bluetrin

I see no pings in front of most of the games in the lobby, I see a ping value for only 6 or so at maximum. I see no ping in front of most of the games. I have set the NAT for
ProtocolPort RangeTranslate To ...Trigger ProtocolTrigger Port
Any6112 - 61126112 - 6112--
Any9100 - 91009100 - 9100--
Any30275 - 3027530275 - 30275--
Any30260 - 3026030260 - 30260--

(no trigger port, no trigger protocol and set for both UDP and TCP)


Here are the files requested.

My provider is Be online, I live in the UK in London, my router is a
- Product Name:SpeedTouch 780
- Software Release:6.1.4.3
Winstun on larry.gloo.net
- NAT Mapping is not endpoint independent - VOIP will NOT work
- Does not preserve port number
- Does not supports hairpin of media
- Public IP address: 87.194.61.131

Attached Files

	warnings1.log (942 Bytes, 4 views)
	warnings.log (312.3 KB, 4 views)
	hijackthis.log (18.5 KB, 5 views)
	DxDiag.txt (52.6 KB, 0 views)

ÜberJumper

Speedtouch routers are notoriously bad with the game.

If you have a port forwarding option on your router, forward 6112 UDP to your PC's LAN IP address.

bluetrin

Thanks for the reply I did it already, I have it set to my interface. I am gonna try to set it to an IP directly though to follow your advice.

How a router can be incompatible with a game ? I mean games or any programs just send TCPIP or UDP packets, it doesn t matter how you send them, isn't it ?

d4m

But see, router companies in their infinite wisdom think of other things they can add to their devices or other ways to accomplish the same task of routing packets. Where as web surfing, voip, etc will be fine through that router, other programs will have a chance to conflict because of their changes.

in theory you are absolutely correct. In practice, theory is only a guideline, the reality typically is that the theory only fits a very small 'perfect' situation which the engineers try to build around.

ÜberJumper

To expand on what d4m said, there's no set standard for the features a router must have. All the manufacturers are doing some things slightly differently.

Some routers have additional security features and think they're being flooded when someone legitimately sends a lot of UDP packets their way.

Router's aren't stupid like switches or hubs, they've got programed code in them that behaves differently.

bluetrin

Doh I guess I am out of luck then.

Takes me ages to find a game which I can join. I ll try to get back my Netgear as soon as I get back home.

ÜberJumper

FYI, netgear routers are also "problematic", some models anyways.

Search the forum for "speedtouch" and see if anyone else has come up with a solution that might work for you.

bluetrin

Found a related post

http://forums.relicnews.com/showthr...ight=speedtouch

It seems that some routers don't translate the ports properly and the solution can be to bridge it with a switch ...

bluetrin

Hey guys I finally manage to solve it for the Speedtouch 780 I still don't see the pings but I can join nearly any game

It's a very dirty solution though, be sure to warm up your firewall ...

Start Menu -> Run -> Type cmd

telnet 192.168.1.254

Login with Administrator then no password

Type 'nat maplist'

write down your outside address without the port

then type:

nat mapadd intf=RoutedEthoA type=nat outside_addr=<YOUR OUTSIDE IP ADDRESS> inside_addr=192.168.1.65

This basically is a DMZ type setting so be careful, your comp is fully exposed to attacks on your network...

The default port forwarding on a Speedtouch is a NAPT, not a NAT which seems to cause problems.


Have fun ....

ÜberJumper

Ohhhh good info Bluetrin.

It'd be interesting if there was a way to get the speedtouch to switch from NAPT to NAT.

Who's your ISP?

bluetrin

My ISP is Be in the UK. They forced me to take that router .

The only problem with that speedtouch 780 (I don't know for the others) is that you cannot specify ports when you use NAT, you can specify ports only for NAPT =/

MuttleyGrouch

Hi guys, been playing with that but it doesnt like the

nat mapadd intf=RoutedEthoA

command, it says that its an invalid param for intf?

Is that the exact sequence of commands when in telnet?

bluetrin

I know that the syntax is different with some other speedtouch, what is the exact model of your speedtouch ?

Type

nat maplist

And

nat tmpllist

Are there lines with RoutedEthoA ?

--

My post was a copy from the console where I typed it
I am gonna check when I get back home tonight. I didn't find a way to set it for any outside_addr value though.

