 6x6 2-1/2 ton. (G-508) Truck [Troop Transport] each carrying one Pioneer and Ammunition squad
  • 1 GMC CCKW 6x6 2-1/2 ton. (G-508) Truck [Troop Transport] carrying one M1917 Machine-gun Engineer squad
  • 1 M4A3 Sherman Bulldozer* (75mm) OR M4-POA-CWS 75H2 Sherman (flamethrower) tank with Mine Flail
• 1 Battalion Headquarters Detachment, with:
  
  
  • 1 M3A1
  • 2 Willys MB 1/4 ton. 4x4 Jeep (.30-cal M1919A4)
• 1 Battalion Service Company Ammunition & Supply Detachment, with:
  
  
  • 1 GMC CCKW 6x6 2-1/2 ton. [Logistics & Supply]
• 1 Battalion Reconnaissance Platoon Detachment, with:
  
  
  • 2 Willys MB 1/4 ton. 4x4 Jeep (.30-cal M1919A4)
• 1 Light Company Headquarters Detachment, with:
  
  
  • 1 M5A1 Stuart
  • 1 Willys MB 1/4 ton. 4x4 Jeep (.30-cal M1919A4)
• 1 Light Company Tank platoon, with:
  
  
  • 5 M5A1 Stuart
• 1 Medium Company Headquarters Detachment, with:
  
  
  • 1 M4A3 (76)* "Sherman" Medium Tank
  • 1 Willys MB 1/4 ton. 4x4 Jeep (.30-cal M1919A4)
• 1 Medium Company Platoon, with:
  
  
  • 5 M4A3 Sherman (76mm*)
• 1 Armored Field Artillery battery, with:
  
  
  • 6 M7 "Priest" Self-propelled Artillery Gun
  • 1 M4 Sherman Observer

*requires player researched upgrade[/b]

[Sturmhaubitze]

If you're going to keep on citing my documents, please note it as such. I can easily tell that's one of my older lists, as you've exactly duplicated the errors/changes I made to the actual TO&E for Armored Rifles.

[fldash]

Very interesting to say the least... Are you sure he's citing your stuff and not pulling directly from FOW? I don't really know because I never examined your old documents in that much detail. I did find it peculiar how similar to your mod all this sounds. Then again, if you are using the same base reference (FOW), wouldn't it be expected?

[hnunez]

there are certain reference sources that sturmhaubitze gave me to research and i listed his input and commentary as credited for the inspiration he has provided , he has extensive knowlwedge of world war II and has been extremely helpful in providing tremendous insight into the orginization and equipment of both the axis and the allied armies, I also have been reading extensively the FOW materials and ASL materials that I have, I also included some of the information from that source and from his thread also in quotes; the structure of the TO&E references comes from the Osprey series books as well as the encyclopedia of US armed forces, as well as my development notes. some of the materials from the flames of war site also were researched and have been noted where they appear by their respective posts on this thread.

[Sturmhaubitze]

Your Armored Rifle Company lists comes from the first thread of this page:
http://forums.relicnews.com/showthre...&page=12&pp=15

You've touched it up a bit, but it still has the tell-tale error of the M1917 team in the Armored Rifle Platoon. In actuality it was an M1919 section consisting of 2 LMGs, but CoH doesn't have the M1919 so I fudged it a little bit.

Not saying you can't use my research, as WWII is WWII and so our mods will look quite similar, but do remember to quote your sources