@SilvertabbyWe don't know yet why they didn't kill Sam.
I love Bowkers
@SilvertabbyWe don't know yet why they didn't kill Sam.
Egregious Professor Of Cruel And Unusual Geography
It was a very fucking awesome scene regardless. The 3 horns and the wights appearing out of the mist was a huge "oh fucking shit" moment even better than the books. I knew it was coming but still, fuck.
It's like the opening to Inglorious Basterds, every time I watch it again I'm still gripped.
"The thing I find so interesting about you is absolutely nothing."
Let's sail in this sea of charms
Let's drown underneath the stars
RincewindDoesn't matter why they spared him. The fact that they have (so far) breaks it for me. He only survives because of an accidental use of Dragonglass, when he should have died horribly. In this scenario, he either gets thoroughly ignored (rubbish), or fights his way out (again, rubbish: he's a coward). I can see why they'd put him in this situation, but unless the resolution is really good, they've borked his storyline...
There are 2 rules to being a success in life:
1. Never give out all the information.
If I had a gold dragon for every time I'd read somebody on the internet saying that the show had ruined the series or a character because of X or Y...
Doltmarines, for the Emprah: the place to play Dawn of War: Soulstorm
"The ecosystem! We destroy that and this is ovah! CHAAAARGE!" - Lomax
Blood and Balls: the Relicnews Doltathon Blood Bowl Blog (awaiting renovation)
"I'd probably lose my shit if I saw a mushroom with a mouth, eyes, and legs walking toward me in real life. That doesn't make me afraid to play Mario." - Starblade
SpoilerExcept the wights are supposed to try and kill him and he isn't supposed to survive because of some random laziness/kindness on the part of the nameless evils of the cold north.
The Others do not spare people, it is simple as that.
Not really a book spoiler, but spoiled anyways just in caseI really doubt that the Wights are just going to continue walking by Sam unhindered. I don't think they ignored him so much as decided to kill him when one of the wights gets close enough to kill him without going out of their way.
about the epPerhaps its because he's carrying dragon glass, maybe in the show they can sense it or some bullshit like that
What Langy said, basically. GUYS THERE IS ANOTHER SEASON FOR THIS SHIT TO HAPPEN.
IMPOSSIBRU IT MUST HAPPEN NAAAOOWWWW
Another year before more game of thrones makes Starfisher a sad panda
Or maybe, they didn't kill him outright so people who didn't read the books will be worried/hyped as to what happens next? Saying that 'THEY DIDNT KILL HIM NOW ITZ RUINED FUCK YOU DIRECTORS' is so impossibly stupid because we didn't get any resolution from that other than them showing that the White Walkers/Others/Crystal ninja snow zombies are coming for the living. That pity look was most probably only to show that the Walker acknowledges the existence of the fat lard wanker as in - he lives/I see him, time to murder his intestines. I mean, you read the books, I didn't, but I don't believe they've diverged much from the original material, this is after all, adaptation, not a retelling, so I understand important scenes such as these will not be changed in any significant way :P
I read somewhere that series were going to become every 6 months.Could be internet though.Another year before more game of thrones makes Starfisher a sad panda
A Lannister always pays his debtOriginally Posted by Pouk
My issue is they've put Sam in a position where they either have to kill him, or make the Others look weak one way or another to get him out of it.
They ignore him? Makes the Others have emotions and not as scary. The arguement of "I don't have time to kill you" is silly, as having two wights turn around and eat him isn't going to slow a horde that big.
They attack him? No way Sam can get out of that,. He can't fight and is a self-confessed coward who would curl up and let them eat him.
Spoilereven with dragonglass
They didn't need to do this to make us fear the horde. The characters were in enough peril and we knew it. They didn't need to have the Other make eye contact.
SpoilerIn the books, Sam fights one, and kills it by accident as it almost disembowels him. He was running away at the time, with the few remaining survivors.
You don't always have to have a major character present to give a scene emphasis. Sometimes a scene can *gasp* speak for itself. Whether it matches the books or not is largely irrelevant, they have undermined a major threat unless something happens to make his escape feasible (and I'd love to know how they plan to do that) or they kill him.
Last edited by SilverTabby; 8th Jun 12 at 6:50 AM.
Silvertabby - use spoilers, you bad kitty.
@SilvertabbyNo, they have put Sam in a position where he will be rescued by the timely arrival of Lord Commander Mormont or some other Night's Watch badass. They had to put someone near the White Walkers to give us a close up look. Admittedly it would have been better if it had been someone who would have died.
Rince: Read only at your peril, I'm basically spoiling everything.
about Sam and Mormont in reply to Rincewind (seriously these spoiilers are getting daft now)IMPOSSIBRU. Mormont is on the Fist fighting for his life. Then he is leading the terrible desperate retreat, before he gets snuffed by traitors at Craster's Keep, at which point the Great Ranging has basically come apart, most of the Black Brothers from it will die, with a precious lucky few making to back to Castle Black.
