Reactions to the Beta.

[Mekztra]

Just played my first team game after sorting out my horrible lag (it was caused by the sound quality being on high as default) and I'm enjoying it a lot more. Falling in love with the Eldar - Warp Spider Exarch is just so good, and webway gates absolutely make the team games. Lovely.

[HotAvatar101]

Well, this is my third post here, ^^ but i have to say, im starting to get a feel for the game. I honestly almost hated the beta at first, but now its getting quite fun (after 3 days). I think the major reason that the beta has been getting negative so far (and i used to be negative, really negative as well) is that all of us are SS players, and the change b/w DoW and DoW2 is so big that honestly there is almost nothing similar b/w the two games. Its a big change, and many of us are/were alienated by that. At this point, i still say that the game needs some things fixed b/c it doesn't stack upto the original DoW, but nonetheless i find that im starting to have fun playing this game as i find out more about its mechanics and dynamics.

Needless to say though, the game might have a tough time finding a good audience b/c its first impressions are often not good.

[runab0ut]

Some things that irks me:
- Too fast decapping, would like it to be slower.
- Too much moving back and forth with random points. Make points a bit worthwhile to cap.
- Grouped unit icons in the UI should be larger so its usable, make the unit portrait significantly smaller.

So far, its nice...

[supertino99]

I have only managed to read the first few pages but the jist seems to be people who played COH expected it to be like COH and DOW1 players for itt o be DOW1.. for me its a good mix, Less focus on base building and more on the battle and taking/holding points.

I would like resources to build up faster but its beta they can be tweaked.

I dont like VP maps, I hoped there would be some Aniliation maps in there, I and hope they will be their in retail.

I have not made a match so I dont know if these are in the game, but would be cool to tweak a game such as +100% armour for all units... +500% resource rate and so on.

Lets take starcraft 2, another massive RTS out this year at some point, thats sticking more to its previous game and rightly so... until then I think DOW2 will pass the time.

[CrackeD_B0neZ]

For a supposed sequel, this is a sequel in name ONLY. If you're expecting a proper successor to DOW 1, you're in for a huge disappointment. While it's not a bad game, it's not a great game either. The sad thing is that I love COH and DOW, despite their niggling faults...but DOW2? It just doesn't grab me the same way that COH and DOW did and if this is something that needs to grow on me, then it's not worth pre-ordering or even buying on Day 1. Certainly DOW 2 is a new and bold experiment, but new does not necessarily equal better or improved and not all experiments are successful.

Everything that's needed to make this game truly brilliant is there. The real problem is that it's all buried under mediocrity and lackluster, restricted and heavily streamlined and dumbed-down gameplay design.

I feel EXACTLY the same as you, it is NOT a successor of DoW...unfortunately...and I played 25 1v1 auto ( head to head) now...finding myself running all around the map..

I miss fighting over that particular LP and being stubborn about it willing to throw all my army to get it back even if it is +6 rec...:/

There was a point fighting around LP, and if you wanted to retreat...your 0 morale made you run faster so...

Anyway, can't get used to this game yet..I promise I will keep trying...I'm a huge DoW fan, me and my roomates played DoW for 3 years online, I remember old name like StephaneHeines(SP?), Troubleshooter, Servant, Peturbado, LEFT, Grim_Ripper etc.

I played alot, but was nearly never in the forums... ( here , or Dowsactuary etc. ) I'm reading alot though.

[Noble]

Try 3v3 Cracked Bonez. 3v3 Arranged Team games are really what the game was balanced around.

[NFIH]

I haven't played DoW in perhaps two years now and haven't tried the beta, but I've been following these discussions because I have high hopes for a DoW game that uses the CoH engine (a game I played more recently and a lot of). Concerning this requisition point issue, how about this:

Instead of having an addition that protects the point as in DoW 1, but which it seems most are agreed would be near impossible for Relic to add in now that the game is finished, how about removing some points and increasing the resource rate on the remaining ones? Would that stop the whack-a-mole capping issue people are talking about?

Second alternative: As I understand it, turrets are buildable to some degree. How about expanding the number you can build so that every player can pretty much build a defensive turret beside all of his/her points?

Neither of these would be engine changes so it *seems* like they could be done in a patch.

Good ideas? Bad?

[Alegis]

Surely they can add listening posts and the like, v1.0 is finished for printing to discs but they'll be updating the game.

whack-a-mole is present in 1v1 as the maps are relatively bigger there (compared to the spot you get in 3v3) and you have a small army that can only exorcise force on smaller portions of the map. Slowing down decap (in 1v1) seems like a good idea as most have been suggesting.

I think they shouldn't be afraid of introducing a lot more changes in 1v1 to keep it a little more traditional, while having it separate from 3v3 where DoW 2 shines right now and is balanced about. Hardcore 1v1 gamers from DoW 1 would be more satisfied I guess.

