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HW1 Source Code Modding

  1. #1
    Member Vemarkis's Avatar
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    HW1 Source Code Modding

    Discuss About Modding HW1's Source Code Here, and also maybe post ideas. :cowboy:

    i got few

    A)Improve HW1's Graphic Engine(If its moddable via source code),update support for ship models to something near HW2. and add other miscallenius graphic engine tweaks such as shaders or bump-maps in some future..

    B)Edit the hardcoded race limit, put limit for race unlimited.

    C)improve HW1's Support For Beam weapons, and add support for tractor beams.

    D)Improve HW1's Collision detection system, by implementing the hitbox be counted from actual model(meaning the guns would actually hit the ship, unlike now it hits the box few cents away from the ships actual surface).

    E)Add Support For More Ships per race and enable adding new ship categories.

  2. #2
    Stress Puppy
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    Tractor beams have already been done in the Star Trek:HW SoA mod

    As far as everything else you mentioned, good luck. We still cant compile the source yet. Im afraid that by the time we can HW2's source will be released :/

  3. #3
    Freelance Armorer SvK's Avatar
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    Well, those tractor beams are rather a hack.

  4. Child's Play Donor  #4
    Guilty. Of being in space! Captain Pierce's Avatar
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    I'm from Iowa--I only work in outer space
    Yes, well, your tractor beams actually exist.

  5. #5
    Member Vemarkis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Pierce
    Yes, well, your tractor beams actually exist.
    I mean fully functioned ones that can disable ship in place or pull a frigate or corvette in docking hangar to inflirtrate & capture. Also can somebody give me a link to dl HW1 source-code elsewhere than Relic site?First when i was in line suddenly link gone down, now the thing displays some error. i tried 5 days already and im quite pissed off..and ya shure you dont need bink sdk or directx sdk to compile the build btw?(Avp2 required DirectX 7.0 SDK and Microsoft Visual .NET 7.0)

  6. #6
    Member Vemarkis's Avatar
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    Hmmm Microsoft VBScript runtime error '800a0005'

    Invalid procedure call or argument: 'Mid'

    /decms/_Modules/_Files.asp, line 155 when i click the "Download" button after agreeing the EULA..Is it me or this is starting to smell fishy..

  7. #7
    Ghent
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    no it IS possible to download that file, the source code, the server may be janky, but it is possible to download.

  8. #8
    Member Vemarkis's Avatar
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    Its not, i tried for weeks already, still i get same error :\. Can someone send me via MSN(Ville_Mattila89@hotmail.com)??

  9. #9
    Member Vemarkis's Avatar
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    I got The Source Code now and im thinking about starting a team for modding the game(without adding new races or stuff ourselves, but add support for them). First task would be to add 10 New Race Slots(R3,R4,R5,R6,R7,R8,R9,R10,R11,R12,R13), then add new ship classes and buildables(Class_Cruiser, Class_Platform, Class_Installation, Class_Hyperspace gate), then add new types of teleporation using Hyperspace as base(Slipspace Travel, Subspace)and improve HW1's Hyperspace Graphic Support(Remove the annoying limit with the animations and how big it can be, should be scaled in the ship-file). And add support for Rotating sections on ships and that they can fire same time(Babylon 5 mods in mind). Ill just organize staff, but rest would be up to the staff itself(they would send me the changed files wich i put together and send to the compiler). Each Staff Member Would Work on One Thing(Everybody Diff), i.e Someone would work on Race Slots, someone on Classes and Someone on Hyperspacing.
    Last edited by Akalamanaia; 26th May 04 at 2:38 AM.

  10. #10
    Stress Puppy
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    Good luck, I hope you code monkeys can pull this off. I know you pulled your hair out trying to mod O-R-B as did I. Shame that nothing could come of all that effort. IF you can pull such a mod off that would be a BIG boost to the community.

    Slight list of things that IMO we all need (im sure these were mentioned somewhere before but ill say them again here)...

    1) Support for MORE texture memory without using a textures.ll file. THIS in itself is one of the most annoying things about modding HW that is the 32 meg texture limit for everything (maps, effects, and ship textures). This is what causes 99% of the texture corruption issues most mods have. Which results in mod teams using low quality lower res textures to try, and work around this.

    2) Get rid of the hardcoded ship slots, slot limitations, and animation limitations... enough said

    3) Support for light mapping.. I belive when they 1st started building HW that was intended to be a feature in the lifs (there is mention of it in the source), but it obviously got cancelled for whatever reason.

