Star Trek mod for HW2

[Firewarrior1705]

I was wondering if there's any ST mod for HW2, I liked very much the Sacrifice of angels mod for HW1 and I'm a very big star trek fan. Can anyone help pls?

[Joe 2987]

This has been tried, but so far, every time, the maker gets slapped with a copyright infringement - from the modelers. No one seems to have figured out how to make thier own models or get permission to use another persons.

Although, I have permission from a couple model makers to use their models as long as I give them credit in the Readme. One was even kind enought to make a low-poly version of a ship for LOD's. It is a possibility that I may actually get moving on this, but it's not entirely likely.

[Moleman]

wait so that why i havent seen any startrek mods, its becasue of the dang goppyright

[Joe 2987]

Yup. Except that Paramount/Gene Roddenberry/Whoever owns ST right now hasn't slapped copyright infringment lawsuits as much as the model creators. They seem to enjoy putting their models up for download and then stating in invisible tiny font that you can't use them for anything. Then they sue.

[adamstrange]

Here you go.
https://www.yousendit.com/download/Q...a0RiV3l4dnc9PQ

[Firewarrior1705]

Thanks buddy any chance of telling me what I have to write in the properties target box to make it work?

I tried the overridebigfile command and the GUI is activated, but when going in skirmish I still have higaran ships.

[adamstrange]

Hmmm,thats odd

Thats something I didn't figure out because it happens to me also.

The Klingon race is there but Starfleet doesn't start up.

[Firewarrior1705]

and the mod is unplayable because the scales are way to big. Too bad the mod team didn't continue the work on it.

[Joe 2987]

Honestly, AT:CtB isn't the best mod. The models are okay, but the textures kind of ruin it. Anyway, If I can get a mod team or even just get a little motivation, I could release a beta for a ST mod. The only problem is that the high-poly model would cause too much lag, and the low-poly model is un-textured.

I can only remember that this fighter is from a DS9 episode:

High Poly:*
Poly count: 44,383
Edge count: 67,509
Detail: Ultra-High
UV Mapped?: Yes

Low Poly:



Poly Count: 443
Edge Count: 709
Detail: Medium
UV Mapped?: No

*The High poly version takes about 3 hours to render. No picture provided because I don't have 3 hours.

[adamstrange]

Hey Joe, I think you should create your ST mod with all the ships from the entire ST series.

[Firewarrior1705]

not necessarily. TNG and then DS9 would do fine, and the races should be: Federation, Klingons, Romulans, Cardies+Dominion+Breen and (maybe) Borg. You can find a lot of great models on Armada2.filefront.com and many of them are open source which means that you don't need permission for all of them. I myself am working on a A2 mod for quite some time and I still have a lot to do. If you need any suggestions on ST ship balance I'm your man

[Joe 2987]

Yeah, I am going to create it with TNG/DS9/VOY ships. Honestly, I should be able to model all the ships from memory, seeing as I own almost all of TNG, rented all of DS9 and I am half-way through season 2 of VOY, but I have no modelling skill.

I may or may not create a campaign or three (one for TNG, one for DS9, and one for VOY, presented in chapters. One Chapter = one Season). The Voyager campaign would be fairly simple, and all it would be is Voyager's journey Home. TNG would really have no cohesive story until about Season 3 or 4, when they started using persistant storylines. DS9 would be really easy to make because it is almost all battles.

Things that would require a lot of work to make:

-Phaser Arcs: On most ships, phasers are the main weapons. They come in arcs. The best way to make this would be to use an animated turret at the center of the arc (all points on the arc are the same distance) and make the muzzle at the middle point of the arc. The problem with this is that the phasers would go through the ship's hull because of the way turrets are made (I think, I may need help for this part).

-Warp Drive: I may just need to disable this, although I could make NIS's at the beginning and end of each mission showing the Warp Drive animation.

- Photon/Quantum Torpedo's: Find Yellow-Orange and Blue Star-bursts or make my own. Have the HOD jsut be blank and attach this effect.

That's the hard part.

Maybe this should be move to Mods in Progress because I'm working on getting a ST model - Any ST model - in-game.

[TON_Viper]

-Phaser Arcs: On most ships, phasers are the main weapons. They come in arcs. The best way to make this would be to use an animated turret at the center of the arc (all points on the arc are the same distance) and make the muzzle at the middle point of the arc. The problem with this is that the phasers would go through the ship's hull because of the way turrets are made (I think, I may need help for this part).

This has been attempted before without luck. The problem is that if you implement it the way you suggest, the turret would only be capable of aiming straight out from the arc. At least that was the consensus reached the last time it was discussed.

I'm thinking that if you place the turret joint at the base of the arc and the barrel joint (for pointing up or down) at the level of the arc itself, you just might be on to something.

It's a pity I can't model at all or I'd give it a try myself.

[Joe 2987]

I wonder... Would it be possible to make an invisible turret subsystem with a gimble on the end? It might just work... The other option is to give each arc a few dozen slaved phasers. The only problem with that is that there might be several phasers firing fom the same arc (doesn't make sense).

