Company of Heroes: Tales of Valor (Now with a Trailer!)

[Tseng_Fox]

yess.. but they aren't just adding skins, they are adding new units.

What he means is the way the reward units will work. They'll essentially replace a unit that was already there. For example, the Hellcat will replace the Wolverine for the US. Instead of letting both be used.

Its counter-productive.

[Kosake]

I mean, if it has the same stats, the same purpose and does exactly the same, except for looks, it is NOT a new unit.

[Deacon412]

the units are supose to be like upgrades, thats how iv heard it, like the hellcat would out preform the m10 or some thing

[Tseng_Fox]

Are you sure? From what I've heard they'll have same if not similar stats to the original versions. The schimwagon was an exception as it replaced the Kettenkrad and could reverse while the ketten could not. Apart from that it was exactly the same (except for the faster in water thing).

[Deacon412]

yea, the schimwagon had a gun too didnt it??? i mean i could be wrong but i thought i read it some where..ill try n find a link

[Kosake]

The Ketten could move to and fro... The Scout-Bike could not.
The Schwimmwagen was to be made in two versions: The regular Wehr, with a mounted MG and a weaponless one fot Panzer-Elite. Either way, thats not really a big deal if you ask me. The Bike is fast enough to turn and honestly, how often did you have to cross water? Besides: Whats the use of a light-to-unarmed unit thats fast in water, while all of your firepower is stuck in that river way behind?

[Pyros]

Looks like Eurogamer made a mistake in their article. Thunder says here that there is no co-op in the campaign, it is just for MP.

[Ludovsky]

Are you sure? From what I've heard they'll have same if not similar stats to the original versions. The schimwagon was an exception as it replaced the Kettenkrad and could reverse while the ketten could not. Apart from that it was exactly the same (except for the faster in water thing).

Staghound also included a hull MG which the M8 wouldn't have. At least, if I recall well the reports from beta players.

[BlackLabel]

Iam highly unimpressed by the presentation. ( but CoH is a letdown since OF for me anyways...) And on top of that, many of the community made tiger skins look far better. No more westfront please, its a dead horse. Go over to the east, there is alot of intresting storys to tell there.

[ralph20]

Wow, i'm amazed at how many of you get excited about campaigns. WHAT? Are you people kidding me? Campaigns are the most boring part of the game. Once you beat them you're done. It takes them so much work for 20 min of fun.

Multiplayer >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Campaign. I would focus more on making multiplayer maps replayable, and actually adding new maps. If we get 20+ maps for 1v1 and 20+ for 2v2 (and none of that bridge noob crap), then this game would be SO much better.

EDIT: NEw doctrines would be cool too.

[Deacon412]

only reason im excited over tov is because the campaigns sound like their going to be worth it this time around thats all...plus that mp co-op has me excited, any thing to extend the mp is a sell for me

[whatsleft]

but damn, if only there was campaign coop. it will fun if u and ur buddies were controlling sherman tanks each, trying to coordinate to take down heavy adversaries, from stugs to panthers, while the campaign ends off with a fight against the toughest german armour, the tiger/kt/jp.

or on the other hand, the dual tigers trying to stall entire advances.

mp may be important, but it gets stale after sometime. sometimes, its better to desperately fight off waves and waves of enemies.

[Schwarzwald]

This is what they've been working on for about a year now?... I most likely won't get it if it's just unit skins and plus i dont want them to overrwrite the beautiful community made skins that i have already from our talented modders.

I did however enjoy the presentation of the tiger ace crew, most likely Michael Wittmann's crew.


to me this will be similar to command and conquer: renegade anyone? just not in FPS mode. I guess time will tell.

[Wintermute]

Fuck yes I didn't even know this was in development...

So, for the uninitiated: Is this going to be adding some campaign that centers around the Tiger Ace?

Edit: Haha, did a bit more reading. Question answered. Really looking forward to this now. I love Relic's SP campaigns.

[Lethal Dosage]

Well as been said a dozen times, there's ot any truely new units, the US gets an M18 that'll replace the M10 and a T17 Staghound to replace the Greyhound. The Brits'll get a Staghound to replace the M5 Stuart, the Wehr will get a Schwimmwagen with a crappy MG42 to replace the bike (can reverse and better fording ability), and the PE gets an unarmed Schwimmwagen to replace the Ketten (can reverse and better fording ability). Take it from someone who's looked in depth at the Staghound and Schwimmwagen's files, they have almost the exact same stats (damage, armour, etc.) and they have the same abilities as the unit they replace, their not unique and you can't us them in addition tot eh old units they replace. I can't speack for the M18 Hellcat though, since there weren't any files included in the Beta to look at.