    If you can do this you will make a veteran HW modder a VERY happy person

    I think you mentioned to me about making the resources moveable like in orb. That would make an interesting change in tactics if asteroids are not stationary.

  11. #11
    Ghent
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    Stress - .... don't worry about textures.ll , it's actually QUITE usefull, and 32mb is not a bad limit at all. With certain options, liflist can actually make textures that are larger than 256x256!! I've tried it out, after a suggestion some time ago by Pesmontis. I converted some HW2 ships back into HW, original textures and all, and they work. ie - the Hgn_destroyer has a 512x512 texture i think, it works great in HW.

    When you actually have a total conversion MOD made and ready, it's quite easy to erase old entries from the textures.ll , and remake a new one using liflist that contains all your new textures. This then enables you to do texture sharing as well, which REALLY saves on memory useage and can stretch that 32mb even farther.

  12. #12
    Aurek
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    please

    I really really hope you get this thing off the ground Akalamanaia. If I can help in some way I will. I cant do any C coding (though I wish I could) but anything else gimme a shout.

  13. #13
    Member Vemarkis's Avatar
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    I can give ideas and stuff, but coding experience i got is zero(still learning what to do). Im still looking around the code to look what i need to change add more ship slots(atleast up to 50 diffrent types for each race would be nice) i think changing #define CM_MaxJobsMothership 2 to 4 (fighter building in mind). Im just wondering how to add Kadeshi & Turanics as races, without taking 2 additional race slots and messing up singleplayer(im still looking for the file that defines what races are in the menu). Btw Give me suggestions for ship classes that should be defined, also if ya want new ships in buildlist avaible(R1 + R2, and Kadeshi and Turanic Raiders..but the ships ya suggest gotta fit in the feel of races and be balanced). Give me the names for the ships(i.e SalCapCorvette). ill try add in much as possible. also can enybody direct me to a free compiler? Im also thinking changing max multiplayers to 12 instead of 8(would need new maps to accomodate 12 players thought). new Ship Desings For Raiders first would be nice(models with anims etc), so i can add em in without need to use default models..
    Last edited by Akalamanaia; 27th May 04 at 4:42 AM.

  14. #14
    Stress Puppy
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ghent
    Stress - .... don't worry about textures.ll , it's actually QUITE usefull, and 32mb is not a bad limit at all. With certain options, liflist can actually make textures that are larger than 256x256!! I've tried it out, after a suggestion some time ago by Pesmontis. I converted some HW2 ships back into HW, original textures and all, and they work. ie - the Hgn_destroyer has a 512x512 texture i think, it works great in HW.

    When you actually have a total conversion MOD made and ready, it's quite easy to erase old entries from the textures.ll , and remake a new one using liflist that contains all your new textures. This then enables you to do texture sharing as well, which REALLY saves on memory useage and can stretch that 32mb even farther.
    Speaking from experience with the SoA, and my own works.. What you mentioned above has been tried (sometimes with limited success), and we still got corruption issues anyway. I know we can use 512's, and ive even experimented with 1024's The trick is to keep everything within the 32 meg mark. This includes ALL the textures in your mod not just the ship textures. Etg's, Btg's, UI graphics, etc, etc, are all included in this. Obviously the best way to do this is by sharing textures whenever possible, but how many mods do u know of interchange components between ships? so we wind up using lower res to try and stay within the limit. this is the barrier id like to see lifted. could u imagine what we could do if we had say a 128 meg limit? it would be a small, but huge leap from what we got to work with now.

  15. #15
    Member Vemarkis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stress Puppy
    Speaking from experience with the SoA, and my own works.. What you mentioned above has been tried (sometimes with limited success), and we still got corruption issues anyway. I know we can use 512's, and ive even experimented with 1024's The trick is to keep everything within the 32 meg mark. This includes ALL the textures in your mod not just the ship textures. Etg's, Btg's, UI graphics, etc, etc, are all included in this. Obviously the best way to do this is by sharing textures whenever possible, but how many mods do u know of interchange components between ships? so we wind up using lower res to try and stay within the limit. this is the barrier id like to see lifted. could u imagine what we could do if we had say a 128 meg limit? it would be a small, but huge leap from what we got to work with now.
    256 meg would be atleast minimum for a Star Wars or B5 Mod..Aurek you could help making Kadeshi & Raider ship designs so they have same amount of ships as Taidans and Kushan(Remember to stay true to the race's profile, Kadeshi could definately use Pulsar and Other ion style weapons on their capitals. And Raiders would make nice use of Missiles and other projectile weaps)

  16. #16
    вяιηgιηg вαยขк тнє нσттιєѕ! scottismo's Avatar
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    Are other websites allowed to mirror the source code download? Being a modding type thing, its definately suitable for the tools section of Jst-Online.....

