HW2:Gothic War (BFG-TC) (In Stasis!)

**Deionarra** · 19th Sep 05 10:21 AM

No downloads available at the moment but stay tuned as I may release an alpha revsion once i've done a bit more work on the Eldar.

Oh and don't ask when it's going to be finished!

LEGEND
Work that is complete or that only needs minor tweeking and would be good enough to release in it's present form.
Work that is partialy completed and is not ready for release in any form.
Work that is planned for the future.
Work that is causing problems and has no visible solution at present

GENERAL RULES

Rules for movement including new basic attack AI and conversion of turn angles and max speeds from BFG-HW2. (these will still be subject to much change in the future)
Rules for Lances and Pulsar Lances. (need some visual work)
Rules for weapon batteries including modifiers for long/short range and holofields converted from BFG-HW2 with exact same probabilities to hit.
Rules for weapon damage and armour converted from BFG-HW2
Rules for shields uneffected by torpedoes, bombers etc. and impenetrable to other weapons until taken down with concentrated fire. (I may revise this system depending on scripting and feedback from play testing)
Rules for torpedoes including interception by turrets and inacuracy vs holofields. (accuracy needs some tweeking)
Rules for fighters and bombers
Rules for assault Boats.

RACES

Hiigaran TC - Hiigarans converted from HW2-BFG rules, primarily for testing purposes. Of all the BFG rases they are most similar to the Imperials.

Vaygr TC - Vaygr converted from HW2-BFG rules, primarily for testing purposes. Of all the BFG rases they are most similar to the Tau (probably as it's not done yet).

Races are listed in the order that I plan to work on them. I intend to try and complete one race before moving on to the next. However as you can see i've done quite a lot of the imperial fleet although i'm working on the Eldar at present.

ELDAR CORSAIRS

Eldar Corsairs AI
Eldar Weapon FX
Hulks

Haven Spire (or varient there of)
Voidstalker Battleship (torpedo and carrier varients)
Shadow Cruiser
Eclipse Cruiser
Solaris Light Cruiser
Aroura Light Cruiser
Hellebore Frigate
Aconite Frigate
Nightshade Destroyer
Hemlock Destroyer
Eldar Transport
Eagle Bomber
Darkstar Fighter

IMPERIAL FLEET

Imperial Fleet AI
Weapon FX
Hulks

Ramilies Starfort
Space Station
Emperor Battleship
Retribution Battleship
Cruisers and Battlecruisers (All variants)
Dauntless Light Cruiser
Sword Frigate
Firestorm Frigate
Cobra Destroyer
Imperial Transport
Fury Interceptor
Starhawk Bomber
Shark Assault Boat

The following races have not been worked on at all yet although I have worked out most of the more complex rules for these races so as not to have to change the ones i'm working on at present.

CHAOS FLEET
ORC PIRATES
SPACE MARINE FLEET
NECRON REAPERS
TYRANID HIVE FLEET
TAU FLEET

Click the spoiler below for about 30 pictures of work in progress. (Thumbnails)

Note that some of the earlier pics (the ones lower down the page, earlier in tearms of developement) are taken with lower graphical settings (mostly the 800x600 pics). This is just because I didn't realise my settings were so bad not because it doen't run well with high settings. Also i've just included all my pics without sorting the good ones from the bad ones

Some images may get scaled down to fit your screen resolution so click on them again to see the proper resolution (they don't look as good otherwise)

Poly counts for all models arel equal or lower than comprable HW2 ships and at present no ships have their goblin layers done so are not as detailed as they will eventualy be in closeup.

LOTS of PICTURES!

Anit-Lawyer shields at full power captain!

This mod is not an official production of Games Workshop Ltd ., nor is it endorsed or licensed by Games Workshop Ltd. Battlefleet Gothic, Eldar, Space Marine, Ork, Necron, Tau and Tyranid are all registered trademarks of Games Workshop Ltd. All artwork and images used in this mod have been created from scratch by hand and not a single pixel is taken from any material that is exclusive property of Games Workshop Ltd. Models featured in this mod are all based on the likeness of minatures that are copywrites of Games Workshop Ltd. Use of these names and images should not be construed as a challenge to such status. No challenge is intended to the status of these or any other trademarks of Games Workshop Ltd. This mod is intended for none profit purposes only and should not be sold in any form.

sound deamon · 19th Sep 05 11:40 AM

ace man looks realy good . ace moddels

**Alex Drake** · 19th Sep 05 3:10 PM

Finally a BFG mod whose gfx don't look like they crawled out of someone's rectum. I wish you good luck on this project.

