[TV/Lit] HBO's adapatation of Song of Ice and Fire, now on Season 2

[Starfisher]

This thread is to primarily discuss the HBO adaptation of the song of ice and fire series. Book series discussion is allowed as well.

HENCEFORTH these rules shall be followed:

Book spoilers must:
1) Be spoilered
2) The spoiler title must contain the book # they are from. IE

Book 3

If you've read the book you'd know what I was going to put here to ruin everyone's shit

3) This goes for everything up until the latest episode in the show. So, Book 1 is now fair game to be unspoilered.
4) When in doubt, spoiler! Do not leave hints that might be spoilers like the names of characters in book 5, which allows people to know that at least that character didn't die.

This thread assumes you are current with the show - show discussion will not be spoilered!

Previous thread's last page to catch up on discussion: http://forums.relicnews.com/showthre...-quot-)/page12

[OhJohnNo]

So yeah I loved the first episode of the new series. A bit dark towards the end, but this is GoT, I expected that.

[Kirjava]

I'm in doubt as to the quality of Liam Cunningham's (Davos Seathworth) performance. He was in a BBC sci-fi show called Outcasts last year and it was... just terrible. He played the President of a colony and by the Lord of Light, he was appalling. Maybe that was the script, because he's been perfectly serviceable in the first two episodes of Season 2. That said, I still have my doubts. And the same about the guy playing Littlefinger. He seems really wooden three quarters of the time.

The lady playing Melisandre, on the other hand... her voice is quite... alluring. I don't know what it is about it, when she says, "For the night is dark and full of terrors" I quiver a bit.

[Pocktio]

She's a fitty, no doubt about that.

I quite enjoyed the latest episode, although not much happened really.

Prolly a bit of a dunce for asking this but

Spoiler

Geoffy ordered the murderisation of all bastards in the city right

Cos it never specified and I just assumed, seemed like a pretty mad thing to do so yeah.

Tyrion, as ever, is the bees knees. The bit where he invades the small council was most entertaining. I look forward to seeing more of him.

[Kirjava]

Pocky, you get more of what you like and answers to your questions next ep!

[OhJohnNo]

I loved Outcasts Kir (one of the most underrated shows I've ever seen), and I thought he was great. But it was very understated acting, so I can see why people would hate it (took some getting used to, myself).

EDIT: Wait, first 2 episodes? When does it air for you folks?

[Kirjava]

No. No no no no no. It was appalling. The reason you think it was understated is because it wasn't there. The two cops? Atrocious. I mean, Daniel Mays is bad in everything but Amy Manson was fun in Being Human and Hermione Norris is a genuinely good actor (actress?) whose work on stage and screen is generally laudable. But here we had cardboard cutout characters, paper thin characterisation, plots that didn't go anywhere, schmaltzy sentimentality, an alarmingly small world given that it was supposed to be a colony of thousands and a failure to use the beautiful South African scenery, on which I imagine a massive chunk of the budget was spent. Jamie Bamber had the good sense to get killed off in the first episode and safe himself, but Liam Cunningham was one-note (literally- his tone never deviated, and I suspect never would, remaining in that particular monotone even when receiving particularly good oral sex) and everyone seemed to be taking their lead from him, including the writers. It's both a relief and a shame that it was cancelled: on the one hand, it was like a mercy killing for a crippled horse; on the other, it was unfortunate that the first chance we got to see some original British sci-fi (with a lot of money spent on it to boot) that wasn't Doctor Who ensured that we probably won't see any more for a good long while. If you want a good laugh I suggest looking up the Guardian blog that followed it, particularly the comments, which are an excellent example of people desperately wanting to like something that was so bad it defeated the best of intentions.

Sorry, not very GoT-related. Must try harder.

[Starfisher]

... o_O

Yes, please do.

I checked HBO GO last night and only saw the opener. There were some rumors that the second episode was up as well, but if it was, they took it down before last night.

[OhJohnNo]

Honestly, Kir, if I want a laugh then I generally just go read the Guardian comments section for any article (particularly music articles, particularly ones that involve Coldplay). It's just so hilariously ironic that the go-to insult they use against anything is "too middle class". But yes, this is massively off-topic and I'll stop talking about it now.

More GoT-related: I wonder if it was Joffrey or Cersei who ordered all those bastards murdered. Cersei is just as insane really, it's just that she's more subtle about it.

[DeafMute]

So can anyone be an extra on this show?
Episode 1 had a british "actress" play an extra.

[sporty]

John, book 1 had some related gossip on Cersei: Robert supposedly fathered twin bastards on a serving wench while visiting Casterly Rock, the queen had the children killed and sold the mother into slavery. You don't need to be subtle when you're royalty.

[OhJohnNo]

That's still more subtle than Joffrey.

[Dark_Axel]

The lady playing Melisandre, on the other hand... her voice is quite... alluring. I don't know what it is about it, when she says, "For the night is dark and full of terrors" I quiver a bit.

Can you say Dutch?
Carice van Houten, she is probably he best know Dutch actress in Hollywood circles.

