Julian

!Read this first!

Well, our old thread got pretty complex, so we've a new plan. A more lightweight, simpler to read, easy browsing thread. (Although it will probably descend into the foul mists of Chaos soon enough.)

13th Company Forum's are located here
-Please sign up so we don't look like a lonely forum!

Space Wolve's 13th Company mod - The Lost Return:

*extreme length warning*

The purpose of this mod:

-To introduce a new unique play style into Dawn of War, coupled with a uniquely styled race.-An attempt to make a sixth complimentary race, in line and balanced (heres hoping) with the existing 5 as of WA's release last year.
-To introduce a race which can show those poncey Khorne Bezerkers how to truly butcher.
-Well, for me to have fun, (and maybe the rest of you lot as well)

The modding team (so far):

Myself (Julian) - On Models, doing stuff and Fluff.
Pacpomarnacki- Texturer and grafix person.
Hirmetrium- Coder and Nerf spammer (balancerer)
Crimson - Is our main animator more on that later.

We also need more texturer's, modelers and anyone we can get to make it look more beautiful. If you think you can assist with anything just post PM or Email me @ Grimnir0@hotmail.com.


The Background:

Space Wolf legend states that the group that came to be known as Thirteenth Company was sent by Leman Russ to pursue the Thousand Sons legion, after the failed attempt to eliminate the Chaos-supporting legion. They vanished from Imperial records, and their loss is honoured by a black stone in the Grand Annulus.

Magnus through his arts, scryed the future, and seeing the treachery of Horus, used his sorcerous arts to send a message to his liege. The Emperor, however, did not believe that his son Horus who was much beloved could betray him, and instead sent Leman Russ, Primarch of the Space Wolves to destroy the Thousand sons, now suspected of attempting to spread discord and sedition between the Emperor and his sons. Russ took his Legion, and with all the Great Companies of the Space Wolves, fell upon the World of the Thousand Sons, Prospero, with the vengeful force of a mighty shower of comets.

The Thousand Sons met the Space Wolves on the field of battle, at its forefront was the Thirteenth company who with incredible ferocity fell upon their erstwhile brethren the Thousand Sons. The Traitorous Thousand Sons could not stand against the righteous force of the Space Wolves, and inch by inch grudgingly gave ground, until they were surrounded in their own Fortress Monastery, and determined to stand to the last man.

Meanwhile Magnus, Giant Cyclops lord of the Thousand sons knelt in his tower and wept as his sons were ripped away from him. In his anger and sorrow he called to all who would listen and one voice answered. Tzeentch the Manipulator, at the moment Magnus gave his soul Tzeentch granted the traitorous-Mutant full mastery of the vagaries of sorcery, and Magnus with his new found power took the battle back to the Wolves of Russ.

Appearing amongst the lines of the Space Wolves, Magnus was unstoppable, even the Feral brotherhood of the Wulfen were unable to stand before the heretical might of the Daemonically enthused Magnus. All fell before him until, the great Primarch of the Space Wolves, Leman Russ advanced upon his Brother. The battle between these two titans was fierce, and would fill several tomes. Regardless, after two days and two nights of combat Russ took the battered body of Magnus, and raising him to the storm wracked skies, brought him down upon his knee.

With a mighty crack, Russ broke the back of his foe, and the heart of his enemy. Magnus sunk to the floor, and as Russ raised his fiery sword Mjalnar to strike his enemies heart, Magnus whispered a single word of Power and sunk into the earth's dark embrace.

As Leman Russ howled his fury to the packs, of the space wolves, the sorcerous-librarians, of the Thousand Sons, opened a vast maelstrom of energy, through which their forces fled. The Wolfkin, the Thirteenth Company of the Space wolves, at a gesture from their Primarch, gave tongue to the chase and followed their foes into the very eye of the warp. With a blinding flash, the swirling maelstrom of energy collapsed and the Thirteenth company, passed from this plane and from Imperial history. -The Saga of the Lost - Egill Skallagrímsson

Their reappearance at the beginning of Abaddon the Despoiler’s Thirteenth Black Crusade has brought them back into the spotlight. They appear to still be pursuing the mission given to them by Russ.

