Elder Scrolls V - Skyrim [post-launch thread]

[SubakuGaara]

The archery classes are the most powerful.

Unlike pro magic style enchantments, you can have the fortify archery enchantment on anything but boots (most pro magic enchantments can only be used one or two types of armor and one or two types of accessories. the fortify archery enchantment can be used on them all freely except for boots). Seeing as that enchantment increases damage by 40 percent and you can have that on all your helmet, armor, gauntlet, ring, and amulet, you very quickly become a killing machine. Throw in sneak damage and the various damage upgrades you get via perks and trust me the archer class is untouchable.

I realize theoretically daggers do the most damage but its slow for clearing out dungeouns. For general playing purposes if you go all out for arrow damage, you will be untouchable. I'm currently taking down mammoths and giants with a single sneaked shot.


I find the mages to be pretty weak overall after playing that style (only if you get items that boost your magicka regen to a total of 300 percent can it be feasible because the high level spells do too little damage and cost too much magicka imo and if you mix in one handed sword place).

[Kien]

I have the feeling that chests gets refilled with stuff over a time and people in caves etc respawn. Is that true?

[Starblade]

Yes, caves get repopulated (not always by the original type of inhabitant) and chests get locked and filled with new content after some time.

[Nalkor]

@Starblade - Very true on the not always original inhabitant part. In my bleak falls barrow bit on my level 64 that I mentioned? There's a room with a waterfall in a snowy area. Gone was the lone female draugr and in her place was a frost troll.

[Malachi]

Daggers are for sneak attacks.
Hence the 16x dmg.
They dont need the dmg from 1 handers.

They shouldn't be classified as One Handed weapons then, though, right? The fact that when you use them you level up your One Handed skill, but don't benefit from it is also rather retarded, don't you think? Also, kinda stupid how with maxed Archery, your sneak shots with bow with the 3x bonus will do more damage than your dagger attacks for 15x. No, I think this is a bug and should be fixed. If the daggers prove too powerful after receiving bonuses from One Handed, then nerf their base damage maybe?

----------

Also, I need a mod to make my horse stop being a bloodthirsty behemoth of doom. It can tank enemies that 2shot me, dragons for example, and it chases after every hostile it sees. A horse chasing a fleeing Sabercat is hilarious.

From what I asked around this happens on master (the horse being uber tough, that is), due to all NPCs being tougher on higher difficulties. This is fine for not having my horse die to a random single hit, but I'd prefer if it would just stand around or run away when attacked. I feel like a cheater when a group of bandits that would probably dispatch me in a few seconds attacks me when I'm on horseback, decides they will all go after my horse and dies horribly to it's mighty hooves, while I try to contribute at least a little to the fight, stabbing them in the back.

Oh and Nalkor, Sneak works perfectly fine for me, although this is on a character with Sneak 100 and fully perked.

[Nalkor]

@Malachi - Thing is, my level 64 started as a stealthy build, if only because charging in was suicide at such an early point, and I never recall getting detected so often unless there were light sources everywhere. It might be because of a bad reload or ill-timed save, it has happened on a semi-rare occasion for me in the past on previous Bethesda games. I can certainly handle the two bandits easily enough, it's just well, annoying is all. Nowhere near as much as being unable to hit a flying dragon because lolsparks/lightning bolt don't have super range and arrows are fuck-all useless against flying (not hovering) dragons.

[Afoxi]

Khajiit Shenanigans!

[Nalkor]

@Afoxi - As if I needed another thing to suck my life/time away in...

[Starblade]

They shouldn't be classified as One Handed weapons then, though, right? The fact that when you use them you level up your One Handed skill, but don't benefit from it is also rather retarded, don't you think?

Why would flailing around with a dagger in the open increase your sneak? They're a one handed weapon because they are a weapon that is held with one hand. Not everything benefits exclusively from one tree, just look at the perks for magic. Destruction greatly benefits from Restoration's +25% magicka regeneration perks.

[Nanaki]

Khajiit Shenanigans!

Involving a pineapple and a yoyo.

[Malachi]

@Starblade: This is not what I meant. If daggers were meant as a backstab-only tool, they wouldn't have a skill connected to them in a way that hitting stuff with them raises it, similar how there is no unarmed skill, and so hitting people with your fists doesn't contribute to leveling any skill (right?).

Daggers increase one handed when you hit people with them, though, which is why I think they count as normal 1H weapons, and thus them not receiving damage bonuses from one handed skill is a bug and not a feature. To top it off, daggers receive all the one handed perk bonuses except the +damage ones, but including even Blademaster, that is described as working for swords only.