[McGlaspie]

Silly question: Can you make a turrent HOD that only contains the reference points and no model or textures? I thought of it before, but never actually tried it.

[Firewarrior1705]

that might be an ideea to start with, considering that in ST the ships don't have visible turrets(but they do have turrets).

As for the ship list, it should look like this(for the federation):

Fighter Class:
- Venture Class scout ship (the one seen in ST: Insurrection)
- Peregrine Class attackfighter (the one form DS9)

Corvette Class:
- Runabout Class(shuttle)
- Delta Flyer Class(shuttle)
- Raider Class(DS9)

Frigate Class:
- Saber Class
- Miranda Class
- Centaur Class
- Steamrunner Class
- Intrepid Class
- Nova Class
- Norway Class

Capital Class:
- Ambassador Class
- Galaxy Class
- Akira Class
- Excelsior Class
- Defiant Class
- Nebula Class
- Prometheus Class
- Sovereign Class

[Joe 2987]

Dominion ships(?):

Fighters:
Jem'Hadar Bug
Cardassian Scout (Non-cannon?)

Corvette:
Hideki Class Patrol Fighter (Cardassian)
Cardassian Shuttle (Same model as Hideki)

Frigate:
Breen Cruiser
Jem'Hadar Battlecruiser (large frigate/destroyer)

Capital:
Galor
Keldon (Same model as Galor)
Jem'hadar Battleship

Platform:
Cardassian Orbital Defense Platform

Mothership/Shipyard:
Terok Nor(?)

[Moleman]

i think that weve got something going here

[Joe 2987]

Don't forget for the Federation:

Mothership/Shipyard:
Starbase (MS)
Drydock (Nemesis)

Also, there should be elite versions of some classes (unit cap = 1). They just have upgraded shields/weapons:

Galaxy: Enterprise D
Sovereign: Enterprise E
Intrepid: Voyager
Defiant: Defiant
Nebula: Pheonix

I am thinking about just using gimbles for the Phasers (just to get things moving). Obviously, the Sacrifice of Angels mod for Hw1 didn't have Phaser Arcs, but I would honestly prefer accuracy over ease.

[Dragonfury]

mmm indeed...

[Joe 2987]

I have found a site full of Trek models. Unfortunately, most of the authors cannot be contacted and many models are in *.MAX, which I cannot open. If anyone with 3ds max can convert them to *.3ds or even *.obj, I will appreciate it.

The site is http://www.trekmeshes.ch/.

[Moleman]

ooo id love to see the borg in action

[Joe 2987]

You will be assimilated.
<-- Borg Army

Anyway, the Borg are easy to do. Just make a cube, sphere, etc. and put the borg textures on it.

I have decided that all ships will use gimbles instead of Phaser Arcs.

Don't forget the Romulans (minor race):
Fighter:
Reman "Scorpion"
Romulan Scout

Corvette:
Romulan Shuttle

Frigate:
Romulan Bird of Brey(Valdore?)

Capital:
Romulan Warbird

Probe:
Drone


And the Klingons (Also Minor Race):
Frigate:
Bird of Prey

Capital:
Negh'Var Flagship
Klingon Cruiser (downgraded Negh'var)
K'tinga
Vor'cha

Borg:
Fighter:
Scout Vessel

Frigate:
Probe (I know, but I'm just using the stats found here)
Sphere

Capital:
Cube
Tactical Cube

Mothership:
Queenship (Borg Diamond)

Other:
Asiimilated ships

[Firewarrior1705]

I think that the dominion battlecruiser should be made a capital ship rather than a frigate. And even though is not cannon, a Hutet would be great for the cardies(there's nothing like a ship that could vaporize an entire continent with only one phaser blast).

Now for the klingons:

Fighter Class:
- the scout from Armada2(don't know the exact name)

Corvette Class:
- D12 Class Bird of prey(from ST: Generations)

Frigate Class:
- Brel Class Bird of prey
- D7 Class Battlecruiser
- Feklhr Class(the klingon science ship form A1 and A2)
- Suqjagh Class(commando ship from A1 and A2)

Capital Class:
- Vorcha Class Battlecruiser
- Neghvar Class Heavy Battleship
- Voodieh Class Battleship(same model as the Neghvar but it doesn't have the 2 heavy disruptors mounted under each wing)
- Kvort Class Battlecruiser(large bird of prey)
- Kvek Class Battlecruiser(again not cannon, is on armada2files and you can ask permission for use of the model)


And the Romulans:

Fighter Class:
- Talon class scout ship

Corvette Class:
- no ideea

Frigate Class:
- romulan bird of prey class(the one from TOS and TMP)
- draconarius/wingdefender class(from A2)
- shrike class(from A1 and A2)
- griffin class(from A1 and A2)
- raptor class(from A1 and A2)
- veles class(from A1 and A2)

Capital Class:
- shadow class(from A1 and A2)
- D'deridex class(warbird)
- norexan class(warbird from ST:Nemesis)
- scimitar class(from ST:Nemesis)

P.S. If you have any question about Star Trek ships balance in terms of weapon types, shield and hull strenght then I'm your man

You could use for the borg mothership one of the unimatrix shipyards rather than the diamond

[singurality]

I havn't put it in the game yet, but i converted the Arika from 3ds from that website to obj files using milkshape 1.8.2

[TON_Viper]

If you mean the Akira, then cool.