MuttleyGrouch

Well according to the web chat its probably a 7G - but this stuff is outside my comfort zone. There's lots of chat out there about the hub and its quirky behaviour - if it fails towork with the nect few games I try playing I will just dump it completely - I laready go through a mad swap round to a linksys to play (which would be permanent but the wireless has died on it!)

bluetrin

There is another way to fix that ...

Either replace the router with one which has no problem (check before)

Or either set it as a bridge with another piece of equipmen. Bridging will forward all data to the second piece of equipment which will do the port forwarding.

bluetrin

Muttley I will look at your problem tonight to see if I find a CLI doc for your router.

I am at the office atm.

ÜberJumper

Just remember that if you IMMEDIATELY get an error saying unable to connect to all users when you try and join a game, that is likely a Ghost Game in the list.

Try games that fill in at the bottom of the list to join first.

CaptHurricane

Hey guys. Great news. Me too please. Bluetrin - Heroes of CoH should get a medal.
Speedtouch and BTHomeHub are both designed by Thomson right?

Uberjumper can deffo. confirm that 'cannot connect ....' takes well over 30 secs to appear with BT. ooh er Hope this works...... getting 80% of games with level 5 and above was kind of good at first to pick up openings but it gets a bit wearisome after awhile....

CaptHurricane

This is what I get following Bluetrin's instructions.
(Wish I knew how to screenshot cmd)

nat maplist

Idx type interface outside address inside address use
1 NAPT Internet 86.143.177.83:51005 127.0.0.1:51005 0
2 NAPT internet 86.143.177.83 unmapped 1

nat tmpllist

Idx type interface Ifgroup outside address inside address use
1 NAT any lan 0.0.0.1 127.0.0.1 0
2 NAPT any lan 0.0.0.1:21 127.0.0.1:21 0
3 NAPT any lan 0.0.0.1:23 127.0.0.1:23 0
4 NAPT any lan 0.0.0.1:80 127.0.0.1:80 0
5 NAPT any lan 0.0.0.1:443 127.0.0.1:443 0
6 NAPT any lan 0.0.0.1:1723 127.0.0.1:1723 0
7 NAPT any any 0.0.0.1:51005 127.0.0.1:51005 1
8 NAPT local network any 0.0.0.1:67 127.0.0.1:67 0
9 NAPT local network any 0.0.0.1:49152 127.0.0.1:49152 0
10 NAPT any lan 0.0.0.1:53 127.0.0.1:53 0
11 NAPT any lan 0.0.0.1:1900 127.0.0.1:1900 0
12 NAPT any lan 0.0.0.1:3235 127.0.0.1:3235 0
13 NAT any lan 0.0.0.1 127.0.0.1 0
14 NAT Internet any 0.0.0.1 unmapped 1

I wish i hadn't done that. Gulp. Decided that i could maybe use the ifconfig cmds help to map my ports. A little knowledge is a dangerous thing they say....Just lost my Internets and had to reset the router to factory settings and reinstall the software. Still don't like the way the internet light keeps flashing......
Time to pack it in for today and listen to the Arsenal - Spurs extra time on R5 I think.

MuttleyGrouch

Well here's mine for what its worth:
(by the way Capt - select your window and press ctrl-alt-prtscn all at once and you can paste into paint etc)

Attached Images

Muttley.bmp (43.9 KB, 245 views)

bluetrin

*** 1 - About the command
Muttley, I had nearly the same last line than you, for the nat maplist and the nat tmplist

Basically it is a line meaning that if it doesn't match the previous rules we throw away the packet.

The difference is that I had RoutedEthoA instead of Internet, so I guess the command would be the same but with RoutedEthoA.

In your example you must put outside_addr=81.129.149.220 (it is the OUTSIDE ADDRESS), NOT 127.0.01


There is also another difference, I have logged on http://192.168.1.254 and I have ALSO set the port forwarding for both ports used by CoH in addition of the command.


For Muttley it seems to be

nat mapadd intf=Internet type=nat outside_addr=81.129.149.220 inside_addr=(internal IP address)

In my case to get inside_addr, I copied the IP used after I have set NAPT forwarding for 6112 trough the normal router interface. (add it trough normal interface, then telnet your router, nap tmpllist should show a new rule).

*** 2 - About the command line blocking the Internet

If you make a mistake it is likely that you cannot connect to anything outside of your local network.

Actually on my comp, when I made the change, I had to close the existings IE, and open a fresh one to access the internet, it messed something with the connections on existing programs ...