The Thirteenth Company's organization departs heavily from Space Wolf norms, due to the lack of reinforcements and 'fresh blood' supplying the Company, the inability to train members in specialist roles, the lack of heavy equipment, and the effect of having to exist within the Eye of Terror for ten thousand years.

Redelf 13th company fluff
Standard Space Wolf Fluff

The TechTree:

This is probably our Final Techtree, although names may be subject to change.


Longhouse:
Produces: scouts, Iron priest, Wolf Priest
Purpose: main tech building, base etc. produces capping and building units.
Upgrades to: >Stronghouse>Fortress

Wolf Den:
Produces: Grey Slayers, Wolf Packs, Wolf Lord
Purpose: Main troop production building. Makes tier 1 commander and contains some research for the units it makes.

Iron Priest Workshop:
Produces: Nothing.
Purpose: Main research post. contains most troop upgrades. Can be garisoned by Iron priests for defense.
Facts: is a very tough building due to the priests working in it. the iron priests have much work to do for the thirteeth company.

Looted Generator/Thermo Generator:
Produces: Nothing.
Purpose: Produces power for the 13th company. contains research for improved power production.
Facts: its been stolen from chaos. take that you scum!

Listening post:
Produces: Nothing
Purpose: Produces additional req and adds fortification. also contains research for improved requsition production.
Fact: is also one of the tougher structures, to provide its function.
Upgrades to: >LP2(with missle launcher)>LP3(with a single las cannon and additional HP)

Storm Tower:
Produces: Rune Priest and contains research for commander units.
Purpose: Commander research is contained in here.
Facts: VERY important structure, since it produces the rune priest, a crucial and important hero for the 13th company.

Varga-Hold:
Produces: Storm Claws, Long Fangs, Storm Claw Bikers, Wulfen(tier 3), and contains research for some of these units.
Purpose: Secondary troop production, produces all tier two and tier three structures.

Runestone:
Produces: Nothing.
Purpose: Is an important structure. allows the rapid movement and deep striking of troops, and contains tier 4 research as well as warp gate research allowing building relocation.

Units:

Tier 1:
Wolf lord
Purpose: Primary HQ
Weapons:
-Power Axe
-Power fist
-Storm bolter
Upgrades to:
-Frost Blade
-Lightning Claw



Although pretty hard to see he's wearing a red cloak with a pelt across his shoulders.

NEW UPDATED PICS:









(Wolf Scouts
Purpose: Capping, light assault unit.
-Bolt pistols
-Axes/swords
Upgrades:
-Plasma gun)

Grey Slayers
Purpose: Primary anti troop unit. heavily upgradeable, very important/crucial unit.
Weapons:
-Bolters
Upgrades:
-Meltagun(T2)
-Plasma gun(T2)
-Flamer
-Wolf guard sergeant
-Bolt pistol
Upgrades to:
-Plasma Pistol
-Power Axe
Upgrades to:
-Power fist


Wolf Pack
Purpose: Melee unit. Has a commander.
-Claws and maws
-Wolf guard sergeant
Spawns with the pack

Iron priest
Purpose: Builder and repair unit, very light defense. Can be upgraded to be a useful battle unit.
Weapons:
-Bolt pistol
-Thunder hammer(very effective vs vehicals)
-There's been some pretty solid debate over the neccesity of the Iron Priest and although perhaps distinctly unfluffy, we feel that its presence is probably neccessary. Although we're happy to hear your views.



NEW UNTEXTURED LOOK:


Tier 2:
Wolf Priest
Purpose: Secondary HQ
Weapons:
-Crozius Arcanum
-Bolt Pistol
Upgrades to:
-Plasma Pistol






Rune Priest
Purpose: Important HQ. Has powerful Psychic skills, very useful.
Weapons:
-Rune Axe
-Bolt Pistol
Upgrades to:
-Plasma pistol

Storm-claws
Purpose: Elite melee unit
Weapons:
-Bolt Pistols
-Close combat weapons
·Wolf guard sergeant
-Bolt pistol
Upgrades to:
-Plasma Pistol
-Power Axe
Upgrades to:
-Power fist