Turrets are exclusive to TechMarine and Mek Boy and not that much of a problem. They cost quite a bit (200 req 30 power) and have limited arc.

[Mirage Knight]

Noble: I get that impression too...so basically 1v1 match-ups were more of an afterthought with regard to balance and 2v2's can only be accomplished via closed off player slots. Oh yeah, and 4v4's are completely out of the question anyway.

GG Relic

[ghodan]

Ghodan Quote: " no 4vs4 (yes I know the lack of 4vs4 map does not prove that.but the game room does not show a open/closed slot for a 4th person)"

Mekztra Reply:
Neither does Company of Heroes on 3vs3 maps. It's just a newer Relic thing. There may well be no 4vs4 maps in the game, but the lack of a closed slot doesn't mean a thing in this regard.
-----------------------------

Well there is no space for 2 more player slots at all in that screen.
So no 4vs4.
Mark my words if you don't believe me.

[Busby]

I have to say it. If DoW II turned out to be DoW I with prettier graphics, people would of complained even louder.

[GRLSOV]

I have to say it. If DoW II turned out to be DoW I with prettier graphics, people would of complained even louder.

Well, you know that fanbases are never pleased.

[Sebi]

Tried out a few matches, pretty awesome really.

But is it just me or do the "MG- platforms" (shuriken platforms and whatnot) kill way too fast no matter what? I mean I can cope with infantry getting munched by heavy fire on open area and getting suppressed nearly in an instant, but even behind cover infantry don't seem to be any more safe from getting minced.


Has anyone else experienced this or do I just suck and need to lrn2paly?

[DNA61289]

honestly at first i was not impressed but after playing it more i started to like more and more. I do miss base building a bit but whatever. overall i love it!

[Opeth]

But is it just me or do the "MG- platforms" (shuriken platforms and whatnot) kill way too fast no matter what? I mean I can cope with infantry getting munched by heavy fire on open area and getting suppressed nearly in an instant, but even behind cover infantry don't seem to be any more safe from getting minced.


Has anyone else experienced this or do I just suck and need to lrn2paly?

You are teh suck!
No, just kidding. I find units to last quite long against Shuriken (spelled right?) platforms and HB's while staying behind cover, long enough to be able to flank them or drop Jetpack troops on their asses.
But when in the open and attacked by a HB/SP they fall like flies. Especially with the Techmarine ability that marks a target. Damn, that is good.

[CrackeD_B0neZ]

I have to say it. If DoW II turned out to be DoW I with prettier graphics, people would of complained even louder.

Well, not sure about that..

I think DoW fans wanted a DoW sequel...so DoW 1 with prettier graphics AND the new hero system + cover + terrain could be fine for me and alot of DoW fans I think..

[fuggles]

Much too slow, not enough happens to keep me interested and it's all so...small. Look! My banshee exarch has a new sword if I squint...

Also, I hated CoH primarily because of the lack of energy bars, which alas, is a trend that has been kept meaning as best as I can tell, I have to keep selecting my units AND the enemies to work out who is dying fastest as there is no clear visual feedback in the combat.

Also annoys me that a platform will stand being shot as something is just outside its firing arc. Really? Come on now.

@Busby - DoW1 with prettier graphics would have been what I expected and would pretty much have nailed it for me. I've played about 2 skirmishes and I'm sorry to say that I'm done with DoW2.

Though on the plus, the beta is of the level of generosity which made me love relic owing to insect invasion.

[Zephyx]

I am having a lot of fun with the Beta but there is SO MUCH that could be better.

Why is relic trying to reinvent the wheel? In fact, they are throwing out all of the things that made DoW1 and CoH great!

Why did they remove the supply line concept of territory control?

Why cant you reinforce/upgrade standard requisition points?

It would be nice to have more buildings to build (on the battlefield) Like bunkers, towers, etc.

Defensive and utility type commanders need a significant boost to hit points and armor. They die way to easy.

The special power "doctrine" pool (I.E. Waaaagh!, Biomass, etc.) takes way to long to charge up. In 1 vs 1 games I almost never get it filled up to the top even when I am "saving" it for the bombardment power.

Requisition takes way to long to build up. Even if your entire force has been wiped out and you have no upkeep (assuming relic didn't remove the upkeep mechanic all together) it takes a long time to get new troops. In fact, I've had games where I went from 0 to 500+ power by the time I got enough requisition to build a new squad.

Tyranid melee units should move faster than they currently do. Including the hero's.

Unit off map call in abilities cost way to much Waagh!/Biomass/etc.

Maps are far to small.

Cannot see a team mates ping on a map.