For some terribly shots campaign modes, some maps, and a couple of new gamemodes, i sure as hell hope they don't charge what they did for OF. I paid $90 for CoH when it released and $60 for OF on the day it released, i figured it was fair enough to pay $60 for OF if it had two new full-length campaigns (read 15 missions) each, two new factions and that new game mode they promised. Instead i got two castrated campaigns around 7-8 missions each, factions that were either small with little variety, and a faction which had been rushed and shared way too many models. Not to mention the non existent "New Game Mode", but since some people insist there was a new game mode, i'd like to see some evidence of that. With the content they'd released info on already, i'd think this wouldn't be worth more than $40 tops.

Although i'm not saying i wouldn't buy it, if it's reasonably priced i will, and probably the only thing i'm really looking forward to is the Boyes AT rifle squad, hopefully you'll be able to Tread-break and maybe even shoot the driver.

[Imperial Honour]

Another new preview now, from 1UP, not exactly anything new in the preview and the video is practically the same as the IGN version, just on GameTrailers.

http://www.1up.com/do/previewPage?cId=3171458

[Phazon]

Personally I'm completely unimpressed with ToV so far. I mean more scripted campaigns with little more than a few gimmicks isn't making me jump up and down wanting it.

Would've much rathered a proper expansion pack that updated the engine to DoW2's level and added the Russians in as a side (perhaps as a neutral side just to shake things up) with a campaign focused on the Russian's final push into Berlin. Not exactly hard to do, and alot more impressive than what ToV is at the moment from what I've seen and heard.

[darklen15]

A Relic rep brought up an article earlier that shows new multiplayer content ect...

http://www.eurogamer.net/article.php...=310363&page=2

items you unlock in single-player can be carried over into multiplayer

Now this could bring alot of inbalance to the game or at least to the new maps (if any) that will come with the free patch for users that don't op to buy into this "like me and any multiplayer only customer".

There will be co-op in the Campaign, but Relic's saying nothing right now. Which applies to multiplayer in general.

Co-op? you mean the computer opponent vs a few human players? Like maybe a wave of tanks non stop zeroing in on your location and it's up to you and your teamates to sit there and devise a plan to ..... sit there and fight them off? (yawnssss) a good 3v3 game with all human players beats any such new content (don't even comment on a new multiplayer mode such as new special abilities)

New multiplayer modes that leverage our single-player strength at scripting and bring it over to the multiplayer audience". Make of that what you will, but the attention being lavished on multiplayer is with COH's long-standing fans in mind.

Why thank you Relic I am making of it what I will. I do hope that some people here have played scripted custom maps before and how they can either A.) get confusing to the team and or B.) be a smash hit the first time you play untill the next time when it gets old and repetative or C.) Crash because of unforseen command executions from a human player and/or a network problem such as UDP data dumping due to some lag.

I have to give Relic a plus on their AI update - but AI is AI and AI will behave like AI (yawnsss again)

Now I have listed a few critisisms. Here is some things to consider for those (only being fair). Add new command trees w/abilities. New units to the original factions already in game. New larger maps. New larger scripted maps. Keep the unlock weapons/abilities idea wayyyy away from this game. Keep the new singleplayer content for those who love AI play only. Keep the network code improvements comming.

One final thing - Yes its true that all gamming companies that make RTS games to this day sell their game on a single player level. COH is much different than any RTS game - they have allowed a whole new world of human interaction/gamming. To just keep your sales pointed towards singleplayer would not bring justice to the level of COH. It's a multiplayer driven WW2 computer chess game. Community players fight for their right to say their general strategy works the best given the balance to the game units. Some grasp the concept of strategizing and others don't and just add caos (which is still good) to the game. Each multiplayer game is a different experience and brings you through different feelings.

[Imperial Dane]

@Tseng fox and kosake: Yes, that was what we know from the beta, when they were still indending to do it as DLC it seems, but now they have changed their minds and made it an expansion along with a bunch of other stuff, which most likely means that it won't just be new skins for the units, otherwise i doubt they would be calling them new units, and instead the new units will be trade offs so to say in the arsenal i imagine, i mean the hellcat might be faster and stronger than the wolverine, but on the other hand it can't take nearly as many hits before it goes boom.
I can't say about the deer/staghound but i imagine there might be something there.

The shwimmwagen ? I honestly can't say.. just seems like an odd choice hope they change that to be honest, i mean there are other choices, they could add a panzer III, and have it replace the armoured scout cars for example or something completely different, then their second unit could be tank crews :P

[Kosake]

@ Ludowski:
If that hull-MG works as nice as the one on the Bergetiger, they can add five of them and the Staghound will still not do any more damage than the Greyhound.