[Starblade]

If daggers were meant as a backstab-only tool, they wouldn't have a skill connected to them in a way that hitting stuff with them raises it, similar how there is no unarmed skill, and so hitting people with your fists doesn't contribute to leveling any skill (right?).

They're just there because "one handed" is a catchall, you're reading too far into it. Pickaxes increase your one-handed as well. Also, you're wrong. The +20% to one-handers isn't the only thing daggers don't get. They also do not benefit from fortify one-handed potions, enchantments, or effects, or Dual Flurry. If anything, the Bladesman (I assume you mean this, Blademaster isn't a thing) perk applying to daggers is the bug, since as you mentioned they're not swords.

[Busby]

There is no reason not to carry around a sword or two if you find your stabby assassin character can't abuse the ridicules damage of dagger sneak attacks to one shoot anything and everything. Or even better, learn conjure Sword.

[Malachi]

I do carry a sword, indeed.

Starblade, do Pickaxes not benefit from one handed skill either? And I'm not wrong, I'm aware that daggers do not benefit from any effects that add to one handed skill, since they don't get any bonuses from that skill whatsoever. I believe they do benefit from things like Paralizing Strike, don't they?

[Starblade]

I believe they do benefit from things like Paralizing Strike, don't they?

Do they? I wasn't aware daggers had decapitation animations, along with the other bonuses.

And I'm not wrong, I'm aware that daggers do not benefit from any effects that add to one handed skill, since they don't get any bonuses from that skill whatsoever.

Again, this isn't right. They also do not get dual wielding bonuses, along with what I already stated. It's pretty clear they're only supposed to benefit from a select few perks because of what their purpose is.

[DeafMute]

Exactly starblade.
Purpose of the daggers is for sneaky assassins who cut throats.
Not to go toe to toe with bandits weilding warhammers.

[Nalkor]

@Starblade - Oh they do have a decapitation animation. First normal sync kill from up front when dual-wielding them is to plunge both of them into the enemy's chest. The decapitation animation I saw during the Cidhna Mine quest: Stab an enemy in the shoulder/neck to put them on their knees, then both daggers at either side of their neck and well, bring the daggers across, much like Anakin did to Dooku in Episode 3.

Also, keep in mind that daggers are usually 18 inches, or roughly 45cm in length, they can be used in normal combat as long as you're trained in their use and can dispose of the enemy fast enough. It's why marines, army, and other armed forces are deadly with knives as well as their hands. Just because you can use them to stab people in the back or jam it in the side of their neck (again, throat slitting isn't efficient as jamming it into the side of the neck), doesn't mean you can't use it as a melee weapon. In fact, if someone is very skilled and quick enough, a pair of daggers would beat a longsword purely because the longsword isn't meant to be used so close due to how it's held and swung.

Big spoiler for Dark Brotherhood relating to daggers and why you don't underestimate them as normal weapons.

Spoiler

The werewolf, Arnbjorn I think, nearly got killed by Cicero, same as Vazeera, the Shadowscale because they underestimated what he could do with a dagger. Sure Arnbjorn slashed up that Jester, but he was a werewolf at the time. An insane Jester with daggers held his own enough to nearly kill a werewolf and escape, though heavily wounded.

[Langy]

Do they? I wasn't aware daggers had decapitation animations, along with the other bonuses.

They do - I've decapitated people with my Mehrune's Razor a few times.

But yeah, I'm going to have to agree that daggers not benefiting from Fortify One-Handed Damage bonuses is an error.

[Starblade]

That's supposed to speak more to Cicero than to the fact he has a dagger. No one taking the fool seriously isn't exactly a new cliche. Neat that daggers can decapitate though. I suppose considering that they are supposed to benefit from other perks and double up, even if that doesn't make sense. Triple up if you count smithing. Quadruple with alchemy.

Also, keep in mind that daggers are usually 18 inches, or roughly 45cm in length, they can be used in normal combat as long as you're trained in their use and can dispose of the enemy fast enough. It's why marines, army, and other armed forces are deadly with knives as well as their hands. Just because you can use them to stab people in the back or jam it in the side of their neck (again, throat slitting isn't efficient as jamming it into the side of the neck), doesn't mean you can't use it as a melee weapon. In fact, if someone is very skilled and quick enough, a pair of daggers would beat a longsword purely because the longsword isn't meant to be used so close due to how it's held and swung.

I know what daggers are, but the Elder Scrolls isn't exactly a bastion of realism.

e: Tell me that pickaxes have unique decapitation animations too.

[Nalkor]

@Starblade - I always considered the Elder Scrolls to be a bastion of bugs and an unpleasable fanbase on other boards.