[Firewarrior1705]

he probably meant the akira :P. anyway I was wondering whether it's gonna be possible to create rechargeable energy shields in HW2, in order to better simulate trek ships.

I checked out that site myself and I saw that many ship models are missing(the romulan norexan class warbird for example) or look very crappy(the d'deridex models). I may have some of them in .msh format, I used them for my personal Nexus the jupiter incident star trek mod and if you need something just let me know.

[Joe 2987]

No, it's not very easy to do it. I was thinking about the EMP shield however... It uses pretty much what we need, but for EMP. If we could fiind out where "EMP" referred to, we could create a "Damage" version.

As for the site: yeah, I know some of them are crappy. The problem is, the ones that look good are High-poly.

*.msh format? I'm sorry, I don't remember this one, and I definitly can't open it in Wings.

The Hutet sounds a little...too powerful. If we have a ship that can blow up a continent, we need one for each race. Really hard to find a non-cannon ship that powerful for each race.

The dominion Battlecruiser is half the size of the Battleship (give or take a hundred meters) and the dominion needs frigates.

By the way, I'm going with cannon, then non-cannon. Cannon ships take precedence.The lists I have posted are all cannon. If you are going to change them, please leave what I have in, unless you have a reason it won't work. Thanks.

Current ship list: (not final)

FEDERATION:

Fighter Class:
- Venture Class scout ship (the one seen in ST: Insurrection)
- Peregrine Class attackfighter (the one form DS9)

Corvette Class:
- Runabout Class(shuttle)
- Delta Flyer Class(shuttle)
- Raider Class(DS9)

Frigate Class:
- Saber Class
- Miranda Class
- Centaur Class
- Steamrunner Class
- Intrepid Class
- Nova Class
- Norway Class

Capital Class:
- Ambassador Class
- Galaxy Class
- Akira Class
- Excelsior Class
- Defiant Class
- Nebula Class
- Prometheus Class
- Sovereign Class

Mothership/SY:
- Starbase
- Drydock (Nemesis)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

DOMINION+ALLIES:

Fighters:
- Jem'Hadar Bug
- Cardassian Scout (Non-cannon?)

Corvette:
- Hideki Class Patrol Fighter (Cardassian)
- Cardassian Shuttle (Same model as Hideki)

Frigate:
- Breen Cruiser
- Jem'Hadar Battlecruiser (large frigate/destroyer)

Capital:
- Galor
- Keldon (Same model as Galor)
- Jem'hadar Battleship

Platform:
- Cardassian Orbital Defense Platform

Mothership/Shipyard:
- Terok Nor(?)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

ROMULANS:

Fighter:
- Reman "Scorpion"
- Talon class scout ship

Corvette:
- Romulan Shuttle

Frigate:
- Romulan Bird of Brey(Valdore)
- Draconarius/wingdefender class(from A2)
- Shrike class(from A1 and A2)
- Griffin class(from A1 and A2)
- Raptor class(from A1 and A2)
- Veles class(from A1 and A2)

Capital:
- Shadow class(from A1 and A2)
- D'deridex class(warbird)
- Norexan class(warbird from ST:Nemesis)

Probe:
- Drone

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

KLINGON:

Fighter:
- the scout from Armada2(don't know the exact name)

Corvette:
D12 Class BOP

Frigate:
- B'rel class Bird of Prey
- Feklhr Class(the klingon science ship form A1 and A2)
- Suqjagh Class(commando ship from A1 and A2)

Capital:
- Negh'Var Flagship
- Voodieh Cruiser (downgraded Negh'var)
- D7 Class Battlecruiser
- K'tinga
- Vor'cha
- Kvort Class Battlecruiser(large bird of prey)
- Kvek Class Battlecruiser(again not cannon, is on armada2files and you can ask

permission for use of the model)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

BORG:

Fighter:
- Scout Vessel

Frigate:
- Probe (I know, but I'm just using the stats found here)
- Sphere

Capital:
- Cube
- Tactical Cube
- Queenship (Borg Diamond)

Mothership:
- Nexus (From Armada 2)

Other:
- Assimilated ships

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

KAZON:

Fighter:
- Fighter

Corvette:
- "Torpedo" Shuttle

Frigate:
- Raider

Capital:
- Battleship (heavily armed carrier)
- Carrier (Mothership)



I have permission to use the following ships:

TacFighter (DS9)
Negh'Var
Romulan Warbird
Sovereign
Drydock*

*If anyone can convert this from *.max to *.3ds, I would appreciate it. It is the Nemesis Shipyard on STMC.