@ Dane:
gimme a break. I don't care about replacements. It does not change a thing if your tank destroyers have 400 or 425 HP and do 50 or 45 damage. I'm not that into the math to calculate all the stats to know exactly, that the xyz should win a encounter against a zyx by the numbers. that does not work in CoH anyways, since good micromanagement, cover, missed shots and rear armor make that pointless anyway.
What I want are entirely new units with really new functions. Yea, they can include the staghound, why not. But make it do something special. Let it shoot at Henschels, like the Puma and the Armored Car try to fight off Mustangs. Give it some other reasonable ability too. Maybe only smokescreen instead of mine deployment. It's a bit difficult with armor, but they can add new infantry types. German Jäger-formations of stealthy long-range squads (really effective rifles). Or Anything like that. But not some stupid skins.

[Mirehn_Bielann]

Now these new units will bring alot of inbalance to the game

Fixed.

Relic has shown time and again that they cannot balance or fix bugs. The StuG that insta-kills any Allied infantry that touches it. The machine guns that shoot through terrain. Relic will fix one thing and break another. I mean god, it's been how many years since Dawn of War and they STILL haven't fixed drop-hacking?

Relic is certainly innovating the expansion packs now. Instead of adding real content, now they're just adding replacement content. No more new things! We'll just do the same old thing in new clothes! People are paying for a mod. A half-assed skin's mod. I'd rather pay for the good Tiger skins mods before I paid for the new "hellcat".

Seriously guys, just because the slut's wearing longer skirts now, doesn't mean she's still not a slut.

I'm am thoroughly unimpressed with ToV.

Postscript: Maybe it's good that Relic isn't introducing new sides. Since they can't balance four, can you imagine them trying to balance nine? *cough cough*

Postscript 2: I mean shit guys. Has no one noticed that Relic's GREATEST GAME, Homeworld, had MIRRORED SIDES? But nooooo we need half assed INNOVATION!

[sighman]

Let's first see what these new multiplayer modes are before drawing conclusions. Hopefully, its not only this touted "defend against the AI", but perhaps more. I'd look forward to mirror matches (who cares whether it "feels" right, its just a game; why not just implement a ticker as in historic or alternate) and other multiplayer modes if they added it. If not, meh.

Some questions:
Which factions are added to the pack?
What can be the approximate time its released? (IGN says June 2009, all the other online sources say March)

[Tseng_Fox]

The StuG that insta-kills any Allied infantry that touches it

lolwut?

@Imperial Dane: Perhaps. Just seems that from the new unit point of things the Axis have been thouroughly screwed over. Allies get new armoured cars and tanks, axis get.... buggys.

Which factions are added to the pack?

You mean new factions? theres none.

But I think theres a campain for Wehr, US, Brits and PE.

[ChocoboKnight88]

Although i'm not saying i wouldn't buy it, if it's reasonably priced i will, and probably the only thing i'm really looking forward to is the Boyes AT rifle squad, hopefully you'll be able to Tread-break and maybe even shoot the driver.

I saw that in the files too. I was really quite excited with that. I really hope that Relic replaces the Commando's PIATs with Boys Rifles. It should make them good against light armour but lacking against heavier armour, kinda like the bofors. Not only will this give Commandos more accurate anti vehicle weapons, but it will also mean that PIAT Commandos will no longer obsolete PIAT Sappers.

At least that's only what I'm hoping for. I'm confident that Relic has much more to reveal. Although I must say that I'm disappointed that the British aren't mentioned as one of the armies with a mini campaign. I was kinda hoping to do some Commando Raiding missions...

[Kosake]

Lol nice. Since that freaking Wolverines are smashing my poor PzGrens times and times over, now some revenge from the axis side! Kiss our treads, mo!§%§"§.ers!!!

[BlackLabel]

Kinda boils down to if it will be "Tales of Value" i guess.

[rakgitarmen]

Huge disappointment. The trailer showed nothing new.

I'd say cut PE off the game(COH doesn't really need 2 same Axis sides), polish up British and add Soviets. Then THAT IS a worthy expansion pack.

Otherwise it seems so excit . . . *yawn*.

[senseo1990]

No its quite the opposite: Coh needs much more Axis -Sides ... each new german faction is a great faction for me =)
And I also dont understand why everyone is complaining about the OF Armies...its always: "AAAH Brits destroyed the game"
"PE is just annoying, but worthless" I like new play-styles and for me balance is good so far...there are certainly some units that are useless and need to be fixed but the factions themselves are okay =)

Edit: Oh and maybe something on topic: Calm down guys, I dont think that relic informed us about every feature of the addon yet...so just wait.