I want a mod to use excess dragon souls to lower the recharge on my shouts, I may have said it before, but I'll say it again. Storm call is useless against dragons if anything else is nearby. My bounty in Riften started rising because the lightning struck horses and guards instead of a dragon.

[Starblade]

My bounty in Riften started rising because the lightning struck horses and guards instead of a dragon.

Thanks for the warning that it hits friendly targets as well as unfriendly, I figured it marked the difference like the cloaks.

Actually, going back to daggers, I wonder how absurdly powerful you could make them including fortify one-handed stuff.

[Grabnutz]

I'm going through all sneaky like on a new character now, and its a completely different game. Lot's more patience waiting for people to turn corners etc, and positioning for the perfect sniping spot. Glad i read about daggers here though, I was dual wielding a sword and dagger combo for some obscure reason..

Also why are old ladies still awake at 4am when i'm trying to rob their houses? They still do that oblivion thing of "oh look a sneaky obvious thief by the front door, better give them three warnings"

[Malachi]

You guys I'm not sure if if isn't placebo or something, but I seem to be PWNing stuff a lot more with dual daggers than before. Maybe they ninja fixed that issue? Need to check the numbers to be sure.

Is the weapon skill bonus (ex. One Handed) aleeady facrored in the weapon's displayed damage?

[Busby]

Yea. It makes actually judging the base damage of certain weapons hard unless your willing to do math. And who does math any more?

[Deionarra]

I've retired my level 40 Ork monk now that she's finished the main quest and have started a new evil High Elf suprematist. I don't normaly roleplay evil characters but it seemed like an interesting choice to go with as otherwise I was going to play a sneeky pacifist like I've always done in previous games. I made Faendal and Sven fight to the death to prove Elven superiority.

Also using weapons feels so strange after punching everyone all the time. Suddenly melee enemies are so much easier to kill but mages and Hagravens are nuts. My monk never had any trouble with spell casters, pretty sure even the first Hagraven I met died fairly easily and I never died to one a single time.

I'm duel wielding a sword and dagger, currently my one handed skill is 29 which is exactly the same as my level 40 character has. With a single point in the one handed skill tree my Elf is seeing 7 as the base damage for a steel dagger while it's only 6 for my Ork monk who has no points in one handed.

So it does look like it affects daggers.

[Nalkor]

@Starblade - Another thing about Storm Call, when the Shout goes off, there's a big PBAoE (Point Blank Area of Effect for the uninitiated) that can also do some damage and add a bounty.

[Kien]

Crap my vampirism is full blow out now so to say. Now I scare people and they hate me. I hate being vampire in these games. Why can't I be allowed to kill them without getting their damn disease? I have no idea of to cure it. Btw I'm level 41 now and I'm starting to face fire mages now. At lower levels it used to be necromancers and cryomancers. Now it's pyromancers, which is bad when you're vampire. I found an ebony greatsword btw. Too bad I'm too in love with my ebony battleaxe since long ago, which now is in legendary quality. Also the ebony greatsword isn't that pretty. -.- I also found a daedric dagger finally.

[Langy]

To cure vampirism, just go around to random people and ask about rumors.

[Grabnutz]

Kien start here:

Spoiler

Morthal, when you meet a ghost, you know you're going along the right questline

[Shuma]

So, guess who voices Paartunax.

Spoiler

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Martinet

Never would've guessed to be honest.

[Rincewind]

New patch seems to have broken the game for me. I see no main menu at all. Validating files didn't help... maybe I need to get rid of my mods, but that doesn't make much sense - why would mods break the menu?

[Grabnutz]

Mountain + 2500 Cheeswheels

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fCrhDamN82k

(I continuously fail at embedding...)

[Misiok]

That patch looks rather underwhelming. I don't know why but I expected quite a lot more. Guess I'm spoiled thanks to DoW 2 :P

[Shuma]

I don't know about that, the patch introduces backward dragons:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=_xCjK3BD6u4

[Busby]

Hmph. The patch has definitely fixed all those bodies that weren't being cleared up correctly. Apart from encountering a Dragon that was doing its best impression of a Aussi trying to play a FPS on a North American server, I haven't noticed any glitches. And I'm not even sure if the patch would cause a dragon to fly backwards and warp around.

Edit: Shuma has a sneak of 100.

[Maktaka]

The patch reportedly also breaks all resistances for everything in the game. So there's that.

[Hirmetrium]

Apparently it also breaks all magic resistance.

EDIT: STOP USING SNEAK 100 MAKTAKA.