Storm claw Bikers
Purpose: Only Vehical unit. Light Ranged unit, fast attack.
-Twinlinked Bolters
-Power axes for all
Upgrades:
-Meltagun
-Plasma gun
-Wolf guard sergeant

Long Fangs
Purpose: Ranged heavy anti tank unit. Very powerful weapons, effective at crushing buildings and tanks very quickly with their powerful weapons. also effective at killing infantry.
Weapons:
-Heavy Bolter
Upgrades:
-Missile Launcher(t2 Anti tank)
-Plasma Cannon(t2 anti inf)
-Multi Melta(t3 close range anti tank)
-Lascannon(t3 long range anti tank)
-Long fang sergeant

Tier 3
Wulfen
Purpose: Super heavy elite melee unit, Capable of ripping apart tank armor!
Weapons:
-Claws and Fangs






Expect Irregular updates...

Please discuss all you want/contribute/whine any good suggestions will be considered, but don't go off topic or the powers that be will smite this thread like some really smitey people.

-VIDEOS-
Grey Slayers Teaser

13th Company GUI: main bar and map panel for the 13th made by Pacpomarnacki.



28-09-2006 at 02:03 AM. Reason: Grey Slayers video added
10-06-2006 at 01:45 PM. Reason: Added new Wulfen pictures
10-06-2006 at 01:39 PM. Reason: Added larger Tech Tree
10-06-2006 at 10:52 AM. Reason: added more fluff links
16-06-2006 at 12:06 AM. Reason: Added Redone tech tree
16-06-2006 at 12:09 AM. Reason: Added new updated Wolf lord images.
03-07-2006 at 04:27 PM. Reason: Wolf Priest images added.
03-07-2006 at 11:54 PM. Reason: Textured Wolf Priest images added
10-09-2006 at 10:40 PM. Reason: New Untextured Iron priest added

PacPomarnacki

Just a quick note from me, the Tech tree I made which is further up the page is kinda small annoyingly, ill try to sort it out at a later point.

Edit: Tech Tree's A good size now, also I changed 2 of the names on julians request. Portal Command now reads Runestone to fit in with the text and Wolf Pit is now Varga-Hold, which is norse for wolf :P we felt there where too many Wolf names in the buildings so we changed the language of one. If you have any suggestions for buildings please post below.

thudmeizer

I got alot of modeller/texturers for ya.. sending mail..

Glad to see SpaceWolves are still MOVING FORWARD!

Oz_Striker

Are there any vehicle, like leman russes or dreads?

Hands_of_Fate

From what I've read on the previous thread and know of the 13th Company's background, there will be no vehicles in the mod. Think of 13th Company as elite light infantry in the terms of deployment and tactics. The only reliable ranged heavy support they can really count on are units of Long Fangs.

I have one question of my own too. Concerning this:Now, if I read this right, you have a squad leader spawning together with the squad? How did you guys managed to put spawning of a leader together with the squad ingame? I, and indeed every other coder, would me most interested in that bit of info. I'm talking LUA coding here, if it's Scar based, then I'll bother you no more.

jesukrixto

Hi there guys. Looks like your mod is quite advanced already, doesn't it?...lots of models looking great!!

Three questions:
1- your techtree mentions the Portal Command, a Tier 3 building...but you don't give any description. What does this building do?

2- No vehicles (except bikes) means like 40 infantry cap? or some of the infantry units will take up support cap, like long fangs and wulfen beign support or something like that?

3- Any progress on the bikes?...will you be using the one that was beign already developped by another modder?(don't remember who)

K, I think that's it. GL with your mod pals!!!

Madman

Well i have to say this mod looks fantastic space wolves and chaos - a very good mix. You have my full support! I may (once my maps for another mod team have finished) be able to help you with some specially designed chaosy winter maps for you.