You just need to reboot the modem (for my model at least), because changes made by the commad line are not permanent unless you use the command saveall (or nat saveall, I can't remember)

*** 3 - Take a screenshot of the console

Select the console, press ALT+Print Screen
Open MS Paint -> Start -> All Programs -> Accessories -> Paint
Select Paste, save the picture, upload it on something like imageshack.com and post the link here.


*** 4 - Warnings

Again, on my modem a simple reboot (NOT RESTORE TO FACTORY SETTINGS) restores the previous settings, because there is a command called saveall or nat saveall to make the changes permanent even if rebooting.

This is a kind of fast fix, your internal IP should be fixed (you can assign an IP from the interface of your router so your IP on your local network should always be the same), but your external IP is likely to change quite often unless you have a static IP address.

I have a Speedtouch 780 and Be Online, the command line must be different for each comp

IMPORTANT WARNING: this modification exposes your computer to all the security threats you can find on the internet as it is like a DMZ setting, it forwards you everything sent on your router.


*** 5 - Command Line Instructions (CLI)
documentation for Speedtouchs
Here is the page where I found CLI documentation

http://www.speedtouch.com/support.htm

I don't find one for 7G although it must be the same than another model.


*** 6 - Unsure about settings ?

If you are unsure do this:

Log onto http://192.168.1.254

Go in the port forwarding (on mine it's called assign port to a game or interface, or something like this)

Add a game, forward the 6112 ports ... etc then apply it

Next time you will use the nat lists commands you will see a line with NAPT, it tells you what to put in the command line.

MuttleyGrouch

Thanks for this - to be honest it looks too dodgy - I think I'll stick to TW Med2 and the occassional hard to connect game of COH for now. Not very keen on dropping my barriers completely!! Peer to peer, God only knows what viral ridden piece of porn-a-ware you may be connecting to!

I think other BT /SPeedtouch users will find this helpful.

CHeers

bluetrin

I still have a firewall on my comp though but I see what you mean.

My friends also went back to war 3 since alot of us couldn't connect and play correctly and now don't want to bother trying to fix it ...

CaptHurricane

This works... I think too soon to be certain. Just played 2 1vs1s and a 2vs2 both filled almost immiediately and I got equal opponents. Only 500 people online. Much better than usual. After about ten minutes I get a ping from 50% of games.... was less than 10% before.

I had a problem setting up the static IP address as i could not access the router to forward the ports afterwards. Some DCHP issue. reboot reset my IP address to same as before... but I found an option in the HUB to 'always use same IP' so maybe that's ok.

Muttley.... It's not so bad really m8. Remember anyone not using a router will probably not have a h/w firewall anyway. So provided you have a decent s/w firewall and it still functions we might be ok. i'm gonna check that now. do a scan. Also it may be possible to macro what we've done so we only need to DMZ when in CoH .

Thanks Bluetrin. More info to come.

ÜberJumper

Remember, there are quite a few "Ghost" games in the list that you won't see pings on.

bluetrin

Woohoo it works for CaptHurricane, can I get my medal now ?

Muttey yeah like he said, just setup a good firewall and enjoy the game

CaptHurricane

WhoooowHooooo....... YeeHaaaa. Yup. Like for certain this works. Uberjumper this man deserves a full on engineers medal avatar (or pioneers which is probably better lol).

My firewall seems to be working blocking stuff on average once or twice a minute but I'd never checked before so I've no idea if this is better or worse. I did a full backup and install/restores recently when trying stuff out myself and have done a full update Norton and rescan after being up for 4 hours or so. No reports of anything nasty.

The on-line game experience is like sooooo much better. I've added 3 new nice folks to my friends list and sorta joined a clan for multiplayer already....

Err but bluetrin if you are still about....I wish I'd asked how to back it out before I started. I'll going to try unplugging the hub and then plug it back in and see what that does now. there is not reset switch ---only reset to factory. I kinda had a look at the help in the cmd console but I remebered what grief that gave me last night and thought better of it.

Also discovered why I couldn't do PrtScr yesterday, I think, I had CoH running with Bridgers keys and that seems to mess it. Works today.

Who is gonna break the good news to everyone else?

Right now it is deffo time for some worlds war 2 destructive fun....Byeeeeeeee. Crash..

bluetrin

Hey I am happy that it works well for you
Do a
- nat maplist

Then you can do a :
- nat mapdelete index=<number of the rule to delete>

The rule should be right before the last one with unmapped, and contain the word NAT instead of NATP.

**
I have a button to switch it on and off, so I just reset it myself.

You can also probably log on
http://192.168.1.254 and do a reset

MuttleyGrouch

Now you're just tempting me.......