Cannot see the chat log or chat at all for that matter when someone types tp their team.

Not enough units.

As it stands now, Dawn of War is Dawn of Point Capping - There is virtually no "War" until late game.

We need requisition fortifications, 360 Turret rotation, and more build-able defenses. All this running around is making me sick!

Well that's all I can think of at the moment. Hopefully some of these things will get patched and/or added/fixed in expansions.

See you all in game

[RayLancer]

I'm starting to enjoy the game more now (however, the crashes are making me hate the beta). But yea, I'm surprised about the supply line concept, I thought that was a neat concept.

[D-coy]

@ fuggles

If you refuse to play some 3v3 games VS mates or random people you're missing out.

[Kirjava]

Yeah, 3v3 is where it's at.

Though crashes are getting quite annoying.

[SmellyTerror]

Why did they remove the supply line concept of territory control?

Why cant you reinforce/upgrade standard requisition points?

The first is to make it simpler, which makes sense. It was hard for a lot of people to get their heads around.

The second was to make it a more mobile game - get out there and fight, don't bunker up. Which makes sense, since it's visceral bloody combat that we want. LPs don't have blood.

The problem, IMO, is that the two put together means there's no focus to the battlefield, and it's actually hard to find a fight that you have a reason to engage in.

I think there are enough units - again, it simplifies things to have an easy to read unit roster without complex tech trees, and new folk will just pick stuff they like. But with upgrades and unit synergies, to do well requires a lot of thought. I'm getting unit X so I can get upgrade Y which will work well with unit Z and my Commander, which will kick enemy unit A's arse. I really like it.

If I can just find a fight...

[D-coy]

Throwing Roks on 3-4 SM squads lobbing lead at my poor Mekboy bunkered up while they're standing on narrow stairs on the jungle themed 3v3 map was never this satisyfing. These moments really shine.

To does who might not know, Roks are like OB, but more Orky. Big boulders from the sky crush everything.

[Kirjava]

The most satisfying thing I've done today is land a squad of Assault Marines on a Shuriken team. Another team, well-positioned to defend the first, opened fire. Gotcha, thinks the Eldar player. At which point my second Assault Marine squad swoops in and the butchery commences, while my Heavy Bolter squad and Techmarine lay down covering fire for my Scouts to cap a Victory point. Moments later, a Wraithlord bursts through a wall. Balls, I think, I have nothing to hurt him! But wait! I upgrade my Assault squads with Melta bombs while desperately trying to avoid the Wraithlord. Just as he catches my Techmarine, two grenades fly through the air, the countdown starts- BOOM! Wraithlord down. The remaining Eldar retreat in a hail of bolter fire. It's over- but they'll be back.

I love this game.

[KPMaker]

To me it just seems to be a step backwards from CoH.

I know it was not designed to be like CoH, but again I think that is where this game will fail in the eyes of many CoH fans.

• 2 unique powers per commander vs. 6 unique doctrine abilities.
• 2 types of nodes compared to 3 in CoH (I would have preferred the Zeal, Waaagh, etc… to be a universal resource and assigned to a new type of power node.)
• Territory control missing.
• Smaller unit roster compared to CoH (for now.)
• Smaller maps.
• No real Arty.
• Less static defenses/ cannot reinforce requisition points/ no sense of a fortified front line.
• Vehicles worked so much more smoothly in CoH.
• Damaged vehicles as cover (said to be patched in later.)
• Critical hits on vehicles/ main gun destroyed/ eng. Destroyed, etc…
• Teching too fast (Resource rate seems ok though/ if people want a faster game then please go play C&C, or the gazillion other fast paced RTS’s out on the market.)


To highlight just how spectacular the mechanics of CoH are, some people are complaining about the special specific race resource (Zeal, Waaagh, etc…) taking too long to build up. Well, if they were all one universal resource assigned to a 3rd type of node then the player that tactically controls the map better would get that resource that much quicker and be rewarded. I know fighting rewards in this sense too, but this way the person that is controlling the map gets more as compared to each race having about the same chance with killing units & units being killed.

If I was reviewing this game I would in no way give it a higher score than CoH. Now I see why some reviewers are being criticized for stating the obvious.

Now the game can still be a blast and will appeal to peps that either hated CoH, loved DoW more than CoH, or never played either of those games. It just does not have that super duped WoW factor that CoH had and still has IMO.

A step backwards in a genre that yearns for a new and brighter future…..

[Opeth]

• 2 unique powers per commander vs. 6 unique doctrine abilities.

Also, the wargear options.

• Teching too fast

Totally agree.

[KPMaker]

The wargear options are great; to me this would have been a nice touch on top of everything CoH already had.

[Soulblighter]

this thread is getting a bit out of control.

please continue the "discussion" here.