Sam eventually gets sent away with Gilly and Maester Aemon to Old Town via Braavos, so Sam definitely needs to survive the north. Plus that journey is where get and Gilly bump uglies and he becomes a real man and you can't take that from Sam with an inglorious demise in the cold wastes.
Last edited by Nurizeko; 8th Jun 12 at 6:14 AM.
NuriOnly that you can. It's been stated long ago that the show will divert more and more from the books, and frankly, having Sam die there instead of going through the rather boring period of him and Gilly hanging out in Braavos doing nothing relevant seems like a viable alternative. They could also use him instead of the undead bear.
The problem with him dying, though, is that he has all the dragonglass, right? So it would fall into White Walker hands. Although it could be fun to see his brothers try to extract obsidian blades from now-zombified Sam.
Last edited by Malachi; 8th Jun 12 at 3:03 AM.
Rincewind, what didn't I spoiler that hasn't been said previously or seen on the tv in both countries now? /Confused
SpoilerIf it was the dragonglass thing, it's fixed now.
No-one is going to come get him. The Fist is a defensable position, and they won't leave it for one brother who can't fight anyway.
What "both" countries? There are people from all over the world here. Spoiler everything and mark it clearly, please.
@Nurizeko, SilvertabbyI've read everything so no real spoilers for me, I was rather trying to argue that the scene was made the way it was made for a reason. Mormont isn't yet fighting for his life because the battle hadn't started at that point. The horns sounded, the foragers headed in and people were getting ready to start dancing but I'm willing to bet 10€ that Sam will be saved by an unseen Night's Watch guy, almost certainly a named one, will show up, chop a wight in half and then they'll run from the White Walkers. Sam is behind that rock so we can see that thing's face, every other theory "omg sam dies omg divert from show" is just speculation.
Just though I'd say that the books are really great and easy to read. They're not as flamboyant as I was expecting and relatively simple. I was expecting some Tolkein-esque drawl that would spend pages and pages describing objects with no relevance to the plot.
Something I learned from the books and never picked up on in the TV series: Lord Commander Mormont, the commander of the Nights Watch, is the father of Ser Jorah. That's pretty neat. It was probably mentioned in the series, but I clearly wasn't paying attention.
"Celtic fans right now sit in silence and watch, and hope that the damage doesn't get any worse from this Graham Carey free kick. Away by Wilson. Teale. Still options waiting in the middle for St. Mirren...OH, AND THEY HAVE ANOTHER ONE! It's stunning! It's absolutely stunning at Hampden park! And it's Steven Thompson, who scores his thirteenth goal of the season, and that might just be the goal that takes St. Mirren into the league cup final!" - 27/01/2013
Haven't seen season 2 but season 1 I did. From what I've heard/read, season 2 deviates more from the books and sometimes for confusing reasons. It also was a bit lackluster? Thoughts? Martin was coproducer for season 1 but I think he is not for season 2. That might have something to do with the lesser quality?
I'm currently on book 3 and not sure I want to see season 2 if it isn't as good as season 1.
Martin was involved, I believe they had him write the Blackwater episode. Not sure the extent though. Certainly they wouldn't deviate without checking what they do isn't going to screw later plot...
I personally found season two just as enjoyable as season one, more to some extent. In season one there were moments when I thought "hang on, if you haven't read the books this makes *no* sense", but in season two that didn't happen. Like the finding of a litter of direwolves when the direwolf hadn't been explained as the Stark symbol, or the relevance of the number of cubs = number of kids.
Season 2 has a couple of duff moments but overall I think it's just as enjoyable as the first. Only way to find out is to see it for yourself I guess! It was different for me in that I watched 1 without reading the books, and by 2 I had read all of them...
So Ive picked up the first 2 books, 5 books in total right? with 2 more on the way? Assuming the old geezer doesnt kick the bucket.
Both of those things are explained in episode 1, over the direwolf's corpse, in the same sentence, by Jon Snow.Like the finding of a litter of direwolves when the direwolf hadn't been explained as the Stark symbol, or the relevance of the number of cubs = number of kids.
I don't think there's any noticable quality drop between seasons 1 and 2. It's just that it doesn't have the novelty power anymore. Season 1 I was like "OMG, it's the best TV series since Twin Peaks!" right now it just keeps steady quality.
"All power demands sacrifice" - Sindri Myr
Originally Posted by MoeOriginally Posted by FriendlyFire
Season 1 felt asif it had alot more, open, outdoor scenes compared to S2.
The antlers in the direwolf's throat was never explicitly explained in the TV series, and only alluded to in the books, but it's a pretty awesome piece of foreshadowing.