**Kou Uraki** · 19th Sep 05 5:15 PM

**Tiresias** · 19th Sep 05 5:47 PM

nicely done, looking forward to it

Doney · 19th Sep 05 11:51 PM

Havnt had an excuse to log in for ages, but this mod blew me away. Man i love the models and I truly wish you the best of luck.

Anyway to replicate the feel of the battlefleet style fighting you should give any thing that is an escort or moves swiftly a fighter attack pathing when attacking. This would help tie in the feel of doing hit and runs which pretty much all eldar cruisers excel at.

Give the imperial ships that are meant to stand off the normal behaviours. This may help to give a more authentic experience when playing as each race.

I love it and cant wait to see this mod finished. That and blackstone fortresses

**Deionarra** · 20th Sep 05 5:55 AM

Thanks for all the positive feedback and i'll try to make sure I give regular updates and hopefuly may have something available for download in the near future.

Anyway to replicate the feel of the battlefleet style fighting you should give any thing that is an escort or moves swiftly a fighter attack pathing when attacking. This would help tie in the feel of doing hit and runs which pretty much all eldar cruisers excel at.

This has already been done and it works realy well. Because of their excellent turning speeds I have even made the Eldar ships do some fighter manouvoures such as immelman turns. They also do barrel roles which helps them fire at targets below the edge of their prows .. and it looks great as well, especialy when a Voidstalker does it

Give the imperial ships that are meant to stand off the normal behaviours. This may help to give a more authentic experience when playing as each race.

I can't tell for sure what will work best until I actualy put some of my Imperial Cruiser models into the game. However I have made the Hiigarans very similar to the Imperials and have given their ships the same sort of attack AI as the Eldar. This works because their ships are so much slower, particularly when it comes to turning and accelerating, so they don't actualy behave the same way.
Using the normal HW2 attack scripts for capital ships would have them stop (like they were doing Burn Retos every turn) and just fire at eachother where as in BFG they should keep moving all the time, only quite slowly compared to the Eldar.

I've mainly tested them against the Eldar though so i'll have to do some more tests of them fighting similar opponents.

Thanks for the input anyway Doney

Llan · 20th Sep 05 8:51 AM

Very, very, very, VERY nice pictures. Seems to be a mod without thousands of weapons for each ship. That's nice (also for my relatively slow computer)

HailZeon! · 20th Sep 05 2:05 PM

THIS MOD LOOKS AWESOME!!!
PLEASE FINISH OR AT LEAST MAKE A RELEASE OF THIS MOD!!!!

**Alex Drake** · 20th Sep 05 2:06 PM

Did you read the first post?

HailZeon! · 20th Sep 05 2:07 PM

Yeah I reread his post, and I already edited my previous post...

twitchey · 20th Sep 05 3:13 PM

shouldn't the elder corsairs be blue with red sails

Doney · 20th Sep 05 6:12 PM

First of all, no twitchy colour schemes of late for the eldar are white with blue from the new magazines.

Now dei what i meant for the slower races like chaos and imperials is that every picture or mention i see has them slowly moving towards each other to give the enemy a broadside. Only the smaller esorts seem to strafe the enemy.

I reckon you should maybe edit the standard ai for attacking to do a jousting style as seen in st: dominion wars. If those slow ships both had those kind of pathing it would allow them come at each other and then give each other a broadside. This seems to be imperial naval combat from what i can tell in the fluff. The only other example of it other than ramming is when the two fleets just come right next to each other and become entwined similar to star wars return of the jedi.

Now for the escorts and light vessels had you considered putting them into squadrens. I only say this because isnt that how they are grouped in BFG now?

Cant wait to see the marines in action, for their bombardment cannons you should consider asking eville about his nukes from rehash mod.

twitchey · 21st Sep 05 4:57 AM

give the nuke to the chaos planet killer

Doney · 21st Sep 05 5:21 AM

nah the planet killer has got a massive beam. Bombardment cannons fire lots of different powerful ordanence

**Deionarra** · 21st Sep 05 9:14 AM

Very, very, very, VERY nice pictures. Seems to be a mod without thousands of weapons for each ship. That's nice (also for my relatively slow computer)

Yes i'm intentianaly trying to avoid the kind of thing some other mods have (mentioning no names

) where the screen just gets filled with weapons fire to the point where it becomes difficult to play (regardless of how good your computer is) beacause you can't see what's going on any more.
I probably won't make the unit caps too high as well as i've found it far more enjoyable when there are just a few ships on each side. (although I will give the option to increase it of course for those who want to).

shouldn't the elder corsairs be blue with red sails

First of all, no twitchy colour schemes of late for the eldar are white with blue from the new magazines.