[DeafMute]

This little clip is from Season 1.
Had to share as its hilarious.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rxLOX...endscreen&NR=1

[Ewokz]

Really enjoying the new season so far, Tyrion's still my favourite character by far. Looking forward to seeing him piss off more powerful people in future episodes

[Aesaar]

I think Cersei is the one who ordered it. I don't think Joffrey gives a shit.

[RexOmniaLupus]

About who ordered the killings

Cersei did it. Robert's bastards with his black hair are evidence that her fair-haired children are bastards born from her incest with Jaime, and thus not heirs to the throne. Being discovered would lead to the dethroning of her child (and just as importantly to her, herself,) as well as bringing intense shame to herself and her House. Joffrey still thinks Robert is his father, and thus has no reason to kill bastards to protect a secret he doesn't know exists.

[Akranadas]

Didn't notice this before, but the intro songs are different between the two seasons.

[Kalimac]

I noticed that as well. They have added a couple of bars at several places in the intro tune, probably to extend it to make room for the new locations they show during the intro credits. It does however make the theme sound a bit awkward at times, and I definitely prefer the original version.

[Starfisher]

So the last episode had a lot of WTF moments for me. Seems like they're starting to deviate fairly substantially from the books. That had to happen, I suppose, but some of their tangents are really confusing. The ending was a complete DAYURRR??? moment. I have no idea where that's going.

On the other hand, that's kind of cool. Now I don't know where things are going anymore. I guess I do in broad strokes, but it looks like the details are going to be substantially different along the way.

[Tregelen]

Granted I've not read the books in a while but I swear Stannis' wife wasn't bed ridden and that he had a daughter with greyscale? Wierd Change.

[Akranadas]

Yeah that's correct Tregelen.

[Aesaar]

It's not like Stannis' daughter added anything to the plot. And do they say Stannis' wife is bedridden? I thought all they said was that she's reclusive, basically.

[Akranadas]

Probably easier to write her out of the show by saying he's stuck in bed all the time. She really doesn't show up much in the books until about aDwD.

They also wrote out Davos' learning to read from the look of it.

[Tregelen]

Probably right Aesaar, on the upside ghost was awesome to see and littlefinger's really being put over as a total bastard.

[Langy]

Granted I've not read the books in a while but I swear Stannis' wife wasn't bed ridden and that he had a daughter with greyscale? Wierd Change.

Yeah, Stannis's wife wasn't bedridden, and he has the daughter with greyscale - but no sons, and in the books Stannis really doesn't like his wife (or women in general). His wife's also apparently got some massive facial hair problems and generally stays away locked in her tower up until A Dance with Dragons.

Book 2 Spoilers

Stannis does do this in the book, though I don't remember when it occurs - their child winds up being the Shadow that Melisandre gives birth to later on in the book.

[Shaitan]

Langy, it never happens from a POV and it's never confirmed it's just implied, though it's safe to say you're correct.

[Langy]

So it's similar to the younger Baratheon brother being a homosexual - implied in the books, but outright shown in the show. Not really much of a deviation from the books, to be honest.

[PetarB]

If you'd like to see 'more' of Carice van Houten I highly recommend 'Black Book' (Zwartboek in its native Holland)- the great Paul Verhoeven's last movie. I wish he'd make more movies. It's a really awesome movie about a spies and nazis in WWII Holland, with fantastic production values for a period drama and tension ratcheted up to 11.

Anyway, I really can't wait to see episode 3 - perhaps we finally meet Brienne?

In episode 2 where Arya meets a certain character I though the character was totally miscast. But after thinking about it for a moment, on second thought I realised I was happily wrong! It had been a while since I read the book. Good start to the next series.

[RexOmniaLupus]

So it's similar to the younger Baratheon brother being a homosexual - implied in the books, but outright shown in the show.

I must not have read Renly's appearances very carefully, because somehow I never got that implication. Anyone know what part of which book it was hinted at strongest?

[Akranadas]

@RexOmminaLupus

Book2

When Renly Dies, Loras' explosions of rages is describe as that of a lover who's lost their love

Other than that, its only really hinted at rather than pushed out in front of you.

[Malachi]

So the last episode had a lot of WTF moments for me. Seems like they're starting to deviate fairly substantially from the books. That had to happen, I suppose, but some of their tangents are really confusing. The ending was a complete DAYURRR??? moment. I have no idea where that's going.

On the other hand, that's kind of cool. Now I don't know where things are going anymore. I guess I do in broad strokes, but it looks like the details are going to be substantially different along the way.

Yeah, I feel the same way. I think I prefer to have it different than the books, as I won't know for sure what would happen.

The only things that were really WTF worthy in the negative way was Asha Greyjoy being renamed to Yara (???) and Arya immediately confessing her true identitiy to Gendry the moment he suspects she's a girl.

Also, the scene in the brothel was kinda LOLworthy. The sex stuff got really comical in this season, at least for now.

Oh, and Rorge seems to have one nose too many.