[Nalkor]

How wonderful, how can I start steam in offline mode then? This is one reason I prefer to willingly download patches off the official site instead of hoping Steam is set to offline.

edit: FUCK NO! I COULDN'T DISABLE AUTO-UPDATE FAST ENOUGH! IT WON'T LET ME PLAY WITHOUT UPDATING IT NOW! GODDAMN BETHESDA! RELEASE YOUR FUCKING CREATION KIT SO THE COMMUNITY CAN, AS ALWAYS, FIX YOUR HIDEOUS FUCK UPS!

[Grabnutz]

I have no idea if i've got the patch or not, does it auto instal on steam? (At least I can't see an option to actually install it..)

[Nanaki]

How wonderful, how can I start steam in offline mode then? This is one reason I prefer to willingly download patches off the official site instead of hoping Steam is set to offline.

edit: FUCK NO! I COULDN'T DISABLE AUTO-UPDATE FAST ENOUGH! IT WON'T LET ME PLAY WITHOUT UPDATING IT NOW! GODDAMN BETHESDA! RELEASE YOUR FUCKING CREATION KIT SO THE COMMUNITY CAN, AS ALWAYS, FIX YOUR HIDEOUS FUCK UPS!

I disabled auto-update and steam went 'lol autoupdate anyway'

I have no idea if i've got the patch or not, does it auto instal on steam? (At least I can't see an option to actually install it..)

Yup, auto downloads and installs.

[DeafMute]

Yet more capitals from naukor? Say it aint so =P

Does anyone know when this creaton kit is being relased?
Before the end of the year or sometime in feb+?

[Grabnutz]

ah gash, there goes my double enchanted everything with buffs and magic resistances... I'm assuming it applies to things like the shield and alteration perks which blocks magic?

[Nalkor]

@DeafMute - The capslock is for when I'm either 1) supremely pissed, 2) supremely giddy, or 3) trying to be a little funny. The spell absorption works fine, and the shield block resistance perk supposedly is still in effect, but yeah, fighting dragon priests on Master is out of the question. Someone on the bethesda forums mentions being one-shotted by a dragon priest fireball on Master at 525 HP due to no resistances. Also, I think dragons don't land anymore, making killing them VERY difficult. This is likely (though doubtful) result of mods that require tweaking the .ini files because there's no actual Creation Kit yet, so modders are improvising. I'm still seeing new posts crop up about the bugs happening even without the mods and all.

[Akagi_Ryu]

Don't you guys get it? Clearly Skyrim was shipped as an unfinished product. They just forgot to note on the box that they have planned FREE DLC bonus of Daggerfall-degree bugs that they didn't have enough time to introduce into the game

Now it all works as intended

[Nalkor]

Apparently the QA over a Bethesda is a bunch of retarded chimpanzees who wouldn't know QA 101 if it ran up and kicked them squarely in the balls over and over and over.

[Brenil]

Because a game this large, with this many variables, and such a demanding engine is easy to QA for? Right?

C'mon. Bethesda's games have always been like this. They'll fix a few things and break a few others. The game is just too big to test every piddling thing on every system setup and not taking into account the myriad of people complaining about bugs when they're playing a modified game to begin with.

But Brenil, you say. What about the modders that fix Bethesda's fuck-ups? Oh you mean the modders that take months to 'fix' things, then have just as many people or more having various problems with their fixes and conflicts? Or what about the modders that release something then say, "Fuck you, you're doing it wrong.", when someone comes with a bug report?

I'd hate to say it, but there is no perfect game design or designer. All games, all patches, will have bugs in a game this large with so many things to consider. It's easy to say Bethesda is incompetent when you have done nothing to prove that anyone else could do anything any better. Bethesda has their faults, and all their games get patched to the barest of bones before they're off to another project.. but they don't deserve all this crap they get on a regular basis on their own forums that sounds exactly like the sort of drivel you just spewed out.

[Nalkor]

I don't mind bugs, some are even fun. I do however, mind when a patch that fixed a few minor and mostly ignorable little issues starts creating game-breaking bug after game-breaking bug. There's a difference between being a little buggy like any normal game and the atrocity that is now Skyrim in it's current state.

[BigSteve]

Have not experienced any of these issues... Running the FXAA injector, 4gb mem, HD texture packs & voice mod.

[Brenil]

The atrocity? The only confirmed major bug is the resistance bug. That's the only major one that is apparently affecting everyone. The rest seem to depend on the person's system, setup, and vision of reality.

[Grabnutz]

"I used to >insert reference to youtube video here< but then I took an arrow in the knee" has now ascended to memehood on the 'tubes