You mean like this?

Incase you didn't realise you can pick whatever two colours you want for your ship eg..

Although i'm not sure how many people would paint their fleet pink and yellow.

The main body of the ship coresponds to the main colour (surprisingly) and the sails are the stripe colour.

Now dei what i meant for the slower races like chaos and imperials is that every picture or mention i see has them slowly moving towards each other to give the enemy a broadside. Only the smaller esorts seem to strafe the enemy.

I reckon you should maybe edit the standard ai for attacking to do a jousting style as seen in st: dominion wars. If those slow ships both had those kind of pathing it would allow them come at each other and then give each other a broadside. This seems to be imperial naval combat from what i can tell in the fluff. The only other example of it other than ramming is when the two fleets just come right next to each other and become entwined similar to star wars return of the jedi.

I'm not too clear about what you are saying here, you seem to be contradicting yourself a bit. I've not seen ST: Dominion Wars so I can't be sure but from your description it sounds like you are describing how the attack AI works in my mod.

The best thing to do would be to actulaly show you some ships fighting so here is a little video clip:

Video of a small battle between Eldar and Hiigaran ships. Aprox 4.3MB

I've tried to keep the camera in a fixed position for most of the battle so you can tell exactly how the ships are moving around. Bear in mind this is far from a finished version and the picture quality is poor to make it download friendly.
Oh and see if you can spot the silly mistake

Now i'm worried about all the mistakes, other than the one I ment, that people are going to point out.

Now for the escorts and light vessels had you considered putting them into squadrens. I only say this because isnt that how they are grouped in BFG now?

Indead i have considered this and will most likely put them into squadrens. The only concern is that each squadren will use 1 unit cap regardless of how many of the ships have been destroyed. This means you could find yourself in the situation of having to deliberatly get the last escort in a squad killed (or scuttle it) so you can call in a new squad.
On the plus side however, the unit cap will probably be quite large for escorts (BFG fleet list say there is no limit as to how much of your fleet can be made up of escorts). Also having them in squads will allow them to concentrate their fire better on a single target which is very useful against shields, particularly useful if they are stronger than strength 2.

nah the planet killer has got a massive beam. Bombardment cannons fire lots of different powerful ordanence

I'm some way from doing this but that's more or less what I had in mind. Think of something kind of like Sajuuk for the Planet Killer while the minesweeper burst effect would be the kind of thing the Bombardment Cannons would be (only heavier). The weapon most like a nuke would be the Nova Cannon which is sort of like a railgun that fires a nuclear bomb. (to be precise it fires a huge plasma bomb using gravity acceleration rather than magnetic acceleration)

twitchey · 21st Sep 05 9:53 AM

some of the art for the chaos and imperials have thousands of guns on the larger ships like the devine right and some of the battleships

Doney · 21st Sep 05 4:18 PM

OK what i meant in that post was how 2 ships will move at each other, pass by each other while firing their broadsides then pulling away. What i meant by them intermingleing is where they have large fleets of ships that just come together and fire at whats ever in range. Look for a picture of ravensburg, the best is in the EoT codex. Ill post more later

**Void** · 22nd Sep 05 11:27 AM

wow ...... :insane: keep on the good work!

......when will a release come?

Rico · 22nd Sep 05 11:38 PM

G'day Deionarra,
I assume that you are planning to turn this into a TC.
I'm from Battlefleet Gothic Commander, a TC mod for HW2.
Forum here:
http://bfgcommander.proboards51.com/

Currently we are working on codeing and doing heavy research to make the mod as close to BFG as possible, I assume that you have the same objective, so we were thinking that perhaps we could combine forces, to make the best BFG TC for HW2 possible.

