Tyranids Advice

[Imp]

Ok, I got an existing Tyranids army that has 2 Carnifx Barbed Strangler/Sything Talons, and A Warrior brood as my HQ chice with Guns more than Claws. Then I have Broods of 25 Hormagaunts with Scything talons and +1 Initave. As well as some Geanstealers to attract shots away from my gaunts, and if they get into enemy lines they do good also.

Now I was wondering if anyone has tryed Termigaunts with there possible 4 BS. That is something I did not notice the first time I made the army. Now squads of 20 or so Gaunts with guns shooting like Space Marines seems good on paper...... but we all know how stuff on paper compaired to the result on the Table usualy go.

Anyone have any thoughts on that?

[TS_ahriman]

Scythe gaunts are almost always better than gaunts with guns....why? Because even with the termagants, you'll be fleet of clawing just to get into shooting range (just 12"). It isn't worth the extra points to maybe allow them a chance at inefficient shooting.

I also tried out uber-shooty gaunts...a shame they don't work.

[Vexer_s]

yea combat gaunts is the way to go, like he said u are going to be useing fleet of claw to get there u might aswell just go the little bit firther and get into combat and do more damage

[ShadowFox]

Use a Hormagaunt breed, but instead of uping their Weapons Skill spend an extra point to give them adrenal glands. This means they will be 11 points instead of 10 points, but it will easier for you to wound marines and necrons. The +1 to Weapon Skill that they get to begin with does not increase your chances to hit against any normal infantry(except tau, but if you got them in CC it aint going to make a difference).

Also use the Hive Node mutation as much as possible. The last thing you want is for your guys to revert to basic instincts and run away.

P.S. - Try seedling swarms

[TS_ahriman]

Use a Hormagaunt breed, but instead of uping their Weapons Skill spend an extra point to give them adrenal glands. This means they will be 11 points instead of 10 points, but it will easier for you to wound marines and necrons. The +1 to Weapon Skill that they get to begin with does not increase your chances to hit against any normal infantry(except tau, but if you got them in CC it aint going to make a difference).

Try 6 or 7 point gaunts. Scything talons and init. upgrade is the most efficient. Taking WS is almost a purely defensive upgrade (so that marines hit you on 4's instead of 3's) and strength is outweighed by the opportunity cost of the gaunts you could have taken in its place. Especially in v.4 with 2" cc radius, more gaunts=better.

[ShadowFox]

You can make them super cheap if you just go with scything talons,(4 for the gaunt 2 for the talons) but you sacrifice the ability to wound easier, and leaping which is what makes them so effective. If you are going to just go straight scything gaunts(no upgrades) you might as well just stick with termies because normal scything gaunts must be within 6 inches to assault(just like normal infantry). Terms can shoot at 12 inches and their guns have a 4 strength which means they stand a greater chance of actually hurting space marines. Not to mention they aren't going to die as fast as normal scything gaunts because they will be within that 12 inches(to shoot) a turn before normal scythe gaunts will be able to assault. If you give your gaunts leaping they can assault at the same range termies can shoot, which makes them more effective.

I would suggest a group of upgrade hormagaunts, with a group of either normal scythe gaunts or terms. Terms only work when mixed with CC units....you may also want to hold off on your decision until next year when the new codex comes out. Who knows what changes they will make....it would suck to have to make new gaunts because it turns out they changed them. I suggest keeping leaping if nothing else because if you have CC gaunts your primary mission is to get close to your enemy. Technically if you have leaping and get good FOC rolls you could close a full 24 inches by the end of the round.(if you get in assault range)

Weapon Skill for gaunts is useless because they are going to die regardless. The WS extra isn't going to help them hit or hurt marines, so you might as well not get it. If the upgrade doesn't help you actually kill your enemies in some way then its not worth getting....

[TS_ahriman]

Termagants are not going to be more effective with str.4 guns (for a 7 point model) than scythe gaunts using just scything talons (6 ppm).

A squad of 20 termagants shoot at a squad of tac. marines:
20 shots.
10 hits.
5 wounds.
1.66 dead marines

A squad of 20 scythe gaunts charge a squad of tac. marines.
(2" assault radius might make getting all 20 in easier...i haven't tried it, so i'm just theorizing here)
60 attacks
30 hits
10 wounds
3.33 dead marines

A squad of scythe gaunts (without charging)
40 attacks
20 hits
6.66 wounds
2.22 dead marines

8 marines
16 shots (you are within 12 inches after all)
10.66 hits
7.1 wounds
7 dead shooty gaunts....so, assuming that you get a squad of 20 termagants within range of a squad of marines, you'll be killing 15-30 points of guys, and they'll be killing 49 points of gaunts. Gaunts are better in cc because they get the added attack, have good to excellent initiative, and get to take their regular save (for what it's worth...).


I'll make a concession regarding leaping in v.4 (with the whole 4" radius thingy)....maybe a large squad of leaping scythe gaunts and smaller non-leaping squads.

[ShadowFox]

I forgot about charging so that makes sense. But I am saying that if your scythers don't have leaping your termies are going to be shooting the marines before normal scythe gaunts ever get into CC.(with leaping this a moot point) Yes, I would tend to agree that they are better for CC, but they need leaping for them to be used to their full effectiveness. If you don't give them leaping they just stand a better chance of dieing when they forced to survive another "shooting phase".

Not to mention we are not taking into account that the enemy may have CC specialists that will eat the scythers for breakfast. Fortunately, your gaunts most common enemy is going to be Tac Squads so they make for the best examples.

[Imp]

I usualy give em Scything talons, initave +1, and Leaping. Cause you just got to love the within 2" you get full attacks, a must for Nids swarm players.

Now that 4th gives everyone the 2" full attacks thing I am not sure what I will do..... I guess I should pick up the new rule book and see if we get anything to counter that or at least put nids back at #1 CC race.....

[TS_ahriman]

Leaping now provides a 4" assault radius for your full number of attacks. So sayeth the v.4 FAQ's.

[JStallion]

I highly recommend going here www.warpshadow.com when needing Tyranid Qs answered. Very good advice from lots of tyranid players. Lots of pictures of their models and all too in the gallery. Moloch has crazy good skills in painting etc. so check out his Hive Fleet.

[ShadowFox]

Sick, some of those armies from that site were brilliant looking. Especially the Bio-Titans...

[JStallion]

Yeah, saw that site, read a lot of their battle reports (check out phage's, hes got a huge list of them and he's barely lost any, could always be lying but he's a good guy and seems to post the truth) so I joined it and learned 10x what I knew about 'Nids from it.

[Imp]

Thanks for the address, I shall go check it out and see if I cant make some Imperial's die by my claws.