[Firewarrior1705]

for the cardies/dominion I was thinking of making the galor and keldon frigates because they are weaker than most federation and klingon ships(the cardies relly on large formations of ships covered by fighters) . On the other hand, the jem'hadar battlecruiser is about the same strenght as the vorcha and only a thad inferior to the galaxy. That's why I think it would be much better if you made it a capital ship. If you think the cardies would then lack more capital ships, you could add the Hutet from DS9 Dominion Wars

The Valdore and the Norexan are the same ship and is listed as a battleship. The romulan bird of prey is a 23rd century heavy destroyer/light cruiser(you have her on that site)

I think you should put in the Scimitar for the Romulans(if not a stock ship then as a hero ship)

And the Ktinga and D7 are the same ship the D7s were given to the romulans by the klingons as an alliance was formed between them in the late 23rd century

[Riess]

Not to sound like an ass here but seriously, who the hell cares about the Kazon?

Well I'm not one to talk, I'd like the Klingon Academy universe brought to HW more than the TNG timeline, but still... you'll have enough work bringing the Big Three to the game, I wouldn't shovel in too much additional content just yet.

p.s. If you misspell "canon" or "turret" one more time, I'm going to set you on fire with my mind, deadguy style.

[Joe 2987]

Sooorrrry, Riess... I was thinking about having a race for all Delta Quadrant ships, since they are only going to appear in the Voyager Campaign. I was just starting with Kazon.

Off-topic: I got my new Video Card today! Now I'm not only going to make a ST mod, I'm going to add CnL Pepper's awesome Shaders to it!

[Firewarrior1705]

When you'll need info about the ship's weapons, let me know

[Joe 2987]

Sorry, I'm really happy. My video card works! Anyway, I'm ready to get ship stats. Please PM me with them. If I think they need to be tweaked for good game-play, I will post the tweaks here later.

[Firewarrior1705]

Well I thought I'd better post them here for everyone to see and agree with them or not.

So here goes: I'm gonna start with the klingons and post the rest of the races later on:

- D12 class bird of prey -> one of the first models of bird of prey. armed with 2 mark10 pulse disruptors on the wing tips and 1 standard torpedo launcher in the nose, capable of firing one torp every 2 secs. Size is about 100m.

- Brel class bird of prey -> stronger hull and shields, same weaponry. Stronger than the jemhadar bug and hideki(can take on 2 but not 3), about the same strenght as a miranda or centaur but weaker than the saber and nova. Size of about 150m

- Kvort class battlecruiser -> the largest and most advanced bird of prey. It's almost as long as a neghvar and has 4 mark12 pulse disruptors on the wing tips and a triple photon torp launcher in the nose and in the rear. Size of about 600m.

- Vorcha class battlecruiser -> stronger than the kvort, equal in strenght(almost) to a federation nebula(thus a thad weaker than the Galaxy). It has 2 mark12 pulse disruptors on the wings, 1 mark12 beam disruptor in the nose, 2 triple photon tubes in the nose and 1 in the rear. Size of about 460m.

- Ktinga/D7 class battlecruiser -> a little stronger than the brel but much weaker than the kvort or vorcha. Armed with 2 mark10 pulse disruptors on the wing tips, 1 mark10 beam disruptor in the nose, 1 standard torp launcher in the front and one in the back.
Size of about 300m.

- Neghvar class battleship -> the strongest klingon battleship, stronger than the Galaxy or D'deridex but under the power of the Sovereign. Armed with 2 massive mark18 pulse disruptors on the wings, each disruptor being contained in a large casing that can also house triple photon launchers(see DS9: Way of the warrior). It also has a heavy mark18 beam disruptor in the nose and with various hardpoints through out the hull and 2 more triple photon launchers, 1 front and 1 aft. Size of about 680m.

- Voodieh class battleship -> Neghvar variant that forgoes the 2 station type heavy disruptors for more combat manuverability. Armed with 2 triple torp launchers, 1 front and 1 aft, and 4 mark18 pulse disruptors(less powerfull than the station type mark18), 2 in the nose and 2 on the wings. Same size as the Neghvar.

- Kvek class battlecruiser -> this ship is about the same strenght as a Galaxy. Armed with 2 mark12 pulse disruptors on the wings,one mark12 beam disruptor in the nose and 2 triple torp launchers, one front and one aft. Size of about 500m.

- Feklhr class battlecruiser -> about the same strenght as a vorcha. 2 mark12 pulse disruptors on the left and right of the saucer section, 1 mark12 beam disruptor in the nose, 2 triple torp launchers, 1 front and 1 aft. Size of about 400m.

- Suqjagh class assault cruiser -> you should make this the klingon marine frigate 1 mark10 pulse disruptor and 1 mark10 beam disruptor in the nose, 2 triple torp launchers, 1 front and 1 aft. Size of about 300m.