BFG: Commander currently has Duelron from FSNA, myself (adjacent leader of FSNA) and will be haveing one fo FSNA's modalers to help. Modelers are what we need most and you appear to be very good at that.
So is there a chance that you would be interested in a merger?
Rico

Duelron1001 · 22nd Sep 05 11:58 PM

i have a massed a large amount of resorces over the devlopment period of FSNA, many of which can by put to use should we merge, including hosting at game-warden.com (100mbit connection, 100 mb account for starters + near unlimited space on the subserver). so you can see that it would help both mods alot should we agree on a merge.

**Deionarra** · 24th Sep 05 10:05 AM

So is there a chance that you would be interested in a merger?

I've sent you a PM about this as I don't want to clog up this thread.

Anyway for now work continues on this mod just as before.

Here are some new pictures mainly featuring the newly completed Hellebore Frigate.

A pair of Hellebores bask in the light of a nearby star

A Hellebore fires all it's weapons at a Hiigaran Cruiser

3 Hellebores fire their pulsar lances together

A Hellebore and a Hemlock fly side by side

A large battle rages around a Hiigaran Space Station (As before Voidstalker is just a place holder model)

Da_Humie · 24th Sep 05 11:06 AM

This looks really nice. It's good to see a BFG fan doing something so amazing. GOd, I miss BFG...

Llan · 1st Oct 05 6:37 AM

Can you release the mod perhaps as singlew files, so that you have to use the -overridebigfile command, please? Want to try this mod, because it looks so awesome.

**Kou Uraki** · 1st Oct 05 12:25 PM

yeah, when will the 1st version be released? im anxious to play this glorious mod!!

**Deionarra** · 3rd Oct 05 11:14 AM

Good things come to those who wait

Hopefully I will be able to make the first alpha release in the near future (maby a couple of weeks).

I tend to have the problem of being a bit of a perfectionist but I am now trying to put all the stuff I have done so far into the game so that I can make a release with lots of stuff in it, even if a lot of the models will be very basic.

I've adjusted all the resource collecting values in the game so that now the resource cost of every ship is exactly the same as it's points cost in th TT game.

In the meanwhile here are some new pics showing some Imperial Cruisers that i've now got round to putting in the game.

An Imperial Dictator Class Cruiser moves out of the dark to attack an Eldar Eclipse Cruiser

An Imperial Lunar Class Cruiser launches torpedoes

Imperial and Eldar Cruisers clash

An Imperial Lunar Class Cruiser tries to hit Eldar Fighters with it's lances.

A Shadow Cruiser gets caught between two Imperial Cruisers

An Imperial Lunar Cruiser Fires on an Eldar Cruiser

Eagle Bombers close on an Imperial Tyrant Cruiser as it unleashes a full starboard broadside at an unseen enemy.

An Imperial Tyrant Class Cruiser Duels with an Eldar Shadow Cruiser and Escorts

An Imperial Tyrant Class Cruiser is toast!

An Imperial Gothic Class Cruiser goes down!

An Imperial Dictator Class Cruiser side by side with a Hiigaran Fortitude Class Cruiser

Picture showing the new format for displaying ship stats in the build menu, similar to BFG fleet lists.

Llan · 3rd Oct 05 12:31 PM

Your mod is simply incredible. This is the mod I'm most looking forward to.

**dacis2** · 4th Oct 05 10:41 PM

seconded. extremely well done. better reinstall HW2....

**Unk** · 5th Oct 05 9:49 AM

Very good. I especially like the celshaded look you are going for.

**Magus** · 5th Oct 05 6:44 PM

Very, very good work.
Not sure if I like the cel-shaded look, but, as mentioned, a hell of alot better than has been seen around here.

One point I would like to make. It seems you have Imperial Lances using the Keeper Ions, and the Imperial WBs using the Keeper Pulsars. Those two look remarkably similar. What I would advise is using rapid fire Lasers (the Laser Corvette or Trinity Cannon effects) for the WB effects. Looking at it again I see the Eldar do the same with the Hiigaran ones. You could use plasma bombs (preferably the Prog. Dreadnought versions) to get a similar effect.

Also, was curious how you were handling Strike Craft, since as far as I know there is no way to get a variable unit cap...

**adamstrange** · 5th Oct 05 7:40 PM

I don't like the cel shading only because i like the HW2 textures but it is a new way to look at playing the game.

If you did every ship like that ,it would be like playing a comic book in realtime :clap:

Llan · 6th Oct 05 1:11 AM

Yeah, but it looks so good that this doesn't matter. I'm only looking forward to this mod and, perhps, I'm looking forward to the new dustwars-relesase.