[Akranadas]

Asha's name was change to not confused viewers with Osha, the wildling woman who Bran has befriended. Both sound the same when said aloud.

If Rorge didn't have a nose, I wouldn't be able to watch those scenes. *vomits*

[Malachi]

Both are also very easy to mistake while reading, as they only differ in one letter. Apparently, Martin has more confidence in his readers, than HBO in it's viewers.

[OhJohnNo]

O is a rather different letter to A, really.

[Akranadas]

As someone who works with phones all day, O and A can sound very similar when spoken with a British based accent (Australia, New Zealand, South African) where American's pronounce them quite differently.

[Malachi]

The two characters also don't really appear in any scenes together, so the name change is still rather curious to me, but eh.

[DeafMute]

*puts on his idiot hat*
Erm..I think I need someone to clarify this.
Season 1 episode 1. the very first part with the 3 rangers coming across the killed wildlings.
Was the being that killed the 2 rangers a white walker or just a re-animated wilding?
And was the bodyparts wildings that came to be reanimated?

[Starfisher]

The thing that pissed me off about the Stannis scene is that Stannis, in the books at least, is such an incredible hardass about honor, but here he caves to sexy times in like two seconds. Also,

Spoiler

By the second time, the whole "I'll give you a son" thing has to be pretty obviously not what's going on, so I always kind of figured that Stannis was in on the whole shadowspawn thing and just "did his duty" like he always does to take the throne. But here he's made out to be lustful and almost weak. Weird change to me.

Deafmute: The thing with the ice sword and ice chain mail is a white walker, which is some sort of evil winter spirit dealy. The reanimated people are just zombies that the white walker makes out of corpses.

[DeafMute]

Thanks Starfisher.

As for Episode 2 Season2. I LoL'D hard when youve the half brother of the stark family on his way to his true fathers castle, touching up his sister along the way. lol. Man this author has no issue with Incest loving at all. Its downright hilarious.

I havnt read the book but I watched the season 1 comiccon and supposidly Season 2 will have the black marsh battle.
Is that a good thing?

[Malachi]

I feel somewhat similar about Stannis, although we don't really get to know how it happened in the books, so there's place for interpretation. Melisandre has magic and alchemical means on her disposal, especially the

minor book 5 spoiler

"powder to make smoke for lust"

she might have used. Although it wasn't hinted anywhere in the TV series she was using such things.

[DeafMute]

Okay another question.
Obviously this tv show and books take part in a semi realistic fantasy world.
Youve armor, swords and soon to be dragons. Is wizards/fireballs also within this series?
Just curious.

[Malachi]

Nah, not really fireballs, and Melisandre is as close to a wizard as you get.

[Kirjava]

Since surely Stannis will be going to face Renly soon, I imagine there's a plot reason for Stannis to have sorted out Melisandre on the map table.

Liked that we also got another (albeit tiny) hint of White Walkers at the end of the episode. Old Man Craster, you dog, consorting with demons! Events of Book 2 are hazy enough in my mind that I can't really remember the details of what happens next, so can't wait for next episode...

Also, people might get a good laugh out of this: 12 Reasons to Boycott Game of Thrones (NSFW) from a Christian website called Christwire, which I suspect has to be an elaborate troll. Sample quote: "12. The moody, dark cinematography will make teens depressed. Many youth subculture groups, including Goths and Skinheads, prefer to inhabit the world of the night. In darkness they find convenient cover to master their addiction to drugs and sexual violence. Does Games of Thrones actively promote marijuana usage and rape? Should parents really sit idly by as we await the answer to this important question?"

[OhJohnNo]

Craster looks so much more normal than I always imagined him in the books.

[Malachi]

@DeafMute: Theon Greyjoy isn't Stark's "half brother", just Ned's ward (something between an adopted son and a hostage). The battle of Black Marsh is definitely a good thing - it would be awkard if they skipped it the way they did in season 1 - lots of plot-relevant stuff actually happens during that battle, unlike the one where Tyrion got knocked unconscious. I still regret that they haven't shown the capture of Jaime, could have made for a great combat scene.

[Starfisher]

The Jon Snow/Craster thing never happened in the books, and it actually sets up a really significant deviation. Jon Snow just saw Craster sacrifice a child to a fucking WHITE WALKER. That's MAJOR PLOT. Craster should kill him to keep that secret, or when Jon Snow tells Mormant, Mormant should kill Craster. I mean, everyone knew that Craster was killing his boy children, but the involvement of actual Others is huge.

I'm not sure why they did that. I hope it's for a good reason.

[Malachi]

Yeah, really curious about it too. I guess they're aiming to speed up the behind the wall plot development somewhat. I trust they won't come up with anything stupid.

Oh man, I love Balon Greyjoy. The actor who plays him really has the character pinned down.

[Kirjava]

Ah, the hilarious article in my last post about why Game of Thrones is corrupting America's youth is indeed from a satire site. I am relieved.

[OhJohnNo]

Christwire is well-known for being a hilarious parody site. Remember: Poe's Law.