I really can't place exactly where, but there were two episodes near the middle of season 2 that I just found really boring and dragged a little, but it picked up pretty well again towards the finale. Other than that I thought it was great.
@Aesaar: really? Then it must have been a brief, mumbled sentence as it went straight past me and I was looking for it... ;-)
But then, Jon does seem either perpetually bemused or grumpy and so a lot of what he says I naturally filter.
Must have been you Tabby. I watched season 1 before reading the books and caught both these things perfectly well.
You are absolutely right, I apparently entirely missed the dialogue in that entire scene.
I blame having late pregnancy brain at the time
On rewatching the entire season 2, there is exactly one scene I find utterly moronic and unnecessary - Jaime's "escape". Stupid, cliche, and serves exactly no purpose to the general plot. I liked the preceding talk betwden Jaime and Alyn, though.
The way I saw it was that it was partly character development- we learn that Jaime squired for Ser Barristan and how he was an adoring child once as well- and then we see the brutal character that he is. Also, it means that Catelyn sends him on his way to King's Landing when it appeared that King's Landing might fall to Stannis. Similar to how Maester Luwin sent to Stark boys to the Wall when there would be no Jon to greet them.
Originally Posted by Starblade
They kinda needed to do that for Karstark to lose a son I think. There was an escape attempt in the book as well it just went differently.
I must not fear. Fear is the mind-killer. Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration. I will face my fear. I will permit it to pass over me and through me. And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path. Where the fear has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.
Mmm, without having Karstark's sons dead at the Whispering Wood, the show needed another place to get a reason for Karstark getting royally furious with his liege in there. If it had been Whispering Wood, we would have needed to have met Karstark back in Season 1, and they hadn't cast him back then, plus it might be considered asking a lot for a more casual audience to remember the specifics of that engagement a year later in the second half of Season 2.
Sure, I see the things they did using that scene, by unnecessary I meant that they could have done these things in various different ways, it was not critical for the plot for Jaime to attempt escape.
The whole thing with the guard just allowing himself to be strangled by Jaime (Oh hey, there were two prisoners in this cage, one is dead, LET'S NOT LOOK FOR THE OTHER ONE BEFORE ENTERING), and then him making it out from the middle of the camp... I don't buy it. Felt like an insult to the viewer's intelligence, honestly, something that show is keen on avoiding, usually.
It's also a replacement for the escape attempt in the books, albeit a bit different.
Were you worried your favourite character might not be making it into the show? Worry no longer!
(potential spoiler warning: this video only gives character names, but that could be enough for some people!)
New Cast Video
Had to look up Orell since I stopped my re-read after book 2, where he isn't named yet. Peculiar casting I think, maybe he'll be the combination of his namesake and Varamyr?
Quite a bunch of favourite characters, the Blackfish, the Reeds, and (not included in the video) Tormund Giantsbane
One step closer to the end of the decadent Eldar race.
[...] the reason we don’t like DRM solutions is because they punish the innocent and they have to jump through all these hoops. We don’t want to do that [...]
Iwan Rheon looks perfect for Ramsay, down to the icy-blue eyes and the wormy lips and the psychotic glare that some of the (unrelated) stills are showing. And apparently Theon's back for Season 3 so we can see the
Spoilerfruits of their beautiful relationship
i told you it cant be removed, if you dont like that as an answer then go fuck yourself.
That noise there was me dying of laughter.
In other news, I'm onto A Feast For Crows. Damn good stuff so far, and A Storm Of Swords was just... well... I can't wait for season 3 or 4 now!
you really don't want to know if you don't read the booksI can't believe that EVERYONE died. And all the stuff with Jaime and his hand was right touching, Tyrion and his father and wtf with Lady Catelyn and the Brothers Without Banners at the end.
Really can't wait for the fight between Beric Dondarrion and The Hound though!
Oh and STAN THE MAN to the rescue at castle black was unexpected, and then Lord Commander Snow was pretty fun. Jon's chapters really are the comic releif chapters when it comes to Pyp and Edd and the others. It's like watching a silly old war movie where everyone has a very clear character that doesn't change.
The cat is awesome, and has my three year old's stamp of approval.
Both my kids love the theme tune. They ain't getting anywhere near the show...
When I saw this thread I decided to stay far away until I was up to date with the books which I hadn't started at the time....
AND NOW AN AGE LATER
Just finished Dance of Dragons, amazing stuff. I'm also liking these new casting choices for the most part. In particular Iwan Rheon as Ramsay Snow/Bolton looks like a great choice and David Scott as Beric, I mean look at this guy
The only one that has me confused is this Ciaran Hinds. I've seen this guy on a few shows and he's a great actor, but he doesn't look like Mance Rayder at all.
SpoilerI don't see him singing any bard songs that's for sure or being a particularly good fighter that Mance is. Hinds looks more like a wise old leader, like a Doran Martell or someone like that.
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