[WhiteDeVile]

Forgive me for not digin' through the whole thread, I'll just write the first impression I had when watching the trailer.

So, basicaly they want CoH to become Soldiers:Heroes Of WWII
Am I right ?
Direct fire, enabling you to control your tank's turret, thats exactly the feature S:HoWWII and Faces Of War have.
I wonder will we be able to control a single infantry unit the same way.

Anyway I pretty much enjoyed S:HoWWII, and if CoH:ToV wont mess this feature up, AND have something new to offer, then I'll definetively try it

[rifleman]

The thing with singleplayer is that once you 've finished the campaign you can't play it any longer, on the other hand the multiplayer experience is ever changing as you move up the ranks.

ToV seems fun though.

[CompanyOfBrouwr]

Really looking forward to it. But damn this semi english/german voice over has to change. To me (I am from europe) it sound so childish. It takes away a lot of the atmosphere. I think they should talk german. Most europeans can understand that too.
Oh and I hope they put an EIR mode in the game too, to make it more popular!

[WhiteKnight]

@rifleman : That is matter of your opinion. For others it is different. I loved every min of COH SP. I played it near 9 times.

[Tiresias]

Ok had to do some pruning to this thread. Please please no rants about patching etc. This is a thread on Tales of Valour and as such I want it to remain open. However any off-topic rants will be deleted and people may get banned from the thread.

[Mills022]

So if the axis are getting schwimmwagon's which can cross water. Are the allies getting a water crossing vehicle as well? Maybe one of these?http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DUKW

or a buffalo perhaps?

PE should get a kublewagon instead IMO

[Imperial Honour]

Another New Preview - Gamespy's Take On ToV's Preview
Basically shares some of the concerns shown by the fans, offer a little bit of a different take on what they were shown, and perhaps a little bit of different information compared to the other previews (same video though). Obviously not a must-read, but still something interesting to read if you want to know about CoH: ToV.

http://au.pc.gamespy.com/pc/company-.../932930p1.html

[YurdleTheTurtle]

Again, as I have stated on the first page, stop complaining about the lack of new factions: It would be better if we save major additions for Company of Heroes 2, which by then, will have a much better engine to go along with it.

I too am worried about whether or not the new units are actually new or if they are just replacements; but we will find out in time.

Meanwhile though, save judgements until more information is revealed. We don't know enough to call this off just yet. I do have a bad feeling this game may get rushed, especially since it may be released around the same time as DoW 2.

[Kosake]

And still, I don't want any COH2. I'm sick of this running after new graphics and engines. The less developers work on recource-sucking looks, the more time they have for patches, balance, content and plain mechanics of the game.
And I'm dead-sure that an add-on WITHOUT MAJOR ADDITIONS is not worth the buck, no matter what.

[Celution]

I read somewhere in this thread that someone said: "the new Tiger doesn't look any different to the old one, except for the skin.
Well take a look at this picture:


I think it does look different....

For my opinion of ToV, I think it's a good small add-on to CoH, but I really would have hoped for a Eastern Front, or maby new unique units. I don't like the Wehrmacht and Panzer Elite just get the Schwimmwagen, which can't even cross water, and especially when it replaces the Kettenkrad. I really love the unique tracked vehicle. I do love the M18 and Staghound, but it would be amazing if Relic adds the Pz.Kpfw. III.
I mostly agree with alot of people here, but I'm too lazy to make all quotes of them.

[Ludovsky]

Yeah... CoH2 might be nice...

... but the problems is that hardware wise, players are seriously starting to have troubles keeping up with devs, in my opinions. Prices are seriously not going down that much.

Hell, I think 2008 was in fact the very first year where /laptops/ sales beat the sales of desktop PC, if I recalls well the article that was once posted in the newspapers up here(more specifically, Le journal de Quebec, the most read newspaper in my region of quebec).

And laptops are seriously not known for their gaming strength usually. So a CoH2... would need to go double-time on making sure it's extremely hardware friendly, to the point where I feel that to be successful it'd almost have to be more hardware friendly than CoH itself.

[scavenger83]

So, basicaly they want CoH to become Soldiers:Heroes Of WWII
Am I right ?
Direct fire, enabling you to control your tank's turret, thats exactly the feature S:HoWWII and Faces Of War have.
I wonder will we be able to control a single infantry unit the same way.