    Edit: Noticed that 3dgamers has the source code mirrored.
    Relic Entertainment has (re-)released the full source code of Homeworld, their original space-based RTS, no longer requiring registration on their RDN (Relic Developer Network) to download it. This package contains the full source code and plenty of documentation on rebuilding the game
    I never knew they released it for everybody now, not just RDN registered people. I guess if 3dgamers and other websites like fileplanet etc is allowed to mirror it then i can....Interstingly it says on 3dgamers FULL source code while on fileplanet it says "stripped of code not owned by Relic Entertainment".
    May the power protect you, always.



  17. #17
    Ghent
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    Is there a difference between the 2 versions? .... i kinda doubt it personally, but hey, ya never know %)

  18. #18
    Stress Puppy
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    Quote Originally Posted by Akalamanaia
    256 meg would be atleast minimum for a Star Wars or B5 Mod..
    Why not try for 512? Seriously. Any increase will be better than what we got now.

  19. #19
    Member Vemarkis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stress Puppy
    Why not try for 512? Seriously. Any increase will be better than what we got now.
    I don't know what file to edit, and im not shure if im totally cabable of that. By the Way, im making code for multibeam frigates for the 2 races(i just copy Kadeshi Multibeam frigate and edit P2 Out of every single line)so people could make their own multi-beam frigates for other 2 races..ill release the files if someone wants to compile em with HW source code(thought im not shure if it will work properly, but it should) [EDIT]Ok here are the files http://www10.brinkster.com/villem/MultiBeamFrigate.zip i also edited Direct3D texture-related functions a bit but i am not shure entirely if the changes i made work [EDIT]
    Last edited by Akalamanaia; 29th May 04 at 8:16 AM.

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by scottismo
    Are other websites allowed to mirror the source code download? Being a modding type thing, its definately suitable for the tools section of Jst-Online.....

    I never knew they released it for everybody now, not just RDN registered people. I guess if 3dgamers and other websites like fileplanet etc is allowed to mirror it then i can....Interstingly it says on 3dgamers FULL source code while on fileplanet it says "stripped of code not owned by Relic Entertainment".
    Yeah, other websites are allowed to mirror the code, but it needs to be the version that comes as a installer, not the zip file. The installer basically requires the user to accept the same agreement that he'd have to agree to if he were going through the RDN website. Hopefully that makes sense...

    The source code IS stripped of all code not owned by relic.
    "Fear accompanies the possibility of death. Calm shepherds its certainty." - D'Argo, Farscape

  21. #21
    Member Vemarkis's Avatar
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    If eny of you dled the above zip file, its updated now with 2 other required files and file paths. . Im also gona add many many more diffrent ship slots later on, so no worries. I just gotta learn to do the coding for the ships then ill ad many more diffrent kinds of ship slots(Ill just do source-code modding that help other mods to add new ships). By The Way If Mods Want Add New Races(Such as B5 Mods), dl the src and take look at the ship coding and make your own Titled I.e EaStarfury.h & EaStarfury.c and add neccesary code you need for the ship. My modifications will be generic, not specifically for eny mod but ill add new race slots & ships if someone sends the code for it.I also found-out i gotta add few more file to the MultiBeamFrigate zip so all works correctly(so the ship is VALID,cause universe.c has definitions for valid ships for each race)

    I am Looking For Following Staff

    Coder(s)
    -Someone To Change Hyperspacing that many ships can use 1 Hyperspace Portal/Gate/Rift.
    -Someone Willing To Implement The Beast & Somtaaw.
    -Someone Willing To Code In New Ships.
    -Someone Willing To Change Animations so that Ship can continiue to rotate or some section of ship can continiue to rotate whlist firing.
    -Someone Willing To Implement Individual Ship Shield Coding.
    -Someone Willing To Change Texture memory from 32mb to 256mb.
    -Someone Willing to upgrade backround rendering so there will not be pixelation of eny kind.

    Graphic Artist(s)
    -Someone Willing to Make 2D Concept Art For New Ships.
    -Someone Willing to Model The 2D Concepts Represented to Him/Her.
    -Someone Willing to Uwmap The 3D Models.
    -Someone Willing To Skin The 3D Models.
    -Someone Willing To Animate THe 3D Models.
    -Someone Willing To Make New Backrounds For New Backround Rendering System If one Will be made.