Julian

Ok first
@ Thudmeizer - Ty man, you are one of the guiding lights of this community.
@Oz_Striker - You read correctly there are no tanks, this came under massive discussion prievously. However Fluff-wise 13th company have no vehicles asides from Bikes. We hope to balance this lack of heavy hardware with, the tank killing capabilities of Long Fang's, Wulfen and Meltaguns.
@Hands_Of_Fate - unfortunately that particular dillemma has come to our attention, currently the spawn is offset with the commander having to be built post squad build. the Techtree entry is mostly an old copy from a preivous post, i missed that one.
@JesKrixto -
1. Pacpomarnacki being and idiot failed to rename it after i told him to. Its actual name should be "Runestone" its purpose is to allow portal relocation, and further tier 4 research (similar to the SM orbital relay).
2.How the support cap and the infantry cap is still under considerable discussion, our current plan is to leave the max squad cap at 20, and cut the support cap down to ten. With Long fangs costing 3 Support and Bikes 2. Although don't quote me on this.
3. Bikes are currently either can hopefully be tagged on with the Bike mod which was kicking around, or we will look into implementing it ourselves.

@Madman - We would be happy to accept any maps, potentially once we have completed the race a Campaign may be in the works. Although mums the word.

Nice feedback so far guys, keep it up, more updates should be on soon, once i reestablish contact with Crimson, You should witness some animation.

Oh forgot this.
Anyone who has browsed the Forums will have seen this its our first in game model, devoid of Anim's and entirely un pink boxed of doomed.

Ignore the Floating guns, they have "tactical purposes".

Current animation of the Grey Slayer runs at

7 idle
2 run
1 die
1 fire

Hands_of_Fate

A pity then.
Oh well, it may hopefully be possible someday. Relic, hear our cries!

Thanks for the info mate. Best of luck with your mod.

ps. Those Wulfen look great!

Hirmetrium

you got me - if all else fails we will rebalance his stats and make him free and quick to make. the idea is he controls the wolves

Julian didnt say that we were considering rising the infantry cap to counter tanks. however it should work extremely well i hope

Julian

Quick update - Been informed of improvements in Wulfen texturing, see here:




Adding to main post as well...

Hirmetrium

FYI for everyone still hoping for some sort of an update, Were in the middle of exams here - My crappy coding has caused lots of problems, but I'm getting back into it and have started again to make sure i get everything right on the ball.

I will talk to Pac and Julian face to face on the 30th(most probably). IF i have worked everything out, IF i have everything together and IF my exams have gone well, expect to see lots of updated. I will not date the dreaded beta test, and for now julian has taken over the mod until i sort out my RL exams.

Oh, and I'm still looking for an experianced coder who I can contact if i screw something up its by no means a full time job, and i know a LOT of mods are clamering for Coders, so i just need someone who i can throw questions at over xfire or MSN.

Other than that, as you see above our modeling and texturing are going extremely well, and with crimson bronx doing our animation we should be ok for now. Julians getting a lot of offers, and were very glad to see such interest even though we said we would be somewhere at this stage

jesukrixto

Ehm, something I just thought...normally when you face any army you have to focus your teching and squad upgrades or squads you create, to tailor them to the enemy army, in terms of balancing antivehicle and antiinfantry.

However when fighting a 13th Company army, the enemy will only have to go antiinfantry, while the 13th will still have to split its forces among one or the other. Not only the forces, but also lots of teching (and what you spend resources on) and other strategic factors will be simplified a lot for the enemy, while remaining the same for the 13th. A Space Marine army will get lots of Plasmas and not a single ML. Sure they'll take longer killing buildings, but if they can slaughter your army, it's just a matter of time till they blow your unprotected base.

I think this looks like a huge disadvantage for the 13th when facing no matter who. Any thoughts on this, fellas?

kindred ravens

good point

Tesla

well if im correct once you got a rune priest out you can do probaly a lot of teleportation, meaning that many units can be telleported into, also maby they will give some units vehicle armour, or somthing like that

Julian

ahh, well this is where, the massive superiority of 13th Company units should balance itself out. Our main problem however, is limiting that power early game. Troop to troop, 1 Grey Slayers are far superior to any base unit from the other races. Although it is a very serious problem, tactically as far as DoW is concerned hopefully a good player, will use the improved manuverability of the 13th Company to keep an opponent on the backfoot, obviously the counter to a 13th army will be to attempt to concentrate your forces, as for the antiinfantry problem, that is something, but hopefully balanceable, with the addition of bikers. Building relocation is also possible so hopefully falling back on the amount of anti-building weaponry will prove foolish, as an attack on 13th company buildings which is not swiftly resolved will be ineffective.

fu12

Because the 13th company is a group of veterans, should you make the marines more...scarred?