And now some suggestions about the way in which ships should be reserched and unlocked: the best way to do this is, in my opinion, by researching the weapon systems they use. The weapon systems should be listed in the utility research sector and each race should have the weakest variants of their weapons available at the begining without the need for research (thus they can have their basic ships ready to build as soon as the prod facilities are constructed)

For the klingons, the mark10 disruptors and standard photon launcher should be available at the begining(thus allowing the d12, brel and ktinga to become availabe without research).

As for the other ships:

- neghvar should require mark18 disruptor research, triple photon torp launcher research and station mark18 disruptor research.

- voodieh: mark18 disruptor research and triple torp launcher research

- vorcha, kvort, kvek, feklhr: mark12 disruptor research, triple torp launcher research

- suqjagh: triple torp launcher research, marine commando training research.

In addition every ship should have 1 or 2 levels of shiled upgrade, 1 or 2 levels of hull armor upgrade and 1 or 2 impulse engines speed upgrade.

Pls tell me what do you think. I'll be back tomorrow with data on the romulans.

[Joe 2987]

Good. May need a little tweaking. I may not be working on this very often as the mod I'm currently working on picked up a little speed again.

Anyway, my computer had a little...accident with Antimatter (localized HD crash) and I had to re-install Hw2. Sooo... I lost all work on this except what I had backed up to my Flash Drive (about 45%). If anyone remembers how to unpack *.pyo (ST: Bridge Commander models) models, please tell me .

[singurality]

lol the star trek models are so realistic i can't put them into cfhoded. is 75000 triangles to high?

[Firewarrior1705]

ok, now some info on the romulans as promised:

- romulan bird of prey: destroyer armed with 2 class16 pulse disruptors on the wings and one plasma torpedo launcher in the nose that can fire one torp every 4 seconds but deals more damage than the standard torpedo. About the same strenght as a brel(note that when I say strenght I mean the hull and shields, not the firepower. I'll refer to all weapons stats when I finish presenting the ships of all races). Size of about 200m.

- shrike class destroyer: 2 class16 pulse disruptors on the wings, 2 standard torp launchers(1 torp every 2 secs), both mounted in the front. Slightly stronger than the romulan bop, size of about 120m.

- griffin class cruiser: armed with 2 class18 pulse disruptors on the wings, 1 class18 beam disruptor in the nose and 2 s2 torpedo launchers(the s2 can fire bursts of 6 torps), 1 front and 1 aft. About the same strenght as a Steamrunner, weaker than an akira, intrepid or vorcha. Size of about 400m.

- raptor class cruiser: armed with 1 class18 pulse disruptor mounted in the nose, 1 class18 beam disruptor mounted in the nose and 2 s2 torp launchers, one front and 1 aft. A little stronger than the griffin and about the same strenght as an intrepid. Size of about 400m.

- draconarius class light cruiser: 2 class16 pulse disruptors mounted in the nose, 2 standard torp launchers mounted in the front. About the same strenght as a klingon ktinga and weaker than a galor. Size of about 300m.

- shadow class heavy cruiser: 2 class18 pulse disruptors, 1 mounted on each wing, 1 class18 beam disruptor mounted in the nose, 2 s2 torp launchers, 1 front and 1 aft. Same strenght as a nebula, akira, vorcha and feklhr. Size of about 450m.

- veles class frigate: -> this should be the romulan marine frigate. 1 class16 pulse disruptor in the nose, 1 class16 beam disruptor in the nose, 1 standart torp launcher.
The same strenght as a klingon suqjagh. Size of about 300m.

- d'deridex class warbird: 3 class21 pulse disruptors mounted in the nose, 1 class21 beam disruptor mounted in the nose, 2 s2 torp launchers, 1 front and 1 aft, the launchers can also deliver plasma torpedoes. Slightly stronger than the Galaxy but less manuverable, weaker than the neghvar, sovereign and prometheus. Size of about 1050m.

- norexan/valdore class warbird: 3 class21 pulse disruptors, 1 in the nose and 2 on the wings, 2 s2 torp launchers, 1 in the nose and 1 aft, they can also fire plasma torps. About the same strenght as a Galaxy with good combat manuverability. Size of about 600m.

- scimitar class warbird: the weapons on this baby are very tricky to add, in Nemesis worf says it has 52 reman disruptors(with probably the same strenght as a class21 disruptor) and 26 torp launchers(maybe s2) and so I let you decide how many weapons to put on it It has (about) the same strenght as a Dominion dreadnought (I think). Size of about 680m.

Now for the research list:

- class16 disruptors and standard torp launchers already researched(which means bop, shrike and draconarius available at the begining)

- bird of prey should have the plasma torps unlocked through an upgrade

- veles class: marine commando training research

- shadow, griffin, raptor: class18 disruptor research, s2 torp launcher research

- d'deridex, norexan: class21 disruptor research, s2 torp launcher research. Both ships should take plasma torps via an upgrade(one different upgrade for each ship)

- scimitar: reman heavy disruptor research, s2 torp research

I'll come back when I have more time with info about the cardies/dominion.

[Moleman]

lol the star trek models are so realistic i can't put them into cfhoded. is 75000 triangles to high?

to do this youd have to use objinserter

[Joe 2987]

7...5,...000? Not good. Anyway, I know what you mean. I've got a fighter model that has...45000 polys.