Can I have your postal address so I can send you my still smoking viral mutation of a PC when it all goes wrong?

Anyway - the rugby is on this weekend so even if I do kill it there's two days of boredom over with before the I miss it!

Thanks

It still doesnt like the cmds - must be a different version of the CLI - sdont worry about it I am happy enough to leave well alone (i think it was a sign)

CaptHurricane

No one likes a smartarse but for the benefit of anyone else reading this thread now or in the future the 'nat mapdelete' command also requires a interface parameter. So.....

nat mapdelete intf=Internet index=<number of the rule to delete>

Muttley - you must have simply made a minor typo, most likely these commands are std.generic and lie behind all the differing window dressing pretty screens. Oh for the good old days of DOSsing about. It's quite a long string and very fussy is all. For example Internet insists on a Capital 'I'. 'i' will not do.

After what I've learned over the last six weeks I'm tempted to try and write a script so when I double click CoH it logs on to telnet etc and does the biz automatically, starts CoH.exe and the resets when the session is over but i think making it wait till I close down CoH to auto the mapdelete will prove beyond my ability.

Bluetrin. You is well brilliant man. This must make CoH online available to maybe as many as 5% more people worldwide......Someone ought to write this up neat and you deserve the credit.....but if you don't fancy it i'll do it for BTHomeHub users later in the w/e....

Never rains but it pours.. just settling down to enjoy my fixed router, after a 6 week opus, when me washing machine broke.......but I think I've managed to fix it on me own by taking the pump and tubing to bits and cleaning out all the crap. just put it back together and it seems to work ..... although I have got an extra nut left over........

MuttleyGrouch

Now Washing machines, now thats something I DO know about......