    Sound Artist(S)
    -Someone Willing to make new sounds for new ship weapons
    -Someone Willing to make new voice acting for new races.

    Im Gathering this as an community project to help mods(ofcourse source-code would be avaible for someone to modify to make new versions but would have to sign same EULA bit modified as he would sign when he installs HW1 Source-Code). This Would be a community Project to make Homeworld 1 better in many aspects(such as add more races, ships, weapons, animation types, texture memory, texture palette limit up from 8bit to 16 & 24 & 32bit) [EDIT]i found the MAX_RACES Switch in Globals.h, changed from 2 to 4
    Last edited by Akalamanaia; 30th May 04 at 6:08 AM.

  22. #22
    Stress Puppy
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    Is this a specific mod (star trek, star wars, b5)? or are you trying to make a "foundation" for other modders to build thier mods on?

    as far as 2d/3d art is concerned, Im sure you will find no shortage of starving artist here (i know, im one of them).

  23. #23
    Member Vemarkis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stress Puppy
    Is this a specific mod (star trek, star wars, b5)? or are you trying to make a "foundation" for other modders to build thier mods on?

    as far as 2d/3d art is concerned, Im sure you will find no shortage of starving artist here (i know, im one of them).
    This would be generic mod wich would also add 2 new races(Kadeshi and Raiders)in multiplayer play, wich other mods could build on.

  24. #24
    SPPIII
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    HW Modding

    Where can I find Intel Complier 4.0? I was on intels website, but I don't feel like dropping 400 to do so. Is there a student version out?

  25. #25
    Member Vemarkis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SPPIII
    Where can I find Intel Complier 4.0? I was on intels website, but I don't feel like dropping 400 to do so. Is there a student version out?
    You could get a free compiler(PowerC++ or what its name was..)

  26. #26
    Aurek
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    Akalamanaia, there were several Turanic/Kadeshi mods around. I know of two Turanic mods in particular, both of them completed alot of work. Im not shure about the Kadeshi mod though (I never could find a download link)

    Those mod teams (or whoever's left) sould be contacted about the possibility of using their ships to fill out the Shiplists.

  27. #27
    Ghent
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    ...but you still need a way to successfully re-compile the HW source code into a working game, for any of the increased texture mem or new ship slot modifications to be of use. :\ That still hasn't been done yet, and we don't even entirely know what was stripped out of the source code.

  28. #28
    Aurek
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    It actually has, twice. Some guy Compiled a Linux port a while back. And then a guy called Arkon4 got it to compile but then dropped of the world

    That being said what you say is still essentally true, a compilable version to download would help people I think.

  29. #29
    Ghent
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    carp, sorry... i forgot about Arkon4's attempt. Friggin little bugger needs to get his butt back around here again and enlighten us all! Anyone know if his disappearence is school/summer vacation related?

  30. #30
    Member Vemarkis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aurek
    Akalamanaia, there were several Turanic/Kadeshi mods around. I know of two Turanic mods in particular, both of them completed alot of work. Im not shure about the Kadeshi mod though (I never could find a download link)

    Those mod teams (or whoever's left) sould be contacted about the possibility of using their ships to fill out the Shiplists.
    Im very well of aware of those mods, and many new ships they added don't just fit in certain races feel. Also there are texture related functions that came with the source code, i just havent been able to locate the file with texture memory yeat.

  31. #31
    Ghent
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    I still don't personally feel that HW lacks that much in terms of textures. If anything in this area... the engine needs to be revised to accomdate a higher polygon budget. In terms of the MODs i have made over the years, and mods i have played/tested, this seems to be a bigger issue (once a mod'er sorts out any texture issues, that is). You can really develop a ton of lag / slowdown in a long game in HW, when using a lot of ships that stray even slightly into higher #s of polygons. It doesn't seem to clear out as ships are destroyed either (could be weapon effect related, then, ie - if things are not getting cleared from memory after their expiration lifetimes).

  32. #32
    Aurek
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    I dont know about the other mods but the Raiders Ascent mod did some good work. Its forums are here

    There is a huge amount that needs to be done with the engine. But people are needed to do it first

  33. #33
    Member Vemarkis's Avatar
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    My Coding Experience is minimal, i cant dare to touch enything engine related, best possible help i can do is put in new ship slots(but someone else would have to code the ships), and im to scared to touch mad file animation things to add rotating possible with conjuction of firing weapons..

  34. #34
    red21264
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    How about you just do incremental things at first. I'd like to see the turanic ships finished with their programming.