PacPomarnacki

Well they are kinda scratched up in the way that half their armour has had to be replaced with Chaos Space Marine power armour components due to battlefield Damage, however if you mean actual scratches, bumps, dents etc in the armour, these models are pretty much beta level or pre-beta, meaning that after the beta is released I will go over everyones comments and almost certainly re-do or at least improve all the textures in the mod.
As for the point about balance, its been discussed in length and is by no means decided upon. We have a good general idea about where we want this mod to go but there is always room for discussion. Me personally, im working more on getting a working race in game, then we can talk about balance :P

Pac.

Mig Mek

Maybe you should implement that you auto start with a certain amount of support cap and a regular amount of infantry cap and every commander unit you get upgrades how many infantry you can get like with space wolves where you need a HQ for some many hundreds of points, just an idea though

fu12

No, I meant skin-wise. Most of the 13th should be gnarled verterans with scars and missing eyes and whatnot. Are you planning on modeling "flesh" heads for the 13th? Cuz if you are, dont make em baby-faced younglings.

fuggles

They have wolfguard? Will the cyclone/assault cannon combo make a comeback? What about wolves, or is that just for...oh nuts, the young head of the space wolves anyone? Ragnar....? I can only think Tornquist right now

Ragnar Blackmane!

Exigo

Ragnar isn't in the 13th company. This is if im right strictly a 13th company mod for the Space wolves.

Like the models btw there looking great!

PacPomarnacki

@fu12, are you referring to the wolf lord? because those pictures are already kind of outdated :P im working on making him look more worn with stubble/beard, a facial tatoo if i can get one to look good and ill be adding more 'old man' features later.

@fuggles, nope, no terminators. Wolf guard yes, but wolf guard dont have to be in terminator armour

Julian

Actually technically the faces can be any age, as in the warp their is no aging, although, they'll probably be scarred, but they don't all have to be grizzled scarred up veteran's, after all not all scars are on the face. We will also hopefully have as many bare heads as possible, maybe random.

PacPomarnacki

Just a quick update, me and jules where working on the latest rendition of the Wolf Lord tonight. Jules added some good looking hair (pigtails!) and I added some wrinkles to his face along with a scar to show what he's been through, essentially fighting thousands of battles on the chaos home ground with no support. The Sword has some updates as do a number of little things. Sooner or later we will get around to the Long Fangs and you can look at a new unit for a change! Check the 1st post for Pics

Pac.

Julian

Yeah, posting new pics here as well, adding to main post:

First head close up, this is were the major changes have been made, added hair, as well as more facial detail.



Another head CU, this from the side, to better demonstrate the pigtails.



Here we have an updated frontal shot, with everything all visible.



And finally a rear view, which should show his new style cloak.

CrossOrion

I must say the face is incrediebally well textured... or at least, eyes down, the scalp looks like it could use a bit of work to look less ... Um.. well, less chippy.

PacPomarnacki

Yeah, thats the only bit I dont like about the head at the moment, unfortunatly its actually the way the model wraps the texture rather than lazy texturing. Its basically to do with the fact that for the scalp it seems to take a small peice of texture and stretch it over his entire head, making anything I add stretch horribly. Itll be worked out later, For now id say hes beta-worthy.

Pac.

CrossOrion

Well. Maybe more hair will help? He looks rather clean and handsome (I use this word with an artistic prespective) for some guy who's been jumping in and out of the Warp :P I really like the eyes.

Actually he sorta reminds me of this guy here. \

jesukrixto

I agree, he's too handsome, his skin too pale, his wrinkles aren't deep enough...he looks more like a rookie than a veteran of a thousand battles (at least to me). Not saying I don't like it, but I think I'd take a different approach alltogether.

Hope that didn't sound too harsh, coz I do like this mod and the textures do look great...it's just that his face doesn't show the spirit I think he should have...but it's just my opinion.