(if only)

~~~~

(went of and tried again - yes must have been typo Doh!)

Ooooooooooh! that does work. My word.

It would be cool to write this up completely with how to save and restore etc for an idiots guide - its been done in the main in earlier posts but putting it all together would be cool. I'll happily give it a go - but perhaps if Monsieur Blue could copy his post and add the last few details like delete and save (maybe explaining the inside address IP - I though mine was static but clearly not so Ill have to go look otherwise I'll have to keep doing this) - it would be a great addition to the tech area. Ill happily give the Idiots guide view - it is a bit scary for non tech folks (by the way I am a software guy - but this is firm/hardware and as all softies know an arcane and black art)

CaptHurricane

Heh. heh Muttley. Now I can give you a right 'wtf pwnage base rape dude' or whatever it is the top geeks in Sword wibble on about all night.

Don't knock the washing machine. Stroke of genius that. Start of the week I'm in danger of going off on one online with frustration and faced with buying a new router when I've supposedly already got one. Then. Bluetrin sorts the router issue and now with me being able to fix the washing machine myself I've saved enough money to buy a new graphics card...... On a Friday too!

Now the Suns come and I don't want to play atm. How good is that???

nicksource

I have the same problem! My thread:
http://forums.relicnews.com/showthread.php?t=134839

I have the SPEEDTOUCH 576.

My IP is 172.214.26.85...

Do I do
telnet 192.168.1.254

or
telnet 172.214.26.85
(^ My IP ^)

Please help.

Edit:
I tried it both ways and it says:

"Invalid interface name specified. Bad value for parameter 'intf'"

CaptHurricane

It was 192.168.1.254 for me m8.

I think the other IP you quote is your outside address - for your router. Your actual PC has a generic set of internal address(s') usually by convention starting 192.168.1.nnn. But like don't quote me on that 'cos for all I know really it could be bollocks. Bluetrin knows. You will have to follow Bluetrins procedure on the first page. Muttley and I have BTHomeHubs which are Thomson designed but not Speedtouch badged so there are minor differences.

Hope that helps. Good luck. Get back if you get stuck....it's worth doing it for sure.

nicksource

I did:

nat mapadd intf=Internet type=nat outside_addr=172.214.26.85 inside_addr=192.168.1.64

It accepted it, trying it out now.

How would I revert this? Undo? If it doesn't work or causes problems? Thanks.

CaptHurricane

nat mapdelete intf=Internet index=<number of the rule to delete>

You can also simply reset your router....

nicksource

It worked! I can join any game now!

Thank-you so much and PLEASE STICKY THIS FIX! We need to make sure everyone knows this BT/Speedtouch router fix.

Sporky

Does anyone have any idea on how belkin routers do with CoH? Since I have one and aside from ranked games it's a complete bitch to join games.
Does this 'fix' only work for speedtouch?

CaptHurricane

Doesn't look like are many Belkin users in this thread Sporky. Which considering it is the tech forum where people come come when they have problems might be good news for you.
RO is not designed to run through routers and firewalls anyway and so it is not in THQ or Relics interest to publish or allow to be published a list of kit that is more or less likely to be problematic. Officially no routers or firewalls work.



Same symptoms mind . Do you also find you wait a long time for a ranked game and it shows 'starting game' then 'connecting' then goes back to 'searching for a match' a couple of times before you end up matched against someone with a large rank difference?



No one knows yet. Why not give it a go and find out? Just reset your router if it doesn't work.

Telnet in and do a nat maplist. If you see a row that is unmapped (i.e. thrown away) and not type NAT then note the interface type and set up a new DMZ NAT rule as per the instructions above. Note the warnings previously given.

Strangely, perhaps, there is no immiediate increase in games with a white ping count in the lobby but the increase in the number of games you can join is real and dramatic. You'll soon know.

Good luck and let us know how you get on.

Sporky

Yeah that sounds about right. While 1on1 ranked games mostly don't take much longer then 1 minute to connect and join (even though the 'esimated time' is then around 0:04 ) i'm currently axis lv8 and I am mostly paired against lv1-lv5 allied players. but it takes often 10 minutes before I can get into a 2vs2 ranked.

Joining a unranked lobby is a big no-no. I can either host one and wait for half an hour before people are able to join. Or try and join games manually and end up wasting half an hour because I can't get into any of the listed games.

i'll give it a whirl, ill report back here whenever I got any results.

bluetrin

Alternatively you can buy a router that is working fine with CoH, and setup a bridge between your two routers (your actual router will forward everything to the second one which will handle the forwarding)

cyclone9

is there any fix for LinkSys router?
i seems cant to ping the server and keep dc from game

ÜberJumper

Linksys router's generally work. Post your own thread with the info asked for in the Network Troubleshooting Stickied thread.

CaptHurricane

I would be very pleased to hear from anyone who has successfully bridged a BTHomeHub with an currently available mid range router and got good, fast connection to RO without using the firewall kludge from this thread. Just on the off chance like. Thanks.

MuttleyGrouch

one small word of warning - i have found on two occassions that i have lost connection to BT -- only by deleting the new maplist rule could i reconnect.

I was able to return it later.

It had been fine for 6 weeks? weird.

CaptHurricane

Yes Muttley. I experienced the same thing. I think it is down to BT periodicallychanging your outside address IP via the DNS/DCHP server or whatever it's called. We hardwire in the current IP at the time of initial entry.

You can apparently rent a fixed outside IP and use different DCHP (or whetever) but it's not really worth the hassle. Just look up the new address as normal and re-enter.

btw for anyone else reading here as PC nooby as me. There is no need to enter the whole string in the NAT mapadd command. It's easier to enter NAT mapadd > then each parameter prompt comes up in turn. If you make a mistake you only have to re-enter each param. Makes it easier to do it regularly and you really should turn it off when not actually playing CoH.

Although I've been doing this for 6 weeks now and haven't had any problems. Anyone else?

Jock

I have this problem albeit it is with DoW though in their forums i was directed here.

My problem is ive read through the whole thread and being completely computer illiterate, its seeming a bit complicated.

I'm with BE and have a speedtouch, and only recently moved from orange. Although orange were a disgracefull isp, hence the move, i didnt have these connection issues until i switched.

Is there any possibility someone may be able to explain the fix in more laymans terms. Sorry if i appear dumb but i did try to make sense but ended up a bit lost.

Thanks

CaptHurricane

Jock. Do not worry about it man. I no longer do this nor do I recommend others do so either.

I did get 3 months relativly hassle free CoH out of this process initially but as it bypasses the firewall in your router sooner or later you will get suffer a attack. In my case this needed a full XP reinstall to cure.

After that I ran with my PC in a DMZ (see the advanced section of the BTHomeHub) and Norton protection centre active. This was ok until 1.7 of CoH was released when my kit could no longer stand the overhead (AMD Athlon 64 3200+, 1 GB 2.5, 3,3,8) and I started getting more drops than it was worth.

Do yourself a favour now and buy a new router. It will be less trouble in the long run.

Riverside666

i have a similiar problem with my bthomehub that i got last week..it has infinite pings to the vast majority of people any help wud be appreciated. ive added all ports on router but no joy!