    Their corvettes should also function as salvage corvettes and the carrier can't build or launch plus it confuses the resourcers when they dock

  35. #35
    Iostream
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    this is a good idea!
    adding races and slots for ships would be a major bonus
    would this mean you could dynamically add 'abilities' to ships because they were no longer constrained by the slots they they would normally have to be in?#

    it also needs to be a lot more stable (sorry to be vauge). homeworld's always been heavily prone to random crashing because of mods, and hw2 manages better, because of it's more dynamic and 'open source' approach. would it be possible to make hw1 work in this way? it would probably make it a better modding platform if it were possible

  36. #36
    starblazersfan
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    I agree, if you could just do one minimal thing and then teach all of us how you did it. Then everyone would be jumping on the bandwagon to start programming instead of just replacing ships.
    Thats how I got started moding, I just wanted to change one ship now I can change all ships. I need to start learning how to program and this would be a great way to learn

    starblazersfan

  37. #37
    Iostream
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    yeah, i'm sure we'd all help, but i don't know how to program at all! i'd be willing to learn though.
    a few of the things that annoyed me in homeworld were, when textures unblurred themselves when shot, when you had mod ships that had more then one engine, only plasma would come out of the first one, and those god awful collision spheres!

    so, to fix that, you'd have better texture control (i agree, the graphics in hw arn't actually that bad, but few them without blurring on, and they look, well, disgusting!)
    better engine programming, (for example, be able to tell your ships to have different coloured engine trails or something, and yeah, better looking)
    instead of collision spheres, (i think someone already mentioned this) have the actual hull of any ship be it's collision sphere, so when your ships are fired at, the impact doesn't happen about 5 miles away from the hulll!

    in addition, cataclysm has basic blurred shading, that looks a lot better than the face shading that hw has, so that could be implemented!

  38. #38
    Ghent
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    you can almost, artificially create the vertex shading that HWC uses (T&L). When making or editing models in HW, simply weld ALL vertices, or selectively weld them in a very generous manner. This gives sort of the same effect, with the downside of making some parts of some faces a bit darker than they should be.... HW thinks their vertex normal is the same as another nearby face that may actually be 90 degrees perpendicular %).

    It's far from perfect, but like i said... an ok approximation that's quickest to do.

  39. #39
    Lt. Tampers
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    Okay.....................so........WHERE IS THE SOURCE CODE?!?!?!? :fight: Where is the link? How do I use it? For my intended use, read this forum:
    http://forums.relicnews.com/showthread.php?t=33180

  40. #40
    вяιηgιηg вαยขк тнє нσттιєѕ! scottismo's Avatar
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    Do what I did, use google, don't be lazy
    Its likely that other forum members will simply use google to find you a link anyway. :here: if you really want a hint, you can find it at my site for one place, or fileplanet for another.

  41. #41
    Lt. Tampers
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    Thank you, but you should check that website for typos..: "and and" in the source code description.

  42. #42
    BEFORE talking about what features to shove in, somebody should get a compilable version out there, preferably using VC++ 6

  43. #43
    Lt. Tampers
    Guest
    I couldn't agree more, being the rookie to soure code that I am. By the way, where can I find a site to help a newb like me in the source code arena? Everything in the readme flew in one ear and out the other. (And I am not a blonde.) :bandit:
    I would like to make the Turanic carrier useable to its intended use. I would like to experiment with the Junyard Dog/Dogg/Dawg.

  44. #44
    About the coding, try www.about.com, they had a tutorial for C++.

    As for the modding source code, well, if I would believe in crossing fingers my fingers would be crossed

  45. #45
    I would help, except I can't seem to find a download of the source that doesn't have CRC errors on some of the libs when extracting.

  46. #46
    Ghent
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    sections of the source are missing Delphy, most notably the network stuff, and sound, iirc.

    Sierra owns these sections supposedly, and won't let the full source be released.

  47. #47
    Wait. But they're dead?

    Damn legal issues, sometmes, really... grrr...

    *Koki went to kill someone

  48. #48
    I know Ghent, that wasn't what I said though.

    Specifically, I've downloaded various copies of the Homeworld Source from various places, and all have CRC errors on extraction.

  49. #49
    Ghent
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    ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhh that kind of errors.... uh, my bad. I'll just have the biscuits.

  50. #50
    starblazersfan
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    Supposedly the sound issues have been fixed on the linux homeworld version. If you know anything about linux (and programing :smash: ) you should check it out. http://www.thereisnospork.com/projects/homeworld/

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