@ Firewarrior: I'm copying and pasting your ship specs into a text document so I can look over them even when I'm not conected to the Internet.

EDIT: Lol, it just occured to me: if the game uses the normal Deathmatch gametype... It'll be a slugfest. "Captain, 34 Klingon Birds of Prey and 15 Negh'var class battlecruisers decloaking to Starboard."

[Firewarrior1705]

when I'll finish presenting the ships of all races(except borg and kazon, I've never watched voyager because I hate the crappy storyline), I'll offer specs about the weapons and post you the hull and shield strengths of the ships in my armada 2 mod to get a glimpse of how to balance them And about the overkill thing, most capital ships should have a limit(for example I've never seen more than 1 sovereign or 2 neghvars in a fleet in the show so they should be properly limited to advoid a situation where a player would tech up fast, get the sovys and the neghvars out asap and ruin the whole game like in the unmoded HW2)

[Firewarrior1705]

ok and now for the cardies/dominion:

- jem'hadar attackfighter: armed with 1 medium poleron beam in the nose, 2 Mark1 poleron torpedo launchers(can fire 1 torp every 3 secs), 1 front and 1 aft. Very weak in one on one combat(it takes 3 of them to overpower a brel and about 6 or 7 to beat a defiant), it can perfrom kamikaze runs at enemy ships. Strong when used in large numbers and highly manuverable. Size of about 70m.

- hideki class light destroyer: 1 medium spiral wave disruptor in the nose, 1 forward mounted Model 1 torp launcher(1 torp every 2 secs). A little stronger than the jem'hadar fighter but still weaker than a brel. Size of about 80m.

- galor mk3 class cruiser: 1 medium spiral wave disruptor mounted in the front, 2 Model2 torp launchers(2 torps every 2 secs), 1 front and 1 aft. Stronger than the Ktinga, miranda and centaur but a little weaker than an ambassador or excelsior. Size of about 370m.

- keldon class heavy cruiser: 1 medium spiral wave disruptor mounted in the front, 2 Model2 torp launchers(2 torps every 2 secs), 1 front and 1 aft. Stronger than the galor, weaker than a vorcha, nebula or akira. Size of about 370m.

- breen cruiser -> this would be good for a marine frigate : 2 breen pulse disruptors(similar to the klingon mark10) mounted on the wings, 2 breen torp launchers(we see in DS9: What you leave behind that they can fire one torp every 2 secs), 1 front and 1 aft, energy dampening torpedo(maybe->it should disable a ship for a few secs). About the same strength as a galor. Size of about 300m.

- jem'hadar battlecruiser: 1 heavy poleron beam in the nose, 2 Mark2 poleron torpedo launchers(they can fire about 1 torp every 1.5 secs), 1 front and 1 aft. Slightly stronger than the Vorcha and Nebula, weaker than the Galaxy and D'deridex. Size of about 640m.

- jem'hadar dreadnought: 1 heavy poleron beam in the nose and in several hardpoints across the hull, 4 forward firing Mark2 poleron torp launchers mounted under the hull, 2 aft firing Mark2 launchers. Three times stronger than the Galaxy, almost twice as strong as a negh'var, 50% stronger than a sovereign and the same strength(almost) with the Hutet and Scimitar. Size of about 1200m.

- hutet class super heavy battleship: 8 forward firing plasma torpedo launchers monted on the wings(like we see in the DS9: Dominion Wars opening), 4 aft firing plasma torp launchers, 2 heavy spiral wave disruptors mounted in the nose and on various hardpoints across the hull. Same strenght as the jem'hadar dreadnought. Size of about 1600m.

And now for the research:

- medium poleron beam and mark1 poleron torp launcher already researched(thus jem'hadar fighter available at the start)

- hideki class: model1 torp launchers and medium spiral wave disruptor technology

- galor, keldon class: model2 torp launchers

- breen cruiser: breen pulse disruptors, breen torpedo launcher, commando training research. Upgrade: energy dampening torpedo(if you decide to add it)

- jem'hadar battlecruiser and dreadnought: mark2 torp launchers and heavy poleron beam

- hutet class: heavy spiral wave disruptor research, plasma torpedo research

Next time I'll present the fed ships but before I do that, I wanna ask you a question: We all saw that fed ships in the show(the ones with saucer sections) had 2 phaser arrays, 1 on top and 1 below the saucer section. Is it possible to make in HW2 a fire arc restriction that would make these 2 arrays never to be used at the same time? I mean, can you make them fire without firing through the ship's hull?

[Elukka]

Note what the site says on the download page:

The most important stuff:
You may only use the meshes for rendering images on your own computer, publishing pictures on your personal homepage or in forums. If you do post the pictures anywhere on the internet you must have credits to the author(s) on the image! You may not distribute these meshes without express permission from the author(s).

(emphasis mine)

[Joe 2987]

Yes, that's why I have been trying to reach the authors. Otherwise, I have just been looking at renders of them in Wings3d. Wait...