Nekokaburi · 6th Oct 05 8:13 AM

well, who says that you should have all the detail in the texture of a ship anyways? I mean, who would paint all that detail onto a ship that they were sending out to battle?
"What? Send the fleet straight into battle? Dammit man, we've only just finished the second coat! We havent even put the racing stripes on yet!"

Seriously. There's plenty of detail in the ships. Even if it does look cel shaded, it's pretty damn good work. It's kind of refreshing to see models where every little hatch, window and airlock isn't put on the texture, not to mention all the other little details people love to put in.

Excellent job man. I dont know how much I could do, but if you need help.... And I'm pretty sure everyone else here is the same.

Kolaboration · 9th Oct 05 2:41 PM

Great mod! Keep up the good work!

**Deionarra** · 9th Oct 05 4:11 PM

About time some people started to complain at least a little, I was starting to wonder what was going on

Seriously though I welcome constructive criticism and I will happily awnser any questions, queries and concerns that people have about the mod.

I expected the cel-shaded look to be a little bit hit and miss with people. Basicaly I am trying to make the models look more like the TT minitures than realistic ships. I will try and post some comparison pictures with some slightly different texture styles and see what people think of them.

One point I would like to make. It seems you have Imperial Lances using the Keeper Ions, and the Imperial WBs using the Keeper Pulsars. Those two look remarkably similar. What I would advise is using rapid fire Lasers (the Laser Corvette or Trinity Cannon effects) for the WB effects. Looking at it again I see the Eldar do the same with the Hiigaran ones. You could use plasma bombs (preferably the Prog. Dreadnought versions) to get a similar effect.

I agree that the pulsar and ion beam effects are too similar and inted to change them eventualy to make them more distinctive. However I will stick with these effects for now because both the Eldar and Imperial weapons batteries primarily use lasers and call me old fashioned but I prefer to use beam effects. I will probably use some plasma weapons for the short range component of the Imperial weapons batteries.

Also, was curious how you were handling Strike Craft, since as far as I know there is no way to get a variable unit cap...

Yes I did have a similar idea of making a variable unitcap that allows 1 squadren for every launchbay in your fleet. You are right that this can't be done properly but I think it can be done using build resrictions in the level script.
However as far as I know there is no such limit on the number of squadrens of attack craft you can have on the TT just the number of new squads you can launch each turn. This is basicaly the way I have done attack craft at the moment.
They are very cheep and fast to build, it takes about 2 turns (20 seconds) to launch a squad (9 craft which break into 3 wings of 3 when they attack) and the build time is reduced the more launchbays the production ship has. They don't last very long either, direct fire and turrets cause area damage to attack craft and so can take out whole squads quite fast so you need to keep building new craft constantly.

Seriously. There's plenty of detail in the ships.

Well I haven't done the goblin details on any of the ships yet so there's still more detail to come.

Ok I have just done the goblins on the Imperial Cruisers to make sure I don't run into any problems with them, so here are some new pics

(I haven't done all the detail on the weapon and lance batteries yet because they are subsystems)

Imperial Cruiser Prow View

Imperial Cruiser Aft View

Imperial Cruiser Keel View

A Pair of Cruisers

The Goblin Layer

SNowie · 15th Oct 05 4:55 AM

this mod looks ...
:heyhey::jaw::heyhey::jaw::heyhey::jaw::heyhey:

Llan · 15th Oct 05 8:37 AM

when do you plan to release a release?

**Deionarra** · 17th Oct 05 6:39 PM

When do you plan to release a release?

I have been trying to put all my basic models into the game but usualy I find myself unable to do so without doing lots more work on them to improve them a bit first. They are still are far from finished (the Imperial attack craft in particular) but I am getting there slowly. I still need to do the transports and space stations for both Eldar and Imperials before i'm ready to release anything.

Good news is that I have managed to get the AI working for both races now.

Yes you guessed ... more pictures!

An Imperial Retribution Class Battleship causes a partial eclipse

Retribution Battleship and fighter escort

A squadren of Firestorm Frigates wait for battle

A Retribution Class Battleship Attacks

Imperial Starhawk Bombers and Fury Interceptors fly in formation

Starhawk Bombers attack a Hiigaran Space Station

A Tyrant Cruiser and escorting Firestorm Frigates ambush an Eldar Eclipse Cruiser

Firestorms and Hellebore Frigates clash

Firestorms Attack

The Hiigarans face the Emperor's Retribution!