Correct.Just like Soldiers:Heroes of WW2-Wrath of The Tiger campaign.Battles of Viller Bocage(vs Brits),direct fire,single Tiger story,Witmann vs. all the same

[YurdleTheTurtle]

And still, I don't want any COH2. I'm sick of this running after new graphics and engines. The less developers work on recource-sucking looks, the more time they have for patches, balance, content and plain mechanics of the game.
And I'm dead-sure that an add-on WITHOUT MAJOR ADDITIONS is not worth the buck, no matter what.

CoH 2 isn't coming out soon. It probably won't be for a long while, and by then, I'm sure they will optimize it the same way they did for CoH. I know how you feel (My computer is pretty bad and can only play CoH on the lowest graphics), but you act as if Relic is trying to make a Crysis killer here.

Honestly, it will do the whole series (and the new factions) proper justice if it were developed 'fully' in the future, instead of right now on top of another big game (DoW 2). The engine still can handle improvements. Besides, think of all the new elements Relic will have to deal with when we move on to the Eastern Front; I'm talking environments (jungles, deserts, winter, etc), water usage (naval warfare, etc.), air usage, islands, and much more. This is not including any new ideas that will inevitably pop up from Relic in the future (it seems they now have a reputation of 'shaking things up').

Back on topic:

What would you classify as a 'major addition'? I'm still waiting for additional content reveal, that's for sure, and I'm still on the fence of course. But like I said, there is no point judging the game yet, when they haven't revealed everything. Patience is always a virtue with Relic; I've noticed they tease A LOT.

[Tseng_Fox]

CoH needs one more real expansion before it can be finished. This is good for those who won't have the rig to run CoH2 as well.

I liked that review. It told the truth, alot of fans are a bit worried about this addon.

[Imperial Dane]

Well considering that this Addon seems like DLC smacked together and apparently is, i do wonder if there really isn't something else being worked on as well ?

I mean by the time of the beta when the tiger ace campaign was revealed as DLC, there was already talk of a CoH project, and the balance beta was meant to give access to some new CoH beta... Sooo.. My theory is that there is something to come after Tales of Valour and that Tales of Valour is just a smokescreen to give Relic more time with the other project..

[WhiteKnight]

Yeah with Intel, Nvidia, ATI and AMD bringing new graphics card, motherboard and CPU every months and prices of each of them are expensive.

Iam confused weather to wait for DX 11 card or DX 10 or 10.1.

[Tseng_Fox]

Well considering that this Addon seems like DLC smacked together and apparently is, i do wonder if there really isn't something else being worked on as well ?

Thats a good question.

It could be very well that this is to keep interest in CoH after the disastor the beta was, until the next expansion is announced.

[Imperial Dane]

Disaster ? Might be a bit harsh, in any case as it is, i think the addon might be a treat to keep us occupied until they bring forth the real meat for us to sink our teeths in... and hopefully a proper Wehrmacht campaign
Not that i don't like the Tiger campaign as it sounds right now, far from it. But i would love to have a Wehrmacht campaign where i get to have some large battles fighting with grenadiers and volks grenadiers and what not else.. Would be great fun

I mean i like that Relic are daring to try something new and all that, one of the reasons they are nr in my opinion, but i would still love to see some Proper Wehrmacht action, while the PE campaign was fun, it wasn't quite the same thing as a Wehrmacht campaign.

[Imperial Honour]

Well its possibly a very good way to repackage the gold edition of Company of Heroes to increase sales again for sure, if the stand alone expansion does indeed include all four armies.

[DarkWarrior]

Well, if they arn't adding new factions at least add like a battle for the buldge, or africa or Norway or something like that.

Also prehaps adding larger maps in which you can use small boats for river crossing or such. I dunno, but if its stand alone is must have something besides a campaign?

[Tseng_Fox]

I mean i like that Relic are daring to try something new and all that, one of the reasons they are nr in my opinion, but i would still love to see some Proper Wehrmacht action, while the PE campaign was fun, it wasn't quite the same thing as a Wehrmacht campaign.

Thats true. Thing is, sometimes they do innovate a bit too far at times. They need to learn to pace themselves and spread it out more. That way they'll have more polished and innovative games/addons.

I'm thinking they might be hiding something special in this addon that they aren't going to announce till near the end. Its has to be something like that, something that'll make it worth its price.

But thing is, what could it be?

[Kosake]

@ Dane: They are not trying to occupy us untill they give us real meat, they are bullshitting us into spending our money for a big patch and look if it works. If it does, let all hopes go for a good game in the next 5 years. Same shit that happened when Blizzard made WoW in 2004. No new stuff since then. And probably wont be till end of 2009.
The moment you allow them to make money with anything you don't like you wont get anything you want for a looooong time.