(emphasis mine)

You have something on that site Elukka?

Also, many of the meshes have readmes that say something like

You may use this

Will edit later.

[TON_Viper]

"Emphasis mine" in this case means that the text in bold was highlighted by Elukka and wasn't so on the page where he copied it from.

[Joe 2987]

Oh. Anyway, I am not distributing until I have the express permission of the authors, whether in E-mail or in the Readme.

For example, Ian Bremner has given me permission to use any of his models, and even helped me reduce the polys on one model from 44k to 120 or so.

Also, some authors have put in their readme:

You are free to use and modify this as long as you give credit to me. You may not sell or otherwise use this for profit.

The exact wording varies from author to author, but there are quite a few with a similar statement. The other authors... well, I'm currently on my 2nd week of waiting for an E-mail back from one, and on my 3rd day of waiting for an E-mail from the others... I may need to try to find a new source of models.

[Moleman]

honestly joe i think that youve really put a lot of thought into this havent you

[Joe 2987]

I have been wanting to do this since I got HW2. The SoA mod for HW1 was awesome. Honestly, I would be fine just converting the models from SoA, modifying them a little (make the Higher poly and hi-res textures), and putting them in, dividing the ships by race. However, I also want to add a campaign, and the SoA mod didn't have many ships from minor races (for SP) and I also need higher poly models than SoA can offer.

Moleman: Yeah, I've put in a lot of time thinking this over. For the past 2 or 3 months (summer break), I have been getting up at 7 AM and going to sleep at midnight. In the time between then I have spent (on average):
-5 hours looking for 3d models for animations
-3 hours modding
-1 hour posting on forums
-1 hour modeling
-6 hours brainstorming for mods, of which 4 hours were spent thinking about how to do this.
-1 hour for other things

3*(30*4) = 3*(120) = 360. 360 hours this summer alone. Now, I can't remember when I got HW2, but I estimate it was around 2005. 360*3 = 1,080. I've put a lot of thought into this.

[TON_Viper]

I don't see a problem with putting the old SoA ships in as placeholders until you can get better models for your mod. As long as you restrict the ships to private betas. I was on the SoA team back in the day, and I don't think the guys why did the ships would mind them being used in this way. We did after all have plans for a HW2 mod back when the game was first released. Lack of proper tools meant that the idea never got off the ground though.

[Joe 2987]

Yeah... I'll put them in for a while, maybe edit the models, make high-res textures, etc. HW1 couldn't really handle the kinds of high-poly models that I want, but HW2 can (maybe).

[Firewarrior1705]

ok, last but not least, the federation ship list(arm yourself with a lot of patience if you wanna read this because it's quite a list ):

- peregrine class attack fighter: 2 class1 pulse phasers mounted on the wings(DS9: Sacrifice of angels), 1 typeV phaser in the nose(DS9: Maquis), 1 microphoton torpedo launcher in the nose(firing one torp per second). Very weak in small numbers, very effective in large formations. Weaker than the jem'hadar attack fighter. Size of about 20m.

- venture class scout/fighter: 2 typeV phasers on the wings(ST: Insurrection), 1 forward firing microphoton launcher. Stronger and faster than the peregrine but with less firepower. Size of about 20m.

- runabout class shuttle: 2 typeV phasers, one on each side of the cockpit, 1 microphoton launcher in the nose. Can also be refited to carry another torp launcher just above the joint between the warp nacells(DS9: The jem'hadar). About the same strenght as a Venture. Size of about 23m.

- delta flyer class shuttle: 2 typeV phasers, same positions like on the runabout, 1 forward firing microphoton launcher. Same strenght as a runabout. Size of about 20m.

- centaur class destroyer: 2 typeVIII phaser arrays, 1 above and 1 below the saucer section, 2 standard photon launchers(1 torp every 2 secs), 1 front and 1 aft. About the same strength as a bird of prey. Size of about 350m.

- miranda class light cruiser: 2 typeVIII phaser arrays, 1 above and 1 below the saucer section, 3 standard photon launchers, 1 front,one above(at the joint between the warp nacels) and 1 aft. About the same strength as a bird of prey. Size of about 250m.

- saber class light cruiser: 2 typeX phaser arrays, 1 above and 1 below the saucer section, 2 standard photon launchers, 1 front and 1 aft. Stronger than the miranda, slightly weaker than the galor and breen cruiser. Size of about 200m.

- excelsior class cruiser: 2 typeIX phaser arrays, 1 above and 1 below the saucer section, 2 standard photon launchers, 1 front and 1 aft. Can also be refited to fire quantum torpedoes(DS9: Homefront). Slighlty stronger than the galor and ktinga, weaker than the ambassador. Size of about 500m.

- ambassador class light battleship: 3 typeIX phaser arrays, 1 above, 1 below the saucer section and one on the ventral side of the stardrive section, 2 type1 burst photon launchers(6 torps per burst), 1 front and 1 aft. Stronger than the excelsior but weaker than the nebula, galaxy or vorcha. Size of about 450m.