Eldar and Imperial forces engage

Furies try to fend off Eldar Bombers

Imperial Fury and Eldar Darkstar fighters come face to face

**Magus** · 17th Oct 05 7:31 PM

Still looks like sweetness.
I command you to release it.

Taken for granted that the weapon effects will get changed up a bit, the only other graphical question I have is whether you can use shields without the Defense Field effect. It looks ok on one ship, but in mass combat (The hiigarans face the Emperor's retribution pic) it begins to look silly.

As for strike craft, if the idea is for them to die alot, make them free (or one RU) so they don't impede on your actual ships.
In the TT, the original rules were that there were no limits on AC that could be launched, as long as you kept making your Reload Ordnance checks. This meant that people would sit back with a pair of Emperors or equivalent and just build up massive amounts of AC and attack. No conventional ship could stand against it. The rules were then changed to stipulate that you can only have as many AC in play as you have functioning launch bays.

One more question: Do you have functioning Nova Cannon? If so, we want pictures. If not, remedy that.

Edit: I lied, another question: How are you doing the Tac-overlay icons? I would strongly advise giving Bombers and A-Boats different icons from fighters... I'd go with this:
Fighter : Fighter
Anti-Ship Craft : Corvette
Escort : Frigate
Cruiser/Battlecruiser/Heavy Cruiser : Destroyer
Grand Cruiser : Carrier
Battleship : Cruiser

**Enterprise-E** · 18th Oct 05 3:27 AM

Hey, Deionarra, this is a promising looking mod! i don't know BFG but i see a lot nice new ship models and weapons in there, which makes a mod great!

**Teleros** · 18th Oct 05 5:35 AM

Beautiful work there - keep it up

!

The only thing I will say about the graphics is that they do look rather odd with all those black lines on them (I assume it's the cells everyone's on about :P ). I'd try and go for something more like HW2's ships myself, although I can see a problem with an Imperial cruiser's hull covered in green :P . If you want to break it up a bit, the BFG rulebook had that Retribution Battleship with fine gold lines all over its hull to help break up the monotony of the colours. Also look at the Specialist Games website for more ship designs, eg THIS (big PDF BTW).

Anyway like I said, keep up the good work - we're all itching to see a download for this

.

Mountain-god · 20th Oct 05 2:13 AM

Imagine my glee - finally, a BFG mod for HW2?

I guess I'll have to buy it again just to play :devil:

I recall seeing your work ages ago on another forum - previewing the Imperial Cruisers...

SHIELD EFFECTS
a) Is it possible to decrease the size of the globe surrounding? To more tightly fit the dimensions of the ship.
b) And, if possible, how about making the shield effect non-visible until hit? At which point it flashes - particularly on the edge hit.

**Teleros** · 20th Oct 05 2:32 AM

(a) Good idea

.
(b) I think it'd look better, but as to whether it's possible...

Messenger · 21st Oct 05 8:34 AM

Awesome mod. Can't wait to see an Alpha. If you need anytesting give me a PM.
Also what are your plans for defence? I am not sure what the Eldar would get.

**Homdax** · 21st Oct 05 9:10 AM

I watched the movie and I am impressed by Your work.
Don't You think the Eldar vessels turns a bit too fast? I mean, the most advanced mobility I have seen so far in vessels cruiser size and above are PDS Liir'Hra. They move fast around their axel and turn pretty quick. The Eldar cruisers sort of flip over their own axel worse than fighters. Not very realistic is it...?

Messenger · 21st Oct 05 11:35 PM

Well Eldar vessels are 10000 years ahead of other races so they would have much better engines and what not.

Emperor Kefka · 22nd Oct 05 12:11 AM

And the Necrons are 600,000,000 years ahead of the Eldar. =P

The Eldar can turn like that because their ships are built lightly and they use solar sails to move about. Most maneuverable race in the game.

Messenger · 22nd Oct 05 5:40 AM

Other then Dark Eldar perhaps :P

**DatonKallandor** · 22nd Oct 05 5:44 AM

Just FYI, solar sails are slow. Slower than chemical rockets even (atleast on the timespans involved in quick manouvers).

Daton

**Silver_Wolf#** · 22nd Oct 05 9:11 AM

Solar sails need years to get to top speed...

HW2:Gothic War (BFG-TC) (In Stasis!)

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HW2:Gothic War (BFG-TC) (In Stasis!)

LOTS of PICTURES!

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