Durantheking

Great job but you shouod make them look a little less human I mean even the troops are animals think wolferine style hair and the skin colour should be more grey as if its been wethered all in all great job though.

PacPomarnacki

As to the last few comments, fair enough, thats the reason we post images on the forums, To get your opinions on how we can make our work better. If we didnt care what you think we would suddenly just release a full mod (which in some ways may be preferable to the waiting )
Anyway, back to photoshop for me.

Pac.

Julian

Sneak Updating peek, here we are again with more stuff, first this:
textured by myself and represents a a head of something in the 13th army.

and my latest model, just whipped up quickly, is our new Wolf Priest, untill now unrepresented by us in any form so this represents our first unveiling of this big guy, some of you may be aware of this as going back on our original plan for the absence of terminator armour, but I personally feel that the model warrants it.




The sharpeyed amongst you will spot that its almost entirely Relic parts, but the head and the wolf pelt are both customised additions.

Expect texturing later.

kindred ravens

nice that one mate

thudmeizer

Whooaaa.. All Wolfy-like!!! <goes to hide in cave for a while>

Shinryuu

That's looks awesome! Faces are usually the most difficult part, but you guys really have a flair for making them.
My only quibble is that he doesn't have the Crux Terminatus on his left shoulder.

Julian

The Crux will probably be in texture form, the poly count on this guy is already rather high at 5255 (ouch) so im gonna have to redo the wolf pelt, which is most of the plys. And then i'll add hair and more details.

Julian

Just as the Wolf priest was so nicely recieved, i've got more pics to share, texture on face is now complete, as well as wolf eyes. Beard is just a stand in, and i know it looks pretty basic, its just a blocking out of basic shape.


You can see some over changes in the form of pelts to add a bit more of that space viking look.

and a close up of the face, im pretty proud of this one, gone for a much more aged look than the rest. As he is a wolf priest after all.

thudmeizer

Outstanding.. keep it moving forward SpaceWolvers! Any ideas on the prospective uber-unit? Leman himself perhaps? :omg: :omg:

kindred ravens

nice one, you really have the nack for facial textures!

CrossOrion

Face and model look great and all...

but the head of the wolf seems more like a wombat from the front view :/

epic40k

Leman would need the 2 wolves with him.

Mit Gas

Looking all good so far. I like the skulls.

But please use as the renderer catmull rom. That way we see the textures better. And you'd need to paint a bit stronger shadows into face to get ird of the blurry quality, that's the main problem with photosourced stuff.

thudmeizer

Like that isn't remotely possible? That would be ONE killer Command Squad!!! :omg:

Mr. Mittens

Leman wouldn't be part of the mmod, since it's only for the 13th Company.

Julian

Well if we DID implement Leman, which we wont in a multiplayer version, he would be accompanied by his two wolves Freki and Geri. But as a unit in multiplayer game, it just wouldn't work, i mean he's a primarch.

Although, possibility looms of a campaign, which in my narrative thinking, would have to start with the fall of Prospero, and would feature mister Russ, taking down that mutant weakling Magnus. Plus Thousand Sons in awesome red armour. Although if we do make a campaign it will be after we make a multiplayer race.

And Mittens there is minute justification for the presence of Leman Russ, although I stress that we are not taking that route, but it is theorised that Russ's dissappearence was him going to search for the 13th Company, although there is very little evidence for this bit of fluff.

thudmeizer

Leman would be an excellent candidate for Tier4 Uber btw. Its completely doable and also original considering his sidekicks would be 2 VERY powerful wolverines. It wouldn't be a command squad, per se, but damn awesome to behold! Still.. whatever u chats decide.

Shinryuu

I don't know man... In TT rules Magnus (using him as an example) destroys a terminator squad every turn. For one to survive he has to roll six ones on ten dice. We're talking serious uber here :P

PacPomarnacki

Leman Russ V Baneblade/Land Raider/Avatar/Bloodthirster/Squiggoth
would be interesting to see...
Either way hes definatly not appearing in the Multiplayer version, as jules said, we talked about a campaign and such, which he would be more justified to appear in.