- nebula class battlecruiser: 3 typeX phaser arrays, 1 above and 1 below the saucer section and another one mounted under the stardrive section, facing the enemies that come from below, 4 type2 burst photon launchers(10 torps per burst), 2 forward firing and 2 aft firing, mounted on the weapons pod above the saucer section. About the same strength as a Vorcha and dominion battlecruiser, slightly weaker than the Galaxy. Size of about 450m.

- galaxy class battlecruiser: 3 typeX phaser arrays, 1 above and 1 below the saucer section and another one mounted under the stardrive section, facing the enemies that come from below, 2 type2 burst photon launchers(10 torps per burst), 1 forward firing and 1 aft firing. Stronger than the Vorcha, dominion battlecruiser and Keldon, about the same strength as a norexan and weaker than a neghvar or d'deridex. Size of about 650m.

- akira class heavy cruiser: 2 typeX phaser arrays, 1 above and 1, 4 pulse photon launchers(4 torps per burst but with a higher rate of fire), 2 forward firing and 2 aft firing, 1 mounted on the joint between the warp nacells and another mounted on the saucer section right above the main deflector. About the same strength as a nebula. Size of about 460m.

- intrepid class patrol cruiser: 3 typeX phaser arrays, 1 above and 1 below the saucer section and another one mounted under the stardrive section, facing the enemies that come from below, 4 standard photon launchers, 2 forward firing, mounted right above the main deflector and 2 aft firing, mounted at almost half the distance between the saucer and stardrive sections. Slightly weaker than the akira, about the same strength as a keldon. Size of about 350m.

- steamrunner class escort cruiser: 1 typeX phaser array mounted in the nose, 2 standard photon launchers, 1 front and 1 aft. Weaker than the intrepid, slightly stronger than the galor. size of about 300m.

- defiant class heavy destroyer: 1 typeX phaser array mounted on a turret on the dorsal section of the ship, 4 class1 forward firing pulse phasers, 3 pulse quantum torp launchers(1 quantum every 2 secs), 2 front, 1 aft. One of the most successful and powerfull warships ever build by the federation(also my favorite ). She can take on at least 6 jem'hadar fighters, 3 birds of prey and most enemy ships in one on one combat. It has about the same hull and shield strength as the Galaxy. Only the Dominion dreadnought, Sovereign, Prometheus, Negh'var, Voodieh, Scimitar and Hutet can take on a Defiant and be sure to win. Size of about 120m.

- prometheus class battlecruiser: 3 typeXII phaser arrays, one mounted on each side of its triangular saucer section and 1 on the ventral side of the hull(like on the Galaxy), 3 type 2 burst fire torp launchers, one on each side and one aft. Can be upgraded to fire quantum torpedoes. Very powerfull warship, stronger than the D'deridex and Galaxy but weaker than the Negh'var or Sovereign. Size of about 420m.

- sovereign class heavy battleship: 3 typeXII phaser arrays, one above and one below the saucer section, 1 on the ventral side of the hull, 4 type3 burst fire photon launchers(12 torps per burst), 2 mounted right below the deflector array, 1 mounted at the back end of the saucer section(ST: Nemesis) and one aft, 1
rapid fire quantum torpedo turret(4 qantums per burst). It's only out matched by the Scimitar, Dominion Dreadnought and Hutet. Size of about 680m.

- norway class frigate: -> you should make this the Federation marine frigate: 2 typeIX phaser arrays, 1 above and one below the saucer section, 2 standard torp launchers, 1 front and 1 aft.
About as strong as a Steamrunner. Size of about 400m.

Now for the research: the microphotons, standard photon launchers, typeV and typeVIII should be already done and thus the fighters, shuttles, miranda and centaur are available at start.

- excelsior and steamrunner class: typeIX phaser array research. the excelsior should have a research that would equip her with quantum torpedoes(as an additional weapon and not a replacement for the standard torps)

- ambassador class: typeIX phaser and type1 burst photon launcher research.

- galaxy and nebula: typeX and type2 burst photon launcher research. Upgrade for the Galaxy(if you wanna add it): deflector array beam(like the one in TNG: the best of both worlds). It should come as a special weapon that can only be fired via pressing a key, cost resources, inflict very heavy damage and have a long recharge time. You could use the hiigaran ion cannon texture for it

- akira: typeX, ablative armor and pulse photon launcher research. An additional upgrade that would equip her with quantum torpedoes.

- intrepid class: typeX, ablative armor. An additional upgrade that would equip her with quantum torpedoes.

- defiant class: typeX, ablative armor, class1 pulse phasers, pulse quantum torp launcher.

- prometheus class: typeXII, ablative armor and type2 burst fire photon launcher.

- sovereign class: typeXII, ablative armor, type3 burst fire photon launcher, rapid fire quantum torpedo turret.

- norway class: marine commando training, typeIX phaser.

Phew, that does it :P

Next time I'll try to